Whey protien VS. Soy

crossroad2012
crossroad2012 Posts: 84 Member
in Food and Nutrition
Hi! I decided to try using protien shakes after my workout, since my stomach is in no mood for food after. I bought Pure Protien Plus and saw it had both whey and soy protien. I noticed most people here use 100% Whey, so it got me wondering if I screwed up and bought something that is not ideal. Did I just waste my money?

Thanks in advance :smile:

Replies

  • Vercell
    Vercell Posts: 437 Member
    I use soy cause whey protein has milk in it soy is better on my stomach. I think the only difference is the milk. I could be wrong so just my guess.
  • Doberdawn
    Doberdawn Posts: 733 Member
    Soy is vegetable based. Whey is milk based. If you have a dairy allergy like me, it is a non-issue and you have to use the soy. But, there are pros and cons to both. Whey protein is often favored because it has a higher level of protein per gram and it is more digestible. But, soy has its own benefits as it is higher in arginine and glutamine, both of which are important for muscle building. Arginine is well known as a stimulant of anabolic hormones that stimulate muscle formation, while glutamine is considered essential during metabolic stress. This article has some good info on it for you:

    http://www.mytopform.com/whey-protein-vs-soy-protein
  • crossroad2012
    crossroad2012 Posts: 84 Member
    Thank you for the replies! Going to read the article now.
  • colortheplanet
    colortheplanet Posts: 13
    Soy all the way! Dairy protein is **** for the body.
  • wham55
    wham55 Posts: 44
    Soy is vegetarian :) so i use that
  • NobodyInParticular
    NobodyInParticular Posts: 352 Member
    The body absorbs whey protein better than any other protein. While Soy protein is not as easy for the body to use. So when you take in 20 g of whey protein, you're body will use all 20 g (usually) while it may only use 10-15 g of the soy protein. I'm not sure about the numbers exactly but know that what you're intaking isn't actually what your body is getting. Whey protein and Whey Isolates are the top two protein sources the body can use followed by a whole egg. (The egg used to be the best until the creation of whey)
  • Doberdawn
    Doberdawn Posts: 733 Member
    The body absorbs whey protein better than any other protein. While Soy protein is not as easy for the body to use. So when you take in 20 g of whey protein, you're body will use all 20 g (usually) while it may only use 10-15 g of the soy protein. I'm not sure about the numbers exactly but know that what you're intaking isn't actually what your body is getting.

    If you're curious... the article I posted above has the details on absorption, etc.

    It seems as though it was not a waste of money given the arginine and glutamate benefits of a soy-whey mix... best of both worlds, it would seem, eh?
  • crossroad2012
    crossroad2012 Posts: 84 Member
    Yes, it does seem to be the best of both worlds. Even with the lower absorbtion of the soy, I will still be taking in more protien than what I was trying to eat.

    Thank you all for your help!

    P.S. That was a great article.
  • Doberdawn
    Doberdawn Posts: 733 Member
    Yes, it does seem to be the best of both worlds. Even with the lower absorbtion of the soy, I will still be taking in more protien than what I was trying to eat.

    Thank you all for your help!

    P.S. That was a great article.

    You're welcome. Glad to help.
  • bikinisuited
    bikinisuited Posts: 881 Member
    Yes, it does seem to be the best of both worlds. Even with the lower absorbtion of the soy, I will still be taking in more protien than what I was trying to eat.

    Thank you all for your help!

    P.S. That was a great article.

    Please know, soy protein has a different taste and smell that I dislike period. I am finishing up soy vanilla flavored and taste is not the great. Whey has a tasteless but better for smoothies in my opinion. Good luck!
  • AbsoluteNG
    AbsoluteNG Posts: 1,079 Member
    The body absorbs whey protein better than any other protein. While Soy protein is not as easy for the body to use. So when you take in 20 g of whey protein, you're body will use all 20 g (usually) while it may only use 10-15 g of the soy protein. I'm not sure about the numbers exactly but know that what you're intaking isn't actually what your body is getting. Whey protein and Whey Isolates are the top two protein sources the body can use followed by a whole egg. (The egg used to be the best until the creation of whey)

    Misinformation and I'd like to see the research paper on this if I am wrong but I don't believe that to be the case. There's a lot of misinformation in the fitness world and I have no doubt in my mind that this is one of them as there is a huge market war between Cow Milk and Soy Milk. If your body needs all 20 grams of protein, it will use all 20 grams of protein. Your body will not waste 5 grams of protein just because it comes from a plant. That's like saying I went to fill up my tank of gas with unleaded but since it wasn't supreme, it will only burn 1/2 of what i pour in at the pump.
  • SoulNeedsBeauty
    SoulNeedsBeauty Posts: 154 Member
    sometimes those 20 g are not easily accessible for your body, your reasoning is off.
  • AbsoluteNG
    AbsoluteNG Posts: 1,079 Member
    sometimes those 20 g are not easily accessible for your body, your reasoning is off.

    From the Journal of International Society of Sports and Nutrition.

    Resistance training with soy vs whey protein supplements in hyperlipidemic males
    http://www.jissn.com/content/6/1/8

    Results
    All 3 groups had significant gains in strength, averaging 47% in all major muscle groups and significant increases in fat free mass (2.6%), with no difference among groups. Percent body fat and waist-to-hip ratio decreased significantly in all 3 groups an average of 8% and 2%, respectively, with no difference among groups. Total serum cholesterol decreased significantly, again with no difference among groups.
    Discussion
    The principle findings of this study were that 12 weeks of resistance exercise training significantly increased muscle strength and fat free mass and significantly decreased waist-to-hip ratio, percent body fat, and total serum cholesterol in overweight, hyperlipidemic men. All groups had an equal reduction in total cholesterol, although the ratio of LDL cholesterol to HDL cholesterol tended to improve more in the soy group. These results provide further support for a structured resistance training program to improve strength and the cardiovascular risk profile of sedentary, overweight adult men desiring to improve their overall health.


    Edit: You should probably take note that the soy group improved the good cholesterol over the bad cholesterol more so than the cow based product.


    Conclusion
    Our findings add to the growing evidence that resistance training is beneficial for reducing cardiovascular risk. Our results suggest that protein supplementation is not necessary for strength or body composition changes in overweight men consuming a diet with an adequate supply of amino acids to meet the needs for stimulation of muscle protein synthesis during resistance exercise. Resistance exercise training alone increases muscle mass and improves body composition measures in sedentary, overweight men. Soy based protein supplements appear to be as effective as animal-based protein to support strength gains. Our results also suggest that soy protein supplementation during resistance training warrants further study in larger samples over longer periods of time since previous work has shown that regular soy consumption improves lipid profiles and the insulin-to-glucagon ratio and lowers oxidative stress


    Edit: To put it in a better perspective, the lobbyist behind Cow products is so rich and powerful that they had the food pyramid dedicate one entire section to Cow Milk based products. (The food pyramid is no longer used and it's replacement does not have a section dedicated entirely to Cow Milk based products)
  • Doberdawn
    Doberdawn Posts: 733 Member
    sometimes those 20 g are not easily accessible for your body, your reasoning is off.

    Edit: You should probably take note that the soy group improved the good cholesterol over the bad cholesterol more so than the cow based product.

    The cholesterol will have dropped in the soy users because of the arginine which I mentioned above. It has been shown to have a positive effect on cholesterol levels. But, there has also been some scientific data that the whey is more readily digestible. The numbers by which they differ, however, IMHO (tho I'm no nutritionist or whatever) will probably not make that much of a monumental difference. I believe it was like 99 vs 114... something like that. I think we should focus on the concern of the original poster though... was it a waste of money? No. Both provide sources of protein. And by purchasing a hybrid mix, the best of both worlds can be added to the regimen.
  • AbsoluteNG
    AbsoluteNG Posts: 1,079 Member
    sometimes those 20 g are not easily accessible for your body, your reasoning is off.

    Edit: You should probably take note that the soy group improved the good cholesterol over the bad cholesterol more so than the cow based product.

    The cholesterol will have dropped in the soy users because of the arginine which I mentioned above. It has been shown to have a positive effect on cholesterol levels. But, there has also been some scientific data that the whey is more readily digestible. The numbers by which they differ, however, IMHO (tho I'm no nutritionist or whatever) will probably not make that much of a monumental difference. I believe it was like 99 vs 114... something like that. I think we should focus on the concern of the original poster though... was it a waste of money? No. Both provide sources of protein. And by purchasing a hybrid mix, the best of both worlds can be added to the regimen.

    If you have some of that research I'd like to see it as long as it is from a credible source but at the end of the day, it doesn't matter as the over all end result will be the same as shown from the study above. Same muscle gains no matter the protein source. If your body needs the protein, it will use the protein. It doesn't disregard it just because it came from a plant.
  • AbsoluteNG
    AbsoluteNG Posts: 1,079 Member
    Here's an article from bodybuilding.com about Whey vs Soy. When people say absorption, they are really talking about the rate of digestion. Soy protein will stay inside of your stomach longer than Whey protein but there is no difference in how much protein your muscles will take from either protein source.

    http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/drobson71.htm
  • Doberdawn
    Doberdawn Posts: 733 Member
    Hey... this is for the original poster: here's an article you may want to read... it talks about a new study that says specifically that using the MIX of proteins IS most effective. This was a double-blind, randomized clinical trial in nineteen young adults before and after ingestion of ~19 grams of protein from the blend or ~17.5 grams of whey protein (10 and 9, respectively, per group).

    http://www.solae.com/About-Solae/News-Center/News-Releases/2012/2012-04-23-Protein-Blends.aspx
  • Doberdawn
    Doberdawn Posts: 733 Member
    If you have some of that research I'd like to see it as long as it is from a credible source but at the end of the day, it doesn't matter as the over all end result will be the same as shown from the study above. Same muscle gains no matter the protein source. If your body needs the protein, it will use the protein. It doesn't disregard it just because it came from a plant.

    I don't tend to keep research lying around in piles. LOL Sorry. Everyone on here always wants a quote or cite. It's not my thang. I'm not writing a dissertation. I read it to glean what I need to know to use in my daily life and then pitch it. But, here is one article that I read recently ... so it hadn't made it into file 13 yet. <g> You might find it interesting and should find it authoritative (the Journal of Applied Phsyiology):

    "We conclude that the feeding-induced simulation of MPS [mixed muscle protein synthesis] in young men is greater after whey hydrolysate or soy protein consumption than casein both at rest and after resistance exercise; moreover, despite both being fast proteins, whey hydrolysate stimulated MPS to a greater degree than soy after resistance exercise. These differences may be related to how quickly the proteins are digested (i.e., fast vs. slow) or possibly to small differences in leucine content of each protein."

    Here's the cite: http://jap.physiology.org/content/107/3/987.full

    It has all the medical hoo-haa and details you might want to read to your heart's content. Go and knock yourself out! <g>
  • dinosnopro
    dinosnopro Posts: 2,177 Member
    Soy all the way! Dairy protein is **** for the body.


    LOL....wut?
  • crossroad2012
    crossroad2012 Posts: 84 Member
    Hey... this is for the original poster: here's an article you may want to read... it talks about a new study that says specifically that using the MIX of proteins IS most effective. This was a double-blind, randomized clinical trial in nineteen young adults before and after ingestion of ~19 grams of protein from the blend or ~17.5 grams of whey protein (10 and 9, respectively, per group).

    http://www.solae.com/About-Solae/News-Center/News-Releases/2012/2012-04-23-Protein-Blends.aspx


    Thank you I will certainly check this article out! I appreciate all the time you have all taken to address this. I am so used to making bad purchases...Finally a good one! :happy:
  • wazzanz
    wazzanz Posts: 78
    i was told as a male to avoid too much soy as it containes estrogen and will not be good for your man boobs.
  • AbsoluteNG
    AbsoluteNG Posts: 1,079 Member
    If you have some of that research I'd like to see it as long as it is from a credible source but at the end of the day, it doesn't matter as the over all end result will be the same as shown from the study above. Same muscle gains no matter the protein source. If your body needs the protein, it will use the protein. It doesn't disregard it just because it came from a plant.

    I don't tend to keep research lying around in piles. LOL Sorry. Everyone on here always wants a quote or cite. It's not my thang. I'm not writing a dissertation. I read it to glean what I need to know to use in my daily life and then pitch it. But, here is one article that I read recently ... so it hadn't made it into file 13 yet. <g> You might find it interesting and should find it authoritative (the Journal of Applied Phsyiology):

    "We conclude that the feeding-induced simulation of MPS [mixed muscle protein synthesis] in young men is greater after whey hydrolysate or soy protein consumption than casein both at rest and after resistance exercise; moreover, despite both being fast proteins, whey hydrolysate stimulated MPS to a greater degree than soy after resistance exercise. These differences may be related to how quickly the proteins are digested (i.e., fast vs. slow) or possibly to small differences in leucine content of each protein."

    Here's the cite: http://jap.physiology.org/content/107/3/987.full

    It has all the medical hoo-haa and details you might want to read to your heart's content. Go and knock yourself out! <g>

    Interesting study but it's a little biased. Quote below from the discussion. I should also note that the research grant for this study came from the U.S. National Dairy Council.
    We found that the consumption of whey protein hydrolysate stimulated MPS to a greater degree than casein both at rest and after resistance exercise. While FSR in the whey group tended to be greater than soy in the rested muscle, this did not reach statistical significance.


    Also, someone made a claim earlier that the body will waste a certain about of Soy Protein grams. This study does not show anything of that nature. The study is more about how fast the protein reaches your muscle and not really how much your muscle will utilize or waste.
  • AbsoluteNG
    AbsoluteNG Posts: 1,079 Member
    i was told as a male to avoid too much soy as it containes estrogen and will not be good for your man boobs.

    That's what the Dairy companies want you to believe, hah. I know i must sound silly but read the article from bodybuilding.com down below a detailed and more level headed version of the truth.
    http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/ivan3.htm
  • Doberdawn
    Doberdawn Posts: 733 Member
    Interesting study but it's a little biased. Quote below from the discussion. I should also note that the research grant for this study came from the U.S. National Dairy Council.

    Someone's gotta pay for it, that doesn't make it biased in result... there's a potential for financial influence, but that's always going to be the case. *shrug*
    Also, someone made a claim earlier that the body will waste a certain about of Soy Protein grams. This study does not show anything of that nature. The study is more about how fast the protein reaches your muscle and not really how much your muscle will utilize or waste.

    Are you honestly asking me now to produce articles to support SOMEONE ELSE's points? Really? I am not that bored. I have work to do and fun to have when my work's done.

    My point (see MY - not someone else's - original posts) was that the OP probably made a good purchase. There are pros and cons to BOTH protein sources. Whey is more efficient than the soy for some aspects (which this article supports - as requested), but the soy is higher in other healthy beneficial contents (e.g., arginine) and better for those properties. I said I thought the mix of the two was probably getting the best of both worlds. I believe I even said words to the effect that the areas in which the whey was higher like digestibility probably was not significant IMHO but I'm not a nutritionist. Yeppers, I definitely remember saying that. I have not at any point said the body wastes soy, have I? So, why would it matter whether or not the article I posted supports that? The article I posted supports what *I* said, that whey protein has been shown to be more digestible and efficient for some aspects/purposes.

    Do you READ what people post or just look for arguing points? Since the person you disagreed with won't argue with you, you want me to? I don't get it.

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