Friendly vegan debate - removed?
Yogi_Carl
Posts: 1,906 Member
What a shame the recent vegan debate seems to have been removed. Perhaps the moderator would like to take this opportunity to come forth and explain why it has been removed when it was probably the most civil exchange between vegans and omnivores that has been on here compared to the usual hate-fest these debates can turn into.
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perhaps you should create a group for debating the topic ? Different rules apply to groups.0
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Thank you. It did seem a shame as the debate was quite sensible on the whole - probably for the first time on the open forum.0
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What a shame the recent vegan debate seems to have been removed. Perhaps the moderator would like to take this opportunity to come forth and explain why it has been removed when it was probably the most civil exchange between vegans and omnivores that has been on here compared to the usual hate-fest these debates can turn into.
There is no room for civility on these boards. You should know better than that :grumble:0 -
personally I find the moderators are like "thought police""...for heavens sakes they are ALWAYS pushing their noses in....who cares if a debate descends into anarchy..its not like we can pull a gun on each other...geeze..how about "freedom of speech"...or dosnt that exist in the moderators knowkedge??0
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What a shame the recent vegan debate seems to have been removed. Perhaps the moderator would like to take this opportunity to come forth and explain why it has been removed when it was probably the most civil exchange between vegans and omnivores that has been on here compared to the usual hate-fest these debates can turn into.
There is no room for civility on these boards. You should know better than that :grumble:
but really...who needs civility??...this is an online forum...not meeting the Queen!!0 -
Freedom of speech applies to this board much like it applies to most countries, it's as free as the community, state, or federal government allows it to be.personally I find the moderators are like "thought police""...for heavens sakes they are ALWAYS pushing their noses in....who cares if a debate descends into anarchy..its not like we can pull a gun on each other...geeze..how about "freedom of speech"...or dosnt that exist in the moderators knowkedge??
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Did anyone here who posted to the removed thread see anything to warrant removing it? I thought it was quite friendly if a little passionate at times from some individuals but we were all fairly friendly I thought.0
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Freedom of speech applies to this board much like it applies to most countries, it's as free as the community, state, or federal government allows it to be.personally I find the moderators are like "thought police""...for heavens sakes they are ALWAYS pushing their noses in....who cares if a debate descends into anarchy..its not like we can pull a gun on each other...geeze..how about "freedom of speech"...or dosnt that exist in the moderators knowkedge??
all I can say to that then is "you poor, poor Americans"...no wonder you have so many problems if you have to put up with the kind of anarchial laws that removes a debate on to be or not to be a vegan....geeeze0 -
Freedom of speech applies to this board much like it applies to most countries, it's as free as the community, state, or federal government allows it to be.personally I find the moderators are like "thought police""...for heavens sakes they are ALWAYS pushing their noses in....who cares if a debate descends into anarchy..its not like we can pull a gun on each other...geeze..how about "freedom of speech"...or dosnt that exist in the moderators knowkedge??
all I can say to that then is "you poor, poor Americans"...no wonder you have so many problems if you have to put up with the kind of anarchial laws that removes a debate on to be or not to be a vegan....geeeze
Ummm, it wasn't the American government removing a thread because it violated some vegan discussion law :laugh: MFP is privately owned, even though it's free to users. As a privately owned forum, it has every right to put up or take down whatever the heck it wants to. If they suddenly decide that we can only put up posts that have pictures of bunnies in them, that's their prerogative.
Oh, and just in case:
^^^^ Meet Boris the Blade, the best gigantic one eyed rabbit ever.0 -
personally I find the moderators are like "thought police""...for heavens sakes they are ALWAYS pushing their noses in....who cares if a debate descends into anarchy..its not like we can pull a gun on each other...geeze..how about "freedom of speech"...or dosnt that exist in the moderators knowkedge??
If you don't like how they moderate their site, you could always ask for a refund.0 -
Freedom of speech applies to this board much like it applies to most countries, it's as free as the community, state, or federal government allows it to be.personally I find the moderators are like "thought police""...for heavens sakes they are ALWAYS pushing their noses in....who cares if a debate descends into anarchy..its not like we can pull a gun on each other...geeze..how about "freedom of speech"...or dosnt that exist in the moderators knowkedge??
all I can say to that then is "you poor, poor Americans"...no wonder you have so many problems if you have to put up with the kind of anarchial laws that removes a debate on to be or not to be a vegan....geeeze
Ummm, it wasn't the American government removing a thread because it violated some vegan discussion law :laugh: MFP is privately owned, even though it's free to users. As a privately owned forum, it has every right to put up or take down whatever the heck it wants to. If they suddenly decide that we can only put up posts that have pictures of bunnies in them, that's their prerogative.
Oh, and just in case:
^^^^ Meet Boris the Blade, the best gigantic one eyed rabbit ever.
you are right...of course you are right...but we are necessary to them also..if it wasnt for us mfp wouldnt exist. We are the customers, they should have respect for us and treat us like adults....if we want to slag each ither off...then let us!!...no skin iff their noses!!0 -
personally I find the moderators are like "thought police""...for heavens sakes they are ALWAYS pushing their noses in....who cares if a debate descends into anarchy..its not like we can pull a gun on each other...geeze..how about "freedom of speech"...or dosnt that exist in the moderators knowkedge??
If you don't like how they moderate their site, you could always ask for a refund.
oh....such a cute little dig about it being "free"...course it's free....look at all the revenue they get with adverts....would they get that without "us"...I dont think so...I think it's a great site...apart from the moderators0 -
Freedom of speech applies to this board much like it applies to most countries, it's as free as the community, state, or federal government allows it to be.personally I find the moderators are like "thought police""...for heavens sakes they are ALWAYS pushing their noses in....who cares if a debate descends into anarchy..its not like we can pull a gun on each other...geeze..how about "freedom of speech"...or dosnt that exist in the moderators knowkedge??
all I can say to that then is "you poor, poor Americans"...no wonder you have so many problems if you have to put up with the kind of anarchial laws that removes a debate on to be or not to be a vegan....geeeze
Ummm, it wasn't the American government removing a thread because it violated some vegan discussion law :laugh: MFP is privately owned, even though it's free to users. As a privately owned forum, it has every right to put up or take down whatever the heck it wants to. If they suddenly decide that we can only put up posts that have pictures of bunnies in them, that's their prerogative.
Oh, and just in case:
^^^^ Meet Boris the Blade, the best gigantic one eyed rabbit ever.
you are right...of course you are right...but we are necessary to them also..if it wasnt for us mfp wouldnt exist. We are the customers, they should have respect for us and treat us like adults....if we want to slag each ither off...then let us!!...no skin iff their noses!!
I don't think we as customers get to dictate how they run their business. Oh, sure, we can voice our opinions about it, but ultimately, it's their call. Our ultimate choice is whether or not to use the service. That's where our "freedom" comes into the equation.
ETA: And for what it's worth, your complaining about the moderators in the forums is probably a violation of the Community Guidelines (all hail). Although not precisely on point (as clarified in subparts a) and b), I suspect they would claim it falls under #11.0 -
you are right...of course you are right...but we are necessary to them also..if it wasnt for us mfp wouldnt exist. We are the customers, they should have respect for us and treat us like adults....if we want to slag each ither off...then let us!!...no skin iff their noses!!
I may not always agree with the mods, but there are times when they are absolutely in the right (body shaming posts, etc.).
Those vegan threads tend to go south in a hurry, I've seen it over and over. Maybe that one hadn't YET, but it would have.0 -
Someone probably reported it and the moderators erred on the side of the reporters, as they often do. I found the debate to be quite civil, but there were certain posts that could have been considered "insulting" by someone with delicate sensibilities.0
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I don't think we as customers get to dictate how they run their business. Oh, sure, we can voice our opinions about it, but ultimately, it's their call. Our ultimate choice is whether or not to use the service. That's where our "freedom" comes into the equation.
ETA: And for what it's worth, your complaining about the moderators in the forums is probably a violation of the Community Guidelines (all hail). Although not precisely on point (as clarified in subparts a) and b), I suspect they would claim it falls under #11.
Yup, this. And I do think I've read that questioning the mods' decisions in the forums is against the CG (all hail).0 -
I don't think we as customers get to dictate how they run their business. Oh, sure, we can voice our opinions about it, but ultimately, it's their call. Our ultimate choice is whether or not to use the service. That's where our "freedom" comes into the equation.
ETA: And for what it's worth, your complaining about the moderators in the forums is probably a violation of the Community Guidelines (all hail). Although not precisely on point (as clarified in subparts a) and b), I suspect they would claim it falls under #11.
Yup, this. And I do think I've read that questioning the mods' decisions in the forums is against the CG (all hail).
good grief!!!0 -
Freedom of speech applies to this board much like it applies to most countries, it's as free as the community, state, or federal government allows it to be.personally I find the moderators are like "thought police""...for heavens sakes they are ALWAYS pushing their noses in....who cares if a debate descends into anarchy..its not like we can pull a gun on each other...geeze..how about "freedom of speech"...or dosnt that exist in the moderators knowkedge??
all I can say to that then is "you poor, poor Americans"...no wonder you have so many problems if you have to put up with the kind of anarchial laws that removes a debate on to be or not to be a vegan....geeeze
Ummm, it wasn't the American government removing a thread because it violated some vegan discussion law :laugh: MFP is privately owned, even though it's free to users. As a privately owned forum, it has every right to put up or take down whatever the heck it wants to. If they suddenly decide that we can only put up posts that have pictures of bunnies in them, that's their prerogative.
Oh, and just in case:
^^^^ Meet Boris the Blade, the best gigantic one eyed rabbit ever.
People so often misunderstand what freedom of speech actually means
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I don't think we as customers get to dictate how they run their business. Oh, sure, we can voice our opinions about it, but ultimately, it's their call. Our ultimate choice is whether or not to use the service. That's where our "freedom" comes into the equation.
ETA: And for what it's worth, your complaining about the moderators in the forums is probably a violation of the Community Guidelines (all hail). Although not precisely on point (as clarified in subparts a) and b), I suspect they would claim it falls under #11.
Yup, this. And I do think I've read that questioning the mods' decisions in the forums is against the CG (all hail).
good grief!!!
Woopsies, do we also have "insulting other users" or "escalating drama", too?
Uh oh, I may have just done the same.
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It's called 'the squeaky wheel model of moderation' - in short, the forum gets moderated in line with whomever complains.
For instance, the other day I got a post removed (and an email) because I circumvented the filter to write a swearword. It was used as emphasis in a sentence, rather than to attack anyone. Other people in the same thread had used the same word; their posts remained, mine was removed. Why? Because mine was obviously the only one reported - no doubt by someone who didn't like my opinion so thought they'd shut me up by reporting anything they could find that technically infringed the forum regulations.
It's not a model of moderation that I favour since it leaves the way open for a minority of people who have an axe to grind to dictate the culture of the forum by reporting anything they don't like, rather than ignoring it.
As for the vegan thread - I posted on it and it was a very civil thread with interesting points of view from both sides of the argument.0 -
Just typical really, a civil thread that actually didnt run riot with arguments is shut down..
I found it interesting.... shame really.0 -
"As for the vegan thread - I posted on it and it was a very civil thread with interesting points of view from both sides of the argument. "
I read your posts on that thread with interest and thought they were well constructed and respectfully put even though they were arguments against veganism. Your points gave me lots to think about - thank you.
- and here we are still being civil!0 -
It's called 'the squeaky wheel model of moderation' - in short, the forum gets moderated in line with whomever complains.
For instance, the other day I got a post removed (and an email) because I circumvented the filter to write a swearword. It was used as emphasis in a sentence, rather than to attack anyone. Other people in the same thread had used the same word; their posts remained, mine was removed. Why? Because mine was obviously the only one reported - no doubt by someone who didn't like my opinion so thought they'd shut me up by reporting anything they could find that technically infringed the forum regulations.
It's not a model of moderation that I favour since it leaves the way open for a minority of people who have an axe to grind to dictate the culture of the forum by reporting anything they don't like, rather than ignoring it.
As for the vegan thread - I posted on it and it was a very civil thread with interesting points of view from both sides of the argument.
I've disagreed with some of your posts in the past, but this isn't one of them. Very nice explanation and application of the "squeaky wheel" model.0 -
I'm curious. I want to know what the removed post was about. I missed it!0
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It's a political topic and belongs in a private group. Enjoy your debate!0
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"As for the vegan thread - I posted on it and it was a very civil thread with interesting points of view from both sides of the argument. "
I read your posts on that thread with interest and thought they were well constructed and respectfully put even though they were arguments against veganism. Your points gave me lots to think about - thank you.
- and here we are still being civil!
Likewise I found your point of view interesting as well. That's the thing isn't it, people with opposing points of view can discuss the topic at hand and, even if they don't change their original stance, at least come out of it with better understanding of each other's positions.
It is a pity that such things aren't allowed to be discussed. Sure, they're not about fitness, but then neither are the mountains of '_________ the person above you' threads. The only reason why the latter are tolerated, but not anything more 'meaty' is simply down to moderation resources and budget. It's perceived as costly to moderate threads that may generate heated discussion, but not costly to moderate flirty/chatty threads.0 -
Ok folks,
I am looking into why the other Vegan chat was shut down, but the chances are it was moved to clean it up. Not all of the responses were kind and well thought. Some were attacking and hurtful.
The topic of Vegan vs..........well anything gets to be a divisive topic unto itself. Many reports are made in the process that must be checked by a moderator.
At this time I am closing down this thread, for as you know :11. No Airing of Grievances With Moderators
a) Protesting a moderator or admin action is not allowed on the Forums or in Groups. If you have a question or concern about a moderator or admin action, please email one of the moderators or Olivia, MFP's Community Manager, with your concern and we will investigate the matter promptly.
If you have a question about a specific post, send it to Rachel or Olivia.
Thank You,
AWTY
Volunteer MFP Moderator0
This discussion has been closed.
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