Weight training question

discern82
discern82 Posts: 17 Member
in Fitness and Exercise
Hi,
I've heard many different philosophies and I wanted to see what others think, believe, heard, or do. I don't want to be bulky but look tone. In order to get that result, how should I weight train. I've heard to do one or the either.
1. Make the weights very light and do like 100 reps or as many as a 4 minute song
2. Make the weights so I can do 10-12 reps slowly and correctly with a slight pause between each rep with a 30-60 sec break (focus on making sure the muscle is doing the work)

Also, I was told that after I do a leg workout, I should do at least 30 minutes of cardio so my body continues to burn the entire day. Has anyone heard of this? How do you get the most out of your workout?

I hear so much and at times I think people are just talking but I'm not too sure. So, I like to get other people's opinions.

Replies

  • indigoigloo
    indigoigloo Posts: 20
    find some users on this website that looks like you want to look and ask them what they do. "look toned" is very vague and can mean a lot of things.
  • discern82
    discern82 Posts: 17 Member
    find some users on this website that looks like you want to look and ask them what they do. "look toned" is very vague and can mean a lot of things.

    That's a good idea and so true.
  • p4ulmiller
    p4ulmiller Posts: 588 Member
    Getting bulky is incredibly difficult. You won't look like Arnie by accidentally picking up a dumbbell.

    I follow Stronglifts 5x5 and eat in a moderate deficit. The calorie deficit means I won't gain muscle but I look more "toned" because my muscles have more definition as my BF% falls.
  • Ainar
    Ainar Posts: 858 Member
    Training with very high reps will build muscle and get you toned. But it will be harder and slower to build muscle than heavy weights. And takes a lot of unnecessary work to do all those hundreds of reps while you could just do heavier weights with less reps and get faster results.

    Lower reps with heavier weights will build muscle faster and easier. So you will get toned faster and easier.

    You can add fat pretty fast. But muscle building is EXTREMELY slow process. For people who look bulky, it takes them months or even years, and hard work, to build so much muscle. You can not get too bulky by accident. Just like you can not lose too much fat by accident. "I'm 20 pounds overweight I better go on diet... oops, I'm 20 pounds underweight now, how this that happened?!" NO! It takes some work to lose weight and you can not lose too much if you monitor everything. Same for building muscle.

    So I suggest to lift heavy. Once you have body you like just stop increasing weight and maintain muscle. You need to progress in weight, reps or overall workload to get bigger. If you don't, you will not grow, just stay the same.
  • discern82
    discern82 Posts: 17 Member
    Getting bulky is incredibly difficult. You won't look like Arnie by accidentally picking up a dumbbell.

    I follow Stronglifts 5x5 and eat in a moderate deficit. The calorie deficit means I won't gain muscle but I look more "toned" because my muscles have more definition as my BF% falls.

    Thanks!
  • discern82
    discern82 Posts: 17 Member
    Training with very high reps will build muscle and get you toned. But it will be harder and slower to build muscle than heavy weights. And takes a lot of unnecessary work to do all those hundreds of reps while you could just do heavier weights with less reps and get faster results.

    Lower reps with heavier weights will build muscle faster and easier. So you will get toned faster and easier.

    You can add fat pretty fast. But muscle building is EXTREMELY slow process. For people who look bulky, it takes them months or even years, and hard work, to build so much muscle. You can not get too bulky by accident. Just like you can not lose too much fat by accident. "I'm 20 pounds overweight I better go on diet... oops, I'm 20 pounds underweight now, how this that happened?!" NO! It takes some work to lose weight and you can not lose too much if you monitor everything. Same for building muscle.

    So I suggest to lift heavy. Once you have body you like just stop increasing weight and maintain muscle. You need to progress in weight, reps or overall workload to get bigger. If you don't, you will not grow, just stay the same.

    Thanks!
  • ninerbuff
    ninerbuff Posts: 48,990 Member
    Building muscle on a calorie deficit is improbable (there are exceptions, but even then the gain is minimal).

    To clear it up: lifting weights with lots of reps builds muscle endurance (just like a runner's legs building endurance for long distances)

    Lifting "slow" increases time under tension which builds strength, however one doesn't have to lift that slow since explosive movements also build power and strength.

    Finally to get "toned" (which really has no definition that's standard in fitness) losing flab is due to calorie deficit and some resistance training that builds strength. If one doesn't want the "ripped" look, then don't lose too much body fat.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal/Group FitnessTrainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
  • BusyRaeNOTBusty
    BusyRaeNOTBusty Posts: 7,166 Member
    Show us a picture of this "toned" look you want.
  • Sarauk2sf
    Sarauk2sf Posts: 28,072 Member
    People have different idea's of 'bulky', so it's a bit hard to answer your question without the context. However, women with very large muscles will be enhanced. For the purposes of my response, I am going to assume that you mean this as 'bulky'.

    It is very hard for a female to build muscle as we just do not have the testosterone for it. It is also unlikely that you will build any appreciable muscle on a deficit unless you are significantly overweight.

    Very high reps will not build muscle in any event, it will improve endurance


    ETA: you will burn calories the entire day without exercise. Cardio after weight training does not burn any more calories than cardio done separately.
  • discern82
    discern82 Posts: 17 Member
    Building muscle on a calorie deficit is improbable (there are exceptions, but even then the gain is minimal).

    To clear it up: lifting weights with lots of reps builds muscle endurance (just like a runner's legs building endurance for long distances)

    Lifting "slow" increases time under tension which builds strength, however one doesn't have to lift that slow since explosive movements also build power and strength.

    Finally to get "toned" (which really has no definition that's standard in fitness) losing flab is due to calorie deficit and some resistance training that builds strength. If one doesn't want the "ripped" look, then don't lose too much body fat.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal/Group FitnessTrainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

    Thanks for clearing things up! I like the idea of "lose the flab"
  • discern82
    discern82 Posts: 17 Member
    Show us a picture of this "toned" look you want.

    I will try!
  • discern82
    discern82 Posts: 17 Member
    Here are pictures. I didn't know how to add them as actual photos and not URL address. :(
    http://thumbs.dreamstime.com/x/woman-s-toned-body-16671966.jpg

    http://cdn.simplyshredded.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/female_fitness.jpg
  • kiwigal41
    kiwigal41 Posts: 1,059
    get the book...."The New Rules of Lifting for Women" by Lou Schuler......I bought it and it's very interesting reading.....includes a workout plan and nutrition plan....i'm pleased with it so far....:)
  • discern82
    discern82 Posts: 17 Member
    As I looked for pictures, I see the dilemma. So here is what I don't want. I guess it isn't bulky that I mean but more so, I don't want to look muscular. I know I won't have the huge muscles! So here are some more pictures but these are what I DON'T want to look like.

    http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-f86uD0tCmsE/UT5AA-9_xjI/AAAAAAAADks/UsOmPykOOGI/s1600/Fit+and+Toned+Woman+-+Fitness+Girl.jpg

    http://media.onsugar.com/files/ons1/192/1922729/30_2009/259d8811b0caff11_body-builder.jpg

    http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/659/31441927761859560874919.jpg

    http://tnation.t-nation.com/forum_images/1/0/1077777.1148496948448.julie2.jpg
  • discern82
    discern82 Posts: 17 Member
    get the book...."The New Rules of Lifting for Women" by Lou Schuler......I bought it and it's very interesting reading.....includes a workout plan and nutrition plan....i'm pleased with it so far....:)

    Ok, I'll have to read it!
  • MisterDerpington
    MisterDerpington Posts: 604 Member
    Don't lift too heavy. Your uterus will fall out.
  • BeachIron
    BeachIron Posts: 6,490 Member
    lol at anyone, especially women, accidentally getting bulky at a calorie deficit without drugs.
  • cmeiron
    cmeiron Posts: 1,599 Member
    Unless you're genetically gifted, you won't get that kind of muscle mass by lifting heavy weights, especially not while eating at a deficit. You'd have to train ridiculously hard, for a very long time, and eat above your TDEE to even come close to getting a physique like that. That kind of muscle doesn't happen without a LOT of time and effort (I wish it was easier, 'cause I'm trying to get more muscle mass and it's bloody hard).
  • Serah87
    Serah87 Posts: 5,481 Member
    <
    picks up heavy things. :bigsmile:
  • MstngSammy
    MstngSammy Posts: 436 Member
    get the book...."The New Rules of Lifting for Women" by Lou Schuler......I bought it and it's very interesting reading.....includes a workout plan and nutrition plan....i'm pleased with it so far....:)

    THIS^^^ Without a doubt. I bought it recently because of friends recommendations. Lou sets the record straight on a lot of the myths and goes into detail on how our muscles/bodies behave. Very good read.
  • cwolfman13
    cwolfman13 Posts: 41,865 Member
    Doing 100 reps is pretty much a waste of time...if you want to work on endurance/muscular endurance just do some circuit type training. The results will be better and more efficient than trying to do 100s of reps in the weight room.

    8-12 rep range is good for hypertrophy (i.e. building muscle)...but really, that's going to give you the toned look...it's going to give you a nice physique. Most woman cannot "bulk" and certainly not by accident. It is difficult for men with half way decent genetics to bulk and requires strict adherence to a body building regimen and strict adherence to diet (including surplus calories).

    Just go work an actual program that is progressively intelligent and enjoy your "toned" *kitten*.
  • junlex123
    junlex123 Posts: 81 Member
    As I looked for pictures, I see the dilemma. So here is what I don't want. I guess it isn't bulky that I mean but more so, I don't want to look muscular. I know I won't have the huge muscles! So here are some more pictures but these are what I DON'T want to look like.

    http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-f86uD0tCmsE/UT5AA-9_xjI/AAAAAAAADks/UsOmPykOOGI/s1600/Fit+and+Toned+Woman+-+Fitness+Girl.jpg

    http://media.onsugar.com/files/ons1/192/1922729/30_2009/259d8811b0caff11_body-builder.jpg

    http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/659/31441927761859560874919.jpg

    http://tnation.t-nation.com/forum_images/1/0/1077777.1148496948448.julie2.jpg

    To look like those pictures requires a) a very low bodyfat % after multiple bulk/cut cycles b) a very, very intense workout regimen with chemical assistance in some cases c) appropriate lighting and makeup to highlight the musculature d) being pumped in some of those cases so that the muscles are saturated with blood - a state they won't occupy in everyday activity.

    In short, it's not something you can have accidentally happen to you; you have to want that look and be prepared to work extremely hard to attain it.
  • just_Jennie1
    just_Jennie1 Posts: 1,233
    lol at anyone, especially women, accidentally getting bulky at a calorie deficit without drugs.

    Some people don't know this because they listen to what "they" say. Look at all the women who pedal their fitness DVD's who talk about how women shouldn't lift heavy because they'll explode into muscles and become bulky. It's that kind of philosophy from 'trusted' people that is confusing. Also, it sounds to me like the OP is a bit new at this and is looking for honest answers, not snark.
  • Sarauk2sf
    Sarauk2sf Posts: 28,072 Member
    As I looked for pictures, I see the dilemma. So here is what I don't want. I guess it isn't bulky that I mean but more so, I don't want to look muscular. I know I won't have the huge muscles! So here are some more pictures but these are what I DON'T want to look like.

    http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-f86uD0tCmsE/UT5AA-9_xjI/AAAAAAAADks/UsOmPykOOGI/s1600/Fit+and+Toned+Woman+-+Fitness+Girl.jpg

    http://media.onsugar.com/files/ons1/192/1922729/30_2009/259d8811b0caff11_body-builder.jpg

    http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/659/31441927761859560874919.jpg

    http://tnation.t-nation.com/forum_images/1/0/1077777.1148496948448.julie2.jpg

    #1 - I would not consider that bulky at all. She has put in a lot of intense work and has a low BF% to have her muscles that defined.

    #2 - same as above but also more than likely she is 'chemically enhanced' so unless you are on gear, you do not have to worry about ever looking like that.

    #3 - she is also not natty, and puts a lot of work in and has a very low BF also.

    #4 - quite likely 'enhanced' also.

    Basically, unless you take gear, have very intensive workout routine and get down to a very low BF%, you will not look like that.

    ETA: also as the poster a couple above me mentioned - they will have been 'shopped', pumped and tanned to look like that for their shoots.
  • BeachIron
    BeachIron Posts: 6,490 Member
    lol at anyone, especially women, accidentally getting bulky at a calorie deficit without drugs.

    Some people don't know this because they listen to what "they" say. Look at all the women who pedal their fitness DVD's who talk about how women shouldn't lift heavy because they'll explode into muscles and become bulky. It's that kind of philosophy from 'trusted' people that is confusing. Also, it sounds to me like the OP is a bit new at this and is looking for honest answers, not snark.


    You sound fun . . .

    1/10 would avoid at parties
  • fatfudgery
    fatfudgery Posts: 449 Member
    You're an untrained beginner, how you train won't make a difference for a while. What will make a difference is your training progress and consistency. Look into New Rules Of Lifting For Women, StrongLifts 5x5, Starting Strength, Ice Cream Fitness, Greyskull LP or any other well-established, beginner-level program with linear progression (i.e., adding weight to the bar every workout), pick one you like and stick with it. Don't try to make your own routine; programming is a science and there are knowledgable people out there who've made programs available that deliver optimal results for people in your position. Stay away from machines; learn the big compound barbell lifts, instead (squat, deadlift, press, bench, rows, clean.)

    And don't worry about "looking too muscular." Do you think the first few years of piano lessons for a 5 year-old are any different depending on whether or not she wants to be a concert pianist one day? Would you tell your driving instructor "I don't want to accidentally wind up racing in NASCAR"? Of course not. Again, you're an untrained beginner; you really won't have to worry about becoming an elite-level bodybuilder for quite some time, if at all.
  • pavrg
    pavrg Posts: 277 Member
    What he said.

    Also, OP, pics 2-4 are women who are on steroids. Pic 1 is a woman at like 10-12% bodyfat.
  • discern82
    discern82 Posts: 17 Member
    Doing 100 reps is pretty much a waste of time...if you want to work on endurance/muscular endurance just do some circuit type training. The results will be better and more efficient than trying to do 100s of reps in the weight room.

    8-12 rep range is good for hypertrophy (i.e. building muscle)...but really, that's going to give you the toned look...it's going to give you a nice physique. Most woman cannot "bulk" and certainly not by accident. It is difficult for men with half way decent genetics to bulk and requires strict adherence to a body building regimen and strict adherence to diet (including surplus calories).

    Just go work an actual program that is progressively intelligent and enjoy your "toned" *kitten*.

    Thanks! Very informative! I'm excited!
  • discern82
    discern82 Posts: 17 Member
    You're an untrained beginner, how you train won't make a difference for a while. What will make a difference is your training progress and consistency. Look into New Rules Of Lifting For Women, StrongLifts 5x5, Starting Strength, Ice Cream Fitness, Greyskull LP or any other well-established, beginner-level program with linear progression (i.e., adding weight to the bar every workout), pick one you like and stick with it. Don't try to make your own routine; programming is a science and there are knowledgable people out there who've made programs available that deliver optimal results for people in your position. Stay away from machines; learn the big compound barbell lifts, instead (squat, deadlift, press, bench, rows, clean.)

    And don't worry about "looking too muscular." Do you think the first few years of piano lessons for a 5 year-old are any different depending on whether or not she wants to be a concert pianist one day? Would you tell your driving instructor "I don't want to accidentally wind up racing in NASCAR"? Of course not. Again, you're an untrained beginner; you really won't have to worry about becoming an elite-level bodybuilder for quite some time, if at all.

    Lol!!! Well-taken! The NASCAR comment was hilarious and really puts things into perspective. I'll look at the programs and pick on and get to work!!!
  • CatseyeHardcast
    CatseyeHardcast Posts: 224 Member
    What the others said. You will find it hard to get bulky. If you bulk up easily please tell all the guys your secret ;)

    Stronglifts 5x5, Starting strength, new rules etc etc are all good programs to get you into lifting. Make sure you focus on correct form and proper warm ups (the "SST" app for iPhone works out your warm up sets wonderfully)

    Enjoy

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