Bulking and cardio?

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widmer3
widmer3 Posts: 94 Member
in Fitness and Exercise
I'm currently in my first bulk ever; I'm trying to put on 2 solid lbs of muscle in 4 weeks, which of course comes with another 4 lbs or so of fat (the carbs call to me!), so my first impulse is to run to the treadmill. However, I've been told that cardio is counterproductive to muscle gain. Is this true? How much is ok, and how much is too much? And why?

Thanks!

Replies

  • wellbert
    wellbert Posts: 3,924 Member
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    If the cardio causes you to go into a calorie deficit, that could be an issue.


    You say currently..I see 1400 calories... 1700 calories... Did you just start today? Because usually people bulk with 3500-4500 calories a day.
  • Determinednoob
    Determinednoob Posts: 2,001 Member
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    It burns the calories that could otherwise go into building new muscle. In that regard, you just eat more to compensate. You need to also make sure the cardio is not vigorous enough to hinder muscle recovery to the point of slowing your progression (adding weight and\or reps to lifts)

    Doing cardio on a bulk does NOT prevent fat gain. The best way to do that is to have your calorie surplus just enough for minimal fat gain to occur which signals that you are getting max muscle gain.
  • vtachycardia
    vtachycardia Posts: 374
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    No, it doesn't. That's that.

    Google - cardio destroys muscle myth

    2lb of muscle in a month, good luck
  • lululucky1
    lululucky1 Posts: 39 Member
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    I have read the same thing....they say don't waste ur time on the treadmill after lifting if you want to bulk.
  • JulsCFdelouest
    JulsCFdelouest Posts: 4 Member
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    It can be counter productive if you are trying to get stronger and bigger and fast. A little fat goes a long way, if you manage to eat clean after your strength phase, you should ave no problem leaning out. If you really feel you must do "cardio" stick to really short and intense pieces.
  • Inforthelonghaul
    Inforthelonghaul Posts: 33
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    It can be counter productive if you are trying to get stronger and bigger and fast. A little fat goes a long way, if you manage to eat clean after your strength phase, you should ave no problem leaning out. If you really feel you must do "cardio" stick to really short and intense pieces.

    Second this.

    Stick to High Intensity Interval Training (HIIT) and separate you cardio and weights sessions by eight hours if you're going to do them the same day.
  • myofibril
    myofibril Posts: 4,500 Member
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    It's not counterproductive (in fact it has some benefits) but it is a good idea to limit it. If you are working out 3 - 4 times a week then 20 -30 minutes of LISS after each workout will be fine.

    Obviously good diet is the key but cardio can provide a little "insurance policy" against your diet being sloppier than it should be.

    ETA: this is a fairly good article on how to incorporate cardio into your programme and its benefits:

    http://blog.holygrailbodytransformation.com/?p=112
  • BigGuy47
    BigGuy47 Posts: 1,768 Member
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    I'm trying to put on 2 solid lbs of muscle in 4 weeks
    This is an unrealistic goal. If you work hard at it you might gain between 1/2 - 1 lb in a month.
  • wellbert
    wellbert Posts: 3,924 Member
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    I'm trying to put on 2 solid lbs of muscle in 4 weeks
    This is an unrealistic goal. If you work hard at it you might gain between 1/2 - 1 lb in a month.

    I think it's certainly possible, for a total beginner, at his age, with a very hard training regime and a LOT of calories.
  • widmer3
    widmer3 Posts: 94 Member
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    Hm, well I am a beginner, but I'm also a woman (which explains the lower calorie intake), so I could see how it's unrealistic. I really don't know where I got that number to begin with, honestly. Is 1 lb in a month more realistic?
  • ninerbuff
    ninerbuff Posts: 48,663 Member
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    The cardio WON'T stop fat gain. And if you're looking to put on a SOLID 2lbs of muscle in 4 weeks, then your nutrition is going to have to be pretty much spot on, your training spot on and not over done, rest HAS to be adequate, and you may have to add more than just 2lbs of fat to do it.
    2lbs of muscle for a guy would be tough to do.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 28+ years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
  • wellbert
    wellbert Posts: 3,924 Member
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    Hm, well I am a beginner, but I'm also a woman (which explains the lower calorie intake), so I could see how it's unrealistic. I really don't know where I got that number to begin with, honestly. Is 1 lb in a month more realistic?

    DOH, I'm sorry! I got confused by the profile pic and totally didn't even read the pronoun in the profile.

    1lb/month is probably more realistic then. You still need to eat a lot more than 1350 calories. Think maintenance + 500 a day.

    Another common one is Bodyweight x 22 (or 24) = Calories. So if you weigh 120, you would eat 2600-2800 calories a day, roughly. You'll want to keep an eye on this, and check body fat levels/weight to make sure it isn;t too much or too little.


    What lifting program are you on?

    I highly suggest checking out the online site/blog Lift Big Eat Big.
  • Martucha123
    Martucha123 Posts: 1,093 Member
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    I think aiming for 0.5-1 lbs of muscle is more realistic
    Eat 250 kcal surplus and hope that 0.5 lbs will be muscle, and the rest (1-1.5 lbs) fat
  • widmer3
    widmer3 Posts: 94 Member
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    I'm not on a program, per se. I do Back and Chest on Sundays, Legs on Wednesdays, Arms on Friday, and abs/cardio tuesday and saturday. I have New rules of lifting for women, and I've heard Starting Strength is supposed to be good, but all my lifts are going up so it seems to be working for me right now.
  • vtachycardia
    vtachycardia Posts: 374
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    I'm not on a program, per se. I do Back and Chest on Sundays, Legs on Wednesdays, Arms on Friday, and abs/cardio tuesday and saturday. I have New rules of lifting for women, and I've heard Starting Strength is supposed to be good, but all my lifts are going up so it seems to be working for me right now.

    Who gave you that split to work on? Because it is terrible. Look at the 4 day Power Muscle Burn on www.muscleandstrength.com it may be more suitable for someone wanting to gain pounds. I certainly like that program as a split.

    Back and chest on the same day, and an arm day lordy lordy.
  • wellbert
    wellbert Posts: 3,924 Member
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    I'm not on a program, per se. I do Back and Chest on Sundays, Legs on Wednesdays, Arms on Friday, and abs/cardio tuesday and saturday. I have New rules of lifting for women, and I've heard Starting Strength is supposed to be good, but all my lifts are going up so it seems to be working for me right now.

    I wouldn't do a split right now. You aren't advanced enough to need one. Your body can handle whole-body days for at least a year.

    I'd suggest going with Stronglifts 5x5, but definitely read Starting Strength. (5x5 when doing bar is easy, but you'll probably end up doing 3x5 when it gets heavy.)

    or New Rules, since you have it.
  • Determinednoob
    Determinednoob Posts: 2,001 Member
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    I'm not on a program, per se. I do Back and Chest on Sundays, Legs on Wednesdays, Arms on Friday, and abs/cardio tuesday and saturday. I have New rules of lifting for women, and I've heard Starting Strength is supposed to be good, but all my lifts are going up so it seems to be working for me right now.

    I wouldn't do a split right now. You aren't advanced enough to need one. Your body can handle whole-body days for at least a year.

    I'd suggest going with Stronglifts 5x5, but definitely read Starting Strength. (5x5 when doing bar is easy, but you'll probably end up doing 3x5 when it gets heavy.)

    or New Rules, since you have it.

    SL or SS are good. The one linked below is also very good. The second link has a ton of info for muscle building\fat loss\nutrition

    http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=147447933

    http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/686963-large-collection-of-info-for-beginners
  • wellbert
    wellbert Posts: 3,924 Member
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    All Pro's routine is pretty sweet for sure.
  • widmer3
    widmer3 Posts: 94 Member
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    Great, thanks for all the advice guys! I upped my calories so I'll be eating 1810 on workout days and 1550 on rest days. I'm going to up my reps and stick to the main lifts (deadlifts, squats, overhead press, etc). My protein intake has always been pretty good (~100g) but I need to cut down on the carbs for sure.

    I'll give an update when I'm done with my first cut! Hopefully it'll all pay off. =]
  • Determinednoob
    Determinednoob Posts: 2,001 Member
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    Great, thanks for all the advice guys! I upped my calories so I'll be eating 1810 on workout days and 1550 on rest days. I'm going to up my reps and stick to the main lifts (deadlifts, squats, overhead press, etc). My protein intake has always been pretty good (~100g) but I need to cut down on the carbs for sure.

    I'll give an update when I'm done with my first cut! Hopefully it'll all pay off. =]

    You don't really need low carb on a bulk. I realize we are a bit different ;) but as an example, I am shooting for ~300 per day with 250 pro and 110 fat.

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