This was hard for me to read.
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Christianity is not the issue here. These people are mentally ill. I can't believe they were allowed to keep their kid after they let the other one die. They should be in a mental health facility, not jail or out on the streets either. They must be delusional to believe that their child doesn't need to get medical attention especially after one kid died already. I'm a Christian btw. There are a lot of people that make other Christians look bad because they are psychopaths.0
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I pray the guys pee pee falls off. He shouldnt be having any more kids.
Or this
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Faith isn't exclusively about prayer, that isn't and never has been how God works/ed. You have to have faith, but you have to know when to heed the voice moving you towards the solution. There is an applicable story I heard once, I looked for it online and snagged it off some random website, but this about sums it up:
While out to sea, a large boat became shipwrecked and there was only a single survivor. This man prayed and asked God to save his life. Soon thereafter, another boat came by and offered the man some help.
"No thanks," he said. "I'm waiting for God to save me."
The men on the boat shrugged their shoulders and continued. As the man became more deeply concerned, another boat came by. Again, the people aboard offered this man some help, and again he politely decline. "I'm waiting for God to save me," he said again.
After some time, the man began to lose his faith, and soon after that he died. Upon reaching Heaven, he had a chance to speak with God briefly.
"Why did you let me die? Why didn't you answer my prayers?"
"Dummy, I sent you two boats!"
God is always watching out for the best interests of our spiritual evolution, even when we are too narrowly focused to see all the other opportunities it presents us. Sometimes, all that is needed is a change of perspective.0 -
I am a Christian and this is so wrong to me. I believe God gives people gifts and talents and the ability to use those gifts and talents to help other people. Bringing their child to the doctor could have answered their prayers, I'm sure there was a doctor or a nurse that had the ability to help them.
yep, this0 -
I am a Christian, so I can offer my input. I feel these parents were very confused about how faith and asking for God's help works.
Ever heard the little kids' tale about the man who was shipwrecked and floating in the ocean? Every day he prayed to God to be saved. Soon a fishing boat sailed by. He turned down their help, saying, "God will save me." The next day a cruise ship sailed by. He passed on their assistance, saying "God will save me." The next day an aircraft carrier went by, and he said the same thing, "God will save me". The next day he drowned. When he met God, he asked him why he didn't help. God said to him, "I sent a sailboat, a cruise liner, and even a whole aircraft carrier to save you! Why did you turn them down?"
^^I think that's what's happening, here.
I believe God means other people to help us. (In this case, DOCTORS) From a Christian standpoint, God wouldn't not have made antibiotics and modern medicine available to us if we were just supposed to use prayer to cure maladies. Pretty sure these parents had a few screws loose.. It people like those that makes the rest of the world think Christians are nuts.
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Being a Christian myself, I very much believe in the power of prayer! With that being said, prayer is only part of the equation...if we pray and ask God to heal, He expects that we are going to do our part. Whether that be resting, eating right, or even going to the Dr. There are Christian doctors out there, that will pray for you. There are, I'm sure, that will pray with you. "With God, nothing is impossible..." but not at the expense of such a gift as a child! Plain and simple, that was neglect!0
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Christianity is not the issue here. These people are mentally ill. I can't believe they were allowed to keep their kid after they let the other one die. They should be in a mental health facility, not jail or out on the streets either. They must be delusional to believe that their child doesn't need to get medical attention especially after one kid died already. I'm a Christian btw. There are a lot of people that make other Christians look bad because they are psychopaths.
^^YUP.0 -
Oops - someone else posted the same story/parable....0
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Sorry. I had an after thought. This is man's stupidity not God's. So no one should be blaming Him for these bad choices.0
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I am a Christian and this is so wrong to me. I believe God gives people gifts and talents and the ability to use those gifts and talents to help other people. Bringing their child to the doctor could have answered their prayers, I'm sure there was a doctor or a nurse that had the ability to help them.
^^This. I am a believer but what these people did was wrong. The article mentions the church that they go to and the website for the church has a sermon/article about healing and God. No-where in scripture does it say that we cannot seek aid from doctors. God works through people. We are just not to depend ONLY on doctors.
At my church, when people are sick or having surgery, we often pray for God to guide the doctors hands in surgery and give wisdom in treatments.
Some people like this couple believe that if you pray for healing and it doesn't come, you didn't have enough faith. Faith isn't from self, it is from and of God. It is so sad to see that they have allowed now 2 children to die when it was not necessary.0 -
I know a couple personally that did just this. While I am a Christian I also believe thst doctors are answer to prayers their little boy died. They are great parents raising wonderful children.. they made him as comfortable as possible.
Look at it this way. I would be the same as a couple taking their child to a native medicine man. In their beliefs, this will heal the child.
I dont agree with it. But I am not one to force my beliefs on others. It msy be wrong from wh err e you or I stand.
But take a min to really see their side0 -
That is so sad...I do believe in the power of prayer, I ask people to pray when family members are sick and all..but that is straight up neglect and bad parenting0
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I also believe that God put doctors on this earth and that I can pray for the doctor's hand as he treats my very ill child.
^
Agreed!0 -
I am not a Christian but every Christian I know personally believes in the idea of free will-- meaning you have the free will to to use what tools you have at your disposal to problem solve instead of just praying that God will just fix it for you.0
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I am also a Christian.
Basically, pray that the Doctor knows what he is doing.
And, what might be a little known fact:
The apostle Luke was a doctor.
True story.0 -
I didn't read the article. I just can't read stuff like that or it will haunt me forever.
But - there are a whole lot of crazy people out there and when you mix religion with crazy you get something dangerous.0 -
WOW. This broke my heart.
I odn't know if someone already said it but seiously.. as a Christian I firmly believe that Doctors were put on this Earth for a reason and I believe that God works through the hands of those that help to heal0 -
As a Christian, I know that God has the power to heal people, and there are times when this is what happens. Very often God will use those around us to "be His hands", this can be the doctor that helps a sick child, the person who smiles and says "you look great today".
I truely believe that revelation is not closed, individuals can be guided by God to reach out and bless those around them. Revelation is not closed to the world either, just because the bible was written in a time with less medicine doesn't mean that God cannot guide the hands of doctors and nurses today to improve the health of His children. Open revelation today means that prophets can speak out against things liek child abuse.
When my children are sick, I pray for them, and ask for blessing on them, that doesn not stop me from taking them to a doctor.
Everyone here needs to see the other side of believing too: Christians fasting and praying for their children and geting medical help. Sometimes even with prayers children are not 100% cured, I don't always know why but I expect the Lord to help me help them and often in the process they help me.
here is a link to a much more uplifting blog http://welovegracie.blogspot.ca/ start with the timeline on the right.0 -
I am a Christian and this is so wrong to me. I believe God gives people gifts and talents and the ability to use those gifts and talents to help other people. Bringing their child to the doctor could have answered their prayers, I'm sure there was a doctor or a nurse that had the ability to help them.
I like what you wrote here. While I am not a Christian (a rather non-observant Jew leaning toward Buddhism at this point LOL), I believe that prayer is great if it helps you feel better or understand something, but it does not have to supersede action. It's not like a person can't pray and then TAKE ACTION to change their situation, whatever it is. Most people I know who pray (unlike the couple in the above mentioned article) also choose to take some kind of action....these people did not. I do think they're guilty of neglect by not taking action in their child's case, and I can't imagine how this was allowed to happen TWICE. Those poor children.0 -
Rarely do I read I thread that I wish I wouldn't have, this is one of them. OP, you should have left your thoughts to yourself and left that other link buried in the forums. These parents are confused and because of that were neglectful, not once but twice. The other kids should be taken out of the house.0
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I'm reminded of the old joke:
A religious man is on top of a roof during a great flood. A man comes by in a boat and says "get in, get in!" The religous man replies, " no I have faith in God, he will grant me a miracle."
Later the water is up to his waist and another boat comes by and the guy tells him to get in again. He responds that he has faith in god and god will give him a miracle. With the water at about chest high, another boat comes to rescue him, but he turns down the offer again cause "God will grant him a miracle."
With the water at chin high, a helicopter throws down a ladder and they tell him to get in, mumbling with the water in his mouth, he again turns down the request for help for the faith of God.
He arrives at the gates of heaven with broken faith and says to Peter, I thought God would grant me a miracle and I have been let down." St. Peter chuckles and responds, "I don't know what you're complaining about, we sent you three boats and a helicopter."0 -
well said!I am a Christian, so I can offer my input. I feel these parents were very confused about how faith and asking for God's help works.
Ever heard the little kids' tale about the man who was shipwrecked and floating in the ocean? Every day he prayed to God to be saved. Soon a fishing boat sailed by. He turned down their help, saying, "God will save me." The next day a cruise ship sailed by. He passed on their assistance, saying "God will save me." The next day an aircraft carrier went by, and he said the same thing, "God will save me". The next day he drowned. When he met God, he asked him why he didn't help. God said to him, "I sent a sailboat, a cruise liner, and even a whole aircraft carrier to save you! Why did you turn them down?"
^^I think that's what's happening, here.
I believe God means other people to help us. (In this case, DOCTORS) From a Christian standpoint, God wouldn't not have made antibiotics and modern medicine available to us if we were just supposed to use prayer to cure maladies. Pretty sure these parents had a few screws loose.. It people like those that makes the rest of the world think Christians are nuts.0 -
My dad put it best: "Pray like it all depends on God, and act like it all depends on you." Take away the latter and you end up with a scary situation.0
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Ever heard the little kids' tale about the man who was shipwrecked and floating in the ocean? Every day he prayed to God to be saved. Soon a fishing boat sailed by. He turned down their help, saying, "God will save me." The next day a cruise ship sailed by. He passed on their assistance, saying "God will save me." The next day an aircraft carrier went by, and he said the same thing, "God will save me". The next day he drowned. When he met God, he asked him why he didn't help. God said to him, "I sent a sailboat, a cruise liner, and even a whole aircraft carrier to save you! Why did you turn them down?"
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Oh, I like your version, better!
I'm reminded of the old joke:
A religious man is on top of a roof during a great flood. A man comes by in a boat and says "get in, get in!" The religous man replies, " no I have faith in God, he will grant me a miracle."
Later the water is up to his waist and another boat comes by and the guy tells him to get in again. He responds that he has faith in god and god will give him a miracle. With the water at about chest high, another boat comes to rescue him, but he turns down the offer again cause "God will grant him a miracle."
With the water at chin high, a helicopter throws down a ladder and they tell him to get in, mumbling with the water in his mouth, he again turns down the request for help for the faith of God.
He arrives at the gates of heaven with broken faith and says to Peter, I thought God would grant me a miracle and I have been let down." St. Peter chuckles and responds, "I don't know what you're complaining about, we sent you three boats and a helicopter."0 -
I too am a Christian, and I have witnessed amazing healing first hand that had no medical explanation. I actually experienced it myself as well. That said, God gave us doctors for a reason and provided man with the knowledge of modern medicine. To not use the resources provided for us is just plain dumb and is cruel for the children. Those parents should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law.0
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It makes me sick as well. I am a Christian and my take on it is this - some people take things to the extreme. Of course I pray for healing for my children (I have 2) but when they obviously are needing medical attention - off to the Dr I go! Even before it is recommended (as in, before it gets bad)...
Doctors are given the calling and the gift of healing. We SHOULD take advantage of that!
I wish that there were more natural remedies offered or recognizing that what we put in to our body affects us and that Drs didn't just treat every symptom with a different pill but when a kid is sick, they sometimes need more than that and I am happy to get them treated!!!
I guess it's like sports fans - be a fan, not a fanatic. One thing to go to the game, another to wear your lucky underwear every day of the season, paint yourself and attend the games half naked screaming about the plays and other such craziness *lol*
Seriously though, it's sick. Have balance. And take care of your kids. They are gifts.0 -
I think when it comes to children, then drs/medicine need to be used. A child can't tell you if he/she wants this or that religion.
This. If an adult refuses treatment because they believe that their deity will save them, that's fine. Children are another story, though.0 -
Rarely do I read I thread that I wish I wouldn't have, this is one of them. OP, you should have left your thoughts to yourself and left that other link buried in the forums. These parents are confused and because of that were neglectful, not once but twice. The other kids should be taken out of the house.
On the contrary-- horrible as it is I think things like this SHOULD be brought to light every time they happen (and they do happen more than we would like to think about).0 -
It's one thing to instill your religious beliefs on a child (I was brought up going to church) -- it is quite another to put your child's life in the hands of your God, especially when that child doesn't even have a say or understand what is happening.
This was painful for me to read, too. Then again I never really believed in the power of prayer, even when I was very religious. My mother suffered for nearly ten years with aggressive cancer, and was very sick from constant bouts of radiation and chemo.
People prayed for her the entire time. And guess what? She still died. And by the time she was near death she had practically renounced her own faith.
I am not trying to be disrespectful towards people of faith, because I tried to cling to it for at least a year after her death. When I had faith, even through the roughest times of my life, I felt a sense of security and hope that I have since lost and will probably never regain. And for all I know, God could really exist in some way. So could aliens, zombies, and Bigfoot. But to me at least, the God of the Bible, and the God of all large organized religions, is a fictitious entity created to explain the impossible and to comfort the hopeless.0 -
It is so sad that some people are so blinded by the religion and take the scripture literally. I am a Christian, I believe in the power of prayer but I also believe that GOD will use doctors to help, an answer to your prayers to heal and help those that suffer. If you refuse the help that HE might be sending you as an answer to your prayer -then you cannot call yourself a believer or Christian. This is just wrong I feel sorry for them, and pray that God will forgive them for acting so selfish and arrogant as to ignore the help of the doctors –put there by God to assist us in need.0
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