Newbie w BMR/TDEE Confusion :-( HELP

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Chissy11
Chissy11 Posts: 7
in Health and Weight Loss
Ok, so I am no novice to diet but am definitely just starting off with trying to seriously apply the science of weight loss. I started consistently trying to loss weight Oct 7th and just started tracking my calories October 14th. In the last 3 weeks I've lost 5.8 lbs, 1.2 the first week, .6 the 2nd, and 4 lbs last week. ( FYI btw week 2 & 3 I started cooking more and started a couch to 5K app, so I'm running 3 times a week for 30 minutes followed by 15 minutes of light weights and calisthenics).

This week I've been trying to figure out my BMR and if my calorie goals are correct. I'm 5'7 and started off at 224. I have 33% body fat, (although I've always been told I have an "athletic build" don't know if that matters but i think i have a high percent of lean muscle mass) and work a desk job. I bought a pedometer and on a typical day w/o exercise I take about 4,000 - 5,000 steps. When I calculated my BMR I consistently got a number of about 1818. I multiplied this by 1.375, as I read to do some where and it came up that I need 2500 calories to maintain my weight (using the TDEE calculator someone suggested here today it came to 2797 but whatever). So anyway I wanted to lose at least 2 lbs a week being that I'm technically obese so my calorie goals were set at 1600 calories. This would give me a weekly calorie deficit of 6300. I researched and figured I was burning 325 calories during my 30 minute intermittent run, and another 100 calories during my light weight and calisthenics workout for a total of 425 calories a workout, which three times a week would lead to a weekly deficit of 1275. So in total I figured I'd get a total 2.1 lb lost every week.

However I started reading some threads today about how we should eat over our BMR and at 20% of our TDEE and now I'm totally lost :-( Please help.

Replies

  • sheltrk
    sheltrk Posts: 111 Member
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    OK, let's define some terms:
    BMR is Basal Metabolic Rate. It's basically how many calories you would burn in a day if you were just lying on the couch doing nothing. TDEE is Total Daily Energy Expenditure. This is your BMR plus calories burned doing exercise, and also any non-exercise activities.

    To lose weight, you must consume fewer calories than your TDEE. A weekly deficit of about 3500 calories will result in 1 pound of fat loss. If you have a lot of weight to lose, figuring your deficit at 20% of your TDEE is a reasonable approach. In order to figure your TDEE, though, you have to have a pretty regular exercise routine. Most people who use the TDEE approach have a regular weekly workout routine that they stick to, so it works well for them.

    The way MFP is set up, you never *need* to calculate your TDEE. You can just have it calculate your BMR, your "activity level multiplier" (sedentary, moderately active, etc.), set a weight loss goal and rate, and then log your exercise and your food. It's important not to double count your exercise calories with your activity multiplier, which is where it can get confusing. In my opinion, the easiest way is just to set your activity level to "sedentary" and log *all* your exercise and calorie burning non-exercise activities. Logging *all* your exercise (as opposed to increasing your activity level multiplier) is particularly helpful if you vary your workout routine from week to week.

    MFP will set your daily food calorie goal based on your calculated BMR, activity level, and your weight loss rate goal. It will add calories to daily goal for any exercise you log. People on these forums often refer to this at "eating back your exercise calories". To hit your weight loss rate goal, you want to stick to hitting your net calculated calorie goal on average.

    Hope that helps.
  • Chissy11
    Chissy11 Posts: 7
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    So when the calories are added back on, should you consume them or leave them be?
  • diannethegeek
    diannethegeek Posts: 14,776 Member
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    So when the calories are added back on, should you consume them or leave them be?

    This depends on how you figured your TDEE. If you included your exercise in your calculations then you do not eat them back. They're already accounted for. If you figured your TDEE with a sedentary activity level then you would want to eat at least a portion of them back.
  • sheltrk
    sheltrk Posts: 111 Member
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    If you're using the MFP method and chose "sedentary" activity level: Yes, you should eat any exercise calories.
    If you're using the MFP method and chose a higher activity level: It depends--is the exercise you logged part of your higher activity level calculation? If it is, you shouldn't eat those calories. (In theory, you're not "supposed" to log those activities in your MFP diary...) If it is "extra" exercise--not part of your activity level calculation, then yes, you should eat those calories.

    Personally, I choose "sedentary" and I log all my activities/exercise. I find the concept of "extra food to fuel my workouts" very satisfying.
  • JarrodFit4Life
    JarrodFit4Life Posts: 24
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    Quick and easy reply since it looks like some of the responders have already defined the terms used. You've already calculated your TDEE, which includes your exercise 3x per week, to be roughly 2800 calories to maintain your current weight. Because this already includes your weekly exercise, you would not want to eat your calories back. If you want to lose roughly 2 lbs fat/week, you would need a 7,000 calorie deficit weekly, or about 1,000 calorie deficit per day (3,500 calories = 1 lb of fat). I would say that you are safe eating between 1,600 and 1,800 calories per day if you are looking to lose 2 lbs per week. This already includes your exercise calories, so you wouldn't need to eat any of those back. Sounds like you have a pretty good grasp on the rest of it so you already understand that those 1,600-1,800 calories shouldn't be in one sitting at McDonald's, lol.
  • Stoshew71
    Stoshew71 Posts: 6,553 Member
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    So when the calories are added back on, should you consume them or leave them be?

    This is potentially a controversal question. So I will hit it up from both sides.

    If you have your settings when asked for a 2 lb loss / week, then MFP will provide you an estimate of how many calories you should eat based upon normal activity (minus planned exercises) to create enough of a calorie deficit so you should lose 2 lbs every week.

    If you exercise and log it, then your calorie deficit increases. So if you eat all those calories back (from the exercise), then theoretically you will be at the point of loosing 2 lbs.

    The question then becomes what if I don't eat back those calories. That is where the controversy comes in. Some will quote starvation mode will begin to kick in and if you don't eat those calories back then you risk gaining weight. Other's will say starvation mode either doesn't exist or is misinterpreted. But theorectically, if you don't eat the calories back that you log in for your exercises, you are creating an even bigger calorie deficit than the 2 lbs you already built in. How your body reacts to not eating those calories back depends upon how big of a deficit you created, if you are meeting your macros and micros, how hard you are exercising, and a bunch of other science that you can either google or search this site on for other "expert opinions".

    That is my $.02
  • Stoshew71
    Stoshew71 Posts: 6,553 Member
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    If you have your settings when asked for a 2 lb loss / week, then MFP will provide you an estimate of how many calories you should eat based upon normal activity (minus planned exercises) to create enough of a calorie deficit so you should lose 2 lbs every week.

    I need to emphasise, when it asks you for your activity level (sendimentary, blah blah blah) the above assumes that you are not considering all the planned exercises.

    The way MFP is set up, you tell it your age, current weight, m or f, height, then your normal lifestyle (do you have an office job or are you a nurse and on their feet all day, or are you a construction worker and carry heavy things all day long). Then it asks you how much you want to loose a week (max of 2 lbs). Then it creates your calorie and macro/micro settings.

    If you exercise, and you log it, that is when you go beyond the prebuilt 2 lb calorie deficit.

    If you when asked what your lifestlye is like and you answering it that you are more active than sedimentary because you go to the gym all the time, then the prebuilt 2 lb calorie deficit already takes into consideration that you are exercising. So don't eat them back in that case.
  • Chissy11
    Chissy11 Posts: 7
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    Thanks so much this all makes sense, and in general it seems that the 1600 - 1800 calories a day range should work. My next question is this: for some reason whenever I go through the MFP calculation and enter in my activity as active at 3 workouts per week for 45 mins, they recommend that I eat 1580 calories a day, which is what I was doing and I wasn't eating anything back. However 1) this is under my 1818 BMR, and 2) when calculating my workout do they take in consideration the fact that at my weight I probably burn more calories than most while doing activities?
  • Stoshew71
    Stoshew71 Posts: 6,553 Member
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    My next question is this: for some reason whenever I go through the MFP calculation and enter in my activity as active at 3 workouts per week for 45 mins, they recommend that I eat 1580 calories a day


    The fact that you said you do 3 workouts per week for 45 minutes does not have any bearing on the 1580 calories.
    it calculated the 1580 calories based upon your age, current weight, height, m or f, what your normal activity level is, and how much you want to loose.

    The 3 workouts for 45 minutes is there because it is trying to hold you to that. In your goals, it will track how much exercise you log and see if you are keeping up to what you said you were going to do. Kind of a reminder where MFP is saying, "OK, you said you were going to exercise for 45 minutes for 3 times, but this week you only logged in 2 30 minute sessions. You are under what you said you were going to do".

    But all that has nothing to do with your food intake (calorie) levels. Hope this clears things up.
  • Jagreene62
    Jagreene62 Posts: 4,782 Member
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    OK, let's define some terms:
    BMR is Basal Metabolic Rate. It's basically how many calories you would burn in a day if you were just lying on the couch doing nothing. TDEE is Total Daily Energy Expenditure. This is your BMR plus calories burned doing exercise, and also any non-exercise activities.

    To lose weight, you must consume fewer calories than your TDEE. A weekly deficit of about 3500 calories will result in 1 pound of fat loss. If you have a lot of weight to lose, figuring your deficit at 20% of your TDEE is a reasonable approach. In order to figure your TDEE, though, you have to have a pretty regular exercise routine. Most people who use the TDEE approach have a regular weekly workout routine that they stick to, so it works well for them.

    The way MFP is set up, you never *need* to calculate your TDEE. You can just have it calculate your BMR, your "activity level multiplier" (sedentary, moderately active, etc.), set a weight loss goal and rate, and then log your exercise and your food. It's important not to double count your exercise calories with your activity multiplier, which is where it can get confusing. In my opinion, the easiest way is just to set your activity level to "sedentary" and log *all* your exercise and calorie burning non-exercise activities. Logging *all* your exercise (as opposed to increasing your activity level multiplier) is particularly helpful if you vary your workout routine from week to week.

    MFP will set your daily food calorie goal based on your calculated BMR, activity level, and your weight loss rate goal. It will add calories to daily goal for any exercise you log. People on these forums often refer to this at "eating back your exercise calories". To hit your weight loss rate goal, you want to stick to hitting your net calculated calorie goal on average.

    Hope that helps.


    OMG!! Light bulb moment!!! THANK YOU!!! :bigsmile:
  • Stoshew71
    Stoshew71 Posts: 6,553 Member
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    when calculating my workout do they take in consideration the fact that at my weight I probably burn more calories than most while doing activities?


    MFP doesn't calculate this at all. MFP depends upon you to log all your exercises and if you log them as cardio, there is an option to log how many calories you lost doing that exercise.


    For example, I said that i was going to do 5 1 hour workouts. (I don't always hold up to this and MFP reminds me of this when I look at my goals).

    But what I do do is this. First, every morning (except Sunday) I run on the treadmill. Say if I jog only 15 minutes and loose 250 calories. And that is according to the treadmill itself. So then i immediately log in under cardio (find and choose jogging), then enter how many minutes I jogged for (15) and then add how many calories (250) and bingo. First, MFP will subtract the 250 calories on top as exercise. Plus in your goals it gives you the 15 minutes credit.

    Now if you log under strength conditioning as opposed to cardio, calories is not even considered. Not unless you track it again under cardio.

    So when I workout with weights, it will ask me all the exercises i did, how much weight I used, number of sets and number of reps per set. But it doesn't calculate any time or calories. So now what i do instead is track my weight lifting under as cardio and do a very conservative estimate on calories for how long I worked out for. I use something else now to track my actual workout.
  • Chissy11
    Chissy11 Posts: 7
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    Oh ok this makes sense thanks!
  • Chissy11
    Chissy11 Posts: 7
    Options
    when calculating my workout do they take in consideration the fact that at my weight I probably burn more calories than most while doing activities?


    MFP doesn't calculate this at all. MFP depends upon you to log all your exercises and if you log them as cardio, there is an option to log how many calories you lost doing that exercise.


    For example, I said that i was going to do 5 1 hour workouts. (I don't always hold up to this and MFP reminds me of this when I look at my goals).

    But what I do do is this. First, every morning (except Sunday) I run on the treadmill. Say if I jog only 15 minutes and loose 250 calories. And that is according to the treadmill itself. So then i immediately log in under cardio (find and choose jogging), then enter how many minutes I jogged for (15) and then add how many calories (250) and bingo. First, MFP will subtract the 250 calories on top as exercise. Plus in your goals it gives you the 15 minutes credit.

    Now if you log under strength conditioning as opposed to cardio, calories is not even considered. Not unless you track it again under cardio.

    So when I workout with weights, it will ask me all the exercises i did, how much weight I used, number of sets and number of reps per set. But it doesn't calculate any time or calories. So now what i do instead is track my weight lifting under as cardio and do a very conservative estimate on calories for how long I worked out for. I use something else now to track my actual workout.

    Final question, so it's fine that my daily calories are less than my BMR?
  • Stoshew71
    Stoshew71 Posts: 6,553 Member
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    BMR. That is basically the number of calories your body needs if you were in a coma for 24 hours.
    To go below your BMR is quite a lot of a calorie deficit. Much much more than the 2 lb calorie deficit that MFP calculated.

    Again refer to my original answer and how contradictory that is. If you eat within the 2 lb deficit (including eating your exercise calories back) puts you in a safe zone. When you fall below that then a bunch of things start to become a risk. If you fall just a little bit below the 2 lb ( usually 1000 calories below your TDEE) deficit then I normally don't sweat it. But falling below your actual BMR is a huge risk.

    I am not even sure MFP gives you your BMR. But there are other tools and calculators that will estimate it for you if you do a google search.
  • Chissy11
    Chissy11 Posts: 7
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    Make sense thanks all!

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