Frustration - Wife sabotages herself - women listen up
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My wife had gotten out of a verbally abusive relationship just before we got together so many years ago. Self-esteem, self-confidence, and self-image were all effected (she was 22 at the time). Good, honest compliments and support in everything she did was key to restoring her self confidence and recognizing herself as the smart, beautiful woman I saw.
I tell my wife "I love you" at least a dozen times each day for the past 20 years; I do my best impersonation of Robert McGreggor (movie "Rob Roy") when I express "You know how fine you are to me, Mary Ann?"; I always give her a heartfelt "damn!", when I look her up and down, no matter if she is standing there naked or coming through the door in her work clothes (it always makes her smile); I hold her hand in mine; I listen when we talk; She is my equal and I truly believe she can be anything she wishes to be; I don't push her, I empower her; I am her rock and she is mine; she is the love of my life as I am hers, and we know it because we say it every day.
I honestly think something is not right for you. Whether it is your wife or something in the relationship, you need to be open enough to discuss it in a calm, patient, rational, manner. Be supportive, ask but don't demand an answer, be prepared to be hurt (it's possible) and let her know you can take it, ask her about couple's therapy (but don't ask her about just therapy for HER), let her know you adore her and you want to help make things right, be accepting that maybe the problem is you.0 -
I had a hard time reading as you tore your wife to shreds about her lack of confidence. This was a uniquely painful experience, thank you for subjecting me to this brand new kind of discomfort.
With love,
Burt
This is pretty much the fight I keep having with my BF. I have depression. Some horrible things happened to me in the last few years that made me very afraid that I had been weighed, measured, and found wanting by society in general. And it's very hard to "like yourself" in a vacuum, despite what talk show self help gurus seem to think.
These feelings aren't going to go away overnight, no matter what she, you, or anyone else in the world does. Your wife could win the Miss America Pageant tomorrow and still feel the same way.
My boyfriend is a "fixer" too, and it drives him nuts that I feel this way when he feels he can't do anything about it and he feels it's not "productive" for me to express those feelings. What this accomplishes is making me feel guilty for not feeling confident and happy enough, which gives me another reason to tear myself to shreds in my head.
The best thing you can do for your wife is get the serenity to accept the things you can not change. She might be insecure for a year, five years, the rest of her life. And it's nothing to do with if you like how she looks, or even how she actually looks. It's just the way she feels, and those feelings probably don't have much to do with you, to be honest.
Just get over it and let her find her own way through this. Let her know you love her and you'll be there for her, but let her ASK for help if she needs it.0 -
OP, instead of saying WTF and calling you cray, cray, I'm going to offer some advice. Ready. STOP IT!! Stop what you're doing cause it is full of wrong and then more wrong. It doesn't matter if she took 5hrs to get ready when you met her. How she looks shouldn't be why you married her. To say she's selfish for not wanting sex with you, I'm going to wtf you there. Can't help it. My husband can't wait to tear my clothes off, no matter what I'm wearing or how my hair is. He LOVES ME, not the image I put out. And I wouldn't want to get nekkid with someone who put me down even when they were dillusional in thinking they were praising me. Seriously! And for the love of everything holy, DO NOT TAKE A PHOTO AND TELL HER TO LOOK LIKE IT. NO. JUST NO. And yes, I'm yelling.
Lol! Yeah, this gave me an idea, instead of telling her how pretty she is, just grab her push her up against the wall, n tear her clothes off. Actions speak louder than words.
Sometimes after a few years of marriage, plus however many years you were together before marriage, things can get boring in the bedroom. Maybe the two of you just need to spice things up. As far as how she's dressed, who cares! :happy: :smokin: 0 -
My wife had gotten out of a verbally abusive relationship just before we got together so many years ago. Self-esteem, self-confidence, and self-image were all effected (she was 22 at the time). Good, honest compliments and support in everything she did was key to restoring her self confidence and recognizing herself as the smart, beautiful woman I saw.
I tell my wife "I love you" at least a dozen times each day for the past 20 years; I do my best impersonation of Robert McGreggor (movie "Rob Roy") when I express "You know how fine you are to me, Mary Ann?"; I always give her a heartfelt "damn!", when I look her up and down, no matter if she is standing there naked or coming through the door in her work clothes (it always makes her smile); I hold her hand in mine; I listen when we talk; She is my equal and I truly believe she can be anything she wishes to be; I don't push her, I empower her; I am her rock and she is mine; she is the love of my life as I am hers, and we know it because we say it every day.
I honestly think something is not right for you. Whether it is your wife or something in the relationship, you need to be open enough to discuss it in a calm, patient, rational, manner. Be supportive, ask but don't demand an answer, be prepared to be hurt (it's possible) and let her know you can take it, ask her about couple's therapy (but don't ask her about just therapy for HER), let her know you adore her and you want to help make things right, be accepting that maybe the problem is you.
OP, emulate this man.
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Dude... Dude.... Dude.... I'm going to be brutally honest here, even if it doesn't seem so, the following is meant to help you.
"arguments about her hair"... "Throw away her stuff"... "women listen up"..
You are exhibiting signs of controlling behavior, that is what is wrecking her confidence, and your cost is the problems in bed. I didin't read the 7 pages, only the original post, hopefully others said something along the same lines.
Do not define "appropriate appearance" for a woman, its like asking for a death sentence. Just appreciate her beauty, hoodie or evening gown.. should not matter. If it does, rethink your purpose in that marriage, 3 years is easier to correct a mistake than 13 or 23.
this!0 -
I know this advice was given in good fun, but it's potentially pretty devastating. When one partner is already putting some level of (evidently unwanted) pressure on the other to have sex, turning it physical is way more likely to do the opposite of what's intended.Lol! Yeah, this gave me an idea, instead of telling her how pretty she is, just grab her push her up against the wall, n tear her clothes off. Actions speak louder than words. Sometimes after a few years of marriage, plus however many years you were together before marriage, things can get boring in the bedroom. Maybe the two of you just need to spice things up. As far as how she's dressed, who cares! :happy: :smokin:0 -
Oh boy, I don't think you are trying to be mean, although it sounds like some people think you are (I did not have time to read all the posts). No one really can say how or what your relationship with your wife should be except for you and your wife. Everyone is different, and it's the agreements we make with each other that keep a marriage together (I've been married 32 years). Of course, they have to be agreements we are comfortable making. It doesn't work to try to change someone else and it doesn't work to try to change yourself for someone else. So you have to agree that certain differences are OK and love someone as they are. I remember being 22 and how insecure I was then. I honestly had no clue that I was pretty, sexy, etc. Looking back I cannot believe how I under-appreciated myself. The funny thing is, my husband always appreciated it, and told me all the time how good-looking he was and how much he loved me. I was still insecure. I still had the image of myself age 11-13, the chubby girl no one wanted to dance with in junior high school. I just couldn't help it - even though I was thin and cute. I don't think I really ever became "comfortable in my own skin" until my mid-30s. Fortunately, my husband and I were able to keep working on our relationship, improving our communication, and in the long run, we have ended up better than ever. You should try to talk to your wife about how you feel - make it about you, not about her, so it's not you criticizing her, it's you saying how you feel, and giving her a chance to say whatever she has to say about herself. If you keep communicating, and don't try to always solve each other's problems and hang ups (sometimes all someone needs is a good listener - it took my husband a while to realize I was only asking for that, not to have someone give me advice or try to solve all my problems, only I can do that part), you will get through this. Focus on the things you love and admire about your wife and keep talking and above all listening to her. Good luck and best wishes!0
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OP, instead of saying WTF and calling you cray, cray, I'm going to offer some advice. Ready. STOP IT!! Stop what you're doing cause it is full of wrong and then more wrong. It doesn't matter if she took 5hrs to get ready when you met her. How she looks shouldn't be why you married her. To say she's selfish for not wanting sex with you, I'm going to wtf you there. Can't help it. My husband can't wait to tear my clothes off, no matter what I'm wearing or how my hair is. He LOVES ME, not the image I put out. And I wouldn't want to get nekkid with someone who put me down even when they were dillusional in thinking they were praising me. Seriously! And for the love of everything holy, DO NOT TAKE A PHOTO AND TELL HER TO LOOK LIKE IT. NO. JUST NO. And yes, I'm yelling.
Lol! Yeah, this gave me an idea, instead of telling her how pretty she is, just grab her push her up against the wall, n tear her clothes off. Actions speak louder than words. Sometimes after a few years of marriage, plus however many years you were together before marriage, things can get boring in the bedroom. Maybe the two of you just need to spice things up. As far as how she's dressed, who cares! :happy: :smokin:
That works. 12yrs and going strong....just saying.0 -
My wife had gotten out of a verbally abusive relationship just before we got together so many years ago. Self-esteem, self-confidence, and self-image were all effected (she was 22 at the time). Good, honest compliments and support in everything she did was key to restoring her self confidence and recognizing herself as the smart, beautiful woman I saw.
I tell my wife "I love you" at least a dozen times each day for the past 20 years; I do my best impersonation of Robert McGreggor (movie "Rob Roy") when I express "You know how fine you are to me, Mary Ann?"; I always give her a heartfelt "damn!", when I look her up and down, no matter if she is standing there naked or coming through the door in her work clothes (it always makes her smile); I hold her hand in mine; I listen when we talk; She is my equal and I truly believe she can be anything she wishes to be; I don't push her, I empower her; I am her rock and she is mine; she is the love of my life as I am hers, and we know it because we say it every day.
I honestly think something is not right for you. Whether it is your wife or something in the relationship, you need to be open enough to discuss it in a calm, patient, rational, manner. Be supportive, ask but don't demand an answer, be prepared to be hurt (it's possible) and let her know you can take it, ask her about couple's therapy (but don't ask her about just therapy for HER), let her know you adore her and you want to help make things right, be accepting that maybe the problem is you.
^^for the win0 -
OMG! Reading comprehension here. It's not about the hair bands, it's about he's trying to get a point across to his wife about how beautiful she is. His wife not seeing her as she really is is frustrating the writer. And yes, it effects everyone around her. I have had friends that had no idea how pretty they were and all I ever heard was how they didn't feel pretty at all. Annoying and tiring to reinforce that they are pretty. I stopped after awhile. I can't make them see it, only they can...0
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My wife had gotten out of a verbally abusive relationship just before we got together so many years ago. Self-esteem, self-confidence, and self-image were all effected (she was 22 at the time). Good, honest compliments and support in everything she did was key to restoring her self confidence and recognizing herself as the smart, beautiful woman I saw.
I tell my wife "I love you" at least a dozen times each day for the past 20 years; I do my best impersonation of Robert McGreggor (movie "Rob Roy") when I express "You know how fine you are to me, Mary Ann?"; I always give her a heartfelt "damn!", when I look her up and down, no matter if she is standing there naked or coming through the door in her work clothes (it always makes her smile); I hold her hand in mine; I listen when we talk; She is my equal and I truly believe she can be anything she wishes to be; I don't push her, I empower her; I am her rock and she is mine; she is the love of my life as I am hers, and we know it because we say it every day.
I honestly think something is not right for you. Whether it is your wife or something in the relationship, you need to be open enough to discuss it in a calm, patient, rational, manner. Be supportive, ask but don't demand an answer, be prepared to be hurt (it's possible) and let her know you can take it, ask her about couple's therapy (but don't ask her about just therapy for HER), let her know you adore her and you want to help make things right, be accepting that maybe the problem is you.
This is great!0 -
I'm a woman who feels more comfortable with my hair pulled back, some jeans, and a t-shirt. If my husband ever threw my hairbands away, and told me that I needed to make myself more presentable, he would not be my husband. Shame on you. She's not your trophy.
Sorry, but after reading that part, I couldn't even make it to the end.
Exactly!0 -
Yes, self esteem is pretty much the sexiest thing a woman (or man) can possess.So how can this be fixed? Well, I am happy to say that this is open discussion thus helpful hints would be appreciated. What I can say is that things are getting better as far as my wife's self confidence. She's making an increased effort to get ready, workout, and maintain a healthy lifestyle. I think in doing these things, she has learned that she is worth a great deal more than she thought. Thanks for reading, feel free to respond.
This whole part makes me feel icky. And I don't know, a lot of the post made me feel icky. I obviously don't know you, your wife, your relationship, or anything about you, but you seem way too invested in your wife's self esteem... Maybe it's just coming out in this post and the rest of the time you're a pretty normal guy. I don't know.
"She has made an increased effort to [do the things I think she should]. I think in doing these things, she has learned..." Man, that is just... really uncomfortable for me to read.
I dunno. I wish you and your wife luck.
^^THIS^^
Working out indicates self worth?? NOT a cause and effect relationship. Lots of very busy, confident people in this world don't work out. "Getting ready" - for what?? Women are not Barbie dolls to be dressed for Ken's arm - time spent in front of the mirror - again, no cause and effect with self-worth. Maintaining a healthy lifestyle: are we talking about a chain-smoking binge drinker here? Or are you trying to control her weight, wrapping it in a pretty little "healthy lifestyle" wrapper?
Just words on paper but this fails the smell test for me. Topic title in itself "women listen up" - passive-aggressive. I think *you* may be feeding her self-image problems in a very passive-aggressive kind of way.
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I agree with you! women do sabotage themselves. The times that I do that to myself, my husband always tells me to stop because one of the reasons why he fell for me was myself confidence. The way I carried myself around people or just around him. I also grew up having more guy friends then women. And I have seen how guys don't like to hear a woman whine about themselves. Most men don't see what you are "seeing" why point it out to them!!!! There is nothing wrong with knowing you need to do something to feel better but whinning about it is unattractive to men. But he would not be my husband if he did something like you did or do to your wife. Which he wouldn't because I do my part in looking good for him because what he likes, not because he expects it from me.0
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OP ,
you are a good husband and your heart is in the right place. patience is one thing that you need in abundance to work a marriage right.
when i met my husband,i was heavy and just out of a bad relationship . when he wanted to date me, i tried to drive him away cause i felt i was not good enough. it took 3 long years and endless heart to hearts to convince me that i was a nice person to be with, and finally we married. now thinking back , i think most positive reinforcements i derived was not from the appreciation of physical beauty(though it was too apparent he thought me beautiful:happy: ), but how he made an effort to express the appreciation for every little thing i do( eg. finding relevant references for his academic work,noticing he needed a new office bag, reminding him his medication at the middle of the day). a woman feels to be needed as a person... try to understand what is bugging her and let her know that you her concerned with her feelings.
good luck to you and wish you a happy life together.0 -
While I don't care for the undertones of a woman's worth or self-respect being predominantly based on her physical appearance and level of makeup/hairdressing/fashion/etc, I think you should sit down with her and seriously talk about these issues or visit a couple counselling session instead of posting this on a forum. And do keep complimenting her despite her lack of acknowledgement or stating she thinks you are lying, I have been in the same situation and the removal of the bit of positive feedback that is present only makes it worse.0
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It sounds like you do not know your wife...or women for that matter.....Have you even talked to her about this? Or anything? You are speaking about her like she is a child who you need to compliment for "positive reinforcement".
Just...wow.0 -
I am 54 so I am not a youngster. My opinion is much like the majority of the others.
I suffer from depression and PTSD.
I do not even like to leave the house and I don't really like being around people at all, but I used to like to be social. I am post accident and it caused brain damage and hearing loss so I like just being HOME.
But even before the wreck, I had evolved into a woman (from a "girl") who LIKES TO BE COMFORTABLE!
I do remember when I was younger, getting all "gussied up" to go out and all of that, but I look back at those years of my life, and I realize that I was doing all of that to be "accepted" because I was insecure and I NEVER thought I looked good enough.
I really LIKE who I've become in the realm of being okay with ME (except getting too heavy, and I am working on that, for my health and for my family too), sans all of the trying to impress anyone else stuff.
I am clean, I am funny, I look fine with no make up and I really don't give a rat's fanny what others think of me because I am comfortable with WHO I AM. If someone cannot love me for WHO I AM and not WHAT I LOOK LIKE they can take train right on outta my life.
Maybe you should learn to love your wife AS SHE IS and not try to change her. As she becomes comfortable with herself she will either want to get prettied up, or like me, SHE WON'T, but, IT IS HER LIFE and hopefully, she doesn't fuss at you and tell you what to wear or how you should look.
Google "Agape love"- UNCONDITIONAL acceptance...
Best regards,
Rie
PS- If ANYONE made a JUDGEMENT CALL to throw out ANYTHING that belonged to ME, be it hair junk, clothing, a hat, My dishwater, A scrap of paper I had, or even as much as a little stick of gum, I would do them a similar disservice by throwing out something(s) of theirs and PROBABLY stab them in the eye with my fork.
Being "sorry" after the fact does not make it right, nor does it erase the fact that you TOOK THE LIBERTY TO DO IT.
I vote that you should replace what you got rid of ten fold and add a big fat diamond to the lot of goodies.0 -
Dude... Dude.... Dude.... I'm going to be brutally honest here, even if it doesn't seem so, the following is meant to help you.
"arguments about her hair"... "Throw away her stuff"... "women listen up"..
You are exhibiting signs of controlling behavior, that is what is wrecking her confidence, and your cost is the problems in bed. I didin't read the 7 pages, only the original post, hopefully others said something along the same lines.
Do not define "appropriate appearance" for a woman, its like asking for a death sentence. Just appreciate her beauty, hoodie or evening gown.. should not matter. If it does, rethink your purpose in that marriage, 3 years is easier to correct a mistake than 13 or 23.
:drinker:0 -
Dude... Dude.... Dude.... I'm going to be brutally honest here, even if it doesn't seem so, the following is meant to help you.
"arguments about her hair"... "Throw away her stuff"... "women listen up"..
You are exhibiting signs of controlling behavior, that is what is wrecking her confidence, and your cost is the problems in bed. I didin't read the 7 pages, only the original post, hopefully others said something along the same lines.
Do not define "appropriate appearance" for a woman, its like asking for a death sentence. Just appreciate her beauty, hoodie or evening gown.. should not matter. If it does, rethink your purpose in that marriage, 3 years is easier to correct a mistake than 13 or 23.
:drinker:
yep perfect! ^ listen to him.0
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