losing fat and gaining muscle at same time...

anwest20
anwest20 Posts: 17 Member
in Food and Nutrition
Just found this and wanted to know what people thought...

" But perhaps most interesting is a study of fourteen women who were on a significantly small, 800 calorie, high protein diet. Seven "of the women lifted weights for 30-40 minutes three days a week, and the other seven women dieted but did not weigh train.Both groups of women lost 33 pounds, but the group that weight lifted actually increased their lean muscle mass by 6 percent, whereas the women that did not lift weights lost muscle along with the fat"

Would this be an ok way to go?

Replies

  • ninerbuff
    ninerbuff Posts: 48,988 Member
    Every weight loss plan will include lean muscle loss. Weight lifting helps to reduce lean muscle lost.

    With these women on a VLCD I'm assuming they are obese/morbidly obese since lean muscle being built doesn't usually happen unless there's a calorie surplus. They would be the exception.

    So unless you're obese/morbidly obese and following a supervised VLCD plan, this ISN'T a good way to do it.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal/Group FitnessTrainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
  • angieleighbyrd
    angieleighbyrd Posts: 989 Member
    I'm pretty sure my dog eats more than 800 calories a day....
  • flex500
    flex500 Posts: 63
    are you asking if it is ok to go on an excessively low calorie diet if you lift weights? If so honestly I would not take that approach...it's not sustainable and there is just no reason to go on that low of a calorie diet.

    If you are asking if you should lift weights or do resistance training i would emphatically say yes. it will help you in many ways too many to list them all.
  • Sarauk2sf
    Sarauk2sf Posts: 28,072 Member
    Just found this and wanted to know what people thought...

    " But perhaps most interesting is a study of fourteen women who were on a significantly small, 800 calorie, high protein diet. Seven "of the women lifted weights for 30-40 minutes three days a week, and the other seven women dieted but did not weigh train.Both groups of women lost 33 pounds, but the group that weight lifted actually increased their lean muscle mass by 6 percent, whereas the women that did not lift weights lost muscle along with the fat"

    Would this be an ok way to go?

    I am pretty sure that this study was with obese untrained women (both of those groups are exceptions to the 'not gaining muscle on a deficit rule'. Also, I do not recall them actually gaining LBM, but being with a SD of maintaining (the ones who did not strength train lost LBM).

    Also, LBM does not necessarily mean muscle - it also includes water.

    Do you have the source of the study.

    That being said, lifting is very beneficial and will help maintain LBM, increase bone density, and a slew of other benefits.

    In answer to your question - these women were medically supervised - if you are not, then do not cut your caloric intake that low . Even if you are, and unless it is medically imperative that you lose weight quickly, do not do it.

    However, absolutely lift weights.
  • Brads2ndLife
    Brads2ndLife Posts: 72
    Every weight loss plan will include lean muscle loss. Weight lifting helps to reduce lean muscle lost.

    With these women on a VLCD I'm assuming they are obese/morbidly obese since lean muscle being built doesn't usually happen unless there's a calorie surplus. They would be the exception.

    So unless you're obese/morbidly obese and following a supervised VLCD plan, this ISN'T a good way to do it.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal/Group FitnessTrainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

    I started at 303lbs with 171lbs of lean mass 2 weeks ago. I dropped 6lbs first week and also picked up 6lbs of lean mass. Not doing VLCD but I guess its from same effect you mention for obese people.

    How much lean mass should a normal person expect to lose per lb dropped normally?
  • lobo_a_gogo
    lobo_a_gogo Posts: 265 Member
    You want to eat WAY more calories than that (but still under maintenance level) to increase lean mass while decreasing fat.

    Find out what your TDEE (Total Day Energy Expenditure) is (google TDEE calculator, you'll find one easily). Eat 20% LESS calories than your TDEE. Manage your macronutrients (eat about 40% carbs, 25-30% fat, 30-35% protein).

    Lift heavy weights (heavy enough that by the 15th rep or so you CAN'T do anymore. No more than 3 sets per exercise. No more than every other day.

    Cardio if you choose on your days off.

    Make sure that on workout days you increase your caloric intake, particularly make sure you're eating more protein on lifting days.

    Your weight loss will be slow, but you will notice the size difference.
  • Sarauk2sf
    Sarauk2sf Posts: 28,072 Member
    You want to eat WAY more calories than that (but still under maintenance level) to increase lean mass while decreasing fat.

    Find out what your TDEE (Total Day Energy Expenditure) is (google TDEE calculator, you'll find one easily). Eat 20% LESS calories than your TDEE. Manage your macronutrients (eat about 40% carbs, 25-30% fat, 30-35% protein).

    Lift heavy weights (heavy enough that by the 15th rep or so you CAN'T do anymore. No more than 3 sets per exercise. No more than every other day.

    Cardio if you choose on your days off.

    Make sure that on workout days you increase your caloric intake, particularly make sure you're eating more protein on lifting days.

    Your weight loss will be slow, but you will notice the size difference.

    You do not need to increase your intake or protein on a lifting day - that is personal preference. If you are going to increase calories, I would suggest they go to carbs, assuming a sufficient daily protein target in the first place.
  • Proyecto_AN
    Proyecto_AN Posts: 387
    Morbidly obese and detrained persons will gain LBM if they exercise and eat the right way. Guess what happens when you move alot of weight.
  • Sarauk2sf
    Sarauk2sf Posts: 28,072 Member
    Every weight loss plan will include lean muscle loss. Weight lifting helps to reduce lean muscle lost.

    With these women on a VLCD I'm assuming they are obese/morbidly obese since lean muscle being built doesn't usually happen unless there's a calorie surplus. They would be the exception.

    So unless you're obese/morbidly obese and following a supervised VLCD plan, this ISN'T a good way to do it.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal/Group FitnessTrainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

    I started at 303lbs with 171lbs of lean mass 2 weeks ago. I dropped 6lbs first week and also picked up 6lbs of lean mass. Not doing VLCD but I guess its from same effect you mention for obese people.

    How much lean mass should a normal person expect to lose per lb dropped normally?

    If you lift weights, get enough protein and have a moderate caloric intake and do not get super lean - you can pretty much maintain (excluding water weight).

    The more extreme the caloric deficit, any protein deficiencies, lack of exercise, leanness, age, genetics etc will all determine the % of muscle mass you lose.
  • Brads2ndLife
    Brads2ndLife Posts: 72
    Morbidly obese and detrained persons will gain LBM if they exercise and eat the right way. Guess what happens when you move alot of weight.

    I'll be healthier? :p

    From the way you say it, I guess LBM will come off faster than normal then maybe?
    If you lift weights, get enough protein and have a moderate caloric intake and do not get super lean - you can pretty much maintain (excluding water weight).

    The more extreme the caloric deficit, any protein deficiencies, lack of exercise, leanness, age, genetics etc will all determine the % of muscle mass you lose.

    Thankyou
  • joyfulrunner22
    joyfulrunner22 Posts: 33 Member
    That informatoin (study) you quoted is in a book I am reading, and even the author(s) say that 800 calories is way too low!
  • amy1612
    amy1612 Posts: 1,356 Member
    As a no-obese lifter there is no way I could eat 800 calories a day to support my lifting. Or in any way build muscle. I was struggling on 1600, which is already double the amount those women were consuming.

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