Having your heart rate monitor on while weight training.

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  • Azdak
    Azdak Posts: 8,281 Member
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    I am fortunate not to be afflicted with the apparently common misconception that HRMs serve only to tell you how many calories you burned, so I wear mine for every training session, and I don't give a flying crap what anyone thinks about it. Because I wear it every time I train and record the readings every time I train, I am able to accurately measure my progress from one week to the next, and that is a million times more important for my goals than whether or not the calorie burn is 100% accurate.

    I guess I'm one of those with that misconception. Can you please explain how one accurately measures progress when strength training using a HRM?

    You can't. It's as simple as that. People continue to pound their heads against the wall trying to litigate that fact, but it's not a matter of opinion or persuasion. There is no way, under any circumstances or with any style of resistance training that a HRM can be used to track calories during strength training.

    Again, it doesn't mean that you DON'T burn calories. (Some people seem incapable of making that distinction). It just means you cannot track them using an HRM.
    Neat. I get the privilege of disagreeing with azdak, whom I've quoted and who's blog entries I've linked countless MFP'ers to over the years.

    The innermost quote doesn't ever mention using the HRM for calorie burn at all - The poster says s/he uses an HRM for consistency and as a way to compare to previous (assumed similar) workouts. I would argue that that is a GREAT use for an HRM - recording objective intensity level for comparison to previous intensities. I do the same, albeit probably with greater precision that most non-elite-athlete types, and probably with greater precision than I really need (using an R-R recording suunto memory belt and firstbeat athlete software), which brings up another question ... azdak, you have previously stated in blog posts that some of the higher end HRMS _can_ estimate caloric burn during strength training - and have referred specifically to the high end suunto products - do you no longer hold that opinion?

    edited to add:

    http://www.myfitnesspal.com/blog/Azdak/view/the-real-facts-about-hrms-and-calories-what-you-need-to-know-before-purchasing-an-hrm-or-using-one-21472

    "Note: Certain higher-end HRMs--the Polar RS800 and Suunto T6c use a very sophisticated method of analyzing the R-R interval of heart beat signals. When using this method, it is claimed that they can more accurately estimate caloric expenditure at rest, during anaerobic exercise and even during post-exercise oxygen consumption. Since these models are in the $350-$400 range, I am not including them in this review--if you are interested in more detail, check out www.firstbeattechnologies.com and www.suunto.com"


    For the life of me, I could have sworn I was responding to another calorie comment, not the use of an HRM for monitoring heart rate and using that as a recovery guide. Early morning, the eyes don't work as well as they used to.

    The "anaerobic" comment was made in the context of high-intensity cardio work, not strength training. I know that some people refer to resistance exercise as "anaerobic" training, but I have never associated that term with strength training--only things like sprint work, etc. (Actually I try to avoid the term altogether as it has fallen out of favor and it often/usually used incorrectly--I included it in the original blog as more literary shorthand than anything else).

    So, it may be that the blog statement was unclear, but, no I haven't really changed my position. And I fudged a little bit by saying that "it is claimed" since those assertions are made by the manufacturers and, while Firstbeat has a number of white papers describing their research, to my knowledge those claims have not been independently verified.

    But I appreciate the comments--feel free to disagree or question anything, anytime......:happy:
  • Shadowknight137
    Shadowknight137 Posts: 1,243 Member
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    I don't lift for calorie burn.
  • Doberdawn
    Doberdawn Posts: 732 Member
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    So, for those of you using it for when to do sets and/or recover.... just curious.... what %age of max are you trying to stay in for weight training?
  • DopeItUp
    DopeItUp Posts: 18,771 Member
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    So, for those of you using it for when to do sets and/or recover.... just curious.... what %age of max are you trying to stay in for weight training?

    Depends on the exercise. For squats I am generally trying to hit at least 180-190. Deadlifts 165-175, etc. If I'm not hitting at least 155 for any exercise I'm probably slacking. Once my HR drops below 120 I'm usually ready for another set. Just my own personal guidelines.
  • JustJennie1
    JustJennie1 Posts: 3,843 Member
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    I do. My HR can go up to 140 BPM depending on what I'm doing.
  • Beata375
    Beata375 Posts: 68 Member
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    I do. Just be aware it will probably over report calorie burn if your average is below ~120BPM

    Just curious what you mean by this? so if one wears a hrm while lifting, the calories are exxagerated, if the hrm is at 120 or less?
  • jzammetti
    jzammetti Posts: 1,956 Member
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    I am fortunate not to be afflicted with the apparently common misconception that HRMs serve only to tell you how many calories you burned, so I wear mine for every training session, and I don't give a flying crap what anyone thinks about it. Because I wear it every time I train and record the readings every time I train, I am able to accurately measure my progress from one week to the next, and that is a million times more important for my goals than whether or not the calorie burn is 100% accurate.

    I guess I'm one of those with that misconception. Can you please explain how one accurately measures progress when strength training using a HRM?

    I sent Polar and email asking this exact question. Here is a copy of the response I received:

    Dear Jen,

    Thank you contacting Polar Customer Care, we apologize for the delayed response, Polar has received an influx of e-mails recently.

    Calories are calculated by heart rate data and user information (age, weight, height, gender). Therefore your calories would be accurate no matter how you were exercising.

    As long as the transmitter strap is wet, snug around your sternum and you are seeing accurate heart rate data on your watch, your watch will calculate your calories accurately.

    If you have any more questions or concerns please feel free to contact us directly using the link below. We have representatives available via Livechat, E-mail and our toll free line Monday-Friday 9am-5:15pm EST.

    http://www.polarusa.com/us-en

    Thank you for training with Polar!

    Katherine
    Polar Customer Care
    POLAR ELECTRO INC.
  • queenbea77
    queenbea77 Posts: 402 Member
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    I wear mine - not to record the calories but because I am usually doing some form of cardio before & I don't want to take it off & run back to the locker room.
  • phjorg
    phjorg Posts: 252 Member
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    So, for those of you using it for when to do sets and/or recover.... just curious.... what %age of max are you trying to stay in for weight training?
    you don't track that. your heartrate is utterly unimportant when weight training. Instead focus on how much your lifting, and trying to improve upon that number. Trying to get your heartrate to a certain zone when lifting is just....ignorant to training.
  • Azdak
    Azdak Posts: 8,281 Member
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    I am fortunate not to be afflicted with the apparently common misconception that HRMs serve only to tell you how many calories you burned, so I wear mine for every training session, and I don't give a flying crap what anyone thinks about it. Because I wear it every time I train and record the readings every time I train, I am able to accurately measure my progress from one week to the next, and that is a million times more important for my goals than whether or not the calorie burn is 100% accurate.

    I guess I'm one of those with that misconception. Can you please explain how one accurately measures progress when strength training using a HRM?

    I sent Polar and email asking this exact question. Here is a copy of the response I received:

    Dear Jen,

    Thank you contacting Polar Customer Care, we apologize for the delayed response, Polar has received an influx of e-mails recently.

    Calories are calculated by heart rate data and user information (age, weight, height, gender). Therefore your calories would be accurate no matter how you were exercising.

    As long as the transmitter strap is wet, snug around your sternum and you are seeing accurate heart rate data on your watch, your watch will calculate your calories accurately.

    If you have any more questions or concerns please feel free to contact us directly using the link below. We have representatives available via Livechat, E-mail and our toll free line Monday-Friday 9am-5:15pm EST.

    http://www.polarusa.com/us-en

    Thank you for training with Polar!

    Katherine
    Polar Customer Care
    POLAR ELECTRO INC.

    Wow. That's just doubling down on the wrong. There is no way physiologically that any of that can be true.
  • Kaustubhjagtap
    Kaustubhjagtap Posts: 1
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    From what I have read about, the only problem with wearing a HRM during strength training is that it will give readings that are off the chart. For example, i did a lower body work out today for about 35 mins and 8 mins of warm up and 8 mins of cool down cardio. The HRM showed that I burned 773 calories which is really high. The problem occurs because only one set of muscles are engaged at a time during strength training and your heart pumps blood to that muscle group. But the HRM cannot distinguish that. In case of cardio, your entire body gets a workout and the calories burned are much more accurate. I am going to be on the safer side and only count about 50-60% of the calories shown in my HRM during strength training. That way, I dont go overboard with the eating :)

    Any thoughts or comments are welcome!

    KJ
  • Azdak
    Azdak Posts: 8,281 Member
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    From what I have read about, the only problem with wearing a HRM during strength training is that it will give readings that are off the chart. For example, i did a lower body work out today for about 35 mins and 8 mins of warm up and 8 mins of cool down cardio. The HRM showed that I burned 773 calories which is really high. The problem occurs because only one set of muscles are engaged at a time during strength training and your heart pumps blood to that muscle group. But the HRM cannot distinguish that. In case of cardio, your entire body gets a workout and the calories burned are much more accurate. I am going to be on the safer side and only count about 50-60% of the calories shown in my HRM during strength training. That way, I dont go overboard with the eating :)

    Any thoughts or comments are welcome!

    KJ

    What's wrong is that the HRM has developed algorithms that are only valid under certain conditions, i.e. steady-state aerobic exercise.

    Heart rate can ONLY be used as an indicator of calories expended when the increased heart rate reflects a predictable and reliable relationship with oxygen uptake. During strength training that relationship (heart rate/oxygen uptake) is uncoupled and skewed--therefore the changes in heart rate DO NOT reflect the predicted changes in oxygen uptake that occur during steady-state aerobic exercise. And therefore, the calorie numbers that are reflexively spit out by the HRM are just a fantasy. It has nothing to do with what or how many muscles are worked.
  • RandleCassady
    RandleCassady Posts: 7 Member
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    I have worn it a few times but found it kept getting hit by the bar on bench press and rows.
  • phjorg
    phjorg Posts: 252 Member
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    From what I have read about, the only problem with wearing a HRM during strength training is that it will give readings that are off the chart. For example, i did a lower body work out today for about 35 mins and 8 mins of warm up and 8 mins of cool down cardio. The HRM showed that I burned 773 calories which is really high. The problem occurs because only one set of muscles are engaged at a time during strength training and your heart pumps blood to that muscle group. But the HRM cannot distinguish that. In case of cardio, your entire body gets a workout and the calories burned are much more accurate. I am going to be on the safer side and only count about 50-60% of the calories shown in my HRM during strength training. That way, I dont go overboard with the eating :)

    Any thoughts or comments are welcome!

    KJ
    the problem is that your heartrate has zero corolation to calories being burned while doing strength training because the energy systems the body uses to do the work do not require oxygen. It has nothing to do with muscle groups being used.
  • marc_s_johnson
    marc_s_johnson Posts: 107 Member
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    There's no harm in wearing it, the harm is if you plan to eat those calories back or base your diet around them because its not accurate.

    Might be wrong but if your heart is pumping fast you are burning calories so you just have to accept that it might not be 100% accurate but its there to gauge your workout.
  • jcutler2311
    jcutler2311 Posts: 1 Member
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    OK so it seems that the burn rate is exaggerated when using the hrm during weight training but is there any opinions about taking a % of the calculated burn? Eg- hrm suggests 200 cals so only take 50% of that?
  • pcastagner
    pcastagner Posts: 1,606 Member
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    I no longer wear the strap but I still wear the watch to keep track of time. It beeps every minute too. Pretty handy for timing rest.


    It was neat to wear it for the first five months while weight training, and watch how the numbers changed.
  • bobf279
    bobf279 Posts: 342 Member
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    HRMs are not designed for anaerobic activity like weight lifting...the burn I get is about 150 calories more than my actual burn. I wear mine simply to tell me when to start my next set.

    That is what I use it for too, my heart rate is low at rest (38 ish) and when exercising it only rises correspondingly I average about 140 while running and circuits peaking at around 160 when I push. Doing resistance it raises to about 110 so when it drops to 95 I start the next set.
  • megahops
    megahops Posts: 2
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    I am just starting to introduce weight training along with cardio into my life. I'm new to everything and was wondering how to accurately count calories burned from weight training. I don't want to under eat (or over eat for that matter), so every time I do such psychical activity (weight training and cardio) I would like to know how many calories I am burning. I was thinking of getting a heart rate monitor but now reading all of these comments, I am stuck! I understand that a HRM won't accurately measure calories burned while weight training now. However, how should I measure those calories burned? Are the estimates on MFP accurate? I find that the estimates on the treadmill for calories burned are never the same as the estimates on MFP when logging cardio. So, is that true for weight training too? Would a HRM have accurate readings for treadmill/other cardio activities?

    Any help is appreciated!
  • swinginchandra
    swinginchandra Posts: 418 Member
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    Here's one part of this whole thing I don't get:

    Y'all keep saying that HR is only porportional to calories burned in the case of lower body steady state cardio -- so it would make sense that, take cycling for example, this means the calories are being predominantly absorbed by your quads, and other auxillary leg muscles.
    So what about a set of squats? I bet a set of squats recruits more muscle fiber than biking at the same HR for the same amount of time? So then would it be approaching a good estimation for lower body workouts involving big muscle groups??

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