Calculated TDEE-20%, too many calories?
nespinosa3
Posts: 116 Member
Hey everyone, I have been reading about the whole BRM and using TDEE as a way of counting the calories that I need to lose weight. According to MFP, I should be eating 1,200 calories a day. I tried this for a couple of days and I was hungry all the time, moody, and just didn't feel well. I'm also trying to workout at least 4-5 days a week for 40-55 minutes. So I realized maybe I should eat back some of those calories, because I probably was providing my body with not enough calories and I *really* don't want to slow down my metabolism. Ideally, I am wanting to lose 15-20 pounds, so I planned on eating around 1500 calories a day (even when I don't work out).
However, according to the calculators, my BMR is somewhere between 1480 - 1560 calories. I calculated the TDEE in two different calculators, and always subtract 20% for weight loss. I end up with 1732 calories in one of them, and 1922 calories in the other one. These numbers seem very high for losing weight, so I'm just wondering if people have been effective following these numbers. Or should I stick to my 1500?
Edit: Yeah I also read a lot of advice for not eating less than your BMR...but honestly, won't eating 1600 calories make me GAIN weight? I don't even know if that's that much lower than what I was eating regularly while I gained 20 pounds!
However, according to the calculators, my BMR is somewhere between 1480 - 1560 calories. I calculated the TDEE in two different calculators, and always subtract 20% for weight loss. I end up with 1732 calories in one of them, and 1922 calories in the other one. These numbers seem very high for losing weight, so I'm just wondering if people have been effective following these numbers. Or should I stick to my 1500?
Edit: Yeah I also read a lot of advice for not eating less than your BMR...but honestly, won't eating 1600 calories make me GAIN weight? I don't even know if that's that much lower than what I was eating regularly while I gained 20 pounds!
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Replies
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You should eat back some if not all of your exercise calories. My BMR is 1260 and I eat like 1600-1700 calories a day because of my exercise. You should net nothing less than your BMR
I lost pounds quickly and I'm 5'3 was 123 at first (one month ago). I'm now 116.5 pounds0 -
If your BMR is in the 1480-1560 range, you should not be eating 1500 calories as this would only be adequate fuel for your body if you were in a coma. While sometimes the posts on MFP make me wonder, I work on the assumption that you are not in a coma
Try a happy medium and eat 1800 calories for a few weeks and see what happens. If you aren't losing weight, try 1700. But don't go below your BMR. That is literally the bare minimum.0 -
Anybody have a reference to a science journal or similarly credible source that says you should not eat or net below BMR? or is this broscience?0
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Anybody have a reference to a science journal or similarly credible source that says you should not eat or net below BMR? or is this broscience?
It's broscience. Minimum necessary intake is a function of macros, activity pattern, and fat stores. If you optimize your intake and your fat stores are sufficient to fuel your activity level and type, then you can safely go below BMR.
Obviously this easier to do with larger fat stores and relatively sedentary lifestyles than having low body fat and being highly active.0 -
Anybody have a reference to a science journal or similarly credible source that says you should not eat or net below BMR? or is this broscience?
It's broscience. Minimum necessary intake is a function of macros, activity pattern, and fat stores.
Which is EXACTLY what I was thinking.
I have yet to see someone provide a source saying otherwise and even logically it makes no sense. To me, logically... if a deficit of TDEE is safe because the body will tap into stored up energy (fat) for it's needs, then I see no reason why it would not simply do the same thing for a deficit of BMR.
As long as your body is getting all the macros and micros it needs (and you've got a decent amount of fat stored up for it to use as energy) a deficit of BMR just doesn't sound the least bit dangerous to me.0 -
The formulas are still a guide. Your metabolism and body composition might have you lower than that. So your BMR would be lower. You have to test it a bit and see. And by a bit I mean that's where patience is required, darnit. I'm still trying to figure out my numbers!0
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TDEE method accounts for exercise so you are not supposed to eat back exercise calories doing this method.0
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TDEE method accounts for exercise so you are not supposed to eat back exercise calories doing this method.
Unless you choose to go by Sedentary TDEE in which case you are supposed to eat back exercise calories doing this method.
If you are not absolutely going to maintain the exact same exercise schedule and activity level every week without fail no matter what then Sedentary TDEE minus 10 to 20% and eating back your exercise calories can help you to more accurately and easily meet your net calorie goal consistently.0 -
TDEE method accounts for exercise so you are not supposed to eat back exercise calories doing this method.
Unless you choose to go by Sedentary TDEE in which case you are supposed to eat back exercise calories doing this method.
If you are not absolutely going to maintain the exact same exercise schedule and activity level every week without fail no matter what then Sedentary TDEE minus 10 to 20% and eating back your exercise calories can help you to more accurately and easily meet your net calorie goal consistently.
We'll if you choose a sedentary TDEE and eat back your exercise calories, you might as well do the MFP method.0 -
TDEE method accounts for exercise so you are not supposed to eat back exercise calories doing this method.
Unless you choose to go by Sedentary TDEE in which case you are supposed to eat back exercise calories doing this method.
If you are not absolutely going to maintain the exact same exercise schedule and activity level every week without fail no matter what then Sedentary TDEE minus 10 to 20% and eating back your exercise calories can help you to more accurately and easily meet your net calorie goal consistently.
We'll if you choose a sedentary TDEE and eat back your exercise calories, you might as well do the MFP method.
When I did that MFP gave me 1200 calories which is my Sedentary TDEE minus more than 40%.
Personal preference, and what I would recommend to others, is to find out your Sedentary TDEE, subtract 10% to 20% depending on how much you need to loose, and make that your Net Calorie goal in MFP. Log all food and exercise as accurately as you can, monitor results, adjust up or down as needed.0 -
It's broscience. Minimum necessary intake is a function of macros, activity pattern, and fat stores.
Which is EXACTLY what I was thinking.
I have yet to see someone provide a source saying otherwise and even logically it makes no sense. To me, logically... if a deficit of TDEE is safe because the body will tap into stored up energy (fat) for it's needs, then I see no reason why it would not simply do the same thing for a deficit of BMR.
As long as your body is getting all the macros and micros it needs (and you've got a decent amount of fat stored up for it to use as energy) a deficit of BMR just doesn't sound the least bit dangerous to me.
This.
I've lost 101 pounds so far, probably more come when I weigh myself tomorrow, and I've been eating under BMR for 4 months now with no considerable difference in my health. I don't feel drowsy/irritable, I'm in great mental shape, and don't often feel hungry.
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As for the original poster, I recommend you try 1200 again but with these changes to make you feel better:
1: Make sure you're counting everything you eat, and I mean absolutely everything, in the most accurate way you can. Weigh your food, don't "not count" things like chewing gum or a piece of cookie, etc.
2: Eat your exercise calories back so you don't feel hungry
3: Eat regularly throughout the day instead of having big meals. Try to find low-calorie food and eat a lot of that, instead of eating small portions of high-calorie food.
4: Eat a balanced diet, this will help with how you feel. If you feel hungry and want to have a snack, go for protein, it seems to be the most filling.
5: Drink lots of water to fill your belly and so that you don't become dehydrated
6: Get a good amount of sleep, according to your age group, every night.
7: Entertain yourself and don't eat out of boredom.0 -
Hey everyone, I have been reading about the whole BRM and using TDEE as a way of counting the calories that I need to lose weight. According to MFP, I should be eating 1,200 calories a day. I tried this for a couple of days and I was hungry all the time, moody, and just didn't feel well. I'm also trying to workout at least 4-5 days a week for 40-55 minutes. So I realized maybe I should eat back some of those calories, because I probably was providing my body with not enough calories and I *really* don't want to slow down my metabolism. Ideally, I am wanting to lose 15-20 pounds, so I planned on eating around 1500 calories a day (even when I don't work out).
However, according to the calculators, my BMR is somewhere between 1480 - 1560 calories. I calculated the TDEE in two different calculators, and always subtract 20% for weight loss. I end up with 1732 calories in one of them, and 1922 calories in the other one. These numbers seem very high for losing weight, so I'm just wondering if people have been effective following these numbers. Or should I stick to my 1500?
Edit: Yeah I also read a lot of advice for not eating less than your BMR...but honestly, won't eating 1600 calories make me GAIN weight? I don't even know if that's that much lower than what I was eating regularly while I gained 20 pounds!
If you only need to lose 15-20 pounds, you should aim for losing 1/2 pound per week. When I put that in to MFP, it gives me 1430 calories (lightly active); I'm 5 feet tall and only have about 5-10 pounds to go, so I'm betting yours should be similar. Let's say MFP gives you 1500; you exercise 5 days a week, and if you're following MFP guidelines, you eat back your exercise calories. We can burn 450 calories in a good 45 minute workout, so that gives you 1950 on the days you work out, 1500 on the days you don't. 12,750 calories a week.
Or you follow the TDEE method, take something in the middle of what the calculators gave you, and eat 1800 calories every day. You don't eat back your exercise calories since they are already accounted for in your TDEE. 11,900 calories a week.
So really, following TDEE properly (not eating back exercise calories) is going to give you fewer a week than following MFP. You can really do either way, but no, I don't think that TDEE -20% as you listed is too many calories.
Does that make sense?0 -
BMR is a quick and dirty benchmark of the amount of fuel a body needs to function. Some can probably function on less without endangering your health, but why make that an ideal? Food is good. Eating is fun. Very low calorie diets are miserable. BMR is a happy medium guideline for someone like the OP who is worried about not eating enough.0
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So what would I do in my case?
I have lost 40lbs so far (290, 5'3 26 yr old female) and well I keep plateauing after every 10lbs I lose. I started out at 1800 calories ( I go off TDEE with a 30% deficit and use a body media armband as my correct calorie burn) and I would try to work through it. After a month of this I dropped my calories down to 1700 and blew through another 10lbs and had to do the same thing with dropping my calories as I plateaued for another month. I am down to 1500 calories now and never feel hungry. So I know I am not starving myself and eat a vegetarian diet ( added Salmon and Chicken here and there) I guess I am just wondering what could be up with my body?
my body media clocks my RMR at 2,555 and I should be eating 1550 to have a deficit of 1,000 a day
with another site it says my RMR ( based off my heigh, pant size, weight and age) is 2778 and I should be eating 1788.
MFP has me at 1200 and eating back my calories, which I do not want to do as I am clocking close to 1,100 a day ( well some days).
So any advice please
ALSO FYI: I do have a scale and weigh EVERYTHING and put it in by either scanning the bar-code and or entering it in myself. Entering everything sweet, bad, fatty or other wise that will throw me over my calories as well and drink close to 12 glasses of lemon water a day 0 -
BMR is a quick and dirty benchmark of the amount of fuel a body needs to function. Some can probably function on less without endangering your health, but why make that an ideal? Food is good. Eating is fun. Very low calorie diets are miserable. BMR is a happy medium guideline for someone like the OP who is worried about not eating enough.
TDEE is a quick and dirty benchmark of the amount of fuel a body needs to function (including some or all activity).
Why do you think it is safe to force the body to tap into fat stores by going below TDEE but not BMR?
Why is one ok and not the other?
Where does this idea come from?
Any sources? science or medical journals? etc?
As long as your body is getting all the macros and micros it needs (and you've got a decent amount of fat stored up for it to use as energy) a deficit of BMR just doesn't sound the least bit dangerous to me.0 -
So what would I do in my case?
I have lost 40lbs so far (290, 5'3 26 yr old female) and well I keep plateauing after every 10lbs I lose. I started out at 1800 calories ( I go off TDEE with a 30% deficit and use a body media armband as my correct calorie burn) and I would try to work through it. After a month of this I dropped my calories down to 1700 and blew through another 10lbs and had to do the same thing with dropping my calories as I plateaued for another month. I am down to 1500 calories now and never feel hungry. So I know I am not starving myself and eat a vegetarian diet ( added Salmon and Chicken here and there) I guess I am just wondering what could be up with my body?
my body media clocks my RMR at 2,555 and I should be eating 1550 to have a deficit of 1,000 a day
with another site it says my RMR ( based off my heigh, pant size, weight and age) is 2778 and I should be eating 1788.
MFP has me at 1200 and eating back my calories, which I do not want to do as I am clocking close to 1,100 a day ( well some days).
So any advice please
ALSO FYI: I do have a scale and weigh EVERYTHING and put it in by either scanning the bar-code and or entering it in myself. Entering everything sweet, bad, fatty or other wise that will throw me over my calories as well and drink close to 12 glasses of lemon water a day
It is generally recommended that after every 5 or 10lbs lost you should recalculate your deficit, i.e. figure your new TDEE minus your chosen percentage, and then of course edit your MFP settings to make that your new net calorie goal.
Personally I use Sedentary TDEE minus 20% + Eating Back Exercise Calories as my strategy. As you log exercises in MFP it will increase your net calorie goal for that day.0 -
I think, with all due respect, that you don't seem to understand what BMR is a measure of.BMR is a quick and dirty benchmark of the amount of fuel a body needs to function. Some can probably function on less without endangering your health, but why make that an ideal? Food is good. Eating is fun. Very low calorie diets are miserable. BMR is a happy medium guideline for someone like the OP who is worried about not eating enough.
TDEE is a quick and dirty benchmark of the amount of fuel a body needs to function (including some or all activity).
Why do you think it is safe to force the body to tap into fat stores by going below TDEE but not BMR?
Why is one ok and not the other?
Where does this idea come from?
Any sources? science or medical journals? etc?
As long as your body is getting all the macros and micros it needs (and you've got a decent amount of fat stored up for it to use as energy) a deficit of BMR just doesn't sound the least bit dangerous to me.
Regardless, it is irresponsible to encourage people to eat way below their BMR. In the OP's case, eating even 250 calories below BMR makes her officially wandering into Very Low Calorie Diet territory. Why would you want to do that when she's asked about eating enough and not under- OR over-estimating? What have you got against food?0 -
Personally I think you need to experiment and see what works for you. If you are too hungry there's a risk that you "crash" and start binging which equals that you may go calorie plus instead of minus.
Try to eat 1500 calories and after 1-2 weeks (or longer) evaluate and ask yourself,
1. am I losing weight? If yes - go to question 2. if No you need to decrease your daily calorie goal.
2. Is this manageable, am I too hungry or can I live with this? If "too hungry" try increasing your calories a bit more and see ig you still lose weight.
BMR and TDEE are not exact science, so do not be afraid to feel what your body feels and make adjustment according to that. After all - you're supposed to live with your weight loss and eating habits for the rest f your life.0 -
I think, with all due respect, that you don't seem to understand what BMR is a measure of.BMR is a quick and dirty benchmark of the amount of fuel a body needs to function. Some can probably function on less without endangering your health, but why make that an ideal? Food is good. Eating is fun. Very low calorie diets are miserable. BMR is a happy medium guideline for someone like the OP who is worried about not eating enough.
TDEE is a quick and dirty benchmark of the amount of fuel a body needs to function (including some or all activity).
Why do you think it is safe to force the body to tap into fat stores by going below TDEE but not BMR?
Why is one ok and not the other?
Where does this idea come from?
Any sources? science or medical journals? etc?
As long as your body is getting all the macros and micros it needs (and you've got a decent amount of fat stored up for it to use as energy) a deficit of BMR just doesn't sound the least bit dangerous to me.
Regardless, it is irresponsible to encourage people to eat way below their BMR. In the OP's case, eating even 250 calories below BMR makes her officially wandering into Very Low Calorie Diet territory. Why would you want to do that when she's asked about eating enough and not under- OR over-estimating? What have you got against food?
With all due respect please allow me to be rude, make baseless assumptions, and twist your words... ok lol.
I know exactly what BMR is, I also know that it is not a magic number never to be crossed. You still have not provided any logic or factual sources whatsoever to suggest otherwise.
I don't see anyone here encouraging anyone to "eat way below their BMR"... so I guess you win that straw man argument, congratulations to you.
I don't see anyone here encouraging the OP to eat 250 below BMR either, except for MFP... MFP told her to eat 1200, that's actually more than 250 below her BMR.
The OP is concerned they would be eating too much at their Sedentary TDEE minus 20% and would gain weight.
@OP: If you want to lose 20lbs I would recommend Sedentary TDEE minus 20% + eating back exercise calories, and that is what I do myself. If you are measuring/weighing/logging everything correctly you should not gain any weight, if you gain or maintain for 4 to 6 weeks straight while doing that, then I would cut another 100 calories off your net daily goal for 4 to 6 weeks and monitor results, repeat if needed.0 -
Regardless, it is irresponsible to encourage people to eat way below their BMR.
I haven't seen anyone here suggest any such thing.0 -
So on the days you do workout, you eat your TDEE-20% PLUS those calories that you burned. How do you estimate the amount of calories you burned?
And on the days where you do *not* work out, do you then eat less calories? Or do you stick every day to the same amount of calories?0 -
Regardless, it is irresponsible to encourage people to eat way below their BMR.
Why? My "BMR" is 1381, but I'm doing fine at 1200, have been for weeks. Well, there has been one side effect—weight loss.0 -
So on the days you do workout, you eat your TDEE-20% PLUS those calories that you burned. How do you estimate the amount of calories you burned?
And on the days where you do *not* work out, do you then eat less calories? Or do you stick every day to the same amount of calories?
Your TDEE is your daily calorie total. It's not going to be the same each day. You're supposed to calculate your AVERAGE TDEE, and use that as your number. Don't micromanage TDEE on a day-to-day basis, it all comes out in the wash. Keep it simple. Your body isn't going to suddenly break because you went below 20% once or twice a week. Our bodies aren't Swiss watches.0 -
So on the days you do workout, you eat your TDEE-20% PLUS those calories that you burned. How do you estimate the amount of calories you burned?
And on the days where you do *not* work out, do you then eat less calories? Or do you stick every day to the same amount of calories?
I am using my Sedentary TDEE minus 20%... and I do live a very sedentary life spending 12+ hours a day at a desk. Therefore since my Sedentary TDEE does NOT include exercise calories my strategy is to eat those back (or most of them, most of the time).
MFP has a database of different kinds of activities with calculations of how many calories are burned, and I use that. It isn't perfect but it works. You can also use an HRM or the reading from an exercise machine to manually enter your calories burned.
When you enter that exercise in MFP it automatically increases the amount of calories you can/should eat for that day. So for example if your Sedentary TDEE minus 20% is 1600 and then you burn 500 calories doing an hour or so of cardio then MFP will up your goal for the day to 2100 (1600 + 500) so that your NET calories for the day would be 1600.
It is always possible that you may be over/under-estimating your calories eaten/burned and that your estimated TDEE from any given calculator maybe higher/lower than your actual TDEE. So you will get your best estimates and strategy together, start, log as accurately as possible, monitor results (weight, measurements of waiste/hips/etc, and body fat %), and than adjust based on that information.0
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