Please explain the scinece of muscle building

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chakug
chakug Posts: 28 Member
in Goal: Gaining Weight and Body Building
It has been confusing me.
1. We get fat when we overeat ( not only junk). Then how do we gain muscle in surplus ? Is it only matter of fact if you do weight lifting or not ? Do all of you eat gets used for muscle building ?
2. How much surplus is ideal for muscle gain with minimum fat gain ? ( because I already lost weight recently, I don't want to get it back)
3. Lot of people advised me to do body recomp which I am trying to do. So I want to clarify again, If i eat at maintenance and lift weight ? Do I lose fat too ? Or just build muscle ?

Replies

  • mauryloko
    mauryloko Posts: 16 Member
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    U workouts will cause the protein in ur muscles to break down and build up much faster than it does in ordinary circumstances...... There are 2 ways to do that. Number 1, and by far the easiest, is to eat more protein than u currently do. Protein all by itself is anabolic. It wants to be stored in ur muscles....number 2 is to work out in a way that disrupts ur muscles and forces them to respond u know i mean by getting bigger and stronger bro, and about build muscle and lose fat…at the same time. some people say its a fools errand Others say u need to follow “special” forms of dieting and training. Others still say it takes steroids. But guss what man they’re all wrong. What i belive is that u may or may not be able to do it, depending on your body composition, training experience, and more.
  • feisty_bucket
    feisty_bucket Posts: 1,047 Member
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    You can think of muscles as big bundles of tiny fibers running along the bones. When you work muscles hard enough, you cause "micro tears" in the muscle fibers. When you rest, the proteins you eat are recruited to rebuild these fibers, and they grow back tougher than they were before.

    Kind of like how calluses are developed when you stress some skin too hard. It blisters and then grows back tougher.

    If you search for "micro tears" and "hypertrophy" you'll find a zillion articles explaining this stuff in more detail. Here's one of the multitude: homegymr.com/micro-tears-in-muscles/

    As for the exact optimum amount to eat to grow as fast as possible but not get fatter? That's really tough to dial in. So people traditionally do a bulk-and-cut cycle where they just eat a whole lot for a while (a few months) and then switch it up and focus on dropping the excess bodyfat (they inevitably overshoot some) while lifting lighter.

    Recomposition is a newer strategy with more subdued overeating right after lifting and then also less drastic deficits soon after (so you could look at it as a micro-bulk-and-cut cycle).


  • chakug
    chakug Posts: 28 Member
    edited May 2017
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    filbo132 wrote: »
    Recomp can be done, but the process is much slower when it comes to building muscles than the good ol' Cut/bulk phases. So it's up to you, if you don't mind building a good physique at a slower pace, then by all means go the recomp way.

    I don't have all the time in the world to get a good physique. I read more about recomp and I read that it's a very slow process. I will switch to bulk/cut. But I am really confused if I should cut or bulk. I used calipers to measure my bf but i think it tells wrong (8-9%). Can you look at my picture and suggest me if I should opt for bulk or cut ( I am a really short guy 5"2) . If I should bulk, how much surplus should I do ?
    p.s. my ultimate goal is to get lean and have 6 pack abs
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  • chakug
    chakug Posts: 28 Member
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    @filbo132 Thanks for the reply ! Very helpful.
    I was already in cut for almost a year now and I lost 32 Kgs. I started eating maintenance calorie few weeks ago because many people started complaining that my cheeks look very sunken and I look like a sick peraon and I look very ugly. I thought it's because I was in deficit for that much time. Maybe if I started eating maintenance, I'll start looking better. Do you still recommend me to cut ? Anyways isn't eating in maintenance more effective for muscle building than cutting ? Maybe I won't lose fat but I won't gain too many fat either ?
  • chakug
    chakug Posts: 28 Member
    edited May 2017
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    @cwolfman13 I didn't mean I want to build muscle in a month or weeks. I said so cs I read body recomp is very slow process and it takes over a year and progress is not noticeable week by week.
    I don't want to get jacked or big. I just want lean athletic body like your friends. I am too short to get big.
    I was hoping to bulk 3 months cs I only want to get toned muscle. Then cut my way to 10-12 bf.
    I just keep getting confused. Some people advise to body recomp some some advise to cut others advise to bulk. Internet is a confusing place.
  • sijomial
    sijomial Posts: 19,811 Member
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    chakug wrote: »
    @cwolfman13 I didn't mean I want to build muscle in a month or weeks. I said so cs I read body recomp is very slow process and it takes over a year and progress is not noticeable week by week.
    I don't want to get jacked or big. I just want lean athletic body like your friends. I am too short to get big.
    I was hoping to bulk 3 months cs I only want to get toned muscle. Then cut my way to 10-12 bf.
    I just keep getting confused. Some people advise to body recomp some some advise to cut others advise to bulk. Internet is a confusing place.
    chakug wrote: »
    @cwolfman13 I didn't mean I want to build muscle in a month or weeks. I said so cs I read body recomp is very slow process and it takes over a year and progress is not noticeable week by week.
    I don't want to get jacked or big. I just want lean athletic body like your friends. I am too short to get big.
    I was hoping to bulk 3 months cs I only want to get toned muscle. Then cut my way to 10-12 bf.
    I just keep getting confused. Some people advise to body recomp some some advise to cut others advise to bulk. Internet is a confusing place.

    That's silly to say recomp "takes a year" - results and speed of those results is very personal. Progress also starts immediately. It's not 11 months of nothing and then "results"!

    Before you decide whether to recomp or cut/bulk you need to get your training sorted. You seem to have low muscle mass - maybe share your routine for advice.
  • PAV8888
    PAV8888 Posts: 13,604 Member
    edited May 2017
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    cwolfman13 wrote: »
    Just my $.02, but at this stage of the game I think you just need to get in and lift with a solid program. I don't think you should really be concerning yourself with bulking and cutting cycles...IMO, novice lifters really have no need and no business doing them and outside of bodybuilding, they really aren't necessary for the vast majority of people to improve their physiques. Honestly, outside of the bodybuilding community, it's just kind of a fad kind of thing right now and a lot of people have no idea what they're doing and it can be hard on the body.

    Just get in and put your time in, in the weight room. Results will come...you see them all along the way as your physique evolves. You don't just go a year with no results and then, "boom"...results.

    See I totally agree with the above; but, not what you said earlier "at this point, you'd probably want to cut a little further and then go on a long, slow bulk...like maybe a year or so and then cut again".

    @chakug has already cut for a considerable amount of time. And basically, regardless of leanness, he is at a point where he has to (re)develop some muscles to get the physique he wants.

    BUT, while he has proven that he can cut his food when he needs to, he has not yet proven that he can consistently exercise like he needs to.

    A further cut will also decrease lean mass UNLESS he starts a more extensive strength building program than what he has done to date. Also people tend to be able to do more/feel better/stronger/at maintenance.

    So, yeah, essentially my suggestion would be to start a strength building program while at the same time increasing calories by 100-150 Cal a day on a weekly basis till a trending weight program is showing consistent >0.5lb per week (0.2kg) increases. And back off a bit at that point on the weight gain/increase to maintenance/much much slower rate of change.

    Especially in the beginning he will still see great results and having some results and exercise discipline behind him he can then evaluate a quick cut or continuing at maintenance or a slight bulk.

    If he was just starting out, with his current physique after a period of maintenance, instead of a slight increase in calories to look for a higher maintenance I might have been leaning towards a slight caloric cut (-250Cal) while starting a strength program instead. However I am not thinking that would be best for him because he is already at the tail end of a substantial weight loss.
  • Rusty740
    Rusty740 Posts: 749 Member
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    I did what you did, lost 42 lbs, went down to what I figured was about 12-13% body fat. It took about a year to get there one really long cut.

    I found that I was just mentally in need of a break and so decided to do a bulk. I reverse dieted out of my deficit for a month, then got up to a surplus and am currently figuring out what surplus is the right surplus for me. I'm lifting something similar to a Starting Strength/Strong Lifts mix and making progress. I've gained 1.8 lbs muscle and 3 lbs total body weight in about a month. So about 60/40 muscle/fat balance. I'm not completely sure about that ratio, that's what I'm trying to dial in right now. But what I'm saying is I think this is probably the right path for you since you've been on a long cut and might need the break to focus on something else for several months, until you can do a shorter cut again with better results. I'm not sure how long my bulk will be to gain about 7-8 lbs lean mass, I'm thinking 4-5 months. I'm 5'6", 134 lbs.

    To answer your other questions. Two things you need to gain muscle, a surplus and progressive overload weightlifting.

    Your body has a form that it likes, and it will want to stay that shape whether in a surplus or a deficit. You change the shape by weightlifting.

    So if you want to gain weight, all you need is a surplus.
    If you want to lose weight, all you need is a deficit.
    While in either state, if you want to change the amount of muscle in your body vs the amount of fat you have, you weightlift.

    In a calorie surplus, this works to gain muscle faster than otherwise, in a deficit this works to keep muscle longer than otherwise. Muscle won't grow unless the weights keep getting heavier, otherwise, the muscles just get better at doing the same thing for a longer time.
  • Jthanmyfitnesspal
    Jthanmyfitnesspal Posts: 3,521 Member
    edited May 2017
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    @chakug: Dude, you lost 32kg? And, you're not afraid to show it. Awesome!

    Now you want to get some definition. Doing practically anything helps., but you just need to get cardio, weights, and core. I note that a lot of strength can be gained with very basic weightlifting workouts, as simple as going through all the machines in order, for example.

    Nutrition is the easy part. Eat at maintenance (including exercise) with ~30% of calories from protein. Work out regularly and you get plenty to eat.

    Have fun!

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