Bad foods 'in moderation' IIFYM
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I'm stuffing pumpkin pie in face whilst I'm reading this. :laugh:0
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That was my basic approach (with very limited success) until about the year 2000. Then I went on a low crap diet. I've never looked back.
I had a cookie at christmas in 2010. That was probably the most recent time. And it had probably been 8 years since I'd had one before then.
I haven't had a candy bar, etc. since about 2000.
I do eat tortilla chips sometimes. That's my primary indulgence, but yeah, when my diet isn't based on crap, eating crap in moderation is a LOT easier.
We generally have a dark chocolate candy bar in the house, and yeah, I have a square sometimes in the evening. :-)
I eat pizza, once in a blue moon. But not papa johns, dominos, pizza hut etc.
It's either whole wheat, or preferably, given my tummy, gluten free.
And it's not processed cardboard.0 -
I have no problem eating "bad" foods in moderation. I also don't believe in labeling foods as "bad" or "good". Overeating certain foods may be a bad choice. But you can also overeat the "good" foods too, and that's also a bad choice. In both situations food is being used to fill a void that probably wasn't caused by hunger. Get to the root of the problem that caused you to eat too much (whether it was "good" food or "bad" food) and you have really accomplished something.
I eat pepperoni pizza EVERY WEEK. I learned to be quite satisfied with 2 slices instead of the 4 or more that I ate previously. I bake cookies and breads almost every week, and I eat them. In normal portions.
You shouldn't ever do anything to lose weight that you're not willing to do for the rest of your life to maintain your weight. I don't know about you, but I don't plan on living the rest of my life without pizza and cookies and many other foods that you would probably label as "bad".0 -
This has nothing to do with IIFYM.0
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Comparing that to alcoholism is, in my view, ridiculous. Some people are going to be addicted to food, yes, but 1) alcohol changes the way the body and brain function in more detrimental ways than say, sugar or fats. 2) alcohol is the volume that alcoholics can drink it is much more dangerous than even the 200 grams of sugar binge people can eat, and 3) alcohol is NOT necessary for daily functioning, unlike food.
So really, what it's saying is if you have a certain food you love, don't run away from it. Me, personally? I will fully admit I have a sugar problem. I LOVE sugar. I even have to add sugar to my water or else the water tastes bad. But aside from that, I'm fully healthy. There is NO reason for me to shame myself for letting me spend 150 calories on candy corn. I don't use it as a vice for anything. My cravings aren't so strong that the rest of my life goes on hold. It isn't hurting my health. I'm simply more content with my diet when I still eat some sugar.
Now then, the saying doesn't always apply... some people who have real problems with food MIGHT have a certain food that they cannot moderate at all. If they're obese or it is causing terrible health problems, then yeah, cut that out. But even then, I think part of their health and fitness goals should be to look inside and figure out WHY they have those problems with insert food here. Then, they can try to add it back in moderation if they so have the desire. It'd be a long process, but you know, have a spouse or somebody close give them one oreo and not have the bag available anywhere (maybe take away the keys?) and see how they respond...
Of course that may just be my inner scientist wanting to do an independent experiment :P But really, while I was never super addicted to foods, I had problems stopping with sugary candies. I limited myself to only a few pieces a day, and while it was hard, it helped so that now I don't need to keep eating sugar even when I want it. It's been helpful, and I think more people would keep the weight off if they didn't think about what they "can't" have.0 -
"You can have anything as long as it's in moderation"
"You can eat anything as long as you meet your micronutrient and macronutrient goals"
Seriously?
Imagine sitting in front of the TV watching your favorite program and you are allowed to have 12 pieces of potato chips and 3 cookies.... You eat the food and tell yourself it's enough, but you are sitting there with all the residue of the chips and cookies in your mouth and while looking back in the kitchen you see the box of cookies looking right back at you.
Doing this is gonna have you hungry in 45 minutes...
Sure there are people who can do this, but I never understood eating bad foods 'in moderation.' It's like telling an alcoholic to just have one drink at night and telling him he will be OK when in reality, most alcoholics won't be able to do it.
Everyone always tries to view IIFYM to the extreme. In the end, macro and micro-nutrient sufficiency is required to work. Which means you are eating foods high in micro-nutrients (which subsequently also means that they are usually minimally processed, whole foods which are satiating).
The true genius of IIFYM is flexible dieting and dieting adherence. Its more sustainable long term if you don't deprive yourself of foods you love.
This pretty much nails it. Take the emotion out of it. Use common sense and follow your plan with your macros. That should leave you some room for the occaisional treat.
When it is seen as an "I can't enjoy(put fun food name here) because I can't control myself." Or, "eat what ever you want." Those 2 extremes are not the typical situation and if they are for you, you have emotional issues with food that need to be addressed.
Common sense and flexibility go a long way to staying on plan. If it's a struggle, you need to either look at yourself or reevaluate your plan. A plan that is too restrictive is self defeating. If you can't comply with the plan either you need to work on your self control or the plan is too restrictive.0 -
I eat everything in moderation. From chicken to pasta to cookies and candy. Everything is portioned out and I eat it all in reasonable amounts - good OR bad.
I refuse to tell myself I can't have something because it is "Bad". I feel like labeling food "good" or "bad" isn't a healthy way to look at food. But, that's MY opinion and it works for ME.
I've been in maintenance for two years with only normal weight fluctuations and I eat whatever I want to eat.0 -
take a day (or a meal) off. since you can't have a little of the bad thing, allow yourself for a meal or two a week where you can have anything you want. After a full plate of carbonara and a tiramisu (example) you won't feel deprived anymore. And of course it's not gonna ruin your diet, if you eat "good" for the rest of the week.
Skinny people eat junk food too.
So true. I feel like so-called 'naturally thin' people do this unconsciously, i.e. they might pig out on a night out with friends, but then the next day they will eat healthy food and/or exercise. It's what I'm trying to do now I'm eating at mostly maintenance level. I don't fret if I eat an extra slice of pizza because I know I can always make up for it tomorrow. I didn't gain weight because I ate more cookies than I intended one night. I gained weight because I did that EVERY night.
It's why I get slightly irritated when people say 'Oh I hate people who can eat anything they want and not gain weight'. I know there are some people who are like this, but I feel like there are more people who just lead more active, healthy lifestyles 80-90% of the time and that's why they stay slim.0 -
Hey guys, i've heard of this interesting concept about moderation, now lets distort it by talking about alcoholics.0
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Yes you can eat anything in moderation. If you do eat some of those cookies and chips and can not control yourself enough to stop at just the ones you have chosen to eat, then it's time to for therapy. I used to have a serious food addiction and thought I could never go without binging. But after years of therapy and eating healthy, I have learned that I do not NEED the food. It takes time and dedication but one can learn to eat anything in moderation and not feel the need to go back for more. I will admit I do struggle if I am under a lot of stress. I still have issues with emotional eating, but even this is getting better under control. Finding other ways to cope with the emotions is what one needs to work on.0
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I'm stuffing pumpkin pie in face whilst I'm reading this. :laugh:
Omg...want.0 -
Some people can and some people can't...Not everybody is an alcoholic and not everybody is addicted to food. I was raised to have an unhealthy relationship with food...but over the years I've redirected my thinking to look at food as fuel rather than my best friend. So I don't have a food addiction and therefore can have the occasional treat and still stay on the beam the rest of the time. I am, however, a recovered alcoholic who cannot drink in moderation so I stopped completely over 12 yrs ago. and I work 12 steps in my life on a daily basis to teach me how to live functionally without alcohol. Those 12 steps are for any addiction so may be helpful to someone with a food addiction, as well and are the same 12 steps of Overeaters Anonymous...0
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as part of my maintenance, i choose a Saturday every once in a while and go and get a burger and fries. on these days, i still try to keep the meal at a reasonable caloric level, and i do more exercise to make up for it. also, i cut calories elsewhere. same goes for Thanksgiving, Christmas, and Easter.
i eat very healthy most of the time, but occasionally, it's good to have something you don't usually eat, especially if you do the exercise to earn it.0 -
You are not "deprived" unless you want to be. Your body doesnt need that crap and if you abstain for a short time, you will lose the cravings for whatever it is you think you just have to have.
But I get enjoyment out of the occasional "goodie," whether that goodie is chocolate, ice cream, wine or jello shots. If I'm otherwise eating healthy, why not?
I think of it as entertainment for my tastebuds. :laugh: I don't want everything I watch on tv to be serious educational programming... sometimes I want to watch Wipeout. I don't only read Shakespeare... sometimes I want to read a comic book. I don't listen to only classical music... sometimes I want to listen to the Spice Girls. (Yeah, I said that.) I don't only want to do work-work and housework... sometimes I want to play video games or dance.
Why should how I eat be any different?
eating "goodies" for that reason is different ( to me anyway) than eating because you don't want to feel "deprived"
I am not demonizing any food or treat. We know what junk is. If you want it and know why you want it, then it's your choice. But this "eat in moderation" or else you are depriving yourself idea seems weak to me.
*thumbs up*0 -
Counting calories is not enough to solve psychological issues with food. It's more for people who already have the capacity to eat well, but need the information to know where they stand.
It's like those speed limit signs that show you how fast your car is going. Some people are surprised by the information and slow down. Others don't because they have different issues going on.0 -
Having small portions of "bad food" that I'm craving stops me from binging or throwing my entire week. It keeps me on track. I don't keep those things lying around, though. It's usually something that I can bring home and just have once.0
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That was "lost" by people thousands of years ago. Food is so much more than just fuel for the body, it always has been. Food makes you feel good. Food is a social thing. Eating releases dopamine. Anticipating eating releases dopamine. Thinking of food solely as "fuel for the body" is actually very wrong. It's a gross oversimplification of a very complex system, and can lead to unhealthy relationships with food (orthorexia and the like.)i finally understand something that so many people have seem to forgotten over time FOOD IS FUEL FOR THE BODY, it was never meant to be more for your enjoyment than for your health, somewhere along the way that has been lost by so many people.0 -
I have a hugely unhealthy relationship with food for a myriad of reasons. I have tried keeping everything out of the house, in which case I will binge on food that you wouldn't even think would be binge-able. I have tried keeping everything out of the house, part two, whereby I end up eating everything in sight because tomorrow I won't be able to have it again. But tomorrow never comes because there's always something to stop me from eating properly and a reason to put it off.
So... I've been mostly veggie (for health/illness reasons) since the spring, entirely veggie for a month now, and in the last two weeks, since rejoining MFP, I decided that I would let myself have my two *real* weaknesses: Smartfood and chocolate. Normally I would eat a whole bag or large bar easily.
Instead I have been portioning everything out, having one portion, then asking myself whether I still want more. I remind myself that the Smartfood and chocolate are still there, they're not going anywhere, no one's going to eat them on me, I'm not going to get rid of them again, I'll get more when I want it, etc.
I have yet to go back for a second portion. And I didn't go back for one even during my TOM - which is *incredible*.
This may not work for everyone. I *never* thought it would work for me but it is and I feel fantastic - and I am hoping that some day I will be able to have a totally normal relationship with food and not feel the need to have that "store of treats" but for now if it keeps me 98% on plan, I'm sticking with it.0 -
Everything in moderation is something that I'm working on, very hard! I am also working on conquering my emotional eating, so that should help.0
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That was "lost" by people thousands of years ago. Food is so much more than just fuel for the body, it always has been. Food makes you feel good. Food is a social thing. Eating releases dopamine. Anticipating eating releases dopamine. Thinking of food solely as "fuel for the body" is actually very wrong. It's a gross oversimplification of a very complex system, and can lead to unhealthy relationships with food (orthorexia and the like.)i finally understand something that so many people have seem to forgotten over time FOOD IS FUEL FOR THE BODY, it was never meant to be more for your enjoyment than for your health, somewhere along the way that has been lost by so many people.
As usual, I agree with you.0 -
That was "lost" by people thousands of years ago. Food is so much more than just fuel for the body, it always has been. Food makes you feel good. Food is a social thing. Eating releases dopamine. Anticipating eating releases dopamine. Thinking of food solely as "fuel for the body" is actually very wrong. It's a gross oversimplification of a very complex system, and can lead to unhealthy relationships with food (orthorexia and the like.)i finally understand something that so many people have seem to forgotten over time FOOD IS FUEL FOR THE BODY, it was never meant to be more for your enjoyment than for your health, somewhere along the way that has been lost by so many people.
As usual, I agree with you.
Yep. Food is "just fuel," just like sex is just for baby-makin'.0 -
That was "lost" by people thousands of years ago. Food is so much more than just fuel for the body, it always has been. Food makes you feel good. Food is a social thing. Eating releases dopamine. Anticipating eating releases dopamine. Thinking of food solely as "fuel for the body" is actually very wrong. It's a gross oversimplification of a very complex system, and can lead to unhealthy relationships with food (orthorexia and the like.)i finally understand something that so many people have seem to forgotten over time FOOD IS FUEL FOR THE BODY, it was never meant to be more for your enjoyment than for your health, somewhere along the way that has been lost by so many people.
Totally true! There is no reason not to enjoy and take pleasure from food. Why does that mean you can't be reasonable and moderate in your intake? Many are capable of both enjoying food and being healthy about their intake. To say it's "just fuel" is the other end of the spectrum from those with unhealthy emotional attachments to food. The truth never lives in the extremes but somewhere in the middle0 -
That was "lost" by people thousands of years ago. Food is so much more than just fuel for the body, it always has been. Food makes you feel good. Food is a social thing. Eating releases dopamine. Anticipating eating releases dopamine. Thinking of food solely as "fuel for the body" is actually very wrong. It's a gross oversimplification of a very complex system, and can lead to unhealthy relationships with food (orthorexia and the like.)i finally understand something that so many people have seem to forgotten over time FOOD IS FUEL FOR THE BODY, it was never meant to be more for your enjoyment than for your health, somewhere along the way that has been lost by so many people.
As usual, I agree with you.
Yep. Food is "just fuel," just like sex is just for baby-makin'.
Awesome Lorinna!0 -
I do agree that you can have anything as long as it's in moderation. I have lost 113 pounds just counting my calories. I have basically eaten anything I want...just less of it. However, once you start LEARNING to eat healthy, you tend to make better choices. So, intstead of using my calories on a chocolate chip cookie, I now do the math....what could I eat that I could have MORE of instead of that cookie? I could have a pear drizzled with honey and sprinkled with a few pieces of almonds instead.
On the other hand, pizza is one of my favorite foods, and given the opportunity that an entire pizza is set before me, I will go overbaord. My boundary is this: order a subway personal veggie pizza instead of walking into a pizzaria and ordering a whole pizza. This way, I will only eat what I have. If you really need the cookie, buy ONE nice gourmet cookie and eat half of it. Put the other half away for the next day. That way, you are not tempted to eat the enitre box of cookies.
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I am alway really surprised when people don't acknowledge and celebrate the sensory aspect of food. I'm not addicted to food. But as a very sensory person, I love the sensory aspect of food - the tastes, the smells, the colours, the textures, the noises. Food is of course fuel for my body - but it's so much more than that. It's such a rich source of enjoyment too. And this sensory aspect is also positive and good for the health, just as the fuel aspect is. Perhaps I appreciate this more because of having sensory hypersensitivity, but sensory pleasure can be deeply healing and restorative. And I haven't had to abandon this sensory love of food in order to lose weight - I've reached my target weight, by cutting down food intake and being more active, and I've managed to improve my health and energy levels, but I've never had to stop enjoying food. I've never had to see it as purely fuel for my body.0
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Food was like sex to me back when I was overweight. Sort of like a one night stand. I'd binge then I'd hate myself afterwards and start the vicious cycle all over again. When I first started my fitness journey Dec 2010, I started out depriving myself. It worked for awhile. Then once I had that "cheat" meal/day I'd relapse and binge. Then I found bodybuilding.com and fitday. Read every article, every success story. I've learned that starving myself or deprivation would never work for me. I also learned that something deep inside me drove me to eat like a glutton. It wasn't what I was eating, it was what was eating me. I am dealing with this issue and my relationship with food has improved. I am able to eat whatever I want in moderation. I'm still a work in progress but I am alot stronger mentally than I used to be. So yes IIFYM works for me.0
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Yep. Food is "just fuel," just like sex is just for baby-makin'.
Thinking about it, maybe for some people it is. Maybe some people simply don't get sensory pleasure from food. I'm asexual - I have no interest in, or desire for, sex whatsoever. I know intellectually that most people get pleasure from it, but I can't relate to this on a deeper level. Maybe some people are the same with food. The difficulty, of course, is when people assume their own quirk is the norm and should be shared by everyone.0 -
Yep. Food is "just fuel," just like sex is just for baby-makin'.
Thinking about it, maybe for some people it is. Maybe some people simply don't get sensory pleasure from food. I'm asexual - I have no interest in, or desire for, sex whatsoever. I know intellectually that most people get pleasure from it, but I can't relate to this on a deeper level. Maybe some people are the same with food. The difficulty, of course, is when people assume their own quirk is the norm and should be shared by everyone.
Whoa......0 -
Bump0
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Food was like sex to me back when I was overweight. Sort of like a one night stand. I'd binge then I'd hate myself afterwards and start the vicious cycle all over again. When I first started my fitness journey Dec 2010, I started out depriving myself. It worked for awhile. Then once I had that "cheat" meal/day I'd relapse and binge. Then I found bodybuilding.com and fitday. Read every article, every success story. I've learned that starving myself or deprivation would never work for me. I also learned that something deep inside me drove me to eat like a glutton. It wasn't what I was eating, it was what was eating me. I am dealing with this issue and my relationship with food has improved. I am able to eat whatever I want in moderation. I'm still a work in progress but I am alot stronger mentally than I used to be. So yes IIFYM works for me.
Great post! Thanks for your honesty and transparency. You are fighting the good fight and are dealing with the real cause of overeating in your life. Bravo on you progress and best wished for your continued growth!0
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