Protein intake: Shakes ~vs~ meats, etc???

Options
kemdawson
kemdawson Posts: 15
in Food and Nutrition
I've been using the wheybolic protein shakes, as well as the soy-based and casein ones sometimes for variety. I don't particularly like to eat meat much (unless it's definitely raised on a farm that doesn't use pesticides, hormone injections, or lots of antibiotics). It seems like I've seen several people mention on other nutritional msg threads that the protein from shakes won't have the same long-term effect that food proteins have. I know legumes, dairy, etc. all have protein too. I'm just wondering about the validity of these statements that are putting down the use of protein shakes. Any intelligent feedback from nutritional gurus out there???
«1

Replies

  • BrotherBill913
    BrotherBill913 Posts: 661 Member
    Options
    Good question. I'm curious about that also.
  • neanderthin
    neanderthin Posts: 10,017 Member
    Options
    Protein shakes are a good source of protein, period. Normally protein shakes were to supplement a diet where someone was trying to add muscle, now there consumed so people don't lose their muscle. If your consuming low cals, which seems to be popular then protein powder is not something I would advise, people need other nutrients in that scenario and foods with protein help in that respect.
  • bdamaster60
    bdamaster60 Posts: 595 Member
    Options
    protein shakes, particularly whey isolates or most of them with whey have far greater amino acid profiles then any meats you can find. Meaning they will absorb a lot faster into your system and your body will be able to utilize more protein per gram ingested.
  • kemdawson
    kemdawson Posts: 15
    Options
    Do all the amino acids need to be present each time you consume protein in order to get all the benefits of the protein?
  • bdamaster60
    bdamaster60 Posts: 595 Member
    Options
    Do all the amino acids need to be present each time you consume protein in order to get all the benefits of the protein?

    protein breaks down into amino acids. The greater the amino acid profile, the better quality of the protein and of course the greater bio-availability.
  • Sam215lbs
    Sam215lbs Posts: 1
    Options
    if I'm trying to lose weight should I be taking the protein shakes? I weigh about 215 pounds. Will it turn my fat into muscle?
  • onyxgirl17
    onyxgirl17 Posts: 1,721 Member
    Options
    if I'm trying to lose weight should I be taking the protein shakes? I weigh about 215 pounds. Will it turn my fat into muscle?

    No. Caloric deficit will cause you to lose fat. You will lose less muscle then otherwise if you eat a decent amount of protein. So you can have the protein shakes to help you retain muscle, but it won't "turn fat" into muscle.

    If you want to preserve as much muscle as possible while still losing fat, you would want to do resistance training (lift weights!) as well.
  • theryan244
    theryan244 Posts: 65 Member
    Options
    In terms of it's biological value, whey is the superior protein when compared to other sources. Whey is the best, bottom line.
  • Topher1978
    Topher1978 Posts: 975 Member
    Options
    Protein is rated according to eggs. Eggs are rated at 100. That is the best natural protein available. Now whey isolate and casein isolate both are better than egg protein (albumen). Whey is rated around 140 and casein around 120. Below eggs would be your fish, poultry, meat and dairy. Way below that is the protein you find in the veggie world. It is best, in my opinion, to get protein from several sources. I use whey and casein along with raw eggs nearly daily. I am about to add organic sprouted vegan protein to my diet as well. But for the best growth results, I would say do whey right when you get up and also right after you work out, and use casein right before you go to bed. You can mix a raw egg in with the protein if you like, t makes the shake taste way better. I use kefir, a fermented milk, for half the liquid in my shake, and half water.
  • Topher1978
    Topher1978 Posts: 975 Member
    Options
    Do all the amino acids need to be present each time you consume protein in order to get all the benefits of the protein?
    There are essential aminos that the body cannot create that must be present in the food.
  • AnvilHead
    AnvilHead Posts: 18,344 Member
    Options
    if I'm trying to lose weight should I be taking the protein shakes? I weigh about 215 pounds. Will it turn my fat into muscle?
    Nothing will turn fat into muscle. Fat is fat, muscle is muscle. You can lose or gain either/both, but you can't turn one into the other. Onyxgirl17 hit the nail on the head with her post. Protein shakes will benefit you if you're not getting enough protein intake through whole foods, but there's nothing "magic" about them other than that - they're basically just another food source.

    As to the OP (before the threadjack) - whey protein has the highest bioavailability of any protein source (with egg running a close second). Anybody saying that it won't have the same "long-term effects" has no freaking idea what they're talking about. Your body doesn't know it's a shake - all it knows is that there's protein coming on board (high-quality protein at that), and it processes it accordingly. Legumes are a far inferior protein source to whey.
  • taso42
    taso42 Posts: 8,980 Member
    Options
    Just to be safe, you can make your shakes with actual meat. For example, you can make a london broil, mashed potatoes, & gravy savory shake. Or a lox, cream cheese & scallion. The possibilities are endless.
  • DavPul
    DavPul Posts: 61,406 Member
    Options
    To the OP and anyone else that's curious, this question breaks down to: Are replacements for food better than actual food? The answer is NO. It's always NO. Doesn't matter if we're asking if meat is better than protein powder, or if vitamins are better than eating vegetables, or if metamucil is better than oatmeal. The answer to is always FOOD.
  • Firefox7275
    Firefox7275 Posts: 2,040 Member
    Options
    I've been using the wheybolic protein shakes, as well as the soy-based and casein ones sometimes for variety. I don't particularly like to eat meat much (unless it's definitely raised on a farm that doesn't use pesticides, hormone injections, or lots of antibiotics). It seems like I've seen several people mention on other nutritional msg threads that the protein from shakes won't have the same long-term effect that food proteins have. I know legumes, dairy, etc. all have protein too. I'm just wondering about the validity of these statements that are putting down the use of protein shakes. Any intelligent feedback from nutritional gurus out there???

    If the protein powder is complete - contains a balance of all the amino acids the body needs - as egg and whey are then protein is protein. However not all proteins are created equal as regards other nutrients, some you will get a ton of carbohydrates, many you will NOT be getting the associated micronutrients (vitamins, minerals, essential fatty acids). Stuff like long chain omega-3s and vitamin D from oily fish, vitamin B12 and haem iron from certain meats especially organs. Works the same for many proteins that are no longer in their whole form - chicken breast and egg whites are really not very nutritious.

    Search for yourself, compare equivalent servings say 100g http://nutritiondata.self.com/
    You can also use this to search for individual micronutrients, so ask yourself where are your sources of magnesium, vitamin D, haem iron or long chain omega-3s. Part of the reason I am a dairy fan is simply that it is a royal PITA to get enough bioavailable calcium from canned fish bones, almonds, leafy green veg, meat stock and so on.

    Of course some protein powders are fortified, but I honestly don't see how that is any different to having white, refined flour which has been fortified and claiming a balanced diet. Or fast food plus a multivitamin/ mineral. You can't make a bad diet healthy that way, you never add everything back in the right proportions or in the best absorbed forms and combinations.

    Not to say protein powders, egg whites and chicken breasts are bad, my personal comments if you have seen them have not been on using these but on OVER using these. Supplement a diet with these convenience products by all means, but don't make foods that have limited natural nutrition the foundation of your diet, eating them daily or multiple times daily and imagine it is optimally healthy.

    BTW legumes are nutritious but not ideal to rely on as a source of protein because they are not complete and contain a relatively low percentage, you are better seeing them as a source of carbohydrates, fibre and minerals and the protein as a bonus. The better sources of protein are animal products, nuts and seeds.
  • AnvilHead
    AnvilHead Posts: 18,344 Member
    Options
    To the OP and anyone else that's curious, this question breaks down to: Are replacements for food better than actual food? The answer is NO. It's always NO. Doesn't matter if we're asking if meat is better than protein powder, or if vitamins are better than eating vegetables, or if metamucil is better than oatmeal. The answer to is always FOOD.
    Whey is a dairy (milk) by-product which comes from the process of making cheese. I always thought dairy products were considered actual food.
  • Firefox7275
    Firefox7275 Posts: 2,040 Member
    Options
    To the OP and anyone else that's curious, this question breaks down to: Are replacements for food better than actual food? The answer is NO. It's always NO. Doesn't matter if we're asking if meat is better than protein powder, or if vitamins are better than eating vegetables, or if metamucil is better than oatmeal. The answer to is always FOOD.
    Whey is a dairy (milk) by-product which comes from the process of making cheese. I always thought dairy products were considered food.

    You just answered your own question: natural whey is not the same as whey protein isolate or hydrosylate, dairy BY product is not the same as a dairy product. I would have to eat something like 400g of dry powder to get the recommended amount of calcium from my whey protein. Protein powders are considered a food supplement because you have concentrated one nutrient and lost many others. Salt, sugar, gluten and many alcoholic drinks are all extracted or produced from natural sources: are we going to claim wine is a fruit, sugar is a vegetable, gluten is a wholegrain, salt is seafood?
  • donnam40
    donnam40 Posts: 246 Member
    Options
    OK, I'm going to enter this debate.

    I am monitored via blood screening monthly for a number of things including kidney function. Every time I increase my protein intake with supplements, my kidney function goes hay wire. If I increase via natural sources (chicken, eggs etc) it does not have the same impact on my kidneys. That tells me and my specialist something. She has asked me to have less of the supplements and focus on natural sources of protein. So maybe the body does know something.

    Donna
  • DavPul
    DavPul Posts: 61,406 Member
    Options
    To the OP and anyone else that's curious, this question breaks down to: Are replacements for food better than actual food? The answer is NO. It's always NO. Doesn't matter if we're asking if meat is better than protein powder, or if vitamins are better than eating vegetables, or if metamucil is better than oatmeal. The answer to is always FOOD.
    Whey is a dairy (milk) by-product which comes from the process of making cheese. I always thought dairy products were considered food.

    You just answered your own question: natural whey is not the same as whey protein isolate or hydrosylate, dairy BY product is not the same as a dairy product. I would have to eat something like 400g of dry powder to get the recommended amount of calcium from my whey protein. Protein powders are considered a food supplement because you have concentrated one nutrient and lost many others. Salt, sugar, gluten and many alcoholic drinks are all extracted or produced from natural sources: are we going to claim wine is a fruit, sugar is a vegetable, gluten is a wholegrain, salt is seafood?

    boom
  • kemdawson
    kemdawson Posts: 15
    Options
    Wowww!!! Thanks for ALL the great info...I appreciate all the input, as well as the banter. I do eat eggs almost daily, nuts, some beef and fish, but very little chicken. I would just rather go the organic route as much as possible. I used to try to be a vegetarian or vegan 95% of the time, but have given it up. I've noticed I'm not near as sore after long workouts when I use the protein shakes, which I also add a scoop of Green Vibrance, which is chock full of vitamins, minerals, and probiotics.
  • taekwonkenpo
    taekwonkenpo Posts: 1,004
    Options
    get the protein however you want to get it. Stop stressing. It is not that complicated.

Categories