Changing goal from weight/fat loss to muscle building?

3RMomma
3RMomma Posts: 55 Member
in Fitness and Exercise
Here are my stats – 37 yo female, 5’7”, 149lbs. I started New Rules of Lifting for Women about 6 weeks ago (I have one more wo to complete stage one) but I don’t follow the diet and instead I try to hit my 40-30-30 macro ratio and a calorie goal of 1600 (eating back exercise calories). I lift 3 days a week and usually do 15 min of treadmill intervals (2:1) on those days and I run on the remaining 2-3 days (usually about 4 miles). I did JM's Body Revolution program for 3 months (not food) and lost about 18lbs and moved to NROLW and I’m thinking of changing my goal from weight/fat loss to muscle/strength gain, but I’m a little unsure of the transition process and how to mentally get my brain wrapped around what I should be doing – especially in terms of upping my calories in a smart way. My current %BF is about 26.7 per the scale so I could do with dropping more fat but I don't know whether I should shift goals now or wait until my BF is lower? When I enter my data into IIFYM app with the muscle gain goal it gives me a cal goal of 2407 (332g carbs, 119g protein 67g fat)….which seems crazy. My goal is to look in the mirror and say damn she looks strong! So… I’d love to hear advice –especially from those who made the transition themselves.

Replies

  • margannmks
    margannmks Posts: 424 Member
    I would get the body fat down. Are you losing on the 1600 calories? If you are when you decide to up the calories to build muscle you need to know exactly what your maintenance calories are then add 200 to that or you could eat the maintenance and stop doing the cardio. From what ive read about womens ability to gain muscle at a lb. a month, adding almost 800 calories aday seems excessive.
  • Holisticallylivin
    Holisticallylivin Posts: 8 Member
    Try body weight training to build muscle. It feels so much better than lifting weights (and less expensive).

    Push ups (all varieties), squats, burpees, and so much more.

    Look online for different kinds. I swear it is so worth it even though in the end, your shirt may be drenched with sweat, but tbh, that is the BEST feeling in the world.
  • heybales
    heybales Posts: 18,842 Member
    Try body weight training to build muscle. It feels so much better than lifting weights (and less expensive).

    Push ups (all varieties), squats, burpees, and so much more.

    Look online for different kinds. I swear it is so worth it even though in the end, your shirt may be drenched with sweat, but tbh, that is the BEST feeling in the world.

    Since she already lifts weights, that would be like taking weight off the bar - a sure way to lose strength and muscle mass.

    You have to progressive overload to build muscle.
  • DavePFJ
    DavePFJ Posts: 212 Member
    Add 1000 calories a day and lift heavy.
  • 3RMomma
    3RMomma Posts: 55 Member
    Thanks to all who replied.... but where are the heavy lifters? I was hoping to get more advice/recommendations?
  • geebusuk
    geebusuk Posts: 3,348 Member
    Try body weight training to build muscle. It feels so much better than lifting weights (and less expensive).

    Push ups (all varieties), squats, burpees, and so much more.

    Look online for different kinds. I swear it is so worth it even though in the end, your shirt may be drenched with sweat, but tbh, that is the BEST feeling in the world.
    What feels better about it?
    That she'd be getting weaker :-?
    My intention with doing weights is not to feel good from doing them (standing up a load of times doesn't give me that, unfortunately), but for the way my body will look in a few months time. And I'm confident I'll achieve my goals much better with a chunk of metal on my back.

    Anyway - if you're consistently losing fat and want to lose more, I'd keep going.
    I found myself hitting a plateau a few pounds before my goal. I was happy enough with body composition and had been at a 1000 calorie deficit down to low teens. I added 250 calories a week back for five weeks, so that I would minimise fat gain. My target surplus was 250 calories over, so 1/2 lb a week. At what I expected this to be, I still wasn't gaining weight, so chucked another 250 on, however over time that seemed to come out at more than 1/2lb a week, so cut it down again - should have probably stuck somewhere between the two.

    Incidentally, I'm talking an average of 3250-3500 calories a day for me to gain 1/2lb a week. On 3000 average I seem to lose slightly. I eat back all cardio calories on top of that. I do a starting strength based routine.
  • 3RMomma
    3RMomma Posts: 55 Member
    @eelkha2 - Thanks, but I would have to agree with the other posters (I'd be reducing the work I'm doing rather than increasing my workload.) I did start out by doing a lot of body resistance work and loved it but I wanted to progress to heavier lifting....
  • mymodernbabylon
    mymodernbabylon Posts: 1,038 Member
    I would come to the Eat More Weight Less group - a lot of us are doing either a bulk or cut right now. I would venture to say there is probably also a group for the New Rules too. I'm almost at my goal weight of 145 and I know my body fat is not as low as I'd like, but I want to start building muscle in September so I'll do a bulk and then I'll begin to cut after that. You don't have to lose more weight necessarily.
  • MeanderingMammal
    MeanderingMammal Posts: 7,866 Member
    As your bodyfat is still on the higher end of normal it's probably not the right time to be thinking about bulking, you could afford to come down quite a bit before you start that.

    AS far as your running is concerned I'd drop the fifteen minute sessions on your lifting days and convert your running days away from three steady state, fairly short sessions, towards something a bit more sophisticated. That'll allow you to have more complementary CV and resistance work. Your interval sessions are barely long enough to loosen up, hence suggesting you move it around a bit.

    Four miles is probably taking you about 40 minutes, so take one of those sessions and convert it to an intervals session; 10 minutes warm up, 20 minutes of 60/60 intervals and ten minutes to cool down. For the other sessions something between 4 and 6 miles is probably reasonable.

    Notwithstanding that, as you're using NROL then I'd stick with it, but consider aligning closer to the diet recommendation. As you continue to lose the balance of loss should bias more towards improving that BF%.

    As your focus is weight loss rather than sunning performance then I'd agree with others that bodyweight won't do what you need at the moment.
  • cajuntank
    cajuntank Posts: 924 Member
    I have offered information on other threads asking roughly this same question, so in a nutshell...
    There is a variable of data call P ratio (protein ratio) that Lyle McDonald goes into great detail about.
    http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/muscle-gain/calorie-partitioning-part-1.html

    In a nutshell, there is a matter of genetics that one cannot control this variable except to for maybe around 15-20% based on eating and training (or through "medical assistance"). But the portion we can influence is based on leanness on how much muscle or fat is gain in a caloric surplus and appropriate lifting. So as an example, a man who is in the range of around 8-15% bodyfat will have a better P ratio so when he adds weight (again, caloric surplus and appropriate lifting), he is adding more muscle than fat (some fat is inevitable). If he were to be outside of that range (taking genetic disposition out of the equation as some add muscle better than others and some gain fat easier than others), then the propensity to add fat would be greater than muscle. I think a woman's bodyfat % comparatively is about 8% higher than a man's, but someone can correct if I am misspoken on that. So using my example for a woman, the optimal range of bodyfat would be around the 15-22% range to have the best controllable P ratio to influence a greater % of muscle is added than fat. Hope that makes sense.
  • margannmks
    margannmks Posts: 424 Member
    I have offered information on other threads asking roughly this same question, so in a nutshell...
    There is a variable of data call P ratio (protein ratio) that Lyle McDonald goes into great detail about.
    http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/muscle-gain/calorie-partitioning-part-1.html

    In a nutshell, there is a matter of genetics that one cannot control this variable except to for maybe around 15-20% based on eating and training (or through "medical assistance"). But the portion we can influence is based on leanness on how much muscle or fat is gain in a caloric surplus and appropriate lifting. So as an example, a man who is in the range of around 8-15% bodyfat will have a better P ratio so when he adds weight (again, caloric surplus and appropriate lifting), he is adding more muscle than fat (some fat is inevitable). If he were to be outside of that range (taking genetic disposition out of the equation as some add muscle better than others and some gain fat easier than others), then the propensity to add fat would be greater than muscle. I think a woman's bodyfat % comparatively is about 8% higher than a man's, but someone can correct if I am misspoken on that. So using my example for a woman, the optimal range of bodyfat would be around the 15-22% range to have the best controllable P ratio to influence a greater % of muscle is added than fat. Hope that makes sense.
    I read that too,thats why i advised her to lose more fat first,then be exact on her maintenance before adding the extra calories,to minimize too much fat gain. I was gonna do my bulk but after reading that( even though im at the 22%) i decided to keep doing a deficit and lift heavy and keep my cardio 3 x aweek till oct then i can bulk during the holidays.
  • mymodernbabylon
    mymodernbabylon Posts: 1,038 Member
    That percentage also is dependent on age isn't it? As a 45 year old woman, getting to 22% body fat is different than a 21 yr old, as I believe my range would be even higher.
  • 3RMomma
    3RMomma Posts: 55 Member
    Thanks, all. This makes sense... So I will focus on getting my %BF down and then worry about building muscle.
  • cajuntank
    cajuntank Posts: 924 Member
    Was typing my response this morning kind of quick, so forgot to provide my other link I was going to include. So here it is just in case.

    http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/muscle-gain/initial-body-fat-and-body-composition-changes.html

    Also, my numbers were a little off for woman (sorry, was going off of memory). So according to Lyle, a woman's range would fall around 19-24%.

    Mymodernbabyl: I have not seen any information from Lyle or anyone else about those practical %s being age dependent. I think it is what it is.
  • incogneato
    incogneato Posts: 6 Member
    My goals are similar and my BF% is about 25%. I'm focused on lifting as heavy as I can while maintaining a calorie deficit to lose fat. I am seeing strength/muscle gains despite losing weight but they are slow since I'm not really eating to bulk. When I've lost more fat I will shift my calories up, but only a little bit above maintenance. I'd rather gain muscle slowly than gain a ton of fat too quickly. No matter how much you eat, you can only build muscle so fast, so any additional calories will go towards fat gains.

    GL to you!
  • ars1300
    ars1300 Posts: 159 Member
    Slowly increase your calories and monitor how its affecting your weight. Dont cut your carbs too low if you want energy to lift heavy.
  • 3RMomma
    3RMomma Posts: 55 Member
    Thanks for the great resource! It helps me understand what I need to do now in order to get to where I want to be

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