PALEO: pros, cons and whatever else you may think?

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Replies

  • brraanndi
    brraanndi Posts: 325 Member
    Paleo/Primal taught me some common sense things about fats that I've been able to apply to my diet ( such as not being afraid of eating fat ).

    While I don't subscribe to removing certain types of food from my diet forever, there's alot of nice "common sense" takeaways from them both that I think anyone with eating issues would benefit from.
  • jonnythan
    jonnythan Posts: 10,161 Member
    That's the problem I have with a lot of Paleo bashers/naysayers - they don't actually understand the lifestyle.

    No, I think it's because of things like this:
    The chemicals and hormones in adulterated meat are making us sick too

    and
    we don't believe grains, dairy, legumes, processed foods, etc. are healthy.

    and
    Paleo baked goods
  • Mr_Knight
    Mr_Knight Posts: 9,532 Member
    were there even chickens running around way back then?

    Nope. Chickens are a decidedly post-paleo, post out-of-Africa innovation. Grok didn't eat chicken.
  • darkangel45422
    darkangel45422 Posts: 234 Member
    I do CrossFit (love it) and my box is doing the Paleo challenge. I opted out and they didn't pressure me about it at all. I'd say only a quarter of the people at the box are doing it.

    I have a couple of issues with the diet. For one, I don't think it's sustainable and, to me, there's no point in losing weight on a restrictive diet that won't be continued forever. At some point, you are going to have to maintain so, if you are not ready to go Paleo for the rest of your life, it's probably better to learn how to eat a balanced diet that incorporates all the foods you love in moderation.

    Also, I have hard time understanding why it's ok to spend $$$ on special Paleo sauces and marinades that are obviously processed but eating a peanut is bad. What's the logic there? I don't get it.

    As others have said, sustainable is an individual thing. For me, this lifestyle is incredibly sustainable - the foods I try to limit are doing nothing for my health and are being replaced by undeniably healthy alternatives like vegetables and meats. But you're right - if you're treating it as a short term weight loss diet to be followed by a life of eating junk again, then there's no point. But Paleo diets often (almost always) do include a moderate amount of junk foods, so how is it not "a balanced diet that incorporates all the foods you love in moderation"?

    I think the logic there is that those sauces and marinades, to be actually Paleo, would be minimally processed and include only natural Paleo ingredients. If they don't meet those guidelines then they're not Paleo. The problem with processed foods as I understand it is that they often include undesirable ingredients and additives - if it doesn't have these then I think (unless I'm forgetting something) they're probably ok in Paleo.

    What most people fail to see is that Paleo is a lifestyle, not hard and fast rules. People make their own modifications so it works for them, and that's totally allowable. So for example, Paleo baked goods - most Paleo plans will explicitly state these are things to be eaten in moderation as they're much less healthy than the main foundations of the diet (veggies, meats, etc.). But the ingredients in them don't include unhealthy or super unhealthy things (at least if they're really Paleo), so if you're gonna eat a baked good why NOT eat the healthier version if you like it? Or if you really want it, the non-Paleo version. I for example am not a fan of olive oil/balsamic vinegar/etc. as salad dressings, so I eat Renee's Cesar dressing. It has some non-Primal ingredients (mainly canola oil being it's main ingredient) but it's what I love and the healthiest dressing I can find that I like to put on my salads, so I'm willing to have it - I just acknowledge it's unhealthy points.
  • Mr_Knight
    Mr_Knight Posts: 9,532 Member
    Just because you eat something unhealthy once in a while...

    20% where the 20% is calorically denser isn't "once in a while" - it is, effectively, a meal a day.
  • darkangel45422
    darkangel45422 Posts: 234 Member
    That's the problem I have with a lot of Paleo bashers/naysayers - they don't actually understand the lifestyle.

    No, I think it's because of things like this:
    The chemicals and hormones in adulterated meat are making us sick too

    and
    we don't believe grains, dairy, legumes, processed foods, etc. are healthy.

    and
    Paleo baked goods

    You fail to make any point by putting these quotes in. If you disagree that additives and hormones in meat aren't healthy for us, please explain for me how they're healthy. As for grains/dairy/legumes/processed foods, I specifically stated it was our belief, but it is one that there are studies to back up the fact that they're potentially harmful. In the end, if you don't believe it that's fine - totally your choice - but why bash other people's beliefs when they're neither harmful nor proven wrong?
  • bcattoes
    bcattoes Posts: 17,299 Member
    What most people fail to see is that Paleo is a lifestyle, not hard and fast rules. People make their own modifications so it works for them, and that's totally allowable. So for example, Paleo baked goods - most Paleo plans will explicitly state these are things to be eaten in moderation as they're much less healthy than the main foundations of the diet (veggies, meats, etc.). But the ingredients in them don't include unhealthy or super unhealthy things (at least if they're really Paleo), so if you're gonna eat a baked good why NOT eat the healthier version if you like it? Or if you really want it, the non-Paleo version. I for example am not a fan of olive oil/balsamic vinegar/etc. as salad dressings, so I eat Renee's Cesar dressing. It has some non-Primal ingredients (mainly canola oil being it's main ingredient) but it's what I love and the healthiest dressing I can find that I like to put on my salads, so I'm willing to have it - I just acknowledge it's unhealthy points.

    Is this true? Or is this simply the altered defintiion of the diet you choose to follow?
  • Mr_Knight
    Mr_Knight Posts: 9,532 Member
    I for example am not a fan of olive oil/balsamic vinegar/etc. as salad dressings, so I eat Renee's Cesar dressing. It has some non-Primal ingredients (mainly canola oil being it's main ingredient) but it's what I love and the healthiest dressing I can find that I like to put on my salads, so I'm willing to have it - I just acknowledge it's unhealthy points.

    Exactly what I was talking about. The paleo salad itself is maybe 20 calories worth of greens, the very un-paleo bottled dressing is 160 calories in a typical serving size.

    This isn't eating 80/20, this is eating 10/90.

    Which is like claiming that someone who adds one of those ground down baby carrots with their sirloin steak is a "vegetarian".
  • jonnythan
    jonnythan Posts: 10,161 Member
    That's the problem I have with a lot of Paleo bashers/naysayers - they don't actually understand the lifestyle.

    No, I think it's because of things like this:
    The chemicals and hormones in adulterated meat are making us sick too

    and
    we don't believe grains, dairy, legumes, processed foods, etc. are healthy.

    and
    Paleo baked goods

    You fail to make any point by putting these quotes in. If you disagree that additives and hormones in meat aren't healthy for us, please explain for me how they're healthy. As for grains/dairy/legumes/processed foods, I specifically stated it was our belief, but it is one that there are studies to back up the fact that they're potentially harmful. In the end, if you don't believe it that's fine - totally your choice - but why bash other people's beliefs when they're neither harmful nor proven wrong?

    I'm not sure what additives and hormones you think there are in actual meat; especially ones that are harmful. To my knowledge there's no science whatsoever establishing that anything you find in a steak at the grocery store but not in a steak from a grass-fed cow you raised yourself without any drugs or hormones is harmful in any way. If you feel there are such scientific studies please link to them.

    Beyond that, there are two other quotes there: one, that beans and grains are inherently unhealthy. That's a pretty fringe opinion. Two, that "paleo," which purports to be eating the same way Paleolithic people ate, allows "baked goods" in any capacity. That's plainly absurd. Cavemen weren't baking anything.
  • lithezebra
    lithezebra Posts: 3,670 Member
    The only cons that I see to Paleo are restrictions on some foods that are perfectly healthy for most people, like tomatoes and beans.
  • kkerri
    kkerri Posts: 276 Member
    I really don't see why people care so much about the name and what others eat.

    I am trying this because I have an autoimmune disorder and I read there is a connection with gluten. I googled gluten free diets and stumbled upon the "Paleo" diet and started reading about it and since I wasn't a big meat eater and had never paid attention to gluten, it was easier for me to have a book and read and find recipes. If it doesn't work, no harm no foul. I don't buy into the "what cavemen ate" and "grains are bad" so much as I think "grains *may* be bad for me." Admittedly, I have struggled a bit b/c I don't love a meat based diet. But, I think I like my autoimmune disorder less, so I am trying to work toward a full Paleo diet.
  • itsjustdawn
    itsjustdawn Posts: 1,073 Member
    PROS:

    It can work well and quickly for weight loss
    No need for the hassle of calorie counting
    Can help regularise cravings
    Can help with digestive discomfort

    CONS:

    Restrictive food choice
    Lack of cake
    Can be expensive
    Can be hard to implement into day to day life
    Did I mention lack of cake?

    But lots of bacon. Bacon > Cake
  • bcattoes
    bcattoes Posts: 17,299 Member
    PROS:

    It can work well and quickly for weight loss
    No need for the hassle of calorie counting
    Can help regularise cravings
    Can help with digestive discomfort

    CONS:

    Restrictive food choice
    Lack of cake
    Can be expensive
    Can be hard to implement into day to day life
    Did I mention lack of cake?

    But lots of bacon. Bacon > Cake

    How is bacon not a processed food?
  • goldfinger88
    goldfinger88 Posts: 686 Member
    If you visit paleohacks.com, you'll find some forum messages by paleo followers that are quite disturbing. After being on the diet quiet awhile and getting their six packs (their words, not mine) they're finding their fasting blood glucose going through the roof. In other words, they are prediabetic.

    This happens because carbs make insulin and the paleo diet is extremely low in carbs.

    Having slightly elevated glucose myself, I would advise you against the diet. I suggest you follow a basic, moderate, intelligent food plan that does not take away any food group. The only thing you really need to avoid is added sugar.
  • darkangel45422
    darkangel45422 Posts: 234 Member
    What most people fail to see is that Paleo is a lifestyle, not hard and fast rules. People make their own modifications so it works for them, and that's totally allowable. So for example, Paleo baked goods - most Paleo plans will explicitly state these are things to be eaten in moderation as they're much less healthy than the main foundations of the diet (veggies, meats, etc.). But the ingredients in them don't include unhealthy or super unhealthy things (at least if they're really Paleo), so if you're gonna eat a baked good why NOT eat the healthier version if you like it? Or if you really want it, the non-Paleo version. I for example am not a fan of olive oil/balsamic vinegar/etc. as salad dressings, so I eat Renee's Cesar dressing. It has some non-Primal ingredients (mainly canola oil being it's main ingredient) but it's what I love and the healthiest dressing I can find that I like to put on my salads, so I'm willing to have it - I just acknowledge it's unhealthy points.

    Is this true? Or is this simply the altered defintiion of the diet you choose to follow?

    Unless you're doing Whole30 or something similar, most of the Paleo/Primal lifestyle versions I've seen advocate some room for moderation, so it's true, and not just my personal opinion. Obviously I haven't seen every version of these plans so there may be some exceptions other than Whole30, but for the most part these plans aren't hard and fast "you must be 100% Paleo or you're not Paleo anymore". For example, The Primal Blueprint specifically advocates the 80/20 rule.

    I for example am not a fan of olive oil/balsamic vinegar/etc. as salad dressings, so I eat Renee's Cesar dressing. It has some non-Primal ingredients (mainly canola oil being it's main ingredient) but it's what I love and the healthiest dressing I can find that I like to put on my salads, so I'm willing to have it - I just acknowledge it's unhealthy points.

    Exactly what I was talking about. The paleo salad itself is maybe 20 calories worth of greens, the very un-paleo bottled dressing is 160 calories in a typical serving size.

    This isn't eating 80/20, this is eating 10/90.

    Which is like claiming that someone who adds one of those ground down baby carrots with their sirloin steak is a "vegetarian".

    ...You do realize that's ONE component of ONE meal right? The salad dressing is probably the only non-Paleo approved food I'd have in that day since for the most part I try to eat foods that I (and Paleo) consider healthy - veggies, meats, eggs, some nuts and fruit, etc.

    If I'm eating bacon and eggs for breakfast, the above salad for lunch with an apple, and then have pork chops, broccoli in butter and a handful of mixed nuts for dinner, how is that no longer eating Paleo with the occasional non-Paleo food?

    And just to be clear, while I fully say that Renee's dressing isn't Paleo, the only non-Paleo ingredient is the canola oil (other than possibly xantham gum because I fully admit to not being entirely sure what that is) so you can see that I've still made the best of a bad choice by choosing a dressing that otherwise includes only approved ingredients.
  • PRMinx
    PRMinx Posts: 4,585 Member

    You fail to make any point by putting these quotes in. If you disagree that additives and hormones in meat aren't healthy for us, please explain for me how they're healthy. As for grains/dairy/legumes/processed foods, I specifically stated it was our belief, but it is one that there are studies to back up the fact that they're potentially harmful. In the end, if you don't believe it that's fine - totally your choice - but why bash other people's beliefs when they're neither harmful nor proven wrong?

    Freedom for everyone! People can do what they want. I actually enjoy a protein heavy diet myself.

    But, no one will ever convince me that eating a peanut is worse for me than expensive, processed "Paleo" foods. I think the cavemen were probably more likely to eat a bean then they were to bake Paleo cupcakes.
  • SnicciFit
    SnicciFit Posts: 967 Member
    I really don't see why people care so much about the name and what others eat.

    I am trying this because I have an autoimmune disorder and I read there is a connection with gluten. I googled gluten free diets and stumbled upon the "Paleo" diet and started reading about it and since I wasn't a big meat eater and had never paid attention to gluten, it was easier for me to have a book and read and find recipes. If it doesn't work, no harm no foul. I don't buy into the "what cavemen ate" and "grains are bad" so much as I think "grains *may* be bad for me." Admittedly, I have struggled a bit b/c I don't love a meat based diet. But, I think I like my autoimmune disorder less, so I am trying to work toward a full Paleo diet.

    Exactly. I don't care what cavepeople ate (most likely bugs and raw meat, two things I'm not interested in trying at this time), but through the paleo diet & Whole30, I discovered what foods were aggravating my digestive system and which ones seem to promote better gut health (for me). For example, rice is not paleo, but I can eat it (seemingly) without ill effects. I don't eat it every day and I don't even cook with it at home, but I do eat it. I suppose I could have continued to shove gluten & dairy filled foods in my face and just get on an "aggressive mirilax regimen" while taking a sick day or two every other week like the doctors suggested, but instead I chose to find a way of eating that makes me feel good and doesn't require any OTC or Rx drugs to "keep things moving". As a bonus, I got weight loss, better energy, clearer skin and a renewed love of cooking!

    Imagine that! Weight loss without COUNTING calories. Better health without COUNTING calories. Weirdest thing ever.
  • Beckboo0912
    Beckboo0912 Posts: 447 Member
    I didn't read through all the replies. I did it for two months and felt amazing, it's restrictive and some people need that. It also opened my eyes to the crap in stuff, so at the very least it's educational, try it if you don't like it don't do it
  • HPB2
    HPB2 Posts: 23 Member
    I try very hard to adhere to a Paleo menu. I don't feel deprived and I've tried a lot of new things! I don't consider it a "diet" or frown upon others who don't follow it (heck, I slip up). I just prefer eating lots of meats and veggies!

    Got to do what works for you!
  • LavenderBouquet
    LavenderBouquet Posts: 736 Member
    Just wanted to comment on how a lot of people post about how difficult it would be to eat out, it really depends if you include dairy and how strict you really want to be when eating out for social occasions. If you eat out a lot, particularly at fast food chains, it can be difficult but I found when eating out at normal restaurants, it wasn't particularly difficult to find a salad, or meat and vegetable dish that would be acceptable.
  • jonnythan
    jonnythan Posts: 10,161 Member
    non-Paleo approved food

    That's really the problem with Paleo. It has foods that aren't "approved" because the "philosophy" says they're "less healthy" or actually "make you sick."

    And this list of "non-approved foods" includes things like... black beans, oats, and yogurt.
  • darkangel45422
    darkangel45422 Posts: 234 Member

    But lots of bacon. Bacon > Cake

    How is bacon not a processed food?

    Because we advocate eating non-processed bacon. Best choice would be right from the farmer. Obviously some people don't do this and just eat regular bacon but most Paleo/Primal plans do discuss the bad parts of normal bacon (which come precisely from it being processed)
  • msf74
    msf74 Posts: 3,498 Member
    PROS:

    It can work well and quickly for weight loss
    No need for the hassle of calorie counting
    Can help regularise cravings
    Can help with digestive discomfort

    CONS:

    Restrictive food choice
    Lack of cake
    Can be expensive
    Can be hard to implement into day to day life
    Did I mention lack of cake?

    But lots of bacon. Bacon > Cake

    You must be crazy.
  • Mobilemuscle
    Mobilemuscle Posts: 945 Member
    There are soooo many variables to choosing a proper nutritional program. Paleo works for some. I personally dont see results doing it, and i feel like I want to die. My body seems to require starches and LOTS of them. Even when I would prepare for shows I would RARELY go under 500G of carbs a day.

    Lots of carbs, lots of protein, minimal fats

    hard, heavy training

    proper recuperation

    optimal hydration

    that always worked best for me
  • darkangel45422
    darkangel45422 Posts: 234 Member
    non-Paleo approved food

    That's really the problem with Paleo. It has foods that aren't "approved" because the "philosophy" says they're "less healthy" or actually "make you sick."

    And this list of "non-approved foods" includes things like... black beans, oats, and yogurt.

    ...Yes, yes Paleo does say those foods are less healthy or could make you sick (yoghurt is debatable as some Paleo versions, like Primal, allow dairy). But then, conventional wisdom has foods that are considered less healthy too - trans fats, a Snickers bar, deep fried Twinkies, etc.

    So, your issue with Paleo is that is believes not every food in the world is perfectly healthy for us? I guess you have an issue with every diet recommendation in the world then.
  • SnicciFit
    SnicciFit Posts: 967 Member
    If you visit paleohacks.com, you'll find some forum messages by paleo followers that are quite disturbing. After being on the diet quiet awhile and getting their six packs (their words, not mine) they're finding their fasting blood glucose going through the roof. In other words, they are prediabetic.

    This happens because carbs make insulin and the paleo diet is extremely low in carbs.

    Having slightly elevated glucose myself, I would advise you against the diet. I suggest you follow a basic, moderate, intelligent food plan that does not take away any food group. The only thing you really need to avoid is added sugar.

    This is the first I've heard of this! I'm genuinely intrigued. Especially since there are a lot of "success stories" out there about paleo helping diabetics reduce or eliminate their meds. What is "quite a while"? I've been eating mostly paleo (after being really strict for a while, I've added a few things back in) for over a year, so that is why I ask. Of course, I am careful to not let my carbs get too low because I CrossFit 4+ days a week and I know I need them! I'm not Keto.
  • bcattoes
    bcattoes Posts: 17,299 Member

    But lots of bacon. Bacon > Cake

    How is bacon not a processed food?

    Because we advocate eating non-processed bacon. Best choice would be right from the farmer. Obviously some people don't do this and just eat regular bacon but most Paleo/Primal plans do discuss the bad parts of normal bacon (which come precisely from it being processed)

    Bacon is smoked, cured, pork belly. Smoking and curring are processes. You may call whatever fresh meat you are eating bacon, but it's not bacon. Or you may call your smoked and/or cured meat unprocessed, but it's not.
  • ILoveTheBrowns
    ILoveTheBrowns Posts: 661 Member
    all this talk about cavemen made me think how unlucky they were.......they never got to experience krispy creme.....twinkies......pumpkin rolls......saved by the bell.......die hard 1 and 2.....or reese cups
  • darkangel45422
    darkangel45422 Posts: 234 Member
    There are soooo many variables to choosing a proper nutritional program. Paleo works for some. I personally dont see results doing it, and i feel like I want to die. My body seems to require starches and LOTS of them. Even when I would prepare for shows I would RARELY go under 500G of carbs a day.

    Lots of carbs, lots of protein, minimal fats

    hard, heavy training

    proper recuperation

    optimal hydration

    that always worked best for me

    Random question but I'm curious - where you eating any Paleo/Primal approved starches when you tried Paleo? Sweet potatoes, fruits, etc.?
    Not saying that you weren't and that's why it didn't work for you; just wondering if perhaps you were trying a variation of Paleo that was lower carb or something.

    I'm glad you found something that worked well for you and your health though!
  • nashai01
    nashai01 Posts: 536 Member
    bump

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