Effective Running technique??

bruceinthepit88
bruceinthepit88 Posts: 136
in Fitness and Exercise
Hey guys,

Just wanted to clear up a few things regarding the proper running technique. I have read on the web that the right way is to not land on the heels (so that the whole body and the hip does not take the shock) and instead to land on the toes so that the spring action of the ankles absorb the shock.

Is this the general consensus? A few of us are interested to know more. Appreciate your thoughts.

Cheers !

P.S: Also, landing on the toes also gets a little painful after a while, since the ankle joint is also taking a sort of hit. Is this a good trade-off or would that also have long term effects?
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Replies

  • laelaelae
    laelaelae Posts: 3
    Hey! Thanks for starting the topic! Same questions and I am also wondering about short steps versus longer steps, and how much should we higher our knees while running. and what should we do with the arms! :) thank you to all the runners! For the moment, I cannot run, but alternate run and walk keeping my HR between 135 and 175... L
  • wolfgate
    wolfgate Posts: 321 Member
    A topic where everyone seems to have an opinion. Back to the mantra - we're all an experiment of one.

    First, nobody advocates landing on the toes. They do advocate a forefoot (ball of the foot) landing. Even that appears very close to a flat foot landing. If you follow their foot through it's cycle on the ground, it makes contact ball - heel - ball.

    Second, while some will come in here and say that is the only way to run, that may not be for you. Minimalist running, which necessitates a forefoot landing, is the craze right now. But it's not for everyone.

    There are many successful runners who land gently on the heel. Done correctly, that looks almost like a flat foot landing as well, with the contact point close to under the center of gravity. An error some make with heel landing is to overstride. Another is to point toes up and drive heel in to ground. All landings should be soft.

    A majority of distance runners heel land. That number is decreasing as more try forefoot landing. Many try and find it works for them. many try and go back.

    We're all an experiment of one.
  • wolfgate
    wolfgate Posts: 321 Member
    Hey! Thanks for starting the topic! Same questions and I am also wondering about short steps versus longer steps, and how much should we higher our knees while running. and what should we do with the arms! :) thank you to all the runners! For the moment, I cannot run, but alternate run and walk keeping my HR between 135 and 175... L

    Try to work up to about 180 steps per minute or so. That will in general result in a shorter step. Land close to under your center of gravity. As you pick up speed, stride lenght will increase - behind you, not in front. You do not stride farther forward when you go faster.

    Arms - relaxed, loose wrists. Roughly 90 degrees at elbow. Swinging forward to back. Hand should not cross center of chest. Relaxed. (Did I say relaxed yet?)
  • tri10806
    tri10806 Posts: 192 Member
    This is my recommendation from the New Balance Good Form Running:

    - Contact ground MIDFOOT first.
    - Entire foot lands softly and under hip line.
    - Run light, avaoid pounding.
    - Landing on MIDFOOT promotes a balanced running position minimizing friction (braking).

    There is a lot more good information here:

    http://www.goodformrunning.com/
  • ahamm002
    ahamm002 Posts: 1,690 Member
    Try to work up to about 180 steps per minute or so. That will in general result in a shorter step. Land close to under your center of gravity. As you pick up speed, stride lenght will increase - behind you, not in front. You do not stride farther forward when you go faster.

    Arms - relaxed, loose wrists. Roughly 90 degrees at elbow. Swinging forward to back. Hand should not cross center of chest. Relaxed. (Did I say relaxed yet?)

    180 steps per minutes would be quite a shuffling gate for anyone who isn't running at a fast pace. I believe 180 steps per minutes is what most top marathon runners do, but they're also running 5 minute miles.
  • scottb81
    scottb81 Posts: 2,538 Member
    P.S: Also, landing on the toes also gets a little painful after a while, since the ankle joint is also taking a sort of hit. Is this a good trade-off or would that also have long term effects?
    Your ankle as well as your arch, calves, and tendons will get stronger if you keep doing it. It takes a while but eventually you can run any distance on your fore/midfoot without pain. For me, I have less pain because all my knee problems were eliminated.
  • schicksa
    schicksa Posts: 123 Member
    I have a bum ankle (broke it about 2 years ago) and am just getting back to running. I like to land mid-foot/towards the hell and roll forward. Smaller steps until I'm stronger, then increase your stride and speed.
  • wolfgate
    wolfgate Posts: 321 Member
    Try to work up to about 180 steps per minute or so. That will in general result in a shorter step. Land close to under your center of gravity. As you pick up speed, stride lenght will increase - behind you, not in front. You do not stride farther forward when you go faster.

    Arms - relaxed, loose wrists. Roughly 90 degrees at elbow. Swinging forward to back. Hand should not cross center of chest. Relaxed. (Did I say relaxed yet?)

    180 steps per minutes would be quite a shuffling gate for anyone who isn't running at a fast pace. I believe 180 steps per minutes is what most top marathon runners do, but they're also running 5 minute miles.

    180 is roughly what I run racing 5ks. It's roughly what I run on a much (more than 3 min/mile) slower recovery run. It's the stride length that changes. There is some drop going slower, but not much - maybe 10 steps each way. So I'd be closer to 190 racing and 170 jogging. It's about dead on for a standard training run.

    180 is a standard for optimal running cadence. google "running steps per minute" and you'll see the amount of information that comes up pointed at 180.

    Having said all that - again - we're all an experiment of one.
  • scottb81
    scottb81 Posts: 2,538 Member
    Try to work up to about 180 steps per minute or so. That will in general result in a shorter step. Land close to under your center of gravity. As you pick up speed, stride lenght will increase - behind you, not in front. You do not stride farther forward when you go faster.

    Arms - relaxed, loose wrists. Roughly 90 degrees at elbow. Swinging forward to back. Hand should not cross center of chest. Relaxed. (Did I say relaxed yet?)

    180 steps per minutes would be quite a shuffling gate for anyone who isn't running at a fast pace. I believe 180 steps per minutes is what most top marathon runners do, but they're also running 5 minute miles.

    180 is roughly what I run racing 5ks. It's roughly what I run on a much (more than 3 min/mile) slower recovery run. It's the stride length that changes. There is some drop going slower, but not much - maybe 10 steps.

    180 is a standard for optimal running cadence. google "running steps per minute" and you'll see the amount of information that comes up pointed at 180.
    I agree. Faster cadence with shorter stride is more efficient and easier on the legs. Mine is 180 to 184 running 5Ks. 190 to 200 on max efforts of a mile or shorter, and 170-176 for easy running.
  • DG_Allen
    DG_Allen Posts: 219 Member
    Learning to forefoot run cured my knee pain and made me a much faster runner.

    Regarding the 180 steps per minute, it takes time to learn how to do it when running at a slow pace, but it is doable and it does produce a much smoother and easier run.

    Here's how I think about it, you want to propel your body forward (your center of mass behind your belly button) so why would you want to throw your legs and feet out in front of you and put on the brakes?? To move the body forward, the legs go back. Landing on the forefoot is much easier when the feet land under the body and go back while the body falls forward.

    Good luck with your running!
  • PitBullMom_Liz
    PitBullMom_Liz Posts: 339 Member
    When I tried running in the past I did a heel strike and would get crazy shin splints so I'd quit. Never got past like week 3 of the C25K program. Now that I'm running with a mid-foot strike (and in Vibrams) I haven't had shin splints once, and my first 5K is next weekend.
  • usera1365
    usera1365 Posts: 146 Member
    bump
  • tubaman58
    tubaman58 Posts: 151
    If you follow things like Runner's world and the NY Times Wellness section, you find out that the answer is complicated....

    People vary a lot.... don't try too hard to alter your technique....nudge it in different directions and listen to your body.... then look at the results over time...
  • MrDude_1
    MrDude_1 Posts: 2,510 Member
    the best advice I can give would be to try to not slam your heels... by doing that, you will be landing further forward on your foot... now if you end up with a ball or a midfoot strike will depend on you..

    once I did that in high school, i ran the 3 cross country seasons without any pain at all.
  • StandardFiend
    StandardFiend Posts: 9 Member
    I just got into running a few weeks ago, and when I first started I landed on my heels because I didn't know any better. I'd come home with AWFUL shin splints that put me on the couch for the rest of the day. After doing some research I changed it up, corrected my form to straight back, elbows at 90 degrees, hands loose, and started landing mid foot, and the pain has been reduced by half. I'm still feeling it because, well, I went from completely out of shape to running, but it's getting easier to manage and I worry about it a lot less now. :) Just my experience with what has worked for me.
  • mandypizzle
    mandypizzle Posts: 633 Member
    Hmmmmm I've never given it much thought. I just run. I'll have to pay attention next time. I try to land lightly and not pound it like someone mentioned. But I think I land on my heals/midfoot. I don't know about the minimalist/barefoot thing. It seems more of a trendy thing than anything.... doesn't seem comfortable to run barefoot or land on the balls of the foot (unless going downhill) to me but who knows. I may try different forms this week and see what difference it makes. I run a LOT of uphill/downhill so it's hard to change it up too drastically and be comfortable.
  • SassyCalyGirl
    SassyCalyGirl Posts: 1,932 Member
    the best thing to do is go to your local running store to have your gait evaluated. They will also fit you for proper running shoes based on how you pronate. Under or over pronators should not wear minimalistic running shoes as they offer the least amount of stability.

    a mid-foot strike is correct. I used to heel strike and now have Achilles tendonitis because of it. Once I made the correction, no more pain and no more shin splints.
  • Zomoniac
    Zomoniac Posts: 1,169 Member
    I destroyed my achilles through heel landing, was out for about 6 months. But some manage just fine. Go with what works, you don't know what it is until you try. For me, I land pretty much flat for distance running, a slight lean forwards towards the ball if anything. For a full sprint I'm not entirely sure myself what I'm doing as I've never watched it in slow-motion and the action's too quick for me to transcribe but it feels like it's almost done on tiptoes, with a toe-ball-toe effect rocking back over the pivoting ball finishing in a spring motion.
  • Zomoniac
    Zomoniac Posts: 1,169 Member
    Incidentally my last post refers to running on a flat. Even at slow speeds if I'm on a noticeable incline either up or down I'll always land front-footed.
  • CarsonRuns
    CarsonRuns Posts: 3,039 Member
    Try to work up to about 180 steps per minute or so. That will in general result in a shorter step. Land close to under your center of gravity. As you pick up speed, stride lenght will increase - behind you, not in front. You do not stride farther forward when you go faster.

    Arms - relaxed, loose wrists. Roughly 90 degrees at elbow. Swinging forward to back. Hand should not cross center of chest. Relaxed. (Did I say relaxed yet?)

    180 steps per minutes would be quite a shuffling gate for anyone who isn't running at a fast pace. I believe 180 steps per minutes is what most top marathon runners do, but they're also running 5 minute miles.

    I run at about 175 steps per minute when I'm running at a 10:00 mile pace or a 6:00 mile pace. Turnover is independent of pace.
  • phillieschic
    phillieschic Posts: 615
    I land mid foot and have never had any problems.
  • ahamm002
    ahamm002 Posts: 1,690 Member
    180 is a standard for optimal running cadence. google "running steps per minute" and you'll see the amount of information that comes up pointed at 180.

    The 180 cadence initially comes from studies done on marathon runners. It was found that the top marathoners had a 180 cadence, whereas many recreational and casual marathon runners had a much lower 120-130 cadence. Therefore it was deduced that 180 is the optimal long distance running cadence and many people started trying to increase their cadence to 180. However, the 180 cadence is likely a function of the top marathon runner's speeds. That is, they have a high cadence b/c they are running five minute miles. They don't run five minute miles because they have a high cadence.
  • ahamm002
    ahamm002 Posts: 1,690 Member
    If you follow things like Runner's world and the NY Times Wellness section, you find out that the answer is complicated....

    People vary a lot.... don't try too hard to alter your technique....nudge it in different directions and listen to your body.... then look at the results over time...

    Exactly, trying to run in a way that doesn't feel natural to you is a very good way to get injured.
  • zmoreno10
    zmoreno10 Posts: 69 Member
    I'm a forefoot runner myself, however, I wasn't always this way.

    I began training in June of '11 and then I ran my first two half marathons (Dec '11 and Jan '12) striking on my heel. Around the November mark, I noticed that my recovery times were taking a little longer as my training intensified (More miles = more recovery time, right?); but what troubled me was that while the muscles recovered within hours, the joints took days to feel better. So, after my second half marathon, I started investigating forefoot running and eventually decided it was worth a shot.

    I began re-training myself, and once my body got used to the change, forefoot running feels completely natural to me. My joints feel much better now and my race pace has improved. If I am running and my form changes for some odd reason, i notice it immediately because the heel strike feels so foreign to me.

    And for the record, you don't need to switch to minimalist shoes to be a forefoot runner. I run using Kayano 17's and GT2170's [Asics], both of which have a good sized heel on them and lots of cushioning. As long as you pay close attention to your form when you start off, you can learn to run forefoot in any shoe.
  • CarsonRuns
    CarsonRuns Posts: 3,039 Member
    180 is a standard for optimal running cadence. google "running steps per minute" and you'll see the amount of information that comes up pointed at 180.

    The 180 cadence initially comes from studies done on marathon runners. It was found that the top marathoners had a 180 cadence, whereas many recreational and casual marathon runners had a much lower 120-130 cadence. Therefore it was deduced that 180 is the optimal long distance running cadence and many people started trying to increase their cadence to 180. However, the 180 cadence is likely a function of the top marathon runner's speeds. They do 5 minute miles.

    Again, turnover rate is independent of pace.
  • zmoreno10
    zmoreno10 Posts: 69 Member
    Everybody needs to run in the way that works best for them and their body... Some professional marathoners heel strike, some don't. It all depends on you.

    Just as a side note though, for those that feel forefoot running is just a trend, try this little experiment. Take off your shoes, and find a nice little area to run in, be it wood, tile, grass, carpet, whatever...

    Now, Run/Jog barefoot.

    Most folks who do this will automatically begin running on the balls of your feet, especially if you are on harder surfaces. Why? Because the jarring sensation of your heel hitting the ground is not comfortable at all, especially if you are a larger person like me.

    When you put your comfy shoes on with the nice sole and lots of cushioning, the shoe absorbs some of the impact so its easier to heel strike when you run.

    [I am not knocking comfy running shoes as my current shoes are big comfy Asics]
  • cwelch2677
    cwelch2677 Posts: 69 Member
    Look up Chi running. I think that's what most of the posts are trying to explain in reference to form.
  • ahamm002
    ahamm002 Posts: 1,690 Member
    180 is a standard for optimal running cadence. google "running steps per minute" and you'll see the amount of information that comes up pointed at 180.

    The 180 cadence initially comes from studies done on marathon runners. It was found that the top marathoners had a 180 cadence, whereas many recreational and casual marathon runners had a much lower 120-130 cadence. Therefore it was deduced that 180 is the optimal long distance running cadence and many people started trying to increase their cadence to 180. However, the 180 cadence is likely a function of the top marathon runner's speeds. They do 5 minute miles.

    Again, turnover rate is independent of pace.

    It's far more complicated than that.
  • muddyventures
    muddyventures Posts: 360 Member
    I'm no expert, but I do have an opinion...:tongue:
    your body will tell you to change the way you run, I tried to change my running according to the advice of a friend and a long time runner and it was almost a game ender for me. I started running the way I naturally was inclined to run, and am wearing a more minimal shoe (not a minimalst at all) and my whole body feels better. I have taken the time to watch my foot placement as I tended to run like an inline skater, I also had my daughter video my run.. and what looked like a person landing whole-flat foot on the gournd actually turned out to be landing forefoot. I also take my headphones off once in awhile and listen to my feet hitting the ground... I don't believe in pounding the pavement.. it should be a little more fluid.
  • californiagirl2012
    californiagirl2012 Posts: 2,625 Member
    I switch it up. Sometimes as I get stronger I just feel like running on the balls of my feet. I have arthritis in my hips and this seems to help make my hips feel better. But sometimes I don't feel like it but I focus on at least rolling to the ball of the foot so that the impact isn't such a hard slam.

    I have found certain weight training is making my legs strong for my runs and when I feel like going faster I tend to run on the balls of my feet too.

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