A calorie is not a calorie is not a calorie

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  • Hornsby
    Hornsby Posts: 10,322 Member
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    All I know is that I seem to lose weight no matter *what* I eat, so long as I eat a caloric deficit. I also know, however, that I FEEL a ton better when I'm eating healthy foods and not just getting my caloric intake from candy bars. I have more energy, get sick less frequently, am more patient, and my stomach doesn't gurgle and feel generally angry. So, yes, if my goal is to lose weight, I'll eat whatever I darn well please and ONLY pay attention to calories (a calorie is a calorie is a calorie). If, on the other hand, I want to FEEL good, I better eat foods that help my body function better (physically / psychologically / emotionally etc).

    I would think you would absolutely feel crappy if you got all your calories from candy bars. I can't believe you were willing to try that.
  • neanderthin
    neanderthin Posts: 9,970 Member
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    A low carbohydrate intake (low enough to cause ketosis) can increase this satiety advantage, but individual responses will vary. The best dietary approach for you will depend upon a variety of factors."

    Thoughts?

    NO. NO NO NO NO NO!

    WE MUST HAZ A ONE-SIZE-FITS-ALL SOLUTION.

    CLAIMING "IT'S DIFFERENT FOR DIFFERENT PEOPLE" WILL NEVER FLY.
    Can't be........it's all about calories,right? :bigsmile:
  • hitaks00
    hitaks00 Posts: 6 Member
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    Hello,

    I would have run the comparison using same Low Cal ( 1200 ) parameter but one group with Low Fat content and one group with High Fat content and see what the result would be.
    I did not go through all the papers but from the summary it seems apples to oranges rather than true comparison.
  • lizzardsm
    lizzardsm Posts: 271 Member
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    As a researcher (wrapping up my PhD now), my two cents is that whatever you do - start calculating effect sizes. Ask your adviser to teach you how. In fact, your project could be to just calculate the effect sizes of influential weight loss studies.

    Statistical significance is important to have but it doesn't mean that there's a meaningful effect within the population. An effect size will tell you that.
  • ndj1979
    ndj1979 Posts: 29,139 Member
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    so I see we are debating this for the billionth time....

    I guess this one never gets old..so in...
  • lizzardsm
    lizzardsm Posts: 271 Member
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    so I see we are debating this for the billionth time....

    I guess this one never gets old..so in...

    right?! i've gotta get off the forums...
  • raw_meal
    raw_meal Posts: 96 Member
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    Acg67 posted the following in this topic, did anyone read it?

    Increasing Protein, or Decreasing Carbohydrate…Which Gives You a Metabolic Advantage?

    http://weightology.net/weightologyweekly/?page_id=285

    It's conclusions were:
    "The Bottom Line

    The bottom line is that there is no metabolic advantage to a low carbohydrate intake that is independent of a high protein intake. There is a metabolic advantage to a high protein diet, which will increase the calories you burn by 80-100 calories per day. There is also a dramatic satiety advantage to a high protein intake. A low carbohydrate intake (low enough to cause ketosis) can increase this satiety advantage, but individual responses will vary. The best dietary approach for you will depend upon a variety of factors."

    Thoughts?

    When compared to the rest of the literature on the subject, esp studies controlling both calories and protein, there is not significantly different fat loss between low carb/keto diets and other higher carb diets

    If you could point me those papers I would really appreciate it! Again, trying to address anything that would require further research. So far I'm finding that there is a sig fat loss. Every other study I have read has speculated via computer predictions, or has evaluated its subject long term. Those that have done long term still see the most rapid decline in adiposity in the high fat diet subjects, but then the carb one eventually caught up. Which doesn't mean that the high fat is useless, it could still benefit people who need to get in shape ASAP.

    Presence or absence of carbohydrates and the proportion of fat in a high-protein diet affect appetite suppression but not energy expenditure in normal-weight human subjects fed in energy balance

    http://journals.cambridge.org/action/login;jsessionid=B69AFF098E076B189F25B781980BD018.journals

    Here is a write up of that study

    http://weightology.net/weightologyweekly/?page_id=285

    Here's a bunch of papers listed

    http://evilcyber.com/losing-weight/low-carb-keto-diet/

    Thoughts are that based on MFP rules that should be another thread.

    I concur it should get it's own thread, but it's also related to this topic and was posted here. It does support the OP topic "A calorie is not a calorie is not a calorie." It appeared to be ignored. The thread is focusing on KCAL=KCAL argument when this study and it's related studies indicate cal composition may matter.

    40% Carbs, 30% protein, 30% Fat burns more calories than a no carb diet according to the study and the other studies referenced support higher protein diets burn more calories.

    Take away to me is the body does not treat calories the same. News to me based on the KCAL=KCAL argument. I just started this calorie trip and forum interaction in the last year so my apologies if it is truly a hijack.
  • marshrowan
    marshrowan Posts: 64 Member
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    A calorie is indeed a calorie, but what the body does with it and how it reacts to it is very different!

    There is a good book out there called "the calorie myth...", by Jonathan Bailor that discusses exactly this statement.

    I personally strongly believe that it matters a lot WHAT we put into our bodies and not only how much.
    Stef.

    Exactly !!! I totally agree!!!
  • cwsreddy
    cwsreddy Posts: 998 Member
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    so I see we are debating this for the billionth time....

    I guess this one never gets old..so in...

    but you already posted once in this thread... are you in for the second time?
  • ndj1979
    ndj1979 Posts: 29,139 Member
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    so I see we are debating this for the billionth time....

    I guess this one never gets old..so in...

    but you already posted once in this thread... are you in for the second time?

    yes, but my first attempt was non-committal. I am now committed...
  • fast_eddie_72
    fast_eddie_72 Posts: 719 Member
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    7c06o.jpg

    Winner!
  • fast_eddie_72
    fast_eddie_72 Posts: 719 Member
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    A horse is a horse.
  • cwsreddy
    cwsreddy Posts: 998 Member
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    so I see we are debating this for the billionth time....

    I guess this one never gets old..so in...

    but you already posted once in this thread... are you in for the second time?

    yes, but my first attempt was non-committal. I am now committed...

    oh thank god.
  • mccindy72
    mccindy72 Posts: 7,001 Member
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    A horse is a horse.

    Nope, not true. There is a huge difference, genetically and structurally, between breeds.

    that's like saying a dog is a dog. A chihuahua is not a dog, that's a rodent.
  • mccindy72
    mccindy72 Posts: 7,001 Member
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    so I see we are debating this for the billionth time....

    I guess this one never gets old..so in...

    but you already posted once in this thread... are you in for the second time?

    yes, but my first attempt was non-committal. I am now committed...

    oh thank god.

    That's what I say, I'm always happier when ndj is committed to a thread.
  • fast_eddie_72
    fast_eddie_72 Posts: 719 Member
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    A horse is a horse.

    Nope, not true. There is a huge difference, genetically and structurally, between breeds.

    that's like saying a dog is a dog. A chihuahua is not a dog, that's a rodent.

    Of course. Of course.
  • hkristine1
    hkristine1 Posts: 950 Member
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    All I know is that I seem to lose weight no matter *what* I eat, so long as I eat a caloric deficit. I also know, however, that I FEEL a ton better when I'm eating healthy foods and not just getting my caloric intake from candy bars. I have more energy, get sick less frequently, am more patient, and my stomach doesn't gurgle and feel generally angry. So, yes, if my goal is to lose weight, I'll eat whatever I darn well please and ONLY pay attention to calories (a calorie is a calorie is a calorie). If, on the other hand, I want to FEEL good, I better eat foods that help my body function better (physically / psychologically / emotionally etc).

    I feel really good when I eat a candy bar. I only eat a small amount of one once in a while and I get a great deal of enjoyment from it.


    Oh, me too!! I have some form of "dessert" almost every night - whether it be a small candy bar, or a cookie or whatever... I just meant, if that's ALL I ate, even if I was in a calorie deficit, I'd be losing weight but feel like garbage! I am a strong advocate of sweets (in moderation!).
  • hkristine1
    hkristine1 Posts: 950 Member
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    All I know is that I seem to lose weight no matter *what* I eat, so long as I eat a caloric deficit. I also know, however, that I FEEL a ton better when I'm eating healthy foods and not just getting my caloric intake from candy bars. I have more energy, get sick less frequently, am more patient, and my stomach doesn't gurgle and feel generally angry. So, yes, if my goal is to lose weight, I'll eat whatever I darn well please and ONLY pay attention to calories (a calorie is a calorie is a calorie). If, on the other hand, I want to FEEL good, I better eat foods that help my body function better (physically / psychologically / emotionally etc).

    I would think you would absolutely feel crappy if you got all your calories from candy bars. I can't believe you were willing to try that.

    There was a period of time, in which my diet consisted primarily of 1) mountain dew 2) cheetos; 3) snack size candy bars; and hot dogs with mustard (no bun). And this was a time when I was on "weight watchers" (well, not going to the support group, but doing points). I was within my calorie intake and losing weight, but I did feel like absolute crap. My stomach started hurting ALL THE TIME. (duh - but I was young, dumb, and didn't take my health very seriously - obviously). I don't recommend that diet at all... even though I liked how my clothes fit. ha.
  • Camish911
    Camish911 Posts: 150 Member
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    Very interesting read so thanks for sharing. That fits with the two doctors and certified nutritionist who told me I should be eating low carb. I'm insulin resistant though so maybe that wouldn't be the best recommendation for everyone, but based on that article it certainly looks like anyone who is actively trying to lose weight should be low carb at least part of the time. Perhaps try carb cycling? (Google it) Carbs are frequently made up of highly-processed foods that we probably shouldn't be eating anyway.

    BTW I probably won't be checking back to see if anyone actually responds to this so if you have a negative comment to make then don't bother, because I won't see it.
  • mccindy72
    mccindy72 Posts: 7,001 Member
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    Very interesting read so thanks for sharing. That fits with the two doctors and certified nutritionist who told me I should be eating low carb. I'm insulin resistant though so maybe that wouldn't be the best recommendation for everyone, but based on that article it certainly looks like anyone who is actively trying to lose weight should be low carb at least part of the time. Perhaps try carb cycling? (Google it) Carbs are frequently made up of highly-processed foods that we probably shouldn't be eating anyway.

    BTW I probably won't be checking back to see if anyone actually responds to this so if you have a negative comment to make then don't bother, because I won't see it.

    Hey look, I'm going to make a controversial comment I know people will disagree with and then promise not to check back! Whatever.

    Carbs are made of highly processed foods we shouldn't be eating?
    so no more fruit.

    got it.

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