No Diagnosis; Symptoms Persist...GALLBLADDER?!
ThriftyChica12
Posts: 373 Member
Here is a complete picture of what I have been going through, health-wise, for the last couple months. Lately I have seen some improvement, but not much. I am not sure yet what all of this means, and I am determined to figure it out and address it with nutrition, saving surgery or meds for a last resort:
Symptoms:
Rolling nausea that comes and goes, indigestion and belching (even with small amounts of food), DEEP BELCHING (sometimes starts suddenly, hours after last eating), pain in my R ribs and abdomen that gets worse after physical labor/work, loss of appetite.
Tests I've Had Done:
blood work for my pancreas and liver function (results were normal), an ultrasound of my gallbladder to look for stones or inflammation (results were also normal), physical exam by doctor (she was able to press my abdomen and ribs with no real pain resulting).
Possible diagnoses that have been offered:
Gallbladder issues (suggested by doc, amended when the tests were all normal), tightness or improper functioning of my diaphragm (suggested by my wholistic chiropractor).
Treatments I have tried:
detailed food-symptom journal and careful eating, peppermint tea, kombucha, chiro-adjustments, etc.
Things that make it WORSE:
Eating late at night, eating a large amount of food in any one sitting (more than 1 or 2 c of food total by volume), going too long WITHOUT eating, eating fatty or fried foods, sometimes even just eating nuts or nut butters, physical exhaustion from working
Things that (usually) make it BETTER:
eating small meals, eating often throughout day, eating only foods i make at home (ie: no restaurant food), eating bland food (ie: plain grains, steamed veggies, etc).
Questions I have:
-IS it my gallbladder? If so, can healthy eating cure this, or is surgery inevitable?
-Are the rib pain (worse when lifting or working) and the nausea/digestive related, or just two seperate problems?
-Must I eliminate ALL fats (oils, nuts), and is it healthy to do so?
Symptoms:
Rolling nausea that comes and goes, indigestion and belching (even with small amounts of food), DEEP BELCHING (sometimes starts suddenly, hours after last eating), pain in my R ribs and abdomen that gets worse after physical labor/work, loss of appetite.
Tests I've Had Done:
blood work for my pancreas and liver function (results were normal), an ultrasound of my gallbladder to look for stones or inflammation (results were also normal), physical exam by doctor (she was able to press my abdomen and ribs with no real pain resulting).
Possible diagnoses that have been offered:
Gallbladder issues (suggested by doc, amended when the tests were all normal), tightness or improper functioning of my diaphragm (suggested by my wholistic chiropractor).
Treatments I have tried:
detailed food-symptom journal and careful eating, peppermint tea, kombucha, chiro-adjustments, etc.
Things that make it WORSE:
Eating late at night, eating a large amount of food in any one sitting (more than 1 or 2 c of food total by volume), going too long WITHOUT eating, eating fatty or fried foods, sometimes even just eating nuts or nut butters, physical exhaustion from working
Things that (usually) make it BETTER:
eating small meals, eating often throughout day, eating only foods i make at home (ie: no restaurant food), eating bland food (ie: plain grains, steamed veggies, etc).
Questions I have:
-IS it my gallbladder? If so, can healthy eating cure this, or is surgery inevitable?
-Are the rib pain (worse when lifting or working) and the nausea/digestive related, or just two seperate problems?
-Must I eliminate ALL fats (oils, nuts), and is it healthy to do so?
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Replies
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It is possible your not in complete failure of the gallbladder. How many calories are you consuming per day, and how much exercise are you doing? Do you consume enough fiber and protein? Does your diet consist of spicy foods or greasy foods? I and my family have a long history of gall bladder deficiencies. there are several stages let me know and I will tell you what I know about it. Not medical advise, just trying to help.0
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Sounds like a possibility. My friend had to have hers removed. Pain was intermittent but extremely painful when it occurred. She is all better now that it is out.0
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Your symptoms do sound gallbladder-ish... My co-worker's husband had the belching/nausea problem before he finally got his out.
I had my gallbladder removed two months ago. My only symptom for a year and a half was occasional mild upper back pain (slowly getting more frequent) that would sometimes wrap around my chest and I would feel like my bra was too tight. Most of the time it was just my back and I thought it was a muscle issue (like maybe I was slouching too much or something).
About two weeks before the surgery I started feeling soreness around my rib cage that would get worse with physical activity. I thought it was muscle strain from an event where I had spent several hours slightly bent over a table working on stuff, but it was getting worse instead of better. Then I thought maybe it was inflammation, but, pressing on my ribs caused no pain.
Finally, it escalated into burning chest pain, burning on my left side, and burning/fullness in my stomach. I ended up in the ER and after tests and an ultrasound they told me I had an angry gallbladder. (Complete surprise, I had no idea anything was wrong it before that.) Oddly enough, I never had any abdominal pain around the gallbladder area until right before I walked into the ER, and then I didn't even mention it at first because I thought it was just a cramp in my side from the way I had been sitting in the car.
I had surgery the next morning, and my gallbladder was severely inflamed and had gangrene. The surgery itself was super easy and I've had no problems eating anything, though I have read that a small number of people can end up with "permanent" IBS.0 -
thanks everyone for all the feedback...maybe it IS my gallbladder, even tho ultrasound was normal. many people told me that i should also ask for a "HIDA scan" and other tests...just because my gallby looked normal on an ultrasound (no stones) does not mean that i am completely out of the woods.
the frustrating thing is that, though i DO have health insurance (for the first time in years), my damn deductible is SO HIGH: i have to pay out the first $3,000 out of pocket before my health insurance pays ANYTHING. like most young people working two jobs, i don't exactly have 3000 bucks laying around to spend on a medical wild goose chase that may or may not lead to a diagnosis.
i have already spent $500 just on the tests i mentioned in the original post; they SEEMED to rule some stuff out, but ultimately, yielded no diagnosis
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You should ask the hospital or your doctor to work with you for a payment plan. I had to have a procedure done and they were very nice to work with the costs and reduce some of it based on income and them set up a payment plan. Its costly but better than living in pain. There are many options available. But I never put my health to the side because i can "afford" it. I cant afford to be so sick i cant work either!
It may help to see a different physician, or a specialist if you havent already.0 -
Get yourself checked for celiacs before you do anything that involves surgery to remove your gallbladder. It's actually a pretty darn risky surgery and if all tests point to nothing being wrong with it then don't have it removed.
My sister was having major issues, stomach cramps, sickness etc. etc. and she went to the doctor and hospital. They ran tests and concluded her gallbladder was fine however they insisted that she get it removed 'just because'. She did the smart thing and got a second opinion. Other tests were run and it turned out she had celiacs.
Please, please PLEASE get a second, third, fourth hell a HUNDREDTH opinion before you even consider having your gallbladder removed.0 -
Yes - I agree with getting a second/third/ opinion, etc. My uncle was having GI issues, and they did an ultrasound and said he had polyps in his gallbladder. He had it removed, but it didn't solve his problem. (He also lives in a rural/small town area where they don't always have access to good doctors)
There is always a risk when having surgery, but I don't think gallbladder removal in particular is more risky than anything else. Many people have it done laparoscopically as an outpatient procedure.
Something to think about though, waiting too long could potentially cost you more, depending on your situation. I was admitted through the ER and spent two nights in the hospital with a drain and IV meds. There were extra charges because it was an "emergent" situation. I had no choice of surgeon or anesthesiologist, but fortunately they did a good job. (As I was being taken back to my room, there was another man who had just come out of surgery with a different surgeon and was being taken back for a CT scan. One of the techs was my brother-in-laws aunt, so later I found out that surgeon leaves the room and his residents perform the surgery unattended, and then some of his patients end up with complications). Also, the anesthesiologist did not accept my insurance, so I had to pay more since he was not in my "network".
All of that could have been avoided if I had been able to have a scheduled outpatient surgery, but since my symptoms were so mild until it was too late I didn't have a clue.0 -
thanks EVERYONE who has shared advice and experience!!! lots for me to think about, try, and research.
just posted my food for the day, so u can see an example of how i eat when i am eating "carefully", and u can see some brief journaling about my symptoms in the "notes" section.
fortunately, not too many symptoms today, but still, that damn belching and gas pressure.
weeks ago it was worse: i had loss of appetite and frequent nausea....i think that i may be getting "better" since i have been avoiding certain foods, and avoiding overeating, lately.0 -
Could it be dyspepsia (acid reflux/heartburn)?
You didn't mention a burning sensation, but all your symptoms fit with the other dyspepsia symptoms, and the things you said make it worse definitely fit.0 -
thanks everyone for all the feedback...maybe it IS my gallbladder, even tho ultrasound was normal. many people told me that i should also ask for a "HIDA scan" and other tests...just because my gallby looked normal on an ultrasound (no stones) does not mean that i am completely out of the woods.
the frustrating thing is that, though i DO have health insurance (for the first time in years), my damn deductible is SO HIGH: i have to pay out the first $3,000 out of pocket before my health insurance pays ANYTHING. like most young people working two jobs, i don't exactly have 3000 bucks laying around to spend on a medical wild goose chase that may or may not lead to a diagnosis.
i have already spent $500 just on the tests i mentioned in the original post; they SEEMED to rule some stuff out, but ultimately, yielded no diagnosis
sludge in a gal bladder will not show up in an ultra sound, only stones will. You can still have a bad gal bladder. Make them do a swallow test that traces your food as it digests thru the gal bladder0 -
I had a bad gallbladder attack once that literally felt just like labor pains right at the base of my middle ribs. Contractions that came and went, getting stronger every time, plus nausea. Ultra sound showed no stones, but dr felt it was still Gallbladder so he sent me for a HIDA scan. My GB was contracting backwards, forcing the bile back up into my liver. They took it out and I was fine ever since.
Not saying this is what you have,tho. Yours sounds more like a possible hiatal hernia. Are you very short waisted, and have you have kids, or been very large in your stomach? Sometimes part of your stomach can get pushed up into the esophagus thru the diaphragm, causing pain, nausea, and indigestion. I have that as well after 3 kids. Large meals, especially greasy meals, will cause me bad problems. Oftentimes it also feels like I have swallowed a golf ball, and pain will travel down my food pipe. This happens if I eat too fast, especially things like rice.0 -
It could also be a hiatal hernia. Both of my parents have this and their symptoms are all found in your list.
Ignore the "tightness of the diaphragm" crap.0 -
Actually, it sounds to me more like a stomach problem than gallbladder. I had my gallbladder removed after it completely died, and had 13 hospital visits prior to that where the hospital didn't seem to have any idea what was wrong. They didn't think to do an ultrasound. When they finally did, they saw the gallstone easily. If your CT scan is showing normal, and they can put preassure on your stomach with little pain, it's unlikely to be your gallbladder.
Horrible as it is, I'd suggest you request a Gastroscopy. It's not nice, but it will give the doctors a clear view into what's going on in there.0 -
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I had the SAME EXACT symptoms about 2 or 3 years ago. I had pain and would get worse when I ate but then it would hurt if I didn't eat. It felt like hunger pains but as soon as I ate I would wish I hadn't. It would happen for a few days then go away, comeback a week or so later. I had ultrasound, bloodwork, etc but everything came back unremarkable. I am sorry to say, but nothing was ever found and I didn't really do anything except eat Jello/popsicles/applesauce when I was having these pains. Eventually, the pain stopped and I haven't had any problems in over 2 years. Weird. Good luck, I hope it subsides soon.0
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I'm thinking it might be best to ignore this advice.0 -
Been there done that! You need to ask for the HIDA scan and you need the upper GI done.
I had a sluggish gall bladder and a sliding hiatal hernia. All the symptoms the OP described and then some!
I ignored them too long and one day finally thought I was going to die! I ended up in the hospital for five days on an antibiotic IV drip for acute pancreatitis and had to have my gall bladder removed also.
The hernia was found a few years later after a change in my job status caused increased stress and a seated job, tied to a phone. Which lead to weight gain (the highest percentage around the upper abdomen!), increased indigestion, and a damaged esophagus and a new kind of misery. Omeprazole, diet and attitude changes saved my life that time. I demanded and got a stand up unit for the computer, a wireless phone headset, changed my attitude (quit letting the demands get to me) and balanced my diet.
Good luck to you, I hope you find the right answer and regain your health.0 -
I'm thinking it might be best to ignore this advice.
DITTO
I tried all kinds of stupid on-line and home remedies that wasted a lot of time and money and did absolutely no good! I should have went to the doctor with it much sooner.0 -
No, none of this stuff works. Stay away from curezone, it's full of crazy people0 -
It tooks several months to have my gallbladder issue figured out - the key was to have my bloodwork done when I was actively having an attack. I had several rounds of blood work done, but none showed any issues until I went to my doc when I was in pain. Ta-da, it showed up.0
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Update: went to the E.R. with nausea and pain...they ran some bloodwork (all negative), gave me hydrations IVs, gave me some anti nausea meds, and sent me home.
i have an appt with a gastro later this week, so hopefully, get this all figured out soon!!!0 -
It could be that stones passed from the gallbladder into the bile ducts which is bad. But...should have also been seen on ultrasound. I had mine out in July and before that I had to have a procedure to remove stones that had made it out of the gallbladder and into the bile ducts. Doc thinks it wasn't the first time because I had been having what I thought was acid reflux for over a year but it suddenly kept coming back as what I then thought was random bouts of stomach flu (I was blaming Chipotle for that cuz it just so happened I would get it after eating there....guess it was the spice). Anyhoo...my gallbladder was PACKED with stones. My sister had hers out and only had one very large stone. So you never know. But I would at least suggest a hidra scan to the doc and/or discuss other treatments/tests because its not getting better. Could it be acid reflux? Those attacks suck too.0
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If no stones were seen on ultrasound you could still possibly have "acaclulous" cholecystitis. But that is actually pretty rare and the fact that your doc was able to palpate your liver and gallbladder without eliciting pain makes cholecystitis unlikely. If the stone passed into your bile duct you would likely have evidence of liver inflammation but it could account for your problems with fatty foods. The reasons you could have problems with fatty foods are numerous and could be due to lack of bile production in your liver, blockage of bile duct/cystic duct, pancreatic lipase deficiency, or a malabsorption syndrome in your small intestine. You could go to vitamin shoppe and buy an enzyme complex and see if this helps. I would recommend asking your doc about getting a HIDA done too as ultrasound can miss some stones/structural defects. Be sure to ask your doc about possibility of choledocolithiasis (stone in the bile duct) as that can have very serious complications like ascending cholangitis0
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Had very similiar symptoms...CT scan was normal. HIDA scan showed Gallbladder barely functioning0
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Definitely ask for the HIDA scan. That was the only thing that was able to diagnose my gallbladder.0
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^^ same here.0
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I had the same issues. Constant belching while feeling like it never helped. My PCP felt in the area of my gallbladder and I shot off the table from the pain. I was terrified of having surgery and started looking up natural ways to deal with it.
This is going to sound silly, but I tried Apple Cider Vinegar. I figured I had nothing to lose. I started drinking it with apple juice and after a week the pain was gone. I felt completely better.
I'm not saying it will work, but it helped me avoid surgery!0 -
i had my one and only gallbladder attack on a Saturday night, while winding down (I don't get out much
) . Did a check online to see what typical heart attack signs might be, had my sister take me to the ER (they see you right away if you think you're having chest pains!), and the ultrasonographer picked up stones in my gall bladder. Had the thing removed. The only down side to not having a gall bladder is that you have to be very careful of the fat content in foods, since you no longer have a reserve of bile to emulsify fats. So fats tend to, um, shall we say, run through pretty quickly. 4 years later, I'm still trying to outsmart my GI tract--many times I still have the "negative side effects" when I haven't even eaten anything!! An AM problem, as a rule. Otherwise, I see no really heinous issues in getting rid of the thing. My only regret: I didn't think to ask my surgeon to save the stones for me. I'm a bit odd that way..... 0 -
Update: went to the E.R. with nausea and pain...they ran some bloodwork (all negative), gave me hydrations IVs, gave me some anti nausea meds, and sent me home.
i have an appt with a gastro later this week, so hopefully, get this all figured out soon!!!
I feel for you! I went through the same thing 8 years ago. The ER Dr. actually laughed at me & said it was just gas! My (old) Dr. had wanted to remove my gall bladder & I insisted in seeing the gastro dr. first. He was very helpful. Said it was something I was eating that I had a severe intolerance to -which turned out to be Splenda.
I hope it turns out to be something like this for you- much less pain to you and your pocketbook once you figure out what it is & get it under control (vs. surgery or keep going on in pain). Glad you have an apt- hang in there!0 -
BTW- My pain radiated on my right side from front to back- what I found very comforting was a heat bag I made of rice that I would heat up in the microwave.0
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