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TDEE - What is it and why you should not eat below your BMR

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  • 31prvrbs
    31prvrbs Posts: 687 Member
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    QUOTE:

    So 2232 would be your cal level (including exercise cals up to 394)

    What does this sentence mean, should be eat back those 394 calories if she burns them exercising, what if she burns more than 394?

    Only eat back exercise cals that are *higher* than the amount already figured in, which is 394. So if she burns 494 then she'd only eat back 100 cals, (494-394=100)

    Sorry for the confusion ;)


    Maybe it's just too late to be reading this to try and figure things out or I just don't get it! LOL

    Using the calculator my TDEE is 2047 and my BMR according to MFP is 1391.

    If I cut 15% from my TDEE it's 1739 so on non-work out days I would eat 1700? When I work out (currently doing 30 day shred) I'm burning around 225 - 240 calories so on those days I should aim for 1900?

    Holy crapple - I've been going by MFP and eating so that my net calories equal my goal calories. How do I change my details to fit this in?

    Hope no-one minds me asking all these questions!! I'm so tired of yo-yo-ing and want to do this right so that I burn fat, gain muscle and feel good instead of just losing weight if you know what I mean :)

    No one minds :)

    If your TDEE -15% is 1700, you could...for simplicity..just eat 1700 every day. That makes it easier for most people. Your TDEE already takes into account your workout cals. So unless you burn more than 350 cals, you don't need to eat your exercise cals back.

    You could (1) set up your MFP to your desired goal #, and then NOT eat back any cals, or (2) keep it however you have it set up now, but eat back cals (plus extra if needed) up to 1700. It's a personal choice how you set it up. I've even seen many ladies set their cals to their TDEE -15% number, and then log exercise with "1" calorie burned, so that they don't have to "see" the cals, get confused and eat them back. Which works fine as long as you didn't burn more than your "figured in" amount, and are still netting above BMR.

    Everyone has the way that works best for them. :wink:

    ~Kiki
  • sonyachan
    sonyachan Posts: 518 Member
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    I have my BMR at 1745. TDEE using moderate activity level is 2476. My cut is 2105. So, on non-workout days I should be getting at least BMR, and I can do 2105 and lose weight right? I just did for the first week and my sodium has been through the roof, so I gotta work on that! I gained 6 pounds....but I'm trying hard to let that go and keep working. I have started a primal workout for strength training and I am always sore, so I know I'm gaining muscle and having a lot of water retention. Still running about 3 miles 3 days a week. I have cut out my long run since finishing a 10K. I can't believe how much hungrier I am, but maybe it's because I'm home all week for spring break and not working (aka keeping busy). Hoping the scale evens out after a couple weeks. Having my TOM next week, so I know it won't get any better then. Thanks for all the info and support. This is the best group EVER! :)
  • allybeee
    allybeee Posts: 51 Member
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    Let me start by saying well done on the weight loss :)

    I am female 37 5ft4 198lbs, i have been stuck at this weight since xmas, it is hard not to get disillusioned but i try. I do 3 x 45mins of HIIT cardio and 3 x 45mins of compound fitness + tabata circuits. + a zumba class once a week. i also bike to gym and back.

    Having recently read both burth the fat, feed the muscle and NROLFW, i was all set to start but i have strained something either calf or achilles, it has been very tight on both lower legs, at first i tried to just ease up on legs but this week i have resorted to doing nothing at all just complete rest.

    Based on my usual data i get my BMR at 1643.2

    mod ex - 2558
    2252 less exercise
    and currently none 1965

    I need to try figure out whilst i am not exercising what my cut is and then gradually increase, as i do more hopefully back up to normal speed in a month or so. Really frustrating i had only just got back after a bad shoulder injury for 3 yrs returned to the gym last august, lost 2.5 stone then stuck from xmas onwards. possibly pushing too hard has caused the injury out of frustration of lack of movement on the scales perhaps.

    But since i am currently waddling round like a penguin because my legs are unbelievably stiff i have no choice but to work at a low level. Hope you can advise, much appreciated :)

    My other problem is as a veggie i find it really difficult to keep the carbs down and the protein up. thanks again

    Ally :)
  • 31prvrbs
    31prvrbs Posts: 687 Member
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    I have my BMR at 1745. TDEE using moderate activity level is 2476. My cut is 2105. So, on non-workout days I should be getting at least BMR, and I can do 2105 and lose weight right? I just did for the first week and my sodium has been through the roof, so I gotta work on that! I gained 6 pounds....but I'm trying hard to let that go and keep working. I have started a primal workout for strength training and I am always sore, so I know I'm gaining muscle and having a lot of water retention. Still running about 3 miles 3 days a week. I have cut out my long run since finishing a 10K. I can't believe how much hungrier I am, but maybe it's because I'm home all week for spring break and not working (aka keeping busy). Hoping the scale evens out after a couple weeks. Having my TOM next week, so I know it won't get any better then. Thanks for all the info and support. This is the best group EVER! :)


    Well..... if your sodium was through the roof, then we know your "gain" is "falsified information", lol. To gain 6 "real" lbs, you'd have had to eat 21000 cals ABOVE your TDEE :noway:

    I'd def stay off the scale during TOM, lol.. or at least take the # w/a large grain of (imaginary) salt :tongue:

    But yes, you should be able to lose eating the 2105. You can feel free to eat that # daily if worrying about workout/non-workout days is too much hassle. :smile:

    ~Kiki
  • 31prvrbs
    31prvrbs Posts: 687 Member
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    Let me start by saying well done on the weight loss :)

    I am female 37 5ft4 198lbs, i have been stuck at this weight since xmas, it is hard not to get disillusioned but i try. I do 3 x 45mins of HIIT cardio and 3 x 45mins of compound fitness + tabata circuits. + a zumba class once a week. i also bike to gym and back.

    Having recently read both burth the fat, feed the muscle and NROLFW, i was all set to start but i have strained something either calf or achilles, it has been very tight on both lower legs, at first i tried to just ease up on legs but this week i have resorted to doing nothing at all just complete rest.

    Based on my usual data i get my BMR at 1643.2

    mod ex - 2558
    2252 less exercise
    and currently none 1965

    I need to try figure out whilst i am not exercising what my cut is and then gradually increase, as i do more hopefully back up to normal speed in a month or so. Really frustrating i had only just got back after a bad shoulder injury for 3 yrs returned to the gym last august, lost 2.5 stone then stuck from xmas onwards. possibly pushing too hard has caused the injury out of frustration of lack of movement on the scales perhaps.

    But since i am currently waddling round like a penguin because my legs are unbelievably stiff i have no choice but to work at a low level. Hope you can advise, much appreciated :)

    My other problem is as a veggie i find it really difficult to keep the carbs down and the protein up. thanks again

    Ally :)

    Hi Ally!

    I know exactly where you're coming from, seeing as last summer I injured BOTH Achilles, which put me out of commission for months. I'm actually still really easy on it, but it's much better now. The thing is...I did it the EXACT same way that it seems that you have....over-training. It's really hard to see it coming, but BAM it hits you like a ton of bricks, and then you're forced to give yourself the rest/recovery that should have been worked into your fitness routine from the beginning. Sometimes we gotta learn the hard way, huh? :indifferent:

    I've now learned that flexibility training needs to be a staple in my regimen, as well as good joint supplements and fish oils. I also factor rest days/weeks into my regimen, as well as high/low intensity workouts. Variety is most definitely the spice of my life/workouts, and more is not necessarily better.. I also cut WAY back on the cardio, as I found that I was really over-doing it, and to no avail. During that time, because I had no choice, (and after my weeks of sulking and being miserable that I couldn't workout :sad: ) I finally decided that I would do workouts that I could do. I focused mainly on upper body alternating a day of weights, with a day of cardio (mostly boxing). I took a few days of the week and did yoga/pilates, and even started incorporating barre type work (all of which are NOT my cup of tea), and they greatly facilitated my recovery. Pilates was originally intended as a recovery workout for ballerinas, so I found it challenging, because I'd never done it, as well as helpful in my healing.

    I quickly discovered that w/o even having to abuse my lower half, and beat my body into submission through excessive cardio, I was in the best shape of my life, and I'd finally gotten the upper body that I'd been striving for. By the time my Achilles had healed, I had a totally new outlook on my workouts, and have chosen to keep in all of the things that I learned during that time. Over-training comes mainly from doing the same stuff over and over again, too close together in sequence. The more variety that you can include in your workouts, the better. Even throw stuff that you don't really think you'd be interested in, into the routine on occasion. Sometimes those very things are what we are imbalanced in (thus the reason we don't like them), and working those imbalances will help you in the long run to remain injury free.

    I iced my Achilles regularly, and kept it elevated whenever possible. I focused on keeping that area stretched out as often as possible, and slept w/the foot wrapped in a flexed position which is very important in reducing pain. You want the Achilles to heal in a stretched position, other wise, as soon as you go to stand on it, you stretch it out and re-tear is which is what keeps causing the pain/delay in healing.

    So I'd sit tight. DON'T rush it (I did, which is why I ended up w/TWO injured Achilles). Allow things to fully heal, and in the meantime, do whatever you *can* do. :wink:

    If you'd like more suggestions on working out w/o using your lower half (or limiting use of it) just let me know. I became quite adept @ modifying workouts during that time.

    ~Kiki
  • MrsLong1980
    MrsLong1980 Posts: 181 Member
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    Me again - sorry! LOL I've read the 1st page again and tried to calculate, details below and am confused! I thought reading it at 2000 rather than 2330 would be better!

    Step 1: Calculate You Resting Metabolic Rate
    Women's RMR = 655 + (9.6 x weight in kg) + (1.8 x height in cm) - (4.7 x age in years)
    655 + (9.6 x 72) + (1.8 x 158) - (4.7 x 31)
    655 + (691.2) + (284) - (145) = 1485

    Step 2: Calculate You Activity Multiplier
    Lightly active (e.g., you participate in light exercise or sports 1 to 3 times per week) = 1.375
    RMR Calories x Activity Level Multiplier
    1485 x 1.375 = 2041

    Step 3: Calculate Your Energy Requirement for Digestion
    We will now add 10% to account for the amount of energy it takes to digest every meal.
    Calories Calculated Up to Now + 10%
    2041 + 204 = 2245

    So I'm assuming my TDEE (if I've done it correctly) is 2245?

    If I use the calculator link
    http://www.fitnessfrog.com/calculators/tdee-calculator.html
    With the following details
    Female - 72kgs - 5 ft 2 - 31 yrs - light exercise
    gives me 2040

    Why are the two calculations different by 200 calories?!

    LOSE WEIGHT TDEE - 15%
    2245 - 336 = 1909
    OR
    2040 - 306 = 1734

    Just so I can clarify really as it's confusing me! LOL So even on days when I am not exercising (because I'm not really burning much in terms of calories when I do work out) I should eat the TDEE - 15% figure?

    My BMR incidentally being 1391 (MFP) or 1484 (using link from this post http://www.bmicalculator.org/bmr-calculator/) so I need to eat somewhere between 1391 and TDEE - 15%?

    and now I'm going to find a mop and bucket to clean up the mess of my head exploding! LOL
  • 31prvrbs
    31prvrbs Posts: 687 Member
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    @MrsLong- The calculation differences, I would assume, are probably from the 10% digestion number not being figured into the fitnessfrog calc.

    Yes, you can eat the same number daily because TDEE is figured by taking into account the amount of workouts that you do as a whole (on pretty much a weekly basis). So your "average" activity level is figured in (like 3-5hours per week, 5-6 hours per week, etc). Some people prefer to be more precise and eat according to that activity level for each day, and if that makes you feel more secure, then feel free to do the same. It's all a personal preference. We're all about making the process work for you. There is no one-size-fit-all around here. :flowerforyou:

    ~Kiki
  • MrsLong1980
    MrsLong1980 Posts: 181 Member
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    Thanks Kiki for being so patient! :)

    I'll up my goal calories to 1700 daily regardless of exercise and customise the thingies on MFP as per page 1 and see how it goes - can't do me any harm!! LOL
  • allybeee
    allybeee Posts: 51 Member
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    Hi Kiki,

    Thanks for that bit of encouragement, been sitting here feeling really down and frustrated. I went for a light bike ride today, kept the gears really low and mostly flat route. I found that ok. I was hoping i could use the eliptical and just leep the resistance low. I normally work on burning at least 500 cals a session.

    Yes i probably have overtrained. it started as a 30 min workout each day and it got bigger as i wasnt getting the results i needed.

    I would love some advice on the workout routines and also what you think i should do about my cal intake whilst i cannot do much.

    Didn't really think about keeping my feet flexed, i will now though, sitting typing this with my feet up on a pillow not the easiest position to stay in lol


    Thank you so much for the advice, feel better already! :)

    Should i be working on my barest calorie intake since i won't be getting any exercise really? and just adjust it when i do manage to burn cals?
    BMR 1643.2
    usual level - 2538
    low exercise 2252
    non 1965

    to still lose weight would you recommend i go for a 15% cut on the 1965 in general? that would be 1670 a day, pretty low number no wonder i exercise
  • sonyachan
    sonyachan Posts: 518 Member
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    I have my BMR at 1745. TDEE using moderate activity level is 2476. My cut is 2105. So, on non-workout days I should be getting at least BMR, and I can do 2105 and lose weight right? I just did for the first week and my sodium has been through the roof, so I gotta work on that! I gained 6 pounds....but I'm trying hard to let that go and keep working. I have started a primal workout for strength training and I am always sore, so I know I'm gaining muscle and having a lot of water retention. Still running about 3 miles 3 days a week. I have cut out my long run since finishing a 10K. I can't believe how much hungrier I am, but maybe it's because I'm home all week for spring break and not working (aka keeping busy). Hoping the scale evens out after a couple weeks. Having my TOM next week, so I know it won't get any better then. Thanks for all the info and support. This is the best group EVER! :)


    Well..... if your sodium was through the roof, then we know your "gain" is "falsified information", lol. To gain 6 "real" lbs, you'd have had to eat 21000 cals ABOVE your TDEE :noway:

    I'd def stay off the scale during TOM, lol.. or at least take the # w/a large grain of (imaginary) salt :tongue:

    But yes, you should be able to lose eating the 2105. You can feel free to eat that # daily if worrying about workout/non-workout days is too much hassle. :smile:

    ~Kiki

    Thank you for responding.... It's good know that I know what I know. You know? ;)
  • 31prvrbs
    31prvrbs Posts: 687 Member
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    Hi Kiki,

    Thanks for that bit of encouragement, been sitting here feeling really down and frustrated. I went for a light bike ride today, kept the gears really low and mostly flat route. I found that ok. I was hoping i could use the eliptical and just leep the resistance low. I normally work on burning at least 500 cals a session.

    Yes i probably have overtrained. it started as a 30 min workout each day and it got bigger as i wasnt getting the results i needed.

    I would love some advice on the workout routines and also what you think i should do about my cal intake whilst i cannot do much.

    Didn't really think about keeping my feet flexed, i will now though, sitting typing this with my feet up on a pillow not the easiest position to stay in lol


    Thank you so much for the advice, feel better already! :)

    Should i be working on my barest calorie intake since i won't be getting any exercise really? and just adjust it when i do manage to burn cals?
    BMR 1643.2
    usual level - 2538
    low exercise 2252
    non 1965

    to still lose weight would you recommend i go for a 15% cut on the 1965 in general? that would be 1670 a day, pretty low number no wonder i exercise

    I did lower my cals a bit at first, since I was pretty much incapacitated. W/both Achilles shot, I couldn't even drive :frown: , so my activity level plummeted. As I gained my ability to exercise, I increased cals again, and was eventually back up to proper numbers. So maybe start at your lower cal level, until you get in your groove, then once you get a feel for what workouts you'll be incorporating and the effort you can put out, get those cals up :wink:

    I will tell you, though, that even during that time, I was well above my BMR. I was eating about 1600-1700 cals, and my TDEE is around 2100-2200 (@5'2,120lbs), so take that into consideration when choosing your cal level.

    If it's your achilles, I'd stay off of it for at *least* 6 weeks. :noway: I know...bummer, huh? :sad: I didn't take this advice the first time, and that's how I re-injured the same one, and injured the other. The thing about the achilles is that just because it "feels" healed, doesn't mean it is. So I made the mistake of thinking, "man, I feel great!" and did a little too much foot action in my next 2 workouts and ended up down for the count. I felt like such an idiot, that instead of just waiting a few extra weeks, I'd put myself out for months :explode: . It was such a harsh reality. But if you treat it properly and let it do it's thing, Achilles sprains can heal up quickly. It's just that in the case of tendons, the word "quickly" is not what we'd expect. They are very slow healing. And most times, by the time we actually "feel" the pain, we've done too much damage as it is. So try to keep it low key for the next 4-6 weeks. :ohwell:

    I'd stick w/no to low impact workouts like biking. I picked up spinning during that time (making sure to keep my foot flexed during rides), I was also able to get on the elliptical (much later, because mine was so bad). Boxing became a new fave. I loved being able to get my heart rate up like that w/only my upper body. I'd always loved kick boxing, but the lack of being able to use my feet is what led me to discover some good boxing workouts. The only thing that I couldn't do with that were the "jump rope" type drills, which I would just fast-paced-squat in place during that time, once I was able to. But, adding weighted gloves to those boxing workouts really pump up the heart rate. Eventually I could add the kickbox in as well, but w/no jumping, or quick switching of the feet.

    I work out from home, and do a lot of DVDs by Cathe Friedrich, and it just so happened that she came out w/a complete low impact series during that time, which I snatched up. I also did her weight workouts during that time, doing all of the upper body portions. Upper body weight work was my new BFF. :love: I did 2 days very heavy upper body, and then one day using lighter weight w/very high reps to get a more "cardio" effect. And best of all, I was seeing results! :love: Results I DIDN'T see when I was killing myself bounding all over the place trying to get in the massive cardio burns.

    For lower body work, as I mentioned, I started doing "ballet/barre" type workouts :huh: , which I despised, but they got the job done. Plus all of the pointing and flexing of the foot did more to strengthen my Achilles than I would have done on my own. Those, plus the Pilates/yoga, were all thrown in for rehab, and to give my upper body a rest day (I'd learned my lesson on over-training!), but they did burn some cals, and strengthen many imbalances, so that was a bonus.
  • Fat_2_Fit_Mommy
    Fat_2_Fit_Mommy Posts: 569 Member
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    I am horrible at math it's my worst subject.
  • Fat_2_Fit_Mommy
    Fat_2_Fit_Mommy Posts: 569 Member
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    My BMR is 1670.2 and my TDEE is 2289 what do I go now? I read it but trying to think what to do with the #' s.
  • WeCallThemDayWalkers
    WeCallThemDayWalkers Posts: 259 Member
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    MATH = Mental Abuse to Humans
  • k0nfyo0zed
    k0nfyo0zed Posts: 313 Member
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    My BMR is 1670.2 and my TDEE is 2289 what do I go now? I read it but trying to think what to do with the #' s.

    Once you have your TDEE you subtract 15% (you would get a cut of 1945)... That's your calorie goal, exercise cals are already included so you don't have to eat them back, unless your workout makes you net below your BMR.

    For example: if you eat your 1950 calories, then you burn 400, you are netting 1550 calories (1950 minus 400)... so to get back to your BMR of 1670 you would need to eat another 120 calories.

    Did that make sense? I hope so. There's a reason I was not a math tutor. :)

    edit: You can make MFP reflect that by going to the Home screen, then clicking Goals, then "change goals" and go to custom... once you are on custom, change your calorie goal to 1945 (or 1950 if you're like me and like even multiples of 10, bonus if it's a multiple of 50 or 100)... then your carbs to 40% protein to 30% and fat to 30%... and you're set :)
  • heygina
    heygina Posts: 78
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    bumpage
  • MrsLong1980
    MrsLong1980 Posts: 181 Member
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    I just wanted to say thank you so much for this! Today I have eaten well (a little high on carbs prior to my workout) and felt full between each meal where I haven't felt the need to snack. I have had the most delicious smoothie after my workout this evening, something I never would have considered having prior to reading this post and changing my calorie intake. Can you confirm I'm right in thinking that today's eats were pretty good by taking a look at my food diary? If you have the time that is. Usually I would have a wholewheat muesli for breakfast but have been craving toast so had some this morning as a treat! LOL
  • ANewLucia
    ANewLucia Posts: 2,081 Member
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    I just wanted to say thank you so much for this! Today I have eaten well (a little high on carbs prior to my workout) and felt full between each meal where I haven't felt the need to snack. I have had the most delicious smoothie after my workout this evening, something I never would have considered having prior to reading this post and changing my calorie intake. Can you confirm I'm right in thinking that today's eats were pretty good by taking a look at my food diary? If you have the time that is. Usually I would have a wholewheat muesli for breakfast but have been craving toast so had some this morning as a treat! LOL

    I would say eat those 134 cals in the most protein dense way you can...eat every calorie everyday...

    try to work on getting your protein up to 1gr per lb of body weight...
  • sazroy
    sazroy Posts: 262 Member
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    I've done the calculations.. So I should eat 2052 a day? To lose weight? I'm currently on 1500. So i need to eat more? What about exercise?
  • ANewLucia
    ANewLucia Posts: 2,081 Member
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    I've done the calculations.. So I should eat 2052 a day? To lose weight? I'm currently on 1500. So i need to eat more? What about exercise?

    Not sure if 2052 is your tdee -15% OR tdee but you would eat tdee -15% daily and only eat back exercise calories if your burn takes you under your BMR.

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