First priority -- lose fat or gain muscle??
vsetter
Posts: 558 Member
That is the question. This thread is based off my other thread (http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/768976-need-calorie-guidance-very-discouraged).
I currently weigh 130.5 pounds and am 25.5% body fat. My goal is to be 123 pounds and 20% body fat.
I started lifting a few months ago and enjoy it. So what should be my FIRST priority --- should I focus on calorie deficit with high protein to lose the pounds/fat and retain most muscle OR do I lift HEAVY and focus on muscle building (that will also help to eventually raise metabolism)? Does it matter?
What would you do?
I currently weigh 130.5 pounds and am 25.5% body fat. My goal is to be 123 pounds and 20% body fat.
I started lifting a few months ago and enjoy it. So what should be my FIRST priority --- should I focus on calorie deficit with high protein to lose the pounds/fat and retain most muscle OR do I lift HEAVY and focus on muscle building (that will also help to eventually raise metabolism)? Does it matter?
What would you do?
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What i've done this year is work on getting rid of the fat. I treat my weight lifting days at the gym like icing on the cake...because I really enjoy them.
I got too tired when I tried to work hard at both, and doing both would require more time than I want to spend per day.
I'm getting pretty close to losing the ammount of fat I wanted to lose, so next year I can work harder on the weights .
Some people will tell you that you can do both, but i think you have to know which one is takes precedence...for me it was losing the chub.0 -
Does it matter? Only if it matters for you. It's easier to lose to where you want to be first, I think, but if you do so, you will likely gain a little while you build the muscle, so if you are set on 123, you may have to cut calories again once you get to 20%. They can't really be done at the same time, particularly when you are as close to goal as you are now. I'd keep up what's working for you now as long as you are already doing some weights or at least bodyweight exercises, then when you get to your goal weight, you can up your lifting and cut your cardio to increase your LBM.0
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i would lift heavy with a small deficit. losing fat is more important to me right now. tho tht doesnt exactly mean losing weight.0
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Bump0
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To get lower body fat, I would think you would need to work at strength training. I'm not sure about this, though. I'll be interested in reading what everyone else thinks.0
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Personally, I am focused more on losing fat and maintaining the muscle i have. BUT i have 35 + pounds to lose. If i were you (which is what i think you are asking) i would work on building muscle, since you are so closer to your goal weight. More muscle will burn more fat too.
That's Just my opinion.0 -
That is the question. This thread is based off my other thread (http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/768976-need-calorie-guidance-very-discouraged).
I currently weigh 130.5 pounds and am 25.5% body fat. My goal is to be 123 pounds and 20% body fat.
I started lifting a few months ago and enjoy it. So what should be my FIRST priority --- should I focus on calorie deficit with high protein to lose the pounds/fat and retain most muscle OR do I lift HEAVY and focus on muscle building (that will also help to eventually raise metabolism)? Does it matter?
What would you do?
Given your stats and your goal I would eat at a deficit, 20% under TDEE and lift heavy. Re-assess in about 6-8 weeks.0 -
Your ratios of BF% to weight may not work. They result in approximately the same amount of lean mass and it is unlikely you'll meet this goal. What is more likely to happen, is that if you target weight loss only, then your lean mass will also decrease so once you're at 123#, you BF% may still be above 20% because the lean mass has decreased too.
Conversely, if you target muscle gains (where weight loss may occur) then your weight may stall at 130# but your BF % may decrease because your lean mass increased.
It's really a balancing act. The latter scenario may tip the scales higher but your clothes will be loose and your health better .... even though the BMI may not say so. The BF% will. However, the "loose 12# scenario", you will lose lean mass too which may make the scale look good, but that might be the only thing that does. Sure your clothes may well fit looser too .... but that may not mean you look good or are any healthier for it.
So, I'd suggest either targeting BF% or Weight as a goal, not both (as they are related). Pick your poison. You will loose fat doing the "gain muscle" route or the "lose fat" route. But one is more healthier than the other.
If it were me ... because you don't have that much weight to loose, I'd target the muscle.
My history as an example of what I'm trying to say. Lost 40+ pounds, mostly fat, through calorie restriction (mfp) and exercise. No real target other than the scale. I dropped the weight etc but was still "fat". Since then, I maintained and exercised with weight etc and underwent some body re-composition through just getting fitter and stronger. The scale or my dimensions didn't seem to change, but I was only trying to maintain too. At this point(actual dunk test) 220# with a lean mass of 182#, BF is 17%. I then targeted some weight loss and I few months later I had dropped to 214# but my lean mass also dropped to 180 @ 15%. So although this is good in both % and scale, my lean mass dropped which isn't the best ... but the rate I did it at was a good trade off. I then maintained for a while, without any goals and then decided to get stronger and build some muscle. A year later I weighed 234#. But guess what my BF% was ? It was 17% because although I did increase my body-weight by 20#, my lean mass also increased to 194#. All of my clothes fit the same (except a bit tighter in chest, biceps and legs) and I have not had to buy new underwear or anything. Right now, because I'm back on this site, I am targeting some weight loss .... BUT ... I'm trying to do everything in my power to maintain or even increase my lean mass. So the scale may move down some .... but I'm more interested in body re-composition and BF % decrease. The reason why I wish to get lighter ? Is so that I can move faster .... and it would also be nice to get some of the definition popping out - also, because I gained for a year, there was 7 extra pounds of fat gained that could be taken off.
So essentially, I look, feel and perform better now at 230# (BF% is now unknown) than I did at both 15% and 17% ... regardless of what the scale said - at 214, 220 or 234. Also my BF% was the same when I weighed 220 vs 234#. These measurements were all done by dunking too ... not a guess from measuring my neck and wasteline.
NOTE: I am also not a giant bulky hulk looking dude. I'm relatively athletic looking - most people can't believe I weigh 230# ... they think 210#. I am big/broad through the shoulders and 6'2", but I do not look like some jacked body builder or some guy who "picks things and and puts them down" as you would expect @230#0 -
Bump Bumpity Bump0
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You don't have much more to lose, so I would concentrate on gaining muscle. Eat at a small deficit, watch your protein intake, and the fat will take care of itself.0
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Build more muscle and you will lose more fat.0
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Build more muscle and you will lose more fat.
This! So, both! Build muscle...eat to feed that muscle...your BMR will go up and your Fat% will go down. And you avoid the dreaded "skinny fat" look people can get when they loss a lot of weight but don't do anything to keep it toned and tight.0 -
It depends what you want to do. You can easily build muscle and have a calorie deficit--you'll just gain muscle slower but will also lose a bunch of fat. What I do is I focus equally on cardio and weight lifting and as I get smaller and smaller weight wise, I'm getting stronger muscle wise. Do both. Love both. Enjoy both.
It also depends on your goal. If you want to be super skinny and then build muscle so the muscles really pop, then you have to lose a bunch of fat. If you're just going for a healthy look, then doing both will be more than enough for you!0 -
bump0
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bump0
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Your ratios of BF% to weight may not work. They result in approximately the same amount of lean mass and it is unlikely you'll meet this goal. What is more likely to happen, is that if you target weight loss only, then your lean mass will also decrease so once you're at 123#, you BF% may still be above 20% because the lean mass has decreased too.
Conversely, if you target muscle gains (where weight loss may occur) then your weight may stall at 130# but your BF % may decrease because your lean mass increased.
It's really a balancing act. The latter scenario may tip the scales higher but your clothes will be loose and your health better .... even though the BMI may not say so. The BF% will. However, the "loose 12# scenario", you will lose lean mass too which may make the scale look good, but that might be the only thing that does. Sure your clothes may well fit looser too .... but that may not mean you look good or are any healthier for it.
I would be okay with a higher weight (130). I will admit, not watching the scale is a new way of thinking for me. I always strived to be 118-120. It was a crazy internet calculator that told me 123 was do-able. I'm okay with my size now, i suppose, as long as I could get rid of the fat.
So -- I guess that means I should focus on the lifting. ???0 -
Lose fat PRESERVE muscle.
Eat at a calorie deficit. Strength train 3xs a week. Do cardio 3x a week and maintain protein status. (Ideally about 1 g per pound of lean body mass)0 -
And another problem --- I really don't miss eating 1200 calories. These higher calorie levels have been sooooooo much better!0
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It depends what you want to do. You can easily build muscle and have a calorie deficit--you'll just gain muscle slower but will also lose a bunch of fat. What I do is I focus equally on cardio and weight lifting and as I get smaller and smaller weight wise, I'm getting stronger muscle wise. Do both. Love both. Enjoy both.
It also depends on your goal. If you want to be super skinny and then build muscle so the muscles really pop, then you have to lose a bunch of fat. If you're just going for a healthy look, then doing both will be more than enough for you!
It is extremely difficult to build muscle on a calorie deficit. You want a small caloric surplus. And based on the stats the OP doesnt actually want to build muscle. Now if she said 135 @ 20% bf then it would justify muscle growth. What people tend to forgot is you need to gain weight to gain muscle.0 -
Check out my blog. It's ALOT to explain. I lost 100 lbs and it wasn't focusing on fat/muscle. It really boils down to a calorie deficit. Most of it depends on what you put in your mouth! If you lift weights it will speed the fat loss process but will NOT make you bulky. http://www.makefatcry.com0
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Your ratios of BF% to weight may not work. They result in approximately the same amount of lean mass and it is unlikely you'll meet this goal. What is more likely to happen, is that if you target weight loss only, then your lean mass will also decrease so once you're at 123#, you BF% may still be above 20% because the lean mass has decreased too.
Conversely, if you target muscle gains (where weight loss may occur) then your weight may stall at 130# but your BF % may decrease because your lean mass increased.
It's really a balancing act. The latter scenario may tip the scales higher but your clothes will be loose and your health better .... even though the BMI may not say so. The BF% will. However, the "loose 12# scenario", you will lose lean mass too which may make the scale look good, but that might be the only thing that does. Sure your clothes may well fit looser too .... but that may not mean you look good or are any healthier for it.
I would be okay with a higher weight (130). I will admit, not watching the scale is a new way of thinking for me. I always strived to be 118-120. It was a crazy internet calculator that told me 123 was do-able. I'm okay with my size now, i suppose, as long as I could get rid of the fat.
So -- I guess that means I should focus on the lifting. ???
You can do both. Here's the thing, the weightlifters will eat it caloric excess (to a point where their body is fueled and not gaining fat) to increase size, mass and in return, strength. While doing this, their cardio levels are very low and perhaps simply a 2 mile weighted vest walk 3 times a week. Nothing too much.
But if/when they want to drop weight (for certain performance) they will increase their cardio levels and potentially decrease the volume in lifting, but never actually remove their strength programming. They will lose weight, but their strength and lean mass will drop a little.
So, you can do both. Eat at a small caloric deficit so that you can loose some weight and both cardio and lift. Keep them balanced though, don't spend 17 hours on the treadmill and 3 with a barbell, or vice-versa. Keep it balanced, keep your body fueled and monitor for the results. If you find your scale going up but you like what you see in the mirror. Keep at it. If you don't like what you see, then decrease your calories and make some cardio increases.
But at the end of the day ... I don't know, so this is just my guesses.
The main point I wanted to get across, however, was that BF and Weight relationship.
I simply look at the scale as a guideline to see if my gain or loss is under control. I tweak my diet to adjust for what I want to achieve. More for some gains. Less for some loss. Understanding that if I lose too fast my lean mass will go and if I gain too fast, too much fat will come with that. (which is where the scale and tape measure can help).0 -
Weightlifting burns fat and helps you gain muscle.0
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It is extremely difficult to build muscle on a calorie deficit. You want a small caloric surplus. And based on the stats the OP doesnt actually want to build muscle. Now if she said 135 @ 20% bf then it would justify muscle growth. What people tend to forgot is you need to gain weight to gain muscle.
I actually would like to be stronger and have muscles to show. I guess I was just thinking that you have to lose the fat that covers those muscles. I've just been using internet calculators to figure out roundabout numbers. Plus, I have seen many women my height that are very fit (with low body fat) and in the 120-pound range.
AHHHH --- starting to confuse myself
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Lost fat first, while retain muscle:
moderate calorie deficit
good macros
lift heavy0 -
Lose fat first... Easy as that...
Hoever try to maintain muscle mass! That is soo important... too many push that to the wayside and lose the benefits the extra muscle gives.
At first you can bulk up on a deficit because your a newbie. Once that stage passes, it is almost impossible to bulk up properly on a deficit, hence why I say focus on losing fat and maintaining LBM.
Once your happy with the fat, you will need to drastically up your calories in order to bulk up correctly, you will gain some mass, but then you start a cutting phase to get down again while maintaining etc.
First thing first, get rid of excess fat, then you can work on muscle. It is a fact you need an excess amount of calories in order to bulk up, and if you want to lose fat? That is not going to happen. Even on bulking phase, body builders gain a lot because of the excess. They just cut down a few weeks prior comp in order to get that cut look and even dehydrate to get a better looking physique closer to the time. However the key thing is, they pick up body fat when bulking up.
Now I don't know about anyone here who comments, however I am sure a Mr Universe contender and winner knows what he doing when he says he cannot build on a deficit while getting ready for comp he just tries to maintain the mass he has even though he does lose mass.
Fat first, muscle later. You will thank yourself. Do strength training, but do not make it such a focus on gaining mass until your ready to do so.0 -
I would cut body fat down a bit more prior to doing a round of bulking. You want to be a bit lower because it will translate to a longer period in which you can actually increase muscle. Read this article by Lyle McDonald about bulking and you'll see what body fat range would be ideal to focus exclusively on increasing lean body mass:
http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/muscle-gain/general-philosophies-of-muscle-mass-gain.html
After reading the article, use this online calculator and enter in your stats: 130 lbs; 25.5 bf; 0.5 fat loss goal; moderately active - it will tell you to eat 1800 calories as well as recommended macro breakdown. Keep lifting heavy on this approach.
http://www.weightrainer.net/losscalc.html0 -
Just keep in mind you can lose weight, lose fat but also maintain or raise your bodfat% your best bet is to focus on both and find a program that will maximize your time in the gym.0
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I would cut body fat down a bit more prior to doing a round of bulking. You want to be a bit lower because it will translate to a longer period in which you can actually increase muscle. Read this article by Lyle McDonald about bulking and you'll see what body fat range would be ideal to focus exclusively on increasing lean body mass:
http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/muscle-gain/general-philosophies-of-muscle-mass-gain.html
After reading the article, use this online calculator and enter in your stats: 130 lbs; 25.5 bf; 0.5 fat loss goal; moderately active - it will tell you to eat 1800 calories as well as recommended macro breakdown. Keep lifting heavy on this approach.
http://www.weightrainer.net/losscalc.html
I agree with what he says, but also wanted to note that while, in general, one cannot lose fat and gain muscle simultaneously, newbies can have some limited success in this... so it is best to start by losing fat and taking advantage of any newbie gains to lose fat while preserving more muscle and potentially even gaining a little muscle.0 -
Almost in the same position as you but i'm a bit heavier. I'm itching to get rid of some more fat so I can start building some muscle. I know exactly how I want to look in my head. I just keep at it and slowly my bf is reducing. I eat at a 300 cal deficit under my TDEE, lift heavy 3 days a week and chuck in a bit of cardio as well (HIIT plus other bits), high protein and try and have a cleanish diet. I'm just concentrating on bf reduction until I'm happy with what I see in the mirror. It may take a while yet lol. Good advice on this thread. Me likey ;-)0
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