Getting to a point where good eating is habitual

seandominguez · October 2012

Curious to get MFP's take on this. As calorie counters who see how effective counting is, we understand that being "naturally big-boned" or having a "slow metabolism" are just limiting beliefs. That said, I think we have all met people who eat whatever they want and stay thin/maintain their weight without any extra effort. In my experience, it's because these people merely eat when they're hungry and stop when they're content or mildly full.

I lost a ton of weight in high school watching calories religiously, but I feel like I came out of it with a borderline eating disorder. For example, despite being bigger before losing the weight, I never liked eating birthday cake and never binged (getting bored and eating chocolate covered almonds while playing video games is a different story). Then, I got thin and ended up having some of the most insane cravings for food I ever had. If pouring honey on cheese popcorn to satisfy a sweet craving because the other two bins in those holiday packs were empty isn't an insane craving, I don't know what is.

I'm better now, but I'd love to get to a point in my life where I can just eat steak, push it away, and not be completely torn when there's cake in the fridge.

What are your opinions/experiences with this?

kimothy38 · October 2012

I struggle with this all day everyday. I admire those people who are so in tune with their body wisdom that they only eat when hungry and stop when satisfied - not full or when their plate is empty. I lost 40 kg over 9 months and then regained it all because I felt so intensely deprived. Now I'm eating healthy food because I actually enjoy but it's still a challenge not to get carried away with eating junk food because the trigger in my brain has gone off. There is certain junk foods I can have in the house and not be tempted but my trigger foods such as chocolate is a different story. It calls to me and I can't ignore it so it's best not to have it around. I do notice now that if I don't have fruit with breakfast and salad or veges for lunch and dinner then I feel icky. I just have to be mindful and listen to my body not my tastebuds.

SoDamnHungry · October 2012

I've always been thin and although I overeat at times and love bad food, I think part of it has to do with the way I was brought up. We didn't eat a footlong sub at every meal. We didn't fill our whole plate with casserole. We took some, then went back for more if we wanted it.

jillica · October 2012

"Getting to a point where good eating is habitual"

That is exactly my goal.
My past 15 years of eating habits consist of nachos, tacos, pizza, breadsticks, pasta, burritos, chips, ice cream.
Eating when I'm stressed or procrastinating or even bored!
I can eat just to eat.
I even have moments when I use food to "comfort" me.
I enjoy the taste of food a bit too much!
I know when I am full but keep at it because "it tastes so good."
I'm have a history of being horrible at portion control.
My relationship with food is not normal.

I would say my habits definitely formed in high school. I was active in my sports & school and ate whatever i wanted. I was very busy so I guess now that I look back, I see that even though I ate such high-calorie foods, my portions were in check because I rarely had time to eat seconds. Well senior year, I didn't go out for track and instantly gained 15 lbs in like 3 months! Then another 15 that summer. I've been trying to get it under control ever since.

MFP is helping! I have never before analyzed my calories and nutrients like I am now. It is helping me make better choices and seeing good alternatives to my bad habits.

seandominguez · October 2012

I suppose my goal, even more than just losing the pounds, is to get to a point where I can just be a guy who eats when he's hungry and stops. I think that's more important than anything.

I'm a pretty ambitious guy and it totally sucks when I'm pursuing my dreams and the only thing I can think about is whether or not I should eat and worrying if I'm going to go overboard. This absolutely kills productivity. You have to have a clear mind when you're learning new things and trying to be creative. I know for a fact that I can bull through this and lose a bunch of weight over the next few months, but at what price? I suppose I look at it like investments. Sure there's a possibility that you can make a bunch of money quick doing risky day trading, but in the long-term game, it's just a losing proposition. I've done it before and I don't want to do it again.

A nice breakfast to get me ready for my morning workout, a lunch that sustains me so that I can get through my checklists, and a dinner that I savor and truly enjoy. That's all I want, you know? To never think about food until I actually need to.

I read the book Flow by Mihaly Csikszentmihalyi and he talks about this wonderfully. He says there's a huge, fundamental difference between pleasure and enjoyment. Pleasure (from what I remember) is the sensation you get - the sweetness of ice cream, the texture of bacon, etc.,. Enjoyment encompasses pleasure, but with an element of satisfaction to it. When you do things like binge eat or procrastinate, sure you derive the pleasure of the activity, but you definitely don't get the enjoyment. I suppose I'm trying to transform all of my eating experiences into enjoyment activities.

It's funny when you compare it to, say, alcohol consumption. I feel as if alcoholics suffer the same problem we suffer, just with alcohol. So when I'm drinking 2 or 3 beers and getting a little tipsy, I say "oh, that feels nice, I think I'll stop right here and preserve this buzz". Can you imagine being able to do that with the food you intake? "Oh damn, this chicken parm is amazing, but this portion is a little big and I'm pretty content - I'll save this for dinner".

Anyway, these are just some things that go through my mind all the time and I haven't had an outlet for them, so now you have to deal with it. haha

CaroseH · October 2012

That is SUCH an interesting point you make about alcohol! I've never thought about it, but that is such an accurate description for how I feel too! It isn't any effort for me to stop at 3 or 4 drinks. At that point I'm definitely feeling it and in a good place, and I automatically want to stop without any conscious choice being made. But give me a jar of cookies, and the only thing that will make me want to stop eating them is when my intellect tallies all those calories and realizes that I shouldn't have 6 cookies in one go.

It would be amazing to have that same feeling with food.....but I don't feel like it's something you can create or learn. Once you're the type of person who can easily eat an entire box of girl scout cookies (done many times!), is there any way to go back to having the other relationship with food?

caribougal · October 2012

Think about all the foods that you have no control over. What do they have in common? Sugar, in all it's nasty forms. Even the processed stuff you think is salty has lots of sugar in it.

I doubt you are over-eating veggies and meat. I know I wasn't. I was abusing cookies, candy, pasta, rice, and ice cream. Did I mention candy?

I am not good at "moderating" my diet. It's not just about balancing calories in and out for me, or eating at a deficit. Yes, I would lose weight if I did that appropriately, but I suck at that. I have found that I do better with an elimination diet. But not the kind where I eliminate foods with flavor... as in low cal / low fat. That just made me feel deprived, hungry and sorry for having to "diet".

I read "It Starts With Food", and read about every blog post on www.marksdailyapple.com, and it has completely changed my relationship with food. I eliminated my trigger foods. Completely. And once they were gone, the obsessiveness about them disappeared. The cravings are gone. I can go for long periods of time without snacking, or even miss a meal without going OCD. For the first time in my life, I can get hungry, and think "Huh, I'm hungry. Maybe I should eat something." And then an hour might go buy and I'll realize "Oh yeah, I'm hungry." In the past, I would have been unable to focus on anything other than eating. And, I never really got hungry. I just grazed all day long.

Now, I don't have to think, "Oh, I'll just have one. And one more. And one more. Oh, I hate myself". I just decided that those things are no longer part of my life. I mourned them, and I'm over it. And the funny thing is, now if I do "treat" (not "cheat"), it's a conscious choice, and I'm in control. And, if I "treat", I try to only do it with the very best version so it's worth it. I will never eat another Snickers. Ever. I accept that. But, I will enjoy a square or three of the most expensive 85% dark chocolate. Am I perfect? No, but so far I have not binged and not felt deprived. I feel empowered. And a bit evangelical about it, I suppose.

I'm not saying any one particular diet is best, I'm just saying one that focused on eliminating many of the foods that were trigger foods works for me seems to be working, and I've felt better than ever before. I no longer eat anything processed. I don't eat anything with added sugar. I don't eat any grains or legumes. I don't eat anything with soy. I DO eat lots of delicious veggies, meats, seafood, fruits, nuts, and LOTs of spices, herbs, and sauces. I eat lots of healthy fats that make things tastes great. I have been having a blast learning new ways to cook, new recipes, and feeling proud of my kitchen creations. I love looking at my diary and thinking... "Girl, you ate delicious food today!"

And yes, I think food addiction is a lot like alcohol or drug addition. And how do addicts overcome? They eliminate the addictive substances from their lives. They usually don't "moderate"... hat's a recipe for failure. I have to eat, but I don't have to eat the things that make me sick or obsessive.

seandominguez · October 2012

I suppose it's true - the existence of trigger foods and the near impossibility of reversing it all. But isn't that all paradigm? A person who doesn't believe that a cookie is a trigger food never thinks of it as anything besides what it is - a cookie. The idea that I've gotta pay dues for the rest of my life based on decisions I made when I was less cognizant of potential consequences just doesn't sit well with me. I guess the proof will come over time.

Honestly, I love food. The enjoyment I get eating a healthy plum with just the right amount of firmness is equal to the enjoyment I get from eating a well-marbled ribeye. The prospect of not being able to enjoy the latter isn't a life I would choose to live. Maybe I'm naive, but I think (well, hope more than anything) that I can reverse years of bad habits with a few years of deliberately choosing to recreate some good habits.

Melolicious · October 2012

For me it's been a learning process - the more I learn, the better I can do. If I don't learn anything new about food and nutrition, how can I make better choices? How am I supposed to get healthier eating the same food that helped made me unhealthy? I think I've addressed emotional eating issue that I have, I've broke the viscious sugar cycle (there is a physiological componet) and now I try to eat more vegetables and fruit, whole grains and nothing processed. I am the fittest I have every ben, my nutrition has kept up with my training. I have only had one headache this year and that had to do with a bottle of wine the night before. I haven't been sick yet this year. I'm working on burning more than I consume and as I move to that balance I know my weight will stabilize.
Eating clean is getting easier and easier, it's not instinctual but it's easier and easier every day.

caribougal · October 2012

I suppose it's true - the existence of trigger foods and the near impossibility of reversing it all. But isn't that all paradigm? A person who doesn't believe that a cookie is a trigger food never thinks of it as anything besides what it is - a cookie. The idea that I've gotta pay dues for the rest of my life based on decisions I made when I was less cognizant of potential consequences just doesn't sit well with me. I guess the proof will come over time.

Honestly, I love food. The enjoyment I get eating a healthy plum with just the right amount of firmness is equal to the enjoyment I get from eating a well-marbled ribeye. The prospect of not being able to enjoy the latter isn't a life I would choose to live. Maybe I'm naive, but I think (well, hope more than anything) that I can reverse years of bad habits with a few years of deliberately choosing to recreate some good habits.

I think of it more as feeding my body healthy foods to replace the foods that when abused make me unhealthy. Both a delicious plum and a ribeye are healthy choices in my book. And after eating a plum or a few ounces of steak I won't feel inclined to eat 10 more. That cookie, on the other hand... Very easy to eat 10. And then want some chips. So I make the conscious choice to eliminate the cookie. And I don't feel deprived, because I'm full. Yes, if a batch of freshly baked, warm toll house cookies wafts past my nose I think, "Damn, those smell good". Then I serve them to my husband. And eat a delicious apple with almond butter. Of which I can only eat one, not 10. And go to bed feeling happy and full, not fat and defeated. I'm no longer ruled my my addiction to sugar.

kimothy38 · October 2012

It's funny when you compare it to, say, alcohol consumption. I feel as if alcoholics suffer the same problem we suffer, just with alcohol. So when I'm drinking 2 or 3 beers and getting a little tipsy, I say "oh, that feels nice, I think I'll stop right here and preserve this buzz". Can you imagine being able to do that with the food you intake? "Oh damn, this chicken parm is amazing, but this portion is a little big and I'm pretty content - I'll save this for dinner".

I did a 12 step programme for food addiction which is based on AA. I'm not an alcoholic though I had to attend their meetings and it blew me away how much I could relate to their way of thinking. What amazed me even more is that alcoholics become so addicted they strop enjoying alcohol and have a compulsion to drink it anyway. It wasn't till I did FA that realised it was my screwed up thinking that was the cause of my eating habits.

GemmaRowlands · October 2012

If you stick with it for long enough then it does become a habit. I am fine with healthy meals now, and would much prefer a salad than a greasy burger. This is genuinely the case. I would also prefer a yogurt after dinner than a slice of cake.

I am still struggling with my snacks in an evening. The biscuit box sometimes comes out, and I occasionally have chocolate as well. This is something that I need to stop, and I'm finding it the hardest habit to break. But I know I'll get there!

Helloitsdan · October 2012

I eat well every day.
I will say that normally I run 80:20 ratio of whole to junk foods but sometimes its 50:50.
I dont stress too much as long as I keep it below my burn for the day and stay in a deficit.
A carb is a carb.
Protein is paramount.
Fats are our friend.

UpBeatMaria · October 2012

I am a strong believer that if you eat clean (no artificial or processed junk) then your body will adapt to your new eating style and you will never go back. I have been eating clean for about a year now and I get physically sick if I go out and "splurge" on fast food, greasy restaurant food or packaged processed food. Because I get so sick when I eat these things, I avoid them at all costs!

UpBeatMaria · October 2012

I eat well every day.
I will say that normally I run 80:20 ratio of whole to junk foods but sometimes its 50:50.
I dont stress too much as long as I keep it below my burn for the day and stay in a deficit.
A carb is a carb.
Protein is paramount.
Fats are our friend.

Very well put

CassieReannan · October 2012

I am getting to this point!

HappilyLifts · October 2012

interesting post. I have started to pay more attention to what I eat and in what quantities, but it's taken me nearly the whole of this year to get to that point where I can look at chocolate and other junk and actually make a conscious decision that I can do without it. Early last year I didn't seem to have that ability and it bugged the hell out of me that I couldn't show restraint. So I like to think that I have trained my brain to some extent, but I can't explain how it has happened, it seems to have been a very gradual thing!
I don't think I'll ever be able to completely eat clean (but then, I didn't think I'd ever be able to take or leave chocolate!) but I do find myself consciously trying to balance the good and bad (for want of better words) foods and ensure I am getting an intake of things that I have learnt are beneficial.

angiechimpanzee · October 2012

Yessss. That is my ultimate goal, truly. I've had food issues for as long as I can remember, eating things just because they tasted good, using food as a source of enjoyment, like you said. But like any habit, it was learned, and it can be unlearned.

Lately I've been planning my meals specifically so that they can hold me over long enough to keep me satisfied until my next meal. I've been working on not snacking at all, because I feel like that urge to snack is 99% of the time just the urge to have something that tastes good, not because I actually need it.

I've also found that WHAT you eat is especially important. Fatty things with protein in them, like pizza and chicken wings for example, are yes, bad for me, HOWEVER after two slices & two wings (650 calories tops), I can usually say that I'm quite full. It's just the "but this is so yummy" feeling that sometimes makes me go past that amount, and that's strictly mental, something I think I can control with a bit of practice. BUT with foods like cookies, cakes, muffins, goodness, I could go on FOREVER (often 1200+ calories) and never get full. So if I'm not physically satisfied PLUS I'm still craving that mental enjoyment, then when will I stop? Usually not until I feel slightly sick and have consumed a ridiculously large amount of excess calories. That's why I'm trying to seriously limit refined carbs & sugar in my diet.

Getting to a point where good eating is habitual

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