Is it unreasonable (a vent)?
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I would never expect anyone, neighbor or friend to work at my house for free. Asking advice is one thing, expecting them to do free work is another. I would at least offer to pay and if you said no, you could expect a thank you note along with a gift card in your mailbox.0
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I know this problem. I'm an artist and I do portraits for extra cash. People are always asking me to do artwork for them for free. They usually imply that it'll be "fun" for me and I think that's the justification for not wanting to pay. I used to just go along with it but it got kind of ridiculous so now I just say "sure, I'd love to do that for you. It'll cost about $60," or whatever it is. The only time it's been a problem was with my mother-in-law, who wanted me to illustrate an entire children's book for her. I just explained to her how much time it would take for me to oblige. I broke it down into steps and told her how many hours each step would take.
My grandparents are musicians and they get the same kind of requests about playing weddings for free.
People can be rude. You have to learn to be firm or they're just going to keep doing it.0 -
Yup, this. If your neighbors are chatting with each other. The story goes around about the nice plumber who fixes things for free. Put a stop to it now.
But it's not even that they don't pay - it's that they don't OFFER to pay. We have this cute little retired nun neighbor and we never let her pay - she offers every time.
These aren't huge jobs - like changing hose bibs, or determining where a sewer leak is, or snaking a toilet.
I feel like getting upset over a lack of a gesture is really, incredibly silly on my part.
But that's just it. If they have been chatting with each other. Maybe they are thinking if so-and-so doesn't pay, then I shouldn't have to. It does seem really strange to me that they wouldn't offer. I offered to pay my neighbor for shoveling my walk in the winter. I will find some way to pay her back, probably a gift certificate from somewhere. It's a polite and appropriate thing to offer compensation of some type.
BTW, I forgot the quote of the post I was referring to. :blushing: It was this one.My reply would probably be, "sure I can come by and give you a quote." I'll give you a discount of course since you're a friend/neighbor.0 -
I know this problem. I'm an artist and I do portraits for extra cash. People are always asking me to do artwork for them for free. They usually imply that it'll be "fun" for me and I think that's the justification for not wanting to pay. I used to just go along with it but it got kind of ridiculous so now I just say "sure, I'd love to do that for you. It'll cost about $60," or whatever it is. The only time it's been a problem was with my mother-in-law, who wanted me to illustrate an entire children's book for her. I just explained to her how much time it would take for me to oblige. I broke it down into steps and told her how many hours each step would take.
My grandparents are musicians and they get the same kind of requests about playing weddings for free.
People can be rude. You have to learn to be firm or they're just going to keep doing it.
I would really like a free portrait of my dog, she growls and bites everyone but me, but think of how challenging it will be to capture her true puppy nature!
The exactly same thing happens to me as a photographer -- oh, bring your camera you xyz social event, it will be SO fun! I've had people say "bring the camera to the wedding and see what you can get, we aren't hiring a photographer". Um, no. Sorry.0 -
I know this problem. I'm an artist and I do portraits for extra cash. People are always asking me to do artwork for them for free. They usually imply that it'll be "fun" for me and I think that's the justification for not wanting to pay. I used to just go along with it but it got kind of ridiculous so now I just say "sure, I'd love to do that for you. It'll cost about $60," or whatever it is. The only time it's been a problem was with my mother-in-law, who wanted me to illustrate an entire children's book for her. I just explained to her how much time it would take for me to oblige. I broke it down into steps and told her how many hours each step would take.
My grandparents are musicians and they get the same kind of requests about playing weddings for free.
People can be rude. You have to learn to be firm or they're just going to keep doing it.
I would really like a free portrait of my dog, she growls and bites everyone but me, but think of how challenging it will be to capture her true puppy nature!
The exactly same thing happens to me as a photographer -- oh, bring your camera you xyz social event, it will be SO fun! I've had people say "bring the camera to the wedding and see what you can get, we aren't hiring a photographer". Um, no. Sorry.
NO.
:laugh: See, I'm learning. :smooched:
I have a friend who is a photographer and she has that problem too. She also hates photographing weddings even when she gets paid.0 -
I hear you!!I know the feeling. When people found out that I had an IT degree and worked on computers and networks for a living everyone suddenly had computer issues.
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Its not unreasonable at all..
They should at least pay for the parts if they can't pay for the time. Or atleast offer something in return.0 -
Maybe these people ASSUME you will be sending a bill, since it is your business, after all. My neighbor has a lawn care business. If I called him over to remove heavy branches or something, I wouldn't offer to pay him while he was there, I would assume he'll bill me. You will not run a good business until you get this under control.0
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Maybe these people ASSUME you will be sending a bill, since it is your business, after all. My neighbor has a lawn care business. If I called him over to remove heavy branches or something, I wouldn't offer to pay him while he was there, I would assume he'll bill me. You will not run a good business until you get this under control.
Repair/service work is NOT our business, so this doesn't impact our bottom line whatsoever. We do (and have) run a good business for over 10 years now. These are just favors that we both have a hard time charging for - because we view them as that - favors.
He's doing basic, simple repairs, and helping people figure out bigger issues that we aren't equipped to handle (because, again, we aren't in plumbing service field). Our business is 80% new construction, 20% renovations and 0% service. There's a really big difference between the two.
This is strictly "side" work we're talking about. And all *I* wanted was a bit of gratitude for it.0 -
My husband and I own our own business too, but we don't deal with the general public - our customers are other companies and public agencies, ,etc. Our work is pretty specialized and our technicians have many years in the industry, we've sent them for various training, certifications, etc. But people think that because it's our own business we can hire anyone whenever. We are hit up constantly for jobs - we can't afford to pay someone who doesn't know anything. Same goes with the office - I've had friends ask me if they can come work in our office. We already have 1 full-time office person and then me. We can't just add people to payroll because they want a job.... sometimes (depending on cash flow) I can't even pay my husband and myself - just to make the payroll for the other employees.0
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You know, OP, I get asked all the time to "just bring the cake" to social events because people know I'm a gourmet baker. And they know my hubby likes to cook, so they say "just have him whip something up". Frankly it only happened 1 time both for me to put my big girl panties on and tell them NO as we couldn't afford to "bring an event cake to feed 65" or "whip up a meat dish to feed 65" and then that was the end of THAT!
Obviously, if there was $$$ involved in this transaction, then the outcome is way different! This, however, is how I feed my own family and how I pay my bills.
IF the social event is a Potluck? Then I bring the Chips...or the salsa...or sometimes, even BOTH! :laugh:
With that said,,,,,if my little nephews are involved then they have ASKED their MOM if their *Auntie* can "bring the cake" --- :blushing: --- and then of course their Mom shells out the cash at least to reimburse.
If you figure out how many hours its taken out of your household budget these freebies are, then I would bill your customer as you would anyone else.0 -
Yup, this. If your neighbors are chatting with each other. The story goes around about the nice plumber who fixes things for free. Put a stop to it now.
But it's not even that they don't pay - it's that they don't OFFER to pay. We have this cute little retired nun neighbor and we never let her pay - she offers every time.
These aren't huge jobs - like changing hose bibs, or determining where a sewer leak is, or snaking a toilet.
I feel like getting upset over a lack of a gesture is really, incredibly silly on my part.
Not silly at all. If they didn't have you/your husband to call, then they'd need to hire a plumber! We all need to make a living to get by in this world. This is how you make yours. Make them pay up!! (Or at least from now on...)0 -
Yup, this. If your neighbors are chatting with each other. The story goes around about the nice plumber who fixes things for free. Put a stop to it now.
But it's not even that they don't pay - it's that they don't OFFER to pay. We have this cute little retired nun neighbor and we never let her pay - she offers every time.
These aren't huge jobs - like changing hose bibs, or determining where a sewer leak is, or snaking a toilet.
I feel like getting upset over a lack of a gesture is really, incredibly silly on my part.
My answer would be "no." I refuse to work for free, unless it's for a friend who understands and reciprocates favors. Most people "get it" but the ones who don't are definitely repeat offenders and will not change.0 -
I hate to say it but you probably need to rate who each person is and set some boundaries. I would suspect that for close friends you would drop everything and rush to help them and not worry about being paid. For a neighbor at the other end of the street that you rarely ever see, maybe you can give them advice and the number of someone that does emergency work.0
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You should make a special neighborhood rate or use the emergency call rate or take something in trade. Nothing is free even among friends.0
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Afraid to say this is a sign of our economic times. If people were earning more, much less employed, they might offer to pay. Now we have a society that is conditioned to think everything is or should be free, except their services to others. (Vote for change)0
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Oh honey, I feel your pain! My husband is an electrician and he gets asked electrical questions on a daily basis and family members ask him to do this, fix this, all the time!0
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Be straightforward from the beginning. Put friendly signs on all of your outside doors stating that you cannot do any extra favors or work during non-business hours. Please call my business line and leave a message; I'm offering neighbors a 5% off rate.
Or something. I'm not great at the advertising. You can always cheese it up with some kind of family time message if you feel guilty or think your neighbors will just ignore you unless you preemptively set the asshat trap.0 -
Thanks for all the input. I talked to my husband tonight and we agreed we need firmer boundaries and to start charging, even if it's just $20. It might make people reconsider popping by so often.
I appreciate everyone taking the time to read and respond.0 -
Anytime someone asks, you just respond with: "Absolutely! We'd be happy to have your business. My husband can be over at X:00 to give you an estimate, does that time work for you?"
You aren't saying no, but you are making it plainly clear right from the beginning that you expect to be paid for your services.0 -
Anytime someone asks, you just respond with: "Absolutely! We'd be happy to have your business. My husband can be over at X:00 to give you an estimate, does that time work for you?"
You aren't saying no, but you are making it plainly clear right from the beginning that you expect to be paid for your services.
This is perfect. Do this! :flowerforyou:0 -
My husband is a plumber, and we own our own plumbing business (mostly new construction, some house flipping reno's).
Lately, almost everyone in our neighborhood has found that fact out. So, at LEAST once a week we have someone pop by, asking for help. Neither one of us are very good at saying no, especially since it's always a leak or some other emergency that has the potential to destroy property (this is actually rarely the case).
90% of these people do not offer to pay.
I don't mind helping someone in a jam - especially if it's a true emergency, but wouldn't you at least offer to PAY for those services? Especially when he has to use parts that we buy to order to fix them? After hours rates for plumbers are generally pretty darn expensive (going rate here is around $135 just to show up, then $135/hour). It's not even the money that matters - it would be the gesture.
I realize we probably put ourselves into this situation and that ultimately we're to blame. I get that. Just needed to vent.
and they will continue to do this until you make it impossible for them to do that any longer.
In future, when somebody says they need a plumber either:
1 tell them you are busy
or
2 take a deep breath and tell them that it is impossible for the job to be done without payment for the parts AND labour.
If they refuse to pay, let them find an outsider to do the job.
Seriously, how dare they!!! That is your livelihood, however, do they give a *kitten*? No, they do not. If thyy did they would not take advantage of you and NOR would they take you for granted,
Put a stop to it all now, it is not going to cease, it will get worse.0 -
Whenever anyone asks for a service to be performed they should expect to pay. Especially if you are supplying parts
I agree with this. I like some of the other suggestions like "We can help...we'll charge you our lowest rate". You could also make a comment like, "I'm sure you will want to get some other estimates" which puts them in the position of shopper, not favor asker ;-) Whether they like it or not, you have a BUSINESS to handle.
A lot of people get this same stuff. I have several friends who are attorneys and graphic artists and they are constantly having people ask them to do things for free...annoying.0 -
II'm in IT. For my friends, family, etc, advice is always free. If a part has to go in, they have to supply me the part or I tell them "I'm not in that kind of IT"
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You charge them after the job is done obviously. I didn't know there were really people this inconsiderate about.
I had no idea either! Our friends ask for help often, but they ALWAYS pay.
We've discussed charging them after, or even invoicing them - but it's really not about the money.
I don't think there's really a solution to my butthurt
Ive read some of your posts before and you don't seem to have any problems being forward with your opinion(s) on here, use some of that pent up energy for your overbearing neighbors!
We had a washing machine issue...the initial guy who came out used to work for sears and yrs ago used to come fix it (when it was under warranty).
Fast forward to the present, he now does all that same labor w/out the middleman.
He charged us $20 just to say that the job was more of a Plumbers specialty.
We called our friend who lives in the next town over....tried to pay him...he had smelled the cookies we were making and said to pay him w/ a plate of homemade cookies...although I snuck a $20 under the plate when I put it in his truck.
In the past he has never taken any $ but we have always given him gift cards...which we usually have to get it past him.
He knows we are in a financial situation but aren't most of us and yet I still have to remember that he's driving 20+ minutes to me plus another 20+ minutes to drive back, he's taking time away from his family (2 little girls + his wife).
The last time he was here, he was under our house, in the dark because he came after work.
When we had electrical issues, he referred us to a friend of his but in no way did we get any kind of deal from him...just cause "they" were friends...lol!
Most people charge just to give you the rate of the job...your neighbors are taking FULL advantage of you and they know it.
If its worked this long then why would they suddenly seek out someone who will charge them an arm & a leg when they can keep both limbs :laugh:
Whats the saying....why by the cow when you can get the milk for free?!?!?!
Dang...I don't know how I managed to do the quote this way....anywho, we have paid for parts before because we told him this should Not be his responsibility when he's already coming after hours, on his time and not charging us, gas, time, labor etc etc.0 -
I'm an artist. I have had friends and family ask me to do portraits for them. Unless it's someone I'm very close to, I say "I'd love to. Let me get you a brochure with my price list." If I'm not busy, I might even offer them a steep discount, but they're essentially hiring me to work, and I don't do that for free.0
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Husband is an electrician. He will help out people if he really feels they are on the balls of their *kitten* and cannot pay. But he will make a list of supplies he needs to help them out and sends their butts to Lowes to get the stuff themselves. He will then install and whether they throw him $20 bucks or $200 makes no difference to him. I get more annoyed than he does, honestly.0
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I could live with a barter system - or even just drop off a thank you for saving me $300 card.
We can't really price the job out before he goes, because people often have NO idea what is wrong it's just "there's water coming from xyz".
He doesn't mind doing side jobs - he doesn't even care that people don't pay.
I think it might have more to do with the fact that he's REALLY busy, so when our at home time is interrupted I get fussy. But I can't really say no to these people, either.
Don't say no if you have a hard time with it but do set a price if it bothers you, especially if you guys are paying for parts. Getting a discount on services is favour enough. Don't feel bad for saying that you can help but it won't be free ( just offer a "special friend/family rate" which shows they are still getting a sweet deal).0 -
It's not unreasonable to vent, I would feel the same way. My advice is help them but tell them upfront you have to pay for parts and supplies. or he could quote them a "half price offer" which would include parts and labor. You do it for free and it gets around people expect it, so don't put yourself in that situation again. If they don't like it they can always pay a regular plumber at the going rate.0
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I would at least charge for parts, and skip the labor cost.
My husband has this issue with computers, he's a computer tech guy. Our family/friends expect him to fix their computers for free all the time, which he does with the exception of buying parts. If something needs replaced he will help them find the best/cheapest deal and then install it for them. Its a hobby for my husband he doesn't do it professionally, but I yell at him all the time to charge people! I don't care that its your cousin or whomever make them pay you something! lol0
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