TOTALLY Overwhelmed Newbie HERE

swheart4981
swheart4981 Posts: 16 Member
in Health and Weight Loss
OK, so this is for myself, my husband, and my Mom.

I am totally overwhelmed because I have tried to read ALL the pined "READ FIRST" posts, and I am quite sure my brain is close to exploding!

My husband weighs 296 lbs, his job is quite active (squatting up and down/ arms up and down for 5 to 8 hrs) His calories are an INSANE (pretty sure it's like 2700 or close) So I read that if you take in LESS than that amount you will either NOT lose or you will lose from muscle, but we are running into two issues.

1. How the heck do you eat THAT MANY calories in a healthy way? I mean we can pull it off EASY at Mcdonalds but we all know that will get you no where!!

2. How do you eat that much, and keep you sodium intake low! Today his sodium was OVER 3000mg (mine was 2,656! Taco Bell's bean burrito, which I thought would be OK, was INSANE at 1050mg for ONE!! AND I was still hungry!)

I cook a lot, and I DON"T add salt EVER, never have! We eat A boat load of veggies and fruits!
We use whole grain breads, Oats, and cereals! BUT, we are POOR!
We do not qualify for any assistance.
There are four people in my household the 3 listed above, and my 14 year old son (who is not over weight) I spent $130 in grocerys on Wednesday, that are already almost half way gone (fresh veggies, and fruits fresh & canned)

THEN I read that if I work out, I have to eat MORE (My husband is good with not working out, I have to BEG to get him to go for a walk because he is so wore out from working!!! Honestly, I either feel starved, or like a cow grazing ALL DAY!

I am not discouraged, but I don't know what to do. I got pretty close to my 1700 todays (now yesterdays) I should have eaten 65 more calories, but that's JUST for the 1700 NOT including the 1 mile mod pace walking my horse dog exercising I did. Mom's about on par with me minus the dog and at a slower pace. But we didn't eat EXTRA calories to make up for the walking :(

My husband pulls in maybe 500 more than me, so he is almost 500 short but SODIUM & CARBS are not working!

OK, I'm sorry for ranting, and I am SURE had I read for 2 hours MORE than I already HAD I would have found the answers, but my eyes are burning, and I am totally out of juice for the day!! I hope I gave you all the info you will need to advise me. PLEASE HELP :(

Replies

  • November_Fire
    November_Fire Posts: 165 Member
    MFP's worst feature is it's dumb little warnings about 'starvation mode', some sort of magical thing whereby if you eat too little you don't lose weight. If that were true, Anorexics would look like everyone else. If you eat too little, you lose weight. If you do extreme starvation prison-camp style some things might happen to your body, sure, but those things are not going to affect a normal, dieting person who is consuming food daily.

    So. You eat less than you burn. If he burns 2700, he eats 2200. Or 2300. So long as it's less it's fine - lower number, faster weight loss. You achieve this through home-cooking meat, vegetables and low amounts of carbs - they're not bad or anything, but you want to try and get good levels of protein in your diet, so don't blow all your calorie budget on carbs - and not Taco Bells (junk food will never have 'OK' amounts of nutrients :) ) If you're still under calorie, add cheese to something. Your fruit and cooking oil and butter will all add up, so you'll be surprised at how easily you can hit your goals. Get your daily recommendation of protein (about 0.8g of protein per pound of your weight.)

    MFP's second source of confusion is about eating more if you work out. Activity levels have already been counted in the figures - your husband's exercise has already been accounted for in his 2700 figure, so he should just eat less than that and start burning. Inactive beginners will not be burning huge amounts (walking a mile is, on average and not accounting for height/weight, about 65 calories). And the amounts aren't that big brning 300 on cardio is something easily erased by a snack bar and a sugary drink on the way out of the gym. Eating half of those calories back - 150, say - is easy to do, but what you're really doing with cardio is widening that deficit. So if you burn 1700 and eat 1400 (my numbers), but do a 300 cal bike ride, you're now in a position of burning 2000 and eating 1400. So I can eat a bit more and still be less than my burn. How much you want to eat back is up to you. A 600 deficit nets you more weight loss than a 200 one! But someone who runs a marathon and is 1000 cals wider should probably eat some more back. So yes you eat some extra calories, but it's still a number's game, not just 'eating more and more!' because that'll easily put you over your daily goal and you'll gain weight. Even if I do a 450 cal bike ride, that could easily be wiped out by a couple of biscuits and a banana. Exercise for strength. So that when the fat sheds you look good and so that any muscle loss is minimised by strengthening them.
  • amusedmonkey
    amusedmonkey Posts: 10,330 Member
    If you go by "activity level" you don't have to eat back exercise calories. If you want to eat back some of your exercise calories or if you want to be more precise, you would set activity level at the lowest and count exercise separately.
  • xsmilexforxmex
    xsmilexforxmex Posts: 1,216 Member
    MFP's worst feature is it's dumb little warnings about 'starvation mode', some sort of magical thing whereby if you eat too little you don't lose weight. If that were true, Anorexics would look like everyone else. If you eat too little, you lose weight. If you do extreme starvation prison-camp style some things might happen to your body, sure, but those things are not going to affect a normal, dieting person who is consuming food daily.

    Starvation mode is misunderstood on this forum often. Anorexia causes your muscles to deteroriate, your internal organs to eventually shut down, and your metabolism to crash. When you do not eat enough to meet your BMR for an extended period of time, the same thing can happen. HOWEVER, most people on here don't need to worry about that because their body has enough stored to burn for awhile.

    That being said, If you're brand new to this, my advice is to take it slow. Sure, you want to change and jump in to it, but habits take 21 days to form and they're even harder to break. If you're having trouble meeting your calorie goal, it's because you've switched your diet and are no longer eating the same calorie dense foods you were before - afterall, there's a reason you're here and it's not your perfect diet. If you've already made these changes and it's significantly different than your previous diet, there's a good chance you'll be hungry and lethargic after a few days to a few weeks. But those changes are not necessary for weight loss alone, you can easily eat the same things you were, just smaller portions. Maybe mix both in? Eat what you want, but eat a single or half portion. Share it. Add a simple side salad (lettuce and veggies with a light single serving or dressing) to help fill you up since you're having less than you're used to. Drink more water. These are changes that lead to healthier habits and eventually you can begin eating to fuel your body.
    Dont stress over the excercise calories if it overwhelms you right now.. just follow your goal, if you're hungry still on days you work out, you have the extra to eat more.

    Good luck!
  • Sobus76
    Sobus76 Posts: 242 Member
    Only way i've found to keep my sodium down (which isnt easy) dont eat things out of boxes or cans.

    also, when i started my doctor set me at 2000 calories MFP had me at around 2700, i work on an assembly line for 10-11hrs a day and at this point MFP has me at 2100, i still dont eat that many even when i work out. im usually around 1800.
  • jayb0ne
    jayb0ne Posts: 644 Member
    In my opinion, the hierarchy of needs in terms of nutrition are as follows in order of importance:

    Calories in vs calories out - or 'are you eating less than you're expending?'
    If it fits your macros - or 'is your Protein/Fat/Carbs split on point?'
    Sweat the small stuff - or 'Vitamins and minerals = micro nutrients'

    My advice is not to think about the next one down in the pyramid until you've got the one above it sorted out.

    No point having a perfect macro split but going 1000 calories over or under your target.

    No point meeting your RDA of all the vitamins if you're getting 60% daily fat.

    Once you can meet your calorie goal within 100 calories consistently every day, then start thinking about which foods you can switch out to lower your fat or increase your protein etc without upsetting the daily calorie goal. Once you've got your daily calorie goal almost exactly within the macro split you're looking for, focus on your vitamin intake, your fiber levels, sodium, etc.

    Once you've done that, you've pretty much mastered your nutritional intake - but don't forget, you can always take steps back down the ladder. Fancy some ice cream or pizza for a treat and can't fit it in your macros? Can you fit it into your calorie goal? You're good to go! :)

    Hope that helps some!
  • amusedmonkey
    amusedmonkey Posts: 10,330 Member
    In my opinion, the hierarchy of needs in terms of nutrition are as follows in order of importance:

    Calories in vs calories out - or 'are you eating less than you're expending?'
    If it fits your macros - or 'is your Protein/Fat/Carbs split on point?'
    Sweat the small stuff - or 'Vitamins and minerals = micro nutrients'

    My advice is not to think about the next one down in the pyramid until you've got the one above it sorted out.

    No point having a perfect macro split but going 1000 calories over or under your target.

    No point meeting your RDA of all the vitamins if you're getting 60% daily fat.

    Once you can meet your calorie goal within 100 calories consistently every day, then start thinking about which foods you can switch out to lower your fat or increase your protein etc without upsetting the daily calorie goal. Once you've got your daily calorie goal almost exactly within the macro split you're looking for, focus on your vitamin intake, your fiber levels, sodium, etc.

    Once you've done that, you've pretty much mastered your nutritional intake - but don't forget, you can always take steps back down the ladder. Fancy some ice cream or pizza for a treat and can't fit it in your macros? Can you fit it into your calorie goal? You're good to go! :)

    Hope that helps some!

    I actually consider 2 to be almost the same as1. You can't really go 1000 above or under if you have a perfect macro split.. because macros is where the calories come from!

    That said, managing calories is easier than managing macros, so I pretty much agree with the hierarchy. Good advice. Start small and you will get there :)
  • swheart4981
    swheart4981 Posts: 16 Member
    Before we ate a lot of Hamburger Helpers with ground turkey. We haven't used ground beef in year, but we would fix two boxes for 4 people. One box has 5 servings.

    Lunches are difficult for me right now. I thought I had done good because fat free smoked turkey only has 50 calories, but I didn't pay attention to the sodium until MFP highlighted it in bright RED that we went OVER by a lot!

    So pretty much any fast food is OUT huh? That sucks!!!
  • jayb0ne
    jayb0ne Posts: 644 Member
    In my opinion, the hierarchy of needs in terms of nutrition are as follows in order of importance:

    Calories in vs calories out - or 'are you eating less than you're expending?'
    If it fits your macros - or 'is your Protein/Fat/Carbs split on point?'
    Sweat the small stuff - or 'Vitamins and minerals = micro nutrients'

    My advice is not to think about the next one down in the pyramid until you've got the one above it sorted out.

    No point having a perfect macro split but going 1000 calories over or under your target.

    No point meeting your RDA of all the vitamins if you're getting 60% daily fat.

    Once you can meet your calorie goal within 100 calories consistently every day, then start thinking about which foods you can switch out to lower your fat or increase your protein etc without upsetting the daily calorie goal. Once you've got your daily calorie goal almost exactly within the macro split you're looking for, focus on your vitamin intake, your fiber levels, sodium, etc.

    Once you've done that, you've pretty much mastered your nutritional intake - but don't forget, you can always take steps back down the ladder. Fancy some ice cream or pizza for a treat and can't fit it in your macros? Can you fit it into your calorie goal? You're good to go! :)

    Hope that helps some!

    I actually consider 2 to be almost the same as1. You can't really go 1000 above or under if you have a perfect macro split.. because macros is where the calories come from!

    That said, managing calories is easier than managing macros, so I pretty much agree with the hierarchy. Good advice. Start small and you will get there :)

    Granted, a correct macro split usually comes hand in hand with a correct calorie goal... I'm more thinking of the folk who worry about macro's too early and stop eating hundreds of calories short because they've hit their carb allowance for the day - don't worry about it! Just get the calories right first, then figure out how to adjust to come under your carbs/fat etc each day.
  • swheart4981
    swheart4981 Posts: 16 Member
    But isn't the sodium a big deal in weight loss, causing your body to retain water thus not loosing? And Carbs turn into sugar and is stored faster? I could be totally off base, But how I am understanding it is more protein, meats eggs, cheese?? (is cheese protein?) And bean, but beans have a lot of carbs too?

    Yeah totally LOVE your plan!!! FOCUS on CALORIES!!! :)
  • jayb0ne
    jayb0ne Posts: 644 Member
    Before we ate a lot of Hamburger Helpers with ground turkey. We haven't used ground beef in year, but we would fix two boxes for 4 people. One box has 5 servings.

    Lunches are difficult for me right now. I thought I had done good because fat free smoked turkey only has 50 calories, but I didn't pay attention to the sodium until MFP highlighted it in bright RED that we went OVER by a lot!

    So pretty much any fast food is OUT huh? That sucks!!!

    Don't worry about the sodium as a newbie, you'll tie yourself in circles. Get the calories right first, then the macro's, then the micro's. Sodium comes in under micro's so you're a way off worrying about it just yet...
  • amusedmonkey
    amusedmonkey Posts: 10,330 Member
    In my opinion, the hierarchy of needs in terms of nutrition are as follows in order of importance:

    Calories in vs calories out - or 'are you eating less than you're expending?'
    If it fits your macros - or 'is your Protein/Fat/Carbs split on point?'
    Sweat the small stuff - or 'Vitamins and minerals = micro nutrients'

    My advice is not to think about the next one down in the pyramid until you've got the one above it sorted out.

    No point having a perfect macro split but going 1000 calories over or under your target.

    No point meeting your RDA of all the vitamins if you're getting 60% daily fat.

    Once you can meet your calorie goal within 100 calories consistently every day, then start thinking about which foods you can switch out to lower your fat or increase your protein etc without upsetting the daily calorie goal. Once you've got your daily calorie goal almost exactly within the macro split you're looking for, focus on your vitamin intake, your fiber levels, sodium, etc.

    Once you've done that, you've pretty much mastered your nutritional intake - but don't forget, you can always take steps back down the ladder. Fancy some ice cream or pizza for a treat and can't fit it in your macros? Can you fit it into your calorie goal? You're good to go! :)

    Hope that helps some!

    I actually consider 2 to be almost the same as1. You can't really go 1000 above or under if you have a perfect macro split.. because macros is where the calories come from!

    That said, managing calories is easier than managing macros, so I pretty much agree with the hierarchy. Good advice. Start small and you will get there :)

    Brain dead today. Sorry, retracting the macro talk. I count my macros by grams not by % which caused this confusion. Either way, starting small and step by step is the least overwhelming way to go. Good luck!
  • fridainthesky
    fridainthesky Posts: 9
    Before we ate a lot of Hamburger Helpers with ground turkey. We haven't used ground beef in year, but we would fix two boxes for 4 people. One box has 5 servings.

    Lunches are difficult for me right now. I thought I had done good because fat free smoked turkey only has 50 calories, but I didn't pay attention to the sodium until MFP highlighted it in bright RED that we went OVER by a lot!

    So pretty much any fast food is OUT huh? That sucks!!!

    Don't worry about the sodium as a newbie, you'll tie yourself in circles. Get the calories right first, then the macro's, then the micro's. Sodium comes in under micro's so you're a way off worrying about it just yet...

    Thank you - some seriously sound advice here. Very helpful :smile:
  • sbarella
    sbarella Posts: 713 Member
    Don't worry about the sodium as a newbie, you'll tie yourself in circles. Get the calories right first, then the macro's, then the micro's. Sodium comes in under micro's so you're a way off worrying about it just yet...
    +1, unless you have very high blood pressure that needs to be taken care of asap.
    Take your time to make the progression (worrying about calories --> looking at the macros ---> micros) and take it with a grain of salt, you can't be 100% perfect every day. I'm usually slightly under my fat goal and slightly over my carbs goal, but it's not a big deal. A red number doesn't mean you're going to die :)
  • amusedmonkey
    amusedmonkey Posts: 10,330 Member
    But isn't the sodium a big deal in weight loss, causing your body to retain water thus not loosing? And Carbs turn into sugar and is stored faster? I could be totally off base, But how I am understanding it is more protein, meats eggs, cheese?? (is cheese protein?) And bean, but beans have a lot of carbs too?

    Yeah totally LOVE your plan!!! FOCUS on CALORIES!!! :)

    Water weight is not the same as "not losing". It's just an extra 5 or so pounds that comes and goes as your body goes through certain processes. It's not real fat gain, just a natural fluctuation. It's best to focus on your overall "trend" loss. Example: week one, lost 3 pounds. Week 2: lost 2 pounds. Week 3: lost 1 pound. Week 4: GAINED 1.5 pound. Your overall trend would be losing 4.5 pounds that month! It means what you did was working! If your trend is going up instead of down, you will need to investigate where the extra calories are coming from.
  • heybales
    heybales Posts: 18,842 Member
    OK, so this is for myself, my husband, and my Mom.

    I am totally overwhelmed because I have tried to read ALL the pined "READ FIRST" posts, and I am quite sure my brain is close to exploding!

    My husband weighs 296 lbs, his job is quite active (squatting up and down/ arms up and down for 5 to 8 hrs) His calories are an INSANE (pretty sure it's like 2700 or close) So I read that if you take in LESS than that amount you will either NOT lose or you will lose from muscle, but we are running into two issues.

    1. How the heck do you eat THAT MANY calories in a healthy way? I mean we can pull it off EASY at Mcdonalds but we all know that will get you no where!!

    2. How do you eat that much, and keep you sodium intake low! Today his sodium was OVER 3000mg (mine was 2,656! Taco Bell's bean burrito, which I thought would be OK, was INSANE at 1050mg for ONE!! AND I was still hungry!)

    I cook a lot, and I DON"T add salt EVER, never have! We eat A boat load of veggies and fruits!
    We use whole grain breads, Oats, and cereals! BUT, we are POOR!
    We do not qualify for any assistance.
    There are four people in my household the 3 listed above, and my 14 year old son (who is not over weight) I spent $130 in grocerys on Wednesday, that are already almost half way gone (fresh veggies, and fruits fresh & canned)

    THEN I read that if I work out, I have to eat MORE (My husband is good with not working out, I have to BEG to get him to go for a walk because he is so wore out from working!!! Honestly, I either feel starved, or like a cow grazing ALL DAY!

    I am not discouraged, but I don't know what to do. I got pretty close to my 1700 todays (now yesterdays) I should have eaten 65 more calories, but that's JUST for the 1700 NOT including the 1 mile mod pace walking my horse dog exercising I did. Mom's about on par with me minus the dog and at a slower pace. But we didn't eat EXTRA calories to make up for the walking :(

    My husband pulls in maybe 500 more than me, so he is almost 500 short but SODIUM & CARBS are not working!

    OK, I'm sorry for ranting, and I am SURE had I read for 2 hours MORE than I already HAD I would have found the answers, but my eyes are burning, and I am totally out of juice for the day!! I hope I gave you all the info you will need to advise me. PLEASE HELP :(

    Incredible to think how much you both used to eat and how much you used to spend on food probably.

    Being honest, you know you didn't get to this point eating less than that. While you may have no concept of calorie levels to really compare to, I'll bet those numbers are actually low.

    Look at the MFP Home - Goals page for calories burned in normal activity.
    If you selected the right non-exercise activity level for both of you (and that's what it is, non-exercise), then that is closer to your maintenance level.
    That is what you were eating daily or a tad more if still gaining weight.

    Reset your definition of "healthy" and what foods can't be eaten - it'll get you in to trouble usually.

    Like Almonds - good fat. tad expensive too though. Peanut butter? Just confirm you weigh a serving, not measure it, since calorie dense.
    You can easily reach goal.

    The concern isn't that you won't lose eating less than goal - the real concern shown in studies as that if your body doesn't like a bigger deficit you are creating, it will adapt and slow down, meaning you will no longer be burning what you think you are burning.
    So now you have to eat even less calories - which at this point you may view very positively, eating even less is needed to keep the same weight loss up.
    But do the math to the end game - usually it's about 100 calories less for every 10 lbs lost.
    If your body slows down and you have to eat 500 less than what could have been possible, and then you take your 1000 calories off, now where is the eating level?
    Sustainable, adherable?
  • heybales
    heybales Posts: 18,842 Member
    But isn't the sodium a big deal in weight loss, causing your body to retain water thus not loosing? And Carbs turn into sugar and is stored faster? I could be totally off base, But how I am understanding it is more protein, meats eggs, cheese?? (is cheese protein?) And bean, but beans have a lot of carbs too?

    Yeah totally LOVE your plan!!! FOCUS on CALORIES!!! :)

    Excess carbs, and protein, and fat, will all get stored as fat.

    But you are in a diet, there won't be excess.

    Carbs turn into glucose, and are sent first to top off the liver stores, and then muscle stores, and then used for immediate energy needs for up to 2-4 hrs after the meal. Then anything extra is stored as fat.

    Same with protein, whatever can be used right then is, if not needed then converted to glucose, same as above then.

    Fat is just used for immediate energy needs and then sent to be stored.

    But that end game all happens much less being in a diet - so no concern.

    Eating more carbs may make it harder for you personally though - you may get sugar rush, high insulin spike, then low blood sugar, and now 2-3 hrs after eating you are hungry again, when really you did eat enough.

    Or you don't eat enough, and your workouts that are supposed to be hard are wimpy because you don't have enough quick energy for hard exercise.

    Beans are incomplete protein, do some reading with proper mix ratios so the protein is actually usable from them. Cheese is protein. Start reading nutrition labels. Go look at everything in the fridge and cupboards right now actually, sounds like you might be very unfamiliar with what's in what.
    And while looking notice that serving size is accurately by weight, same as calories is by weight, 1 gram of carbs and protein and 4 calories, 1 gram of fat is 9 calories.
    measuring sizes is for convenience only, and NOT accurate, hence the "about 2 servings" and such you'll find, if you go by say cups.
    But divide the package weight in grams by the serving size in grams and discover how many servings exactly.
  • WaterBunnie
    WaterBunnie Posts: 1,371 Member
    Dependent upon what you are doing the rest of the day there is no need to log a mile walk as exercise. I wear a fitbit and get nothing on top of sedentary calories unless I've walked at least 3-4 miles across the day.
  • GeapetCore
    GeapetCore Posts: 32 Member
    Hi - I just sent you a friend request. I started MFP right after Christmas. I do have a problem with my heart and I have to watch sodium. Like it was suggested by others, start tracking your food and then worry about sodium. I did that and have been able to reduce the sodium gradually (well, quickly reduced it once I dropped fast food, but slowly after). I find it sort of amusing what food has sodium in it already like almond milk. I never would have given that a thought previously but now I do.

    To your one question - it can be easy to eat that many calories in a healthy way. Weigh everything...you are probably eating more than you realize to some extent. My favorite saying lately is how sad I am to find out just how little one ounce of cheese is and I never at that as a serving size before.

    As for walking, track the distance you covered and how long it took you. When I first stared out, I thought I rode the stationary bike at a "moderate" pace sinceI was so tired and sweaty afterwards. Turns out it was "leisurely" pace and I was burning fewer calories than expected. I Googled exercise and found out that only when I hit 12 MPH did it count as moderate (generally, some websites were different but that was the majority).

    Finally, veggies are expensive. I am drawing a blank on what its called but I lived in a town that had a community "farm" (not the word I am looking for) where you help plant and grow the veggies and all members then get the produce. Also, not sure where you live but Kroger is the grocery store I go to. I love how they discount veggies close to their expiration date, including bagged lettuce. We typically buy what is on sale. And frozen veggies are always so much better than canned veggies and those go on sale quite regularly.

    Finally, think of it as an investment - you change the oil in your car to help it run better...you need to eat better to be more healthy.

    Best of luck!

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