Another scientist explaining why dieting usually fails.

maillemaker
maillemaker Posts: 1,253 Member
in Food and Nutrition
Dr. Sandra Aamodt referencing Dr. Liebel who I mentioned earlier explaining why for most people dieting fails. In fact, for most people dieting results in weight gain.

http://www.ted.com/talks/sandra_aamodt_why_dieting_doesn_t_usually_work.html

Dr. Aamodt suggests that our set points for storing body fat may be adjustable upwards but possibly are not adjustable downwards.

Our bodies are programmed to protect fat stores. When you lose weight and you have been obese it triggers a reduction in metabolism that appears may be permanent. Once you descend below your set point for body fat you will be hungry and you will have a slower metabolism. Obesity thus results in possibly permanent body chemistry changes requiring dieters to fight hunger forever, which most people cannot sustain.

Dr. Liebel's lecture: http://videocast.nih.gov/summary.asp?live=2993&bhcp=1

This is a depressing reaffirmation of what I and many people have experienced over their lives. It reinforces the need for medical science to come up with mechanisms to alter this set point or at least negate hunger.

The good news is like Dr. Liebal, Dr. Aamodt shows that even if you are overweight or even obese making 2 out of 4 lifestyle changes (diet, exercise, smoking, drinking) can bring your risk of death in line with healthy people.

Of course most of us aren't just looking to be healthy we are looking to be attractive and able to be physically active.
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Replies

  • nomeejerome
    nomeejerome Posts: 2,616 Member
    I see you lost your willpower again and are back on the excuse train. :ohwell:
  • fxg20
    fxg20 Posts: 61 Member
    I'm obese. I've lost 38 pounds so far walking and using MFP to count calories religiously. I have experienced a significant reduction in appetite now that I am eating in an organized way. Everybody gets hungry, it's annoying in a world full of easy to get food, but it is not an impossible barrier to weight loss or a good excuse.
  • Kenazwa
    Kenazwa Posts: 278 Member
    I've come across this so many times, but it seems that, when you get hungry, if you learn to reach for vegetables instead of Doritos (for example), it's not going to result in weight gain.

    I hope so.

    Remember - look for affirmations supporting your goals, not the opposite.
  • STC1188
    STC1188 Posts: 101 Member
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  • Francl27
    Francl27 Posts: 26,371 Member
    Well of course your metabolism slows down when you lose weight... you have less weight to carry around.

    It's wrong though. I'm not hungry at all. It's the cravings that get me.
  • SezxyStef
    SezxyStef Posts: 15,267 Member


    This is a depressing reaffirmation of what I and many people have experienced over their lives. It reinforces the need for medical science to come up with mechanisms to alter this set point or at least negate hunger.

    The good news is like Dr. Liebal, Dr. Aamodt shows that even if you are overweight or even obese making 2 out of 4 lifestyle changes (diet, exercise, smoking, drinking) can bring your risk of death in line with healthy people.

    Of course most of us aren't just looking to be healthy we are looking to be attractive and able to be physically active.

    Wow...really so I am gonna fail and get fat again...good to know.

    Psh...*rolls eyes* people fail because they have false expectations and go to extremes and then quit...ie never make habits out of their healthy choices and slide back into not counting calories and eating over maintenance.

    ETA: yes lets make science come up with a new fangled mechanism or drug to make our bodies do what we want without the work.
  • WendyTerry420
    WendyTerry420 Posts: 13,274 Member
    I see you lost your willpower again and are back on the excuse train. :ohwell:

    ^^ This


    I've been maintaining for 6 months now without logging. How? I changed my eating habits, and I remain committed to daily exercise. (not the gym, but simply to movement instead of being a couch potato)
  • likitisplit
    likitisplit Posts: 9,420 Member
    I was around 200 for three years. Every time I tried to lose weight, I ended up starving, eating more and gaining.

    Then I figured out an appropriate amount for me to eat and I lost 40 pounds in a year without being particularly hungry, except for right before meals.

    Then I maintained for 6 months without logging, just by paying attention to hunger cues.

    Now I'm trying to bulk by adding 200 calories, but I don't seem to be gaining weight yet.

    It would be great if somebody could tell me what "set point" my body is using.
  • ShannonMpls
    ShannonMpls Posts: 1,936 Member
    Formerly obese girl here. 300+ pounds.

    I'm at a healthy weight (170ish - 5'11"). I have been maintaining my healthy weight for about 18 months now.

    I didn't realize I was hungry all the time. I certainly don't feel hungry all the time. That's probably because I'm not.

    Maybe I did it "right" or maybe I'm just a special snowflake. I might regain all my weight in two years, who knows. But I am 100% sure that if I continue with the same habits I have now, I won't struggle against regain. I log a small deficit during the week, eat whatever I want on the weekends, and exercise regularly. It just seems so easy that I'm honestly a little surprised every time I step on the scale to see that I'm right where I want to be, still.
  • RobinvdM
    RobinvdM Posts: 634 Member
    That Dr is spouting nonsense. Else there are a lot of people out there who haven't caught on to this and aren't following her rules for dramatically slower/reversal of weight loss.

    Between you and I, OP, I feel being attractive isn't attainable. You either are, or you are not. I have seen some pretty ugly "good looking" folks.
  • Galatea_Stone
    Galatea_Stone Posts: 2,037 Member
    I'm going to guess the good doctor never picked up a weight or did any sort of bodyweight/strength training or even considered strength training while performing this study.

    People who lift or perform other strength training exercises while losing weight hold on to more muscle mass and have an easier time keeping weight off.
  • neanderthin
    neanderthin Posts: 10,223 Member
    Set points= can't lose weight. When weight is lost and maintained, guess what we have, a new set point. :smile:
  • waldo56
    waldo56 Posts: 1,861 Member
    Metabolism rises when you spend time consistently gaining weight.

    Granted this might be too much for these researchers to comprehend, and even moreso for most "weight loss" dieter, but the same processes that cause metabolism to fall (adaptive thermogensis, including the possible loss of brown fat) in the face of a consistent calorie deficit also causes it to rise in the face of a consistent calorie surplus.

    Include strength training and and periodic short weight loss periods to limit fat gain, but you can effectively cause your metabolism to rise quite a bit.

    Of course it'll make you look like Arnold if you're not careful.
  • waldo56
    waldo56 Posts: 1,861 Member
    Now I'm trying to bulk by adding 200 calories, but I don't seem to be gaining weight yet.

    It would be great if somebody could tell me what "set point" my body is using.

    There isn't one. It drifts up and down in response to your persistent energy state.

    What you are doing now is causing it to rise. You will have to keep raising your calories over time to continue to gain at the same rate.

    Long periods of gaining with short periods of losing will cause your metabolism to rise A LOT over time.
  • cmriverside
    cmriverside Posts: 34,421 Member
    lesigh

    http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/1077746-starvation-mode-adaptive-thermogenesis-and-weight-loss
  • Roaringgael
    Roaringgael Posts: 339 Member
    http://weightology.net/weightologyweekly/?page_id=415

    Yes there are things that impact on maintaining weight loss. Above explains it as well.
    For those who don't want to read it it says - 150cals/day thermodynamics and up to 500 cals/day exercise efficiency can be the variant for people who have lost weight compared to those who have not had to lose or didn't lose.
    Says to me that armed with the right information we can adjust what we do.
    Sounds more positive than - give up its not gonna work.
  • LiftAllThePizzas
    LiftAllThePizzas Posts: 17,857 Member
    Does Dr. Sandra Aamodt even lift? Clearly not. If she wants to give up and suck forever that's her loss.
  • mauridaher
    mauridaher Posts: 55 Member
    I don't buy it. This is exactly what I would be looking for if I had, say, fallen off the wagon.

    Of course, I'm not obese. I'm just slightly overweight and I'm trying to lose weight mainly for "aesthetic" reasons.

    I'm not saying you or anyone else should beat themselves up, but sometimes the lack of discipline and willpower is to blame, and not the human body or "their genetics".
  • Holly_Roman_Empire
    Holly_Roman_Empire Posts: 4,440 Member
    I see you lost your willpower again and are back on the excuse train. :ohwell:

    Yup. :yawn:
  • cmriverside
    cmriverside Posts: 34,421 Member
    So, OP, why do you have your daily calorie goal set at 1690 calories?

    You're a young male, and over 250?

    You should be eating a lot more on a daily basis. No wonder you have trouble with adherence.

    More links:

    http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/1080242-a-guide-to-get-you-started-on-your-path-to-sexypants

    http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/819055-setting-your-calorie-and-macro-targets


    edit to say, wait. Am I reading that this is your MO?

    Fine. Carry on with your bad self.
  • mauridaher
    mauridaher Posts: 55 Member
    Does Dr. Sandra Aamodt even lift? Clearly not. If she wants to give up and suck forever that's her loss.

    YEAH SUCK IT DOC!
  • thatjosiegirl
    thatjosiegirl Posts: 362 Member
    I watched this TED presentation last week and then rolled my eyes. As much as I love the TED Series this just didn't make any sense to me. Yes, we are bound to get hungry from time to time but it's all about reaching for fruits and vegetables and not crap food. Her theory assumes we are unable to choose what to eat and how much to eat, and that I just don't buy!
  • waldo56
    waldo56 Posts: 1,861 Member
    Does Dr. Sandra Aamodt even lift? Clearly not. If she wants to give up and suck forever that's her loss.

    Not only does she not lift, she apparently knows noone that partakes in such nonsense. She appears blissfully unaware of what occurs when one regularly lifts.
  • msf74
    msf74 Posts: 3,498 Member
    Dr. Aamodt suggests that our set points for storing body fat may be adjustable upwards but possibly are not adjustable downwards.

    Set points (a biological weight which we simply cannot shift as opposed to a settling point which can fluctuate both up and downwards and be manipulated certainly in the short term - say a number of years ) is a controversial subject.

    I do think there is some validity in the idea that the body gets used to a certain range which it seeks to protect making it much more difficult to lose or gain weight outside of that. However that does not mean it cannot be done.
  • ktsmom430
    ktsmom430 Posts: 1,100 Member
    Losing weight is eating less calories than you burn. Doable.

    The problem for most of us is keeping it off. That is where the failure statistics come in.

    Keeping active and constant monitoring is key to not reverting back to overeating.

    How bad do we want it. Simple, not easy.
  • likitisplit
    likitisplit Posts: 9,420 Member
    http://weightology.net/weightologyweekly/?page_id=415

    Yes there are things that impact on maintaining weight loss. Above explains it as well.
    For those who don't want to read it it says - 150cals/day thermodynamics and up to 500 cals/day exercise efficiency can be the variant for people who have lost weight compared to those who have not had to lose or didn't lose.
    Says to me that armed with the right information we can adjust what we do.
    Sounds more positive than - give up its not gonna work.

    I know that different people have different experiences, but I've been obese twice (for more than one year each time) and my resting metabolic rate is still mid-1700s. I eat back the MFP calories and they seem to be reasonably accurate for me.

    But, yeah. For whatever reason your metabolism might be slower (age, dieting, obesity, health issues) it's just a matter of adjusting what you do. And, if you have lower calorie needs, I doubt you're going to be hungry all the time.
  • SunofaBeach14
    SunofaBeach14 Posts: 4,899 Member
    I see you lost your willpower again and are back on the excuse train. :ohwell:

    Yep
  • mustgetmuscles1
    mustgetmuscles1 Posts: 3,346 Member
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  • David_AUS
    David_AUS Posts: 298 Member
    The body is amazingly adaptive and it will aim for the most efficient state to the stimulus it is given. The adaptive nature to stimulus is intertwined and complex involving psychology, physiology and biochemistry. Then there is weight loss / gain vs. fat loss gain - most of us initially focus on weight loss which is not what we are really targeting but works as a great rule of thumb which people can easily track and lets us at least find the path - diets are the same they should be used to help us find the path towards what we want from life.

    It is not dieting that fails per se it is that we try to use dieting as a tool to fix / improve or change ourselves, our "problem". As long as we see something as "work" and ancillary to what we do day to day and it is not integrated into our life we will eventually lose will power and "fail". This is why people here say so often it is a "life style" change, we can use diets to educate ourselves but ultimately we need to assess what we integrate to our daily living that will be realized in the longer term
  • ttx336
    ttx336 Posts: 7 Member
    Losing weight is eating less calories than you burn. Doable.

    The problem for most of us is keeping it off. That is where the failure statistics come in.

    Keeping active and constant monitoring is key to not reverting back to overeating.

    How bad do we want it. Simple, not easy.

    Gee Whiz! What she said ^^

    Seriously, could not have said it better, it is all about portion control and that is where this website shines. Get a food scale, use measuring cups, etc. and log what you eat, this works, but only IF you work it.

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