Resting Metabolic Rate tested...Even More Confused

foster59803
foster59803 Posts: 439 Member
edited November 12 in Health and Weight Loss
I apologize in advance for the length of this post, but I am completely and totally confused!!!

First a little back story:

I joined MFP almost a year ago, but really started exercising and logging faithfully 4 months ago. MFP had my calories set to 1200 calories a day, I raised it once to 1350, but noticed weight gain after 3 weeks, so dropped back to 1200.

I exercise 5 days a week or more… here is my schedule:
Mon- spinning 60 min
Tue- Personal training 60 min (mostly HIIT )
Wednesday- Muscle pump class (cardio/muscle endurance) 60 min
Thursday- Lifting day 45 min
Friday Spinning (60 min)
Saturday – Lift day.

I am 32, 135 lbs 20% bf (caliper test)
I have lost a total of 4lbs in a little less than a year. However, I have decreased my body fat from 26% to 20% in that time period.

On average my daily calorie burn worked out to 387 calories a day. I would eat the majority of those calories back every day. So, my average calorie intake was 1537 (this is a 3 month average for calories consumed and burned).

In that 3 month period, there was no change in my body, no inches, no lbs…nothing. So, I decided to get my Resting Metabolic Rate tested. From what I have read RMR and BMR are similar.

My gym gave me this:
Basal Metabolic Rate (BMR) and Resting Metabolic Rate (RMR) are rates used to estimate the amount of calories a person will burn if he is at rest for 24 hours. It is used to determine the minimum amount of energy a person requires to keep his body functioning, his heart beating, his lungs breathing and to keep his body temperature normal. The tests are conducted the same way but main differences between the two is that BMR is measured under more restrictive conditions, while RMR is measured under less restrictive conditions.


I went into the test assuming I was not eating enough calories… but the test came back with less than positive results. My RMR was 1019 and that put me into a maintenance calorie range (to include daily activities and exercise) at 1200-1400. They said my weight loss calories would need to be at 1200 (because they wouldn’t recommend eating under 1200). I asked the trainer who performed the test if I should eat back my calories after exercise and he looked at me like I was insane!! He basically said that “that is where you were getting it wrong, it is not net calories for someone with your metabolism, you need to create a deficit and if my maintenance level is 1400 calories a day, the best I could do was eat 1200 and exercise without eating the calories back to create that deficit. Now, in all honesty I don’t care what the scale says anymore, but I am trying to get my bf% lower… and to lower my bf% I know I need to be at a deficit! I am basically confused and frustrated and I have been trying to eat 1200 for a week or so without much difficulty. But on days I really work hard at the gym and I see a net calorie of 500 calories it freaks me out! The last thing I want to do is make my metabolism slower than it already is!!

I thought I would have a better understand once I had this test done, but now I am more confused than ever! I would really appreciate any advice or input!

Thanks!

Replies

  • foster59803
    foster59803 Posts: 439 Member
    I know this question is asked a million times... but I could use a little advise :) BUMP! :flowerforyou:
  • odownz
    odownz Posts: 98
    I think, despite what the gym has figured. With your activity level and such, you are eating way less than you need to be.
  • yogibella
    yogibella Posts: 321 Member
    bump~! because she's a lovely lady and needs some advice:)

    I think that trainer is totally wrong :angry:
  • ninerbuff
    ninerbuff Posts: 48,996 Member
    How tall are you?

    A.C.E. Certified Personal & Group FitnessTrainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 28+ years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
  • ninerbuff
    ninerbuff Posts: 48,996 Member
    Also what test did they perform to determine your RMR?

    A.C.E. Certified Personal & Group FitnessTrainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 28+ years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
  • darlilama
    darlilama Posts: 794 Member
    Wow… you say you haven't lost inches, but in your pics, you definitely LOOK different. You are obviously in much better physical shape even for only losing 4 lbs. Sorry, can't help you much with the question. I know the basics, but you need to know more than that!
  • Lleldiranne
    Lleldiranne Posts: 5,516 Member
    I don't think trainers at a gym are always really knowledgable about how the body and metabolism works. As much as you are exercising, I am shocked at your BMR being so low (I've heard many times that regular exercise actually increases your BMR). I would follow up and get advice from someone who is really trained in Sports Medicine (a doctor!!).

    My thought is that either the test was done/interpreted wrong, or you have let your metabolism tank by not eating enough. If your BMR is 1091 and you are doing the exercises you describe (about 60 minutes a day, I will guess at least 300 calories a day) you would be maintaining at about 1400 calories a day (which it sounds like you aren't).

    Also, talk to your doctor about what the healthy body fat % ranges are for women your age. You are pretty low already; not unhealthy, but it sounds like you're trying to get into the "athlete" range. If that's what you want, that's okay, but be aware of where your goals are setting you right now.
  • evamariek
    evamariek Posts: 2
    You should never eat below 1200 calories because then your body begins to feed on it's self and you go into starvation mode. When your body goes into starvation mode it will hold on to the fat we have and what ever else you eat will not be used as energy instead it will want to hold on to that as well. The body does this to protect itself. Number one rule...NEVER EVER SKIP MEALS. Especially Breakfast. Make sure that you are drinking enough water. Take your body weight and divide it by 2. That will tell you how many ounces of water you should have a day. Never get less than 64oz. Next make sure that you are getting enough good lean protien in your diet. They recommend about 65 to 75 grams for women a day. This is easier than it seems. Studies have shown that you should get at least 30 grams of protien in your breakfast. Then eat lots of fruit, veggies well. The next thing you should know is that you need to create a calorie deficit. It takes 3500 calories to equal 1lb loss. All this means is that it will take a little longer for you since your metabolism is slow. Strength training is a great way to help boost metabolism. Because lean muscle burns more calories. So because it would be unhealthy to eat less than 1200 calories you need to create your deficit in your workouts. BMR is what we burn doing absolutely nothing. Our bodies burn calories just to survie. So when you clean your house, go grocery shopping, cook ect. you are burning calories above you BMR. So when you work out this just adds to your deficit. So eat a good amount of good protien, and eat lots of veggies and fuits, and have the right portion of whole grains and you will be feeding your body full of good nutrition and eventually your BMR should go up. Good luck and I hope this helps you.
  • ninerbuff
    ninerbuff Posts: 48,996 Member
    You should never eat below 1200 calories because then your body begins to feed on it's self and you go into starvation mode. When your body goes into starvation mode it will hold on to the fat we have and what ever else you eat will not be used as energy instead it will want to hold on to that as well. The body does this to protect itself. Number one rule...NEVER EVER SKIP MEALS. Especially Breakfast. Make sure that you are drinking enough water. Take your body weight and divide it by 2. That will tell you how many ounces of water you should have a day. Never get less than 64oz. Next make sure that you are getting enough good lean protien in your diet. They recommend about 65 to 75 grams for women a day. This is easier than it seems. Studies have shown that you should get at least 30 grams of protien in your breakfast. Then eat lots of fruit, veggies well. The next thing you should know is that you need to create a calorie deficit. It takes 3500 calories to equal 1lb loss. All this means is that it will take a little longer for you since your metabolism is slow. Strength training is a great way to help boost metabolism. Because lean muscle burns more calories. So because it would be unhealthy to eat less than 1200 calories you need to create your deficit in your workouts. BMR is what we burn doing absolutely nothing. Our bodies burn calories just to survie. So when you clean your house, go grocery shopping, cook ect. you are burning calories above you BMR. So when you work out this just adds to your deficit. So eat a good amount of good protien, and eat lots of veggies and fuits, and have the right portion of whole grains and you will be feeding your body full of good nutrition and eventually your BMR should go up. Good luck and I hope this helps you.
    Disagree about breakfast. You can skip it with no consequences as long as your daily macro/micronutrients are met and your daily calorie goal is met.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal & Group FitnessTrainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 28+ years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
  • dvisser1
    dvisser1 Posts: 788 Member
    I would get a second opinion on that RMR.

    As for the not eating your exercise calories, completely disagree with what the trainer said. If calories consumed is less than total expended calories, you're generally going to lose weight. Now I'm not a doctor, but neither is the trainer.
  • dancingdeer
    dancingdeer Posts: 373 Member
    bump.
  • Yanicka1
    Yanicka1 Posts: 4,564 Member
    Wow, Ok this is my opinion and frankly I am not a DR or a Trainer.

    If anyone told me that my RMR was 1019....... I would do a proper bulk cycle. With a metabolism that shot to hell, I would work very hard to repair it before doing anything else.
  • ninerbuff
    ninerbuff Posts: 48,996 Member
    Waiting for a reply from OP, but looking at how you're working out and IF the RMR reading is accurate, I'd have you cut back to just training 3 days a week for now.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal & Group FitnessTrainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 28+ years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
  • foster59803
    foster59803 Posts: 439 Member
    Oh my goodness... thank you for the responses.

    Ninerbuff- I am 5'5

    They tested my RMR using the "Cardiocoach" it was a 15 min test where I laid in a dark, quiet room. No food or drink for 12 hours prior, no strenuous exercise 24 hrs before the test. From what I have read it seems pretty accurate.
  • foster59803
    foster59803 Posts: 439 Member
    Also, I do eat quite a bit of protein, my typical aim is for 100g min to 140g depending on my exercise for the day. I also drink a lot of water. I definitely have a cheat day here and there, maybe 2 times a month to keep my sanity, but on average I eat a pretty balanced diet. Good fats, lean protein, fruits and veggies .

    I asked the trainer if it was possible that I had damaged my metabolism... he said that unless I did some kind of VLC diet or HCG diet, I most likely did not damage it. He said that it is genetic, that I could increase my metabolism with exercise (mostly weight lifting), but even if I packed on 5 lbs of muscle I would only slightly increase my metabolism.
  • foster59803
    foster59803 Posts: 439 Member
    Wow… you say you haven't lost inches, but in your pics, you definitely LOOK different. You are obviously in much better physical shape even for only losing 4 lbs. Sorry, can't help you much with the question. I know the basics, but you need to know more than that!

    The first picture was taken last last year around July, the next picture was in September ( that is when I started eating around 1200 calories - except for weekends. I was not working out). The last picture was taken this January after working out for 2 months.

    In January I was eating back my exercise calories - to an average of 1500 calories a day. I was able to maintain my weight on this with out much problem. But I could not lose any more weight no matter how much I exercised. That is what prompted me to have this test done in the first place.

    Haha! I just feel like it is all math and there is part of the equation that I am missing.
  • ninerbuff
    ninerbuff Posts: 48,996 Member
    They just had you lay down? Most metabolic testing I've ever done involves wearing a mask to measure VO2max while either at rest or exercising.
    I can't accurately comment since I'm not familiar with that type of metabolic testing, but again if the RMR reading was accurate, I'd cut back on to 3 days of exercise and make 2 out of the 3 lifting and the other cardio.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal & Group FitnessTrainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 28+ years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
  • foster59803
    foster59803 Posts: 439 Member
    I don't think trainers at a gym are always really knowledgable about how the body and metabolism works. As much as you are exercising, I am shocked at your BMR being so low (I've heard many times that regular exercise actually increases your BMR). I would follow up and get advice from someone who is really trained in Sports Medicine (a doctor!!).

    My thought is that either the test was done/interpreted wrong, or you have let your metabolism tank by not eating enough. If your BMR is 1091 and you are doing the exercises you describe (about 60 minutes a day, I will guess at least 300 calories a day) you would be maintaining at about 1400 calories a day (which it sounds like you aren't).

    Also, talk to your doctor about what the healthy body fat % ranges are for women your age. You are pretty low already; not unhealthy, but it sounds like you're trying to get into the "athlete" range. If that's what you want, that's okay, but be aware of where your goals are setting you right now.


    I completely agree with you- trainers are not always the best at nutritional advice!

    In regards to healthy body fat range... typically 20-16% is considered athletic, and that is definitely where I want to be. I am very excited that it has gone down as much as it has (although I know that body fat testing with the calipers is not very accurate and there is most likely a pretty large margin of error). But my goal is to get to around 16% body fat. I was pretty athletic in my youth :) played a lot of sports, and I really want to push my body to see if I can get back to that fitness level again.

    I guess my real question is, do I have to create a calorie deficit to continue to lose body fat? And if I do and I assume my RMR is correct, should I eat back my exercise calories?
  • casbar911
    casbar911 Posts: 61 Member
    I had that test done too- with a O2 sensor mask on. My rate was that low as well - come to find out I actually have Hashimoto's which is a thyroid disorder- which has slowed my metabolism. I would have your PCP do a thyroid screen and just see what your TSH level, Free T4 , Free T3 and reverse T3 levels are.... you might be like me.....
    I was eating 1200 calories, working out 6 days a week with no change... it wasnt because I wasnt trying...
    also my blood pressure and pulse are excellent and all my doctors can tell that I am very fit/healthy... so for me it cant be about the numbers on the scale until I get my med dosages under control... then maybe ...


    good luck
  • kdiamond
    kdiamond Posts: 3,329 Member
    A 5'5" person that is 32 years old should only eat ~1400 a day WITH vigorous training?

    Sounds WAAAAAYYYY off to me.

    Unless your metabolism is really shot, in which case you'll need to eat more to get it back to normal anyhow.

    I would start eating 1500+, give it 2-3 weeks, and reevaluate from that point.

    Edited to say I agree with the OP who said tune down your training to 3 days a week. It definitely sounds like you are overexercising.
  • SHBoss1673
    SHBoss1673 Posts: 7,161 Member
    i would agree with niner and KD et al.

    that BMR sounds awfully low for someone with your statistics. I would guess 1 of three things were out of whack.

    1) you're metabolism has been slowed by consistent under-eating (which from your statements about eating 1500 it doesn't sound that way)

    2) the test was off (more common than you think, these machines need almost constant maintenance, most gyms don't do the required maintenance which makes the results essentially useless)

    3) You have a metabolic condition as suggested above (the hashimoto's)

    these are just guesses of course, but they are more reasonable than a 1016 BMR.

    I would agree with getting your thyroid numbers checked, that never hurts. I'd also look into having the test done in a real metabolic lab instead of a gym. Somewhere with lab techs and the ability to check their equipment on a regular basis. It's usually not that expensive, around 150 bucks or so and they do a much better job at it than any gym I know of. my wife had one done about a year ago.

    PLUS

    1200 to 1400 maintenance with a BMR of 1016 is wrong unless you do nothing but sit at a desk all day and don't work out at all. sedentary is considered 1.2 X BMR
    moderately active is 1.55 X BMR, which it sounds like you're closer to than sedentary, which would mean 1560 or so. Probably a little more than that considering the effort level of the activities you are doing.
  • ConnieEK
    ConnieEK Posts: 1
    See your doctor. You can't listen to people who are giving generic answers from generic charts. Your numbers are identical to mine. I had the KORR test done. 10 minutes of CO2 measurement. My resting metabolism was 1210. I was told to eat 1000 to 1210 calories per day for weight loss. My dietician recommended 1150 calories per day.
    The charts are set for people with TYPICAL average metabolisms. Ours are slow. Mine is 15% slower than average. They will tell you to exercise more, increase your muscle mass. It doesn't always work that way. You may have a thyroid issue. Or like me, I have a muscle disease. Mild but never the less it affects my metabolism. I exercise daily, much like you. I eat healthier than anyone I know, paleolithic, and watch my fat/carb and protein percentages like a hawk. I follow the advice of a dietician. I remain 30 pounds over weight and can't lose weight no matter how hard I try. You can attempt to raise your metabolism by building muscle mass, not skipping meals, increasing your protein, (20 to 25% of daily cals and more than 70g per day), aerobic workout 3x per week, evening walk, adequate sleep. Bottom line, get a check up. You need to find out why your metabolism is running slowly. It may not be your fault. To answer your original question, yes, eat back those calories to a net of 1200. Its part of the reward for exercising!
  • sullus
    sullus Posts: 2,839 Member
    You should never eat below 1200 calories because then your body begins to feed on it's self and you go into starvation mode. When your body goes into starvation mode it will hold on to the fat we have and what ever else you eat will not be used as energy instead it will want to hold on to that as well. The body does this to protect itself. Number one rule...NEVER EVER SKIP MEALS. Especially Breakfast. Make sure that you are drinking enough water. Take your body weight and divide it by 2. That will tell you how many ounces of water you should have a day. Never get less than 64oz. Next make sure that you are getting enough good lean protien in your diet. They recommend about 65 to 75 grams for women a day. This is easier than it seems. Studies have shown that you should get at least 30 grams of protien in your breakfast. Then eat lots of fruit, veggies well. The next thing you should know is that you need to create a calorie deficit. It takes 3500 calories to equal 1lb loss. All this means is that it will take a little longer for you since your metabolism is slow. Strength training is a great way to help boost metabolism. Because lean muscle burns more calories. So because it would be unhealthy to eat less than 1200 calories you need to create your deficit in your workouts. BMR is what we burn doing absolutely nothing. Our bodies burn calories just to survie. So when you clean your house, go grocery shopping, cook ect. you are burning calories above you BMR. So when you work out this just adds to your deficit. So eat a good amount of good protien, and eat lots of veggies and fuits, and have the right portion of whole grains and you will be feeding your body full of good nutrition and eventually your BMR should go up. Good luck and I hope this helps you.

    1. There's nothing magical about 1200. If you have a low metabolism, you might need to go 1000 or 900 to lose.
    2. I guarantee that less than 1% of people on this site have ever been in "starvation mode". (That takes a minimum of 72 hours with ZERO food.)
    3. Skip meals. It's not really relevant.
    4. There's nothing magical about breakfast either. I get up at 530, have my first meal at around 830 or 9, when I get to work.
    5. Drink water when you're thirsty. I rarely drink more than 32 oz a day.

    I think my results have been pretty good ...
  • tafournier
    tafournier Posts: 13 Member
    I'm not sure you actually had a true RMR test.....I've had 3 done in the last 2 years.....did you sit up, or lay down....did you have a mask that covered your nose and mouth and was very restrictive?.....did it last approx 20-30 minutes?......If you say yes to all this, then I would get a second opinion, just to be sure.
  • jwdieter
    jwdieter Posts: 2,582 Member
    Wow, Ok this is my opinion and frankly I am not a DR or a Trainer.

    If anyone told me that my RMR was 1019....... I would do a proper bulk cycle. With a metabolism that shot to hell, I would work very hard to repair it before doing anything else.

    I like this approach. If the OP has a bottom line of not wanting to gain any weight, probably wouldn't work. But otherwise can come out in a few months with more lean mass and stronger metabolism.
  • Sjenny5891
    Sjenny5891 Posts: 717 Member
    It isn't about the scale. You have hit the point where it is all body fat and muscle.
    You are losing the fat but building muscle. That is why you are not losing weight.
    i saw a pic of someone here who gained 5 pounds in muscle working out but lost 10% body fat and looked AWESOME.
  • meluma
    meluma Posts: 1 Member
    bodybuilding.com/content/the-ultimate-guide-to-reverse-dieting.html

    It is completely possible for exercise to slow your BMR. Happened to me and many other people. See above article on reverse dieting for how to heal!
  • VintageFeline
    VintageFeline Posts: 6,771 Member
    meluma wrote: »
    bodybuilding.com/content/the-ultimate-guide-to-reverse-dieting.html

    It is completely possible for exercise to slow your BMR. Happened to me and many other people. See above article on reverse dieting for how to heal!

    Um, this is a years old thread, pretty sure OP will have it all figured out by now......
This discussion has been closed.

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