Cardio "Zone" and Target Heartrate advise/question

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spicy618
spicy618 Posts: 2,117 Member
in Fitness and Exercise
I really love cardio. I rather do cardio for 2 hours than to weight train for 1/2 hour :huh:
My Stats:
41 y/o
5'4
145 lbs. (size 7/8 stretch jeans)

I've read where the cardio "zones" are outdated; so to speak... kinda like the BMI (Because not every "body" is the same and not every "heart" is at the same fit level).

Anyway, according to most "calculators" my Target Heart Rate (THR) is 107 - 179. It also shows that at 90% I'm in the "Anaerobic zone". Well, most times I workout, It's always between 90 -100%, sometimes while Stepping, Zumba or Rollerblading i'm at 102 - 105% of my THR. My Heart Rate Monitor (HRM) is programmed to show me in percents (%) where my HR is. The only time I stay within the 70-80% Zone is when I'm walking.

Am I really "burning muscle" when I'm on the elliptical for 60 minutes at 90-95% of my THR?

I'm not huffing and puffing... I can go for longer if I wanted to. I've tried keeping my HR at 75-80%, it feels like I'm not doing anything. I don't want to burn the little muscle I have.

I know I should do more strength training, but I go over my "Fat" grams EVERYDAY, and cardio is the fastest way to burn fat. Also, when I say to myself "I'm going to do weights today"... I end up not working out at all. :embarassed:

I've updated my goal to lose another 20 lbs. but I rather lose BF%, but it doesn't look like I can achieve that the way I'm going :frown:

BTW, I did buy a Ketttle Bell workout DVD at Walmart for $20 (thanks to the MFP who posted about it). Haven't tried it yet :(

All comments, advice & suggestions appreciated :flowerforyou:

Replies

  • MattySparky
    MattySparky Posts: 771
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    See, the tricky part is you're not really burning alot of fat when you're that high up in your heart rate. Apparently you'll burn the most amount of fat per workout if you are training between 50-70% of your max. I know where you're coming from though because my cardio training always has me around 90% max. Great workout, not so great fat burner. I burn more fat lifting weights.
  • spicy618
    spicy618 Posts: 2,117 Member
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    See, the tricky part is you're not really burning alot of fat when you're that high up in your heart rate. Apparently you'll burn the most amount of fat per workout if you are training between 50-70% of your max. I know where you're coming from though because my cardio training always has me around 90% max. Great workout, not so great fat burner. I burn more fat lifting weights.

    Thanks Matty,

    I was afraid of that :(
  • Edestiny7
    Edestiny7 Posts: 730 Member
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    Plain old walking is one of the best & easiest fat burners.
  • spicy618
    spicy618 Posts: 2,117 Member
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    Plain old walking is one of the best & easiest fat burners.

    You're so right, but it takes longer... :laugh:

    Also, I have a pitbull and she is so lazy... when I take her walking she konks-out at about 2 miles :laugh: But I feel so guilty if I don't take her :ohwell:
  • SHBoss1673
    SHBoss1673 Posts: 7,161 Member
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    I'd be pretty confident in saying that your HRM is misconfigured or otherwise working incorrectly. Either that or your heart doesn't work within the parameters of what is considered "the mean". You can go have this tested, ask your PCP where the nearest lab is to do a heart rate test and/or metabolic test, he/she should know. I seriously doubt you are spending most of your time in the 90 to 100% range in reality, more likely that your HRM THINKS you're in that range either because there are incorrect numbers entered, there is something wrong with it, or like I said, your heart doesn't conform (this isn't necessarily a bad thing by the way, just different).
  • sweetbn
    sweetbn Posts: 318
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    The whole higher heart rate lower fat burned is a myth...

    The reason is s follows: In the "Fat burning Zone"- Let's say you burn 80% fat calories. And you burn 10 calories a minute. So, 8 calories a minute are fat calories.

    Let's say your heart rate is higher and you are in the "Cardio Zone" or whatever you want to call it. Only 60% of your calories burned are fat calories. But, you are burning 15 calories a minute. So 9 calories a minute are fat calories. Yes the percentage is different but you are still burning more fat relative. And you are getting a harder workout and burning more calories in general.
  • Azdak
    Azdak Posts: 8,281 Member
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    The whole higher heart rate lower fat burned is a myth...

    The reason is s follows: In the "Fat burning Zone"- Let's say you burn 80% fat calories. And you burn 10 calories a minute. So, 8 calories a minute are fat calories.

    Let's say your heart rate is higher and you are in the "Cardio Zone" or whatever you want to call it. Only 60% of your calories burned are fat calories. But, you are burning 15 calories a minute. So 9 calories a minute are fat calories. Yes the percentage is different but you are still burning more fat relative. And you are getting a harder workout and burning more calories in general.

    Not only is the "fat burning zone" a myth, the whole idea that the fuel substrate you burn during exercise is of any importance is pretty much a myth as well.

    This is one of those peripheral issues I wrote about in my blog that distract us from focusing our efforts on our goals.

    Simplify: There is a wide range of "normal" when it comes to maximum heart rates. Many people have noticeably higher heart rates than the age predicted formula. Either use trial and error by comparing your exercise HR with your perceived exertion or, if you must know, do like Boss says and go have yourself tested.

    There are three intensity "zones" : easy, medium, and hard. All three should be included in your routine (although not necessarily in the same workout).

    The fuel you burn during exercise will have little or no effect on your body fat levels--short term or long term. It may have an effect on the quality of your workout or your ability to complete a workout, but, in terms of weight loss, it means virtually nothing. Don't even think about it.
  • aippolito1
    aippolito1 Posts: 4,894 Member
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    Okay, I know this is a bad example but it HAS to be a myth seeing as when really overweight people begin to exercise, their heart is RACING and yet they lose weight really fast - and I know the more you have to lose, the quicker you lose it. I just really want to believe I can start running again, without having a HRM because I miss it so much. I'm limited to exercises because my personal trainer told me if I got up too high in my heart rate, I'd burn muscle. I just can't imagine I was burning muscle when I haven't noticed a decrease in my strength or muscles when I see or feel them.
  • spicy618
    spicy618 Posts: 2,117 Member
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    Thanks for the input you guys. :flowerforyou:

    Banks - I have and Polar F4. There isn't much to enter. It asks for height, weight, age and gender. When I'm on the elliptical (level 9, incline of 6/7), it's always about 100 calories More than what my HRM shows. Also, If I calculate 10 calories per minute at moderate intensity. It's usually pretty close to what the HRM show. For example, 50 minutes in Step class usually shows about 540 calories burned.

    I don't dispute your statement :flowerforyou: If i remember, next time I go to my PCP I will ask about the heart test. Thanks.

    Azdak - the way I compare my "exertion" is if I'm sweating within 10 - 15 minutes of when I begin. That is moderate (medium) about 10 calories per minute. Is that an accurate estimate (oxymoron)? :laugh:

    :flowerforyou:
  • SHBoss1673
    SHBoss1673 Posts: 7,161 Member
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    Thanks for the input you guys. :flowerforyou:

    Banks - I have and Polar F4. There isn't much to enter. It asks for height, weight, age and gender. When I'm on the elliptical (level 9, incline of 6/7), it's always about 100 calories More than what my HRM shows. Also, If I calculate 10 calories per minute at moderate intensity. It's usually pretty close to what the HRM show. For example, 50 minutes in Step class usually shows about 540 calories burned.

    I don't dispute your statement :flowerforyou: If i remember, next time I go to my PCP I will ask about the heart test. Thanks.

    Azdak - the way I compare my "exertion" is if I'm sweating within 10 - 15 minutes of when I begin. That is moderate (medium) about 10 calories per minute. Is that an accurate estimate (oxymoron)? :laugh:

    :flowerforyou:

    Google Rate of Perceived Exertion, that's a good manual observational measurement that you can compare to the HRM, if they don't match up, something is off (probably the HRM)
  • spicy618
    spicy618 Posts: 2,117 Member
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    Thanks for the input you guys. :flowerforyou:

    Banks - I have and Polar F4. There isn't much to enter. It asks for height, weight, age and gender. When I'm on the elliptical (level 9, incline of 6/7), it's always about 100 calories More than what my HRM shows. Also, If I calculate 10 calories per minute at moderate intensity. It's usually pretty close to what the HRM show. For example, 50 minutes in Step class usually shows about 540 calories burned.

    I don't dispute your statement :flowerforyou: If i remember, next time I go to my PCP I will ask about the heart test. Thanks.

    Azdak - the way I compare my "exertion" is if I'm sweating within 10 - 15 minutes of when I begin. That is moderate (medium) about 10 calories per minute. Is that an accurate estimate (oxymoron)? :laugh:

    :flowerforyou:

    Google Rate of Perceived Exertion, that's a good manual observational measurement that you can compare to the HRM, if they don't match up, something is off (probably the HRM)

    Goggled it. Thanks Banks :flowerforyou:
  • hamton
    hamton Posts: 245
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    I think either the HR monitor is off or you have a really high heart rate. If it is the latter, you should shift your whole zone higher. Walking should put you around 50%-60% HR. I don't think you should be able to reach 100% HR roller blading either. For me to reach 90% HR (170), I have to do jump knee tuck for 30 seconds. Then my vision starts turning black after that. There is no way I can hold this for more than 2 minutes. Another example of being in the 90-100% zone is sprinting as fast as you can.

    Just my 2c.
  • spicy618
    spicy618 Posts: 2,117 Member
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    I think either the HR monitor is off or you have a really high heart rate. If it is the latter, you should shift your whole zone higher. Walking should put you around 50%-60% HR. I don't think you should be able to reach 100% HR roller blading either. For me to reach 90% HR (170), I have to do jump knee tuck for 30 seconds. Then my vision starts turning black after that. There is no way I can hold this for more than 2 minutes. Another example of being in the 90-100% zone is sprinting as fast as you can.

    Just my 2c.

    Thanks,

    Very helpful.

    However, why when anyone mentions how many calories they burn, I'm close to those numbers too? Like someone in Zumba class stated how they burn about 500-600 calories during the 60 minutes class and that is about the same as what my HRM shows. This person was about the same frame as I am. :ohwell:
  • Azdak
    Azdak Posts: 8,281 Member
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    Okay, I know this is a bad example but it HAS to be a myth seeing as when really overweight people begin to exercise, their heart is RACING and yet they lose weight really fast - and I know the more you have to lose, the quicker you lose it. I just really want to believe I can start running again, without having a HRM because I miss it so much. I'm limited to exercises because my personal trainer told me if I got up too high in my heart rate, I'd burn muscle. I just can't imagine I was burning muscle when I haven't noticed a decrease in my strength or muscles when I see or feel them.

    Your personal trainer is absolutely full of crap. And he is not the only one-- this "cardio burns muscle" crap has cropped up all of a sudden and it being repeated verbatim faster than a Jonas Brothers rumor in a group of 12 year old girls.
  • wjassell
    wjassell Posts: 104 Member
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    Okay, I know this is a bad example but it HAS to be a myth seeing as when really overweight people begin to exercise, their heart is RACING and yet they lose weight really fast - and I know the more you have to lose, the quicker you lose it. I just really want to believe I can start running again, without having a HRM because I miss it so much. I'm limited to exercises because my personal trainer told me if I got up too high in my heart rate, I'd burn muscle. I just can't imagine I was burning muscle when I haven't noticed a decrease in my strength or muscles when I see or feel them.

    Your personal trainer is absolutely full of crap. And he is not the only one-- this "cardio burns muscle" crap has cropped up all of a sudden and it being repeated verbatim faster than a Jonas Brothers rumor in a group of 12 year old girls.

    A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.
    Winston Churchill

    I also have a higher than average heart rate when working out. You can do a Max HR test to find your true Max HR then find your zones. My computed max is 192 but my real Max is around 205bpm.
  • pettmybunny
    pettmybunny Posts: 1,986 Member
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    Your personal trainer is absolutely full of crap. And he is not the only one-- this "cardio burns muscle" crap has cropped up all of a sudden and it being repeated verbatim faster than a Jonas Brothers rumor in a group of 12 year old girls.

    Bwaaa Haaaaa Haaaaaa :laugh: Jonas Brothers rumor in a group of 12 y.o. girls....
  • SHBoss1673
    SHBoss1673 Posts: 7,161 Member
    Options
    Okay, I know this is a bad example but it HAS to be a myth seeing as when really overweight people begin to exercise, their heart is RACING and yet they lose weight really fast - and I know the more you have to lose, the quicker you lose it. I just really want to believe I can start running again, without having a HRM because I miss it so much. I'm limited to exercises because my personal trainer told me if I got up too high in my heart rate, I'd burn muscle. I just can't imagine I was burning muscle when I haven't noticed a decrease in my strength or muscles when I see or feel them.

    Your personal trainer is absolutely full of crap. And he is not the only one-- this "cardio burns muscle" crap has cropped up all of a sudden and it being repeated verbatim faster than a Jonas Brothers rumor in a group of 12 year old girls.

    lol, what I want to know is how you know about Jonas Brothers or the rumors about them that 12 year old girls tell? :tongue:
    I had to google who the Jonas Brothers were. Now I want to throw up! :laugh:
  • robin52077
    robin52077 Posts: 4,383 Member
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    I'd be pretty confident in saying that your HRM is misconfigured or otherwise working incorrectly. Either that or your heart doesn't work within the parameters of what is considered "the mean". You can go have this tested, ask your PCP where the nearest lab is to do a heart rate test and/or metabolic test, he/she should know. I seriously doubt you are spending most of your time in the 90 to 100% range in reality, more likely that your HRM THINKS you're in that range either because there are incorrect numbers entered, there is something wrong with it, or like I said, your heart doesn't conform (this isn't necessarily a bad thing by the way, just different).

    EXACTLY what I was going to say.
    100% is 100%. You should be GASPING and wheezing at that level. You would probably collapse if you actually spent time above 100% of your heart's maximum ability.

    60-70 should feel like practically nothing. 70-80 should feel like you are exercising but can still hold a conversation, 80-90 it should be hard to converse in your normal tone of voice without sounding out of breath, at least that's how it is for me....and above 90...I have to concentrate SO hard at getting breath properly that I could NOT speak.

    Don't forget, once you lose weight, or have a birthday, you need to change your age and weight, it really makes a difference. Or if it asked for your resting rate, perhaps you need to read up on the proper way to get this number and retake it...just some suggestions to check out. Good luck!

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