another 'wondering why we're here/fat acceptance' thread

Your argument for health is valid, but if we lived every second with the fear of disabling illness, we'd all be out at every anti-pollution rally we could find. Come to think of it, I see no downside to this.

But shaming Edna to the point she doesn't come out of her apartment doesn't work either.

I take care of 2 elderly relatives who are crippled physically, on all sorts of medications, have all sorts of health issues, and have since they were in their 60s.

They've never been overweight a day in either of their lives. So, maybe they owe me better? But their size certainly didn't impact anything.

Edit: They also never smoked and neither have had a sip of alcohol in their lives (honestly, I think they'd be in better health if they had had some wine ).


My thoughts on the subject are that if someone is related to you or extremely close to you, and their health concerns you, what they weigh - be it 'too much' or 'too little' - is something that you have the right to care about. A perfect stranger, however, does not have the obligation to be aesthetically pleasing to you, and at the end of the day, you have no idea what their story is. This goes for people who find some folks too fat, or some too thin, or people who say things like, "You have such a great body, it's a shame you cover it up!" to really conservative people, and so force.

Basically, without some kind of background, I don't see why anyone has the right to judge and shame people for their bodies, be they very large bodies or very skinny ones.

THIS IS ALL JUST BLAHBLABHBLABH TALKING -AND WISHING WE LIVED IN A PERFECT WORLD. IT'S THEORY AND SPECULATION WITH LITTLE BASIS IN THE LIVES OF ACTUAL PEOPLE...PLEASE STOP HERE IF YOU'RE VERY SENSITIVE ABOUT YOUR DIET JOURNEY..

But shaming Edna to the point she doesn't come out of her apartment doesn't work either.

ultimately, isn't it Edna's responsibility? to weigh easing the burden on Tracy when Edna hits 80 years old, or let shame immobilize her?

My graphic imagination right now is picturing the 80year old Edna/Harvey, bedridden with multiple diseases all exacerbated by her weight... trying to flip her for hygiene. ... it's not a pretty picture.

it makes for a funny, really hysterical line in the show, but really, we are all trying to stop our knives and forks after a reasonable amount of food intake. Since we never did before, we're HERE at mfp. Now I'm on to FLOTUS... GO MICHELLE.. education will be key...

I am curious as to the limits of this...

Would this general philosophy also cover ignorant people, who through a refusal to learn basic facts or apply sound reasoning skills, impose a real, ongoing burden to large numbers of people every day?

I wonder what that kind of righteous crusade would look like?

my main point is I don't think there is a major disease state that isn't exacerbated by obesity and that should enter into everyone's awareness.

No I totally understand that, trust me. The thing is though, there are plenty of people who laugh and point and shame people who are overweight but are *fine* - and I'm not talking about morbid obesity, I'm talking someone like me (or 10-20lbs larger than me). I mean, I weigh 165lbs and I am 5'4". I am 20ish pounds overweight. Physically, I am in the best shape ever - strength-wise, cardiovascularly, and so forth, even compared to when I was 145lbs and in the healthy range a few years ago. I'm a size 12. My body fat percentage is around 35% - considered very fat/obese. EDIT Not that I think it's right to laugh, point or shame someone who is morbidly obese, either! If your opinion comes from anywhere other than concern - that being you find someone ugly or unappealing or just plain ol' hate fat people - anyone remember that episode of SVU, titled aptly, "Fat"? - you really should just STFU. I went to school with someone who hated fat people, last year. It was a terrible experience.

But like, I'm fine. Seriously. My blood pressure is perfect. My lungs are healing from smoking (which did far more damage to me than being fat ever did, and I was totally stupid to smoke, I get that). I don't consider myself fat any more, but by many peoples' standards, I'm still a heifer. If someone still has good health (even at 215lbs, I had perfect blood pressure by some miracle!), and they're fine with their weight, I just don't see why anyone else needs to be concerned. Now, when I was 215lbs and smoking, I may have been surprisingly healthy, but my knees hurt (like you mentioned with the baseball player), my boobs were way too big (losing 2 cup sizes has been one of my favorite parts of the journey!), and my ankles would swell. So my health was in no way optimal. I had to lose weight to feel better. Being obese was a problem for me. And so, I did lose weight. I still have 25lbs to go to goal. 35 more pounds would be even better.

But if I stopped right now, still 'fat' by many peoples' standards, it would not adversely affect my health in any way. It would be purely aestethic. I'm changing because I want to, but if I didn't, it wouldn't be anyone's business, is my point.

Obesity carries health risks, true. I rarely hear anyone argue otherwise. BUT:

1. You can't tell someone's health by looking at them, or by a number on the scale. I am obese, but according to every test they can do I'm off-the-charts healthy - whereas my normal weight roommate has loads of chronic health problems.

2. Their health is none of your business anyways. A grown-*kitten* adult can make their own decisions about their own health.

3. Alienating or mocking people for their size is not only cruel, it is also damaging. The constant stress and shame of being bullied does real harm, both psychological and physical.

The "fat acceptance" movement is pushing for a world in which people are not bullied for being fat. Part of that is acknowledging in media that fat people can be successful, smart, kind, happy people. We all know it's true, so the real question is why are we trying to hide it in the name of public health? Because we think people need to be shamed into changing.

I don't know about you, but I don't think shame is an effective motivation for change. Shame and self-hatred are crippling emotions. Loving yourself, confidence, positive goals in life... those are much more sustainable motivations. I made the choice to lose weight because of internal reasons, not because others pushed me to do it.

THIS IS ALL JUST BLAHBLABHBLABH TALKING -AND WISHING WE LIVED IN A PERFECT WORLD. IT'S THEORY AND SPECULATION WITH LITTLE BASIS IN THE LIVES OF ACTUAL PEOPLE...PLEASE STOP HERE IF YOU'RE VERY SENSITIVE ABOUT YOUR DIET JOURNEY..

But shaming Edna to the point she doesn't come out of her apartment doesn't work either.

ultimately, isn't it Edna's responsibility? to weigh easing the burden on Tracy when Edna hits 80 years old, or let shame immobilize her?

My graphic imagination right now is picturing the 80year old Edna/Harvey, bedridden with multiple diseases all exacerbated by her weight... trying to flip her for hygiene. ... it's not a pretty picture.

it makes for a funny, really hysterical line in the show, but really, we are all trying to stop our knives and forks after a reasonable amount of food intake. Since we never did before, we're HERE at mfp. Now I'm on to FLOTUS... GO MICHELLE.. education will be key...

I am curious as to the limits of this...

Would this general philosophy also cover ignorant people, who through a refusal to learn basic facts or apply sound reasoning skills, impose a real, ongoing burden to large numbers of people every day?

I wonder what that kind of righteous crusade would look like?

Wire link fence around the state of ND?