Can I bulk now??
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dill_milk
Posts: 61 Member
This is me before my bulk, during my bulk, and after my cut.
There are only six months between the first two pictures, and a whole year between the last two.
I literally did not put on any more muscle after the first six months, I just got fatter and fatter. I ate a terrible diet just to 'dirty bulk'. I don't have a photo from the peak of my bulk, but it was even worse than the middle picture. Just a huge gut and skinny arms. Now I've been cutting for 12 weeks and feel like crap. I've only been eating 1500-1800 calories a day and my weight loss has stalled at 170 lbs. I don't feel like I can continue this cut or go any lower, but I still feel like my body fat percentage is too high. I would love to go on a slow lean bulk (I learned a lot about nutrition during my diet) and make some strength gains but I'm worried my calories will just go back to my gut. I'm frustrated and don't know what to do. I feel skinny and fat at the same time.
There are only six months between the first two pictures, and a whole year between the last two.
I literally did not put on any more muscle after the first six months, I just got fatter and fatter. I ate a terrible diet just to 'dirty bulk'. I don't have a photo from the peak of my bulk, but it was even worse than the middle picture. Just a huge gut and skinny arms. Now I've been cutting for 12 weeks and feel like crap. I've only been eating 1500-1800 calories a day and my weight loss has stalled at 170 lbs. I don't feel like I can continue this cut or go any lower, but I still feel like my body fat percentage is too high. I would love to go on a slow lean bulk (I learned a lot about nutrition during my diet) and make some strength gains but I'm worried my calories will just go back to my gut. I'm frustrated and don't know what to do. I feel skinny and fat at the same time.
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Replies
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1. What's your lifting like? Do you follow a program? Are you making progress?
2. Do you use a food scale?
3. What are you using to measure progress beyond just a scale?0 -
1. What's your lifting like? Do you follow a program? Are you making progress?
2. Do you use a food scale?
3. What are you using to measure progress beyond just a scale?
I'm using a 3 day fullbody program. I was making progress until I went on a cut.
I don't use a food scale but I'll measure things with cups.
Besides the scale, I've been measuring my waist. I went from a 37.5 to 34 inch waist.
I use the navy method to guess my body fat percentage. I know it's not accurate but I've seen progress. (According to the navy method I went from 22% to somewhere between 14-17%.)
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How long have you been at 170? How quickly were you losing prior?
Aside from the above and my questions, I have to say you look to have made some good progress.1 -
You can see your traps have grown quite a bit, I am jealous, I am a hard gaining on my traps. Since you stalled after 6 months your training and/or nutrition is lacking. usmcmp already asked what your lifting and program is like, I would add, what are your macros?0
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I'm thinking you should go maintenance for 2-3 months. I'm not sure if I think you should bulk or not, that usually means you should cut some more, but I'm thinking your body might be telling you that you need a break from cutting. If you cut for too long, you'll risk losing some muscle. It's totally up to you but if you feel like you can't go any lower, then you need a break before you try. Sometimes our bodies reduce our NEAT when the calories get really low and we need to cut some more, but it does take some real determination. You might be better of resetting with maintenance for a bit, then trying again.
I'd also have no problem with you bulking for a short time either, but I wouldn't do a real 4-6 month bulk, just 1-2 month or something. Basically just to get your psyche back in the game.0 -
VintageFeline wrote: »How long have you been at 170? How quickly were you losing prior?
Aside from the above and my questions, I have to say you look to have made some good progress.
About 3 weeks.You can see your traps have grown quite a bit, I am jealous, I am a hard gaining on my traps. Since you stalled after 6 months your training and/or nutrition is lacking. usmcmp already asked what your lifting and program is like, I would add, what are your macros?
Thanks! It was definitely my nutrition. Just eating lots of junk, not getting enough protein, and gaining too fast. I'm doing a routine called the greyskull lp variant. It's basically bench, row, and squats one day, and ohp, chins, and deadlifts another day. I didn't pay much attention to macros on my bulk but during my cut they have been 35c/35p/30f. I was doing low carb at first but I didn't like it so I raised carbs a bit.
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If you average 1650kcal/day and your protein breakdown is 35% you are only getting around 144g of protein a day, which is alright but you could bump it up to around 1g/lbs when you are in a caloric surplus and 1.2g/lbs when you are in a caloric deficit. There is a lot of debate on macro breakdown but if I were you I would take away from the fat and add those calories to the protein. You need a certain amount of fat to maintain hormonal balance, keep in mind your hormones are already out of wack from being in a deficit, but carbs and protein are key for muscle growth.
Dr. Mike Israetel believes if you eat 80% of your calories from healthy food, whole grains, lean meat, veggies, fruit, etc. you can eat 20% of your calories from junk and still be perfectly healthy. A calorie deficit is necessary for loosing body fat but a proper macro breakdown and training are necessary to gain muscle mass.0 -
Are you only training twice a week? Or do you just switch back and forth every other day?0
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Looks to me you could gain at least another 15-20lbs.
As far as your energy, if you say you were running low carbs that is partly responsible. Even on a cut with proper programming, one can/should gain strength as long as their deficit isn't too big.
Dirty bulk isn't the type of food, it's the size of the surplus. If your cals are correct (no food scale would effect this greatly), you won't gain crazy amounts of fat. I consume lots of ice cream and cake dailly on a cut or bulk and fat doesn't get out of hand.
I suggest you invest in a food scale, eat at maintenance the day before big volume to help with energy.
I would also like to see your programming and example of your progression, as this is probaby the culprit if you didn't gain significant muscle. I'm not saying you didn't, I just can't see because of using the app and pic is too small.1 -
Are you only training twice a week? Or do you just switch back and forth every other day?
Every other day. But I wasn't very consistent during my bulk.I would also like to see your programming and example of your progression, as this is probaby the culprit if you didn't gain significant muscle. I'm not saying you didn't, I just can't see because of using the app and pic is too small.
I would take breaks once in a while and have to reset the weight when I started again...I'd also have no problem with you bulking for a short time either, but I wouldn't do a real 4-6 month bulk, just 1-2 month or something. Basically just to get your psyche back in the game.
At the moment, I'm thinking of maintaining until school starts again, then do a lean bulk for 3 months, and then a 1 month cut during exams and Christmas break. I never want to do a twelve week cut again. It really made me miserable. Is a cycle of mini-bulks and cuts a good idea?
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Are you only training twice a week? Or do you just switch back and forth every other day?
Every other day. But I wasn't very consistent during my bulk.I would also like to see your programming and example of your progression, as this is probaby the culprit if you didn't gain significant muscle. I'm not saying you didn't, I just can't see because of using the app and pic is too small.
I would take breaks once in a while and have to reset the weight when I started again...I'd also have no problem with you bulking for a short time either, but I wouldn't do a real 4-6 month bulk, just 1-2 month or something. Basically just to get your psyche back in the game.
At the moment, I'm thinking of maintaining until school starts again, then do a lean bulk for 3 months, and then a 1 month cut during exams and Christmas break. I never want to do a twelve week cut again. It really made me miserable. Is a cycle of mini-bulks and cuts a good idea?
Ymmv, but it's been working fine for me. I have basically been running 16-18 week bulks, followed by a two week hard cut, three weeks of maintenance seeking, then building back to a small surplus.0 -
Are you only training twice a week? Or do you just switch back and forth every other day?
Every other day. But I wasn't very consistent during my bulk.I would also like to see your programming and example of your progression, as this is probaby the culprit if you didn't gain significant muscle. I'm not saying you didn't, I just can't see because of using the app and pic is too small.
I would take breaks once in a while and have to reset the weight when I started again...I'd also have no problem with you bulking for a short time either, but I wouldn't do a real 4-6 month bulk, just 1-2 month or something. Basically just to get your psyche back in the game.
At the moment, I'm thinking of maintaining until school starts again, then do a lean bulk for 3 months, and then a 1 month cut during exams and Christmas break. I never want to do a twelve week cut again. It really made me miserable. Is a cycle of mini-bulks and cuts a good idea?
I have been listening to a lot of science based podcasts and many of the people on the shows have their clients do mini bulks and cuts. I cannot remember their logic but it had something to do with fat accumulation and having their clients be better prepared for shows.1 -
Are you only training twice a week? Or do you just switch back and forth every other day?
Every other day. But I wasn't very consistent during my bulk.I would also like to see your programming and example of your progression, as this is probaby the culprit if you didn't gain significant muscle. I'm not saying you didn't, I just can't see because of using the app and pic is too small.
I would take breaks once in a while and have to reset the weight when I started again...I'd also have no problem with you bulking for a short time either, but I wouldn't do a real 4-6 month bulk, just 1-2 month or something. Basically just to get your psyche back in the game.
At the moment, I'm thinking of maintaining until school starts again, then do a lean bulk for 3 months, and then a 1 month cut during exams and Christmas break. I never want to do a twelve week cut again. It really made me miserable. Is a cycle of mini-bulks and cuts a good idea?
I have been listening to a lot of science based podcasts and many of the people on the shows have their clients do mini bulks and cuts. I cannot remember their logic but it had something to do with fat accumulation and having their clients be better prepared for shows.
Staying lean has been shown to improve insulin sensitivity, nutrient partitioning, etc., on top of avoiding lengthy dieting cycles that tend to tank training capabilities.1 -
Are you only training twice a week? Or do you just switch back and forth every other day?
Every other day. But I wasn't very consistent during my bulk.I would also like to see your programming and example of your progression, as this is probaby the culprit if you didn't gain significant muscle. I'm not saying you didn't, I just can't see because of using the app and pic is too small.
I would take breaks once in a while and have to reset the weight when I started again...I'd also have no problem with you bulking for a short time either, but I wouldn't do a real 4-6 month bulk, just 1-2 month or something. Basically just to get your psyche back in the game.
At the moment, I'm thinking of maintaining until school starts again, then do a lean bulk for 3 months, and then a 1 month cut during exams and Christmas break. I never want to do a twelve week cut again. It really made me miserable. Is a cycle of mini-bulks and cuts a good idea?
I think that would be just fine. 3 month/1 month .It really depends on your goals and you will be able to figure it out after doing a 4 month cycle of that to see if you like it. I personally think that 3 months bulk, 1 month cut is a nice way to break it up for someone with no competition or anything to get prepared for. It keeps the cuts short enough to be relatively quick, (you should be able to lose about 4-5 lbs in one month, give or take) and the bulk is just long enough to make some progress (you might be able to put on 5-10 lbs depending on your surplus and experience etc.) I'm not really sure what I favour, I might also like a 5 month bulk/1 month cut so the bulk can be enough to put on some more muscle and can sort of coincide with summer/winter kind of thing.
It's a good idea to do some calculations. If you pretend you are going to put on 2 lbs per week of (50% muscle/50% fat) then see how many weeks it takes you to get up to 15% BF, then do another calculation to subtract 1 lb of bodyfat (leave lean mass alone) per week until you get down to 12% BF (or whatever your goal BF is). Of course we know that those aren't completely accurate, but they are close enough to tell you what some of your benchmarks are so at least you know where to aim.
0 -
Are you only training twice a week? Or do you just switch back and forth every other day?
Every other day. But I wasn't very consistent during my bulk.I would also like to see your programming and example of your progression, as this is probaby the culprit if you didn't gain significant muscle. I'm not saying you didn't, I just can't see because of using the app and pic is too small.
I would take breaks once in a while and have to reset the weight when I started again...I'd also have no problem with you bulking for a short time either, but I wouldn't do a real 4-6 month bulk, just 1-2 month or something. Basically just to get your psyche back in the game.
At the moment, I'm thinking of maintaining until school starts again, then do a lean bulk for 3 months, and then a 1 month cut during exams and Christmas break. I never want to do a twelve week cut again. It really made me miserable. Is a cycle of mini-bulks and cuts a good idea?
I think that would be just fine. 3 month/1 month .It really depends on your goals and you will be able to figure it out after doing a 4 month cycle of that to see if you like it. I personally think that 3 months bulk, 1 month cut is a nice way to break it up for someone with no competition or anything to get prepared for. It keeps the cuts short enough to be relatively quick, (you should be able to lose about 4-5 lbs in one month, give or take) and the bulk is just long enough to make some progress (you might be able to put on 5-10 lbs depending on your surplus and experience etc.) I'm not really sure what I favour, I might also like a 5 month bulk/1 month cut so the bulk can be enough to put on some more muscle and can sort of coincide with summer/winter kind of thing.
It's a good idea to do some calculations. If you pretend you are going to put on 2 lbs per week of (50% muscle/50% fat) then see how many weeks it takes you to get up to 15% BF, then do another calculation to subtract 1 lb of bodyfat (leave lean mass alone) per week until you get down to 12% BF (or whatever your goal BF is). Of course we know that those aren't completely accurate, but they are close enough to tell you what some of your benchmarks are so at least you know where to aim.
My thinking was somewhat like this: 12 week bulk @ .5 lbs./week = 3 lbs. muscle / 3 lbs. fat. - 4 week cut @ 2 lbs./week = -8 lbs. (mostly fat). Total weight change = +3 lbs. muscle, -5 lbs. fat. Over each cycle I would get a little bit leaner each time. Then as I get leaner I could gradually increase the duration of the bulks. Of course I'm assuming the muscle loss would be very minimal, something like .2 lbs. every cut.
Either way, I definitely want to try a short bulk/cut cycle. It would be easier to stay motivated and not get bored of my diet.
0 -
Are you only training twice a week? Or do you just switch back and forth every other day?
Every other day. But I wasn't very consistent during my bulk.I would also like to see your programming and example of your progression, as this is probaby the culprit if you didn't gain significant muscle. I'm not saying you didn't, I just can't see because of using the app and pic is too small.
I would take breaks once in a while and have to reset the weight when I started again...I'd also have no problem with you bulking for a short time either, but I wouldn't do a real 4-6 month bulk, just 1-2 month or something. Basically just to get your psyche back in the game.
At the moment, I'm thinking of maintaining until school starts again, then do a lean bulk for 3 months, and then a 1 month cut during exams and Christmas break. I never want to do a twelve week cut again. It really made me miserable. Is a cycle of mini-bulks and cuts a good idea?
I think that would be just fine. 3 month/1 month .It really depends on your goals and you will be able to figure it out after doing a 4 month cycle of that to see if you like it. I personally think that 3 months bulk, 1 month cut is a nice way to break it up for someone with no competition or anything to get prepared for. It keeps the cuts short enough to be relatively quick, (you should be able to lose about 4-5 lbs in one month, give or take) and the bulk is just long enough to make some progress (you might be able to put on 5-10 lbs depending on your surplus and experience etc.) I'm not really sure what I favour, I might also like a 5 month bulk/1 month cut so the bulk can be enough to put on some more muscle and can sort of coincide with summer/winter kind of thing.
It's a good idea to do some calculations. If you pretend you are going to put on 2 lbs per week of (50% muscle/50% fat) then see how many weeks it takes you to get up to 15% BF, then do another calculation to subtract 1 lb of bodyfat (leave lean mass alone) per week until you get down to 12% BF (or whatever your goal BF is). Of course we know that those aren't completely accurate, but they are close enough to tell you what some of your benchmarks are so at least you know where to aim.
My thinking was somewhat like this: 12 week bulk @ .5 lbs./week = 3 lbs. muscle / 3 lbs. fat. - 4 week cut @ 2 lbs./week = -8 lbs. (mostly fat). Total weight change = +3 lbs. muscle, -5 lbs. fat. Over each cycle I would get a little bit leaner each time. Then as I get leaner I could gradually increase the duration of the bulks. Of course I'm assuming the muscle loss would be very minimal, something like .2 lbs. every cut.
Either way, I definitely want to try a short bulk/cut cycle. It would be easier to stay motivated and not get bored of my diet.
I think you've got the right idea. Your bulk seems about right, the cut of 2 lbs per week will be hard but you might as well cut as fast as you can in the first few weeks. A good limit is sometimes espoused as 25% less than TDEE, if you go lower you may risk more muscle loss than necessary. 1,000 calories per day deficit is tough slogging.2
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