Not Eating Enough Calories to Lose Weight
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This is not true, you can stall if you eat too few calories which slows down your metabolism. You will also gain it back if you start eating like a normal person.Liftng4Lis wrote: »Starvation mode doesn't exist. If you're not losing, you're not in a deficit.
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mamapeach910 wrote: »
Yes, you can, because science, especially for a physically active person. The issue here is not total intake. It's the size of the deficit. And eating too little can cause one to be more lethargic and burn fewer calories during a workout. If a 200 calorie boost in your diet allows you to burn 300 calories extra during your workout (or gives you the energy for longer or more frequent workouts), then you are creating a greater deficit because of the extra intake. Does this happen? Well, I have often found that if I exercise when I'm hungry, I burn 200-300 calories less during my workout, mostly because I don't have the energy to workout for longer.No that's not right. You can't increase calories to lose weight .. what you can do is tighten up on your logging, weigh everything, log it carefully, never use cups, check calories against packages and other calorie databases, never use other people's homemade recipes and don't overestimate your exercise burns using the MFP database (cut them in half)
That's general advice .. if you want specific you will need to set your diary to public
PS it's Lose weight... and when you do your clothes will become loose
Sometimes you can increase calories to lose weight. I have seen it work several times when people are eating very little and exercising too much. OP...if you are exercising a lot and never eating more than 1400 it could be your problem. How much do you exercise and how much do you weigh?
Nope .. You can't .. cos Science!
The problem is we go around and assume that no matter how much you eat, you will expend the exact same amount of energy working out or that you will do the same intensity, same time workouts no matter your intake. That is often not the case.
Even if you have a point (I don't know enough to care), posting this is on this thread is just pointless. Did you even look at her diary? She's claiming 300+ calorie burns for a half hour activity. That's just not happening.
You can see her specific exercises in her diary? Because I can't. How do I do that? If you are looking at her calorie goals and subtracting 1400 form it and looking at what she says she does in terms of working out, I read it as about 60 mins of activity daily (30 mins walk + 30 mix crosstraining).
You may indeed be correct that she is overestimating her burns but as for whether it's at all possible to burn 300 calories in an hour - I don't know her specific size and how's she's measuring the calories, but it is certainly possible to burn 300+ calories in a half hour of cardio, especially with interval training. Will it happen from a half-hour walk? No. But is it at all possible? It depends on the intensity and the activity (as well as the size of the person) but oh yes.0 -
I agree that you are either a) eating more calories than you think or b) burning fewer calories than you think. Try eating only half of your exercise calories back. Also be very careful about logging. Weigh or measure everything. Remember that if you use measurements like tablespoons or cups, they should be absolutely level, not heaped higher in the center. Also remember that every little lick, taste, and sip add up.0
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SergeantSausage wrote: »snoringcat wrote: »Try messing with your macros more. Increase your protein and fat and reduce your carbs (not cut them out- but make sure they're super clean and not processed). Sometimes it's all about balance. All calories are not created equal.
Actually all calories are equal - 1kcal = 1kcal. It's a scientific unit of measurement!snoringcat wrote: »Try messing with your macros more. Increase your protein and fat and reduce your carbs (not cut them out- but make sure they're super clean and not processed). Sometimes it's all about balance. All calories are not created equal.
Actually all calories are equal - 1kcal = 1kcal. It's a scientific unit of measurement!
I have learned that although all calories are equal, not ALL used the same way. Non resistant carbs, coupled with a body shoots out a-amaylase will pack crap into your fat cells faster than an angry woman packing her cheating husband's bags!.
I gotta call Shenanigans here. This is doo doo.
Doesn't any body here understand what a kcals is? A sample is burned and the resulting energy (heat) released is measured. It is the amount of energy used to raise 1 kilogram of water 1 degree Celsius. All above board and scientific.
However.....our bodies are not calorie meters. This is an approximation of the energy each "unit" of food can give our bodies if we could burn it completely. Our bodies don't burn calories cleanly and efficiently. Some bodies are more efficient than others, and somethings that are easy to burn aren't easy to digest.
Our bodies aren't machines. I was plateaued for months struggling to lose weight eating about 1800 a day. I did an elimination diet eating 2000-2200 a day and lost 20 lbs in 20 days.
Does this mean I think this is an issue for the OP. Maybe, maybe not. Probably not. First you have to honestly look at what you are eating, your exercise and if there are any medical issues.
So yes all calories are equal in a calorie meter, but not in someone's body. Especially if you are close to the weight your body wants to be. 140 to 150 lbs at 5'11"? I would suggest at that height and weight if she is unhappy with her body to try body building for a more sculpted look.
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mamapeach910 wrote: »
Yes, you can, because science, especially for a physically active person. The issue here is not total intake. It's the size of the deficit. And eating too little can cause one to be more lethargic and burn fewer calories during a workout. If a 200 calorie boost in your diet allows you to burn 300 calories extra during your workout (or gives you the energy for longer or more frequent workouts), then you are creating a greater deficit because of the extra intake. Does this happen? Well, I have often found that if I exercise when I'm hungry, I burn 200-300 calories less during my workout, mostly because I don't have the energy to workout for longer.No that's not right. You can't increase calories to lose weight .. what you can do is tighten up on your logging, weigh everything, log it carefully, never use cups, check calories against packages and other calorie databases, never use other people's homemade recipes and don't overestimate your exercise burns using the MFP database (cut them in half)
That's general advice .. if you want specific you will need to set your diary to public
PS it's Lose weight... and when you do your clothes will become loose
Sometimes you can increase calories to lose weight. I have seen it work several times when people are eating very little and exercising too much. OP...if you are exercising a lot and never eating more than 1400 it could be your problem. How much do you exercise and how much do you weigh?
Nope .. You can't .. cos Science!
The problem is we go around and assume that no matter how much you eat, you will expend the exact same amount of energy working out or that you will do the same intensity, same time workouts no matter your intake. That is often not the case.
Even if you have a point (I don't know enough to care), posting this is on this thread is just pointless. Did you even look at her diary? She's claiming 300+ calorie burns for a half hour activity. That's just not happening.
You can see her specific exercises in her diary? Because I can't. How do I do that? If you are looking at her calorie goals and subtracting 1400 form it and looking at what she says she does in terms of working out, I read it as about 60 mins of activity daily (30 mins walk + 30 mix crosstraining).
You may indeed be correct that she is overestimating her burns but as for whether it's at all possible to burn 300 calories in an hour - I don't know her specific size and how's she's measuring the calories, but it is certainly possible to burn 300+ calories in a half hour of cardio, especially with interval training. Will it happen from a half-hour walk? No. But is it at all possible? It depends on the intensity and the activity (as well as the size of the person) but oh yes.
She said what her exercise was on the first page. She walks ... incidental walking for a half a hour and does a half hour interval cross training. That half hour walk is included in calculations for sedentary people, so should not be counted as exercise calories. Burning 300+ calories in a half hour for 150 pound person? I call shenanigans.
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Actually, Roza42 does have a point. See http://www.nutritionj.com/content/3/1/9
This is a peer-reviewed scientific journal and research is increasingly pointing to this. A calorie is a calorie only takes into account the 1st law of thermodynamics and fails to take into account the second law.
Although research is still being done, it appears that low carbohydrate diets do have an advantage in terms of weight loss but more work needs to be done to fully explain the mechanism behind this (no it is not just water weight).
However, my personal belief is that although theoretically relevant, the practical advantages to changing macronutrient profiles are negligible to the average individual. The majority of people got overweight because they ate too much- pure and simple! Therefore, if someone accurately logs their calories they will lose weight. For some people, e.g., those with reduced metabolic rates (e.g., PCOS, CFS) a low carbohydrate diet may help because any inaccuracies in logging can cause more problems due to a reduced ability to eat at a deficit.
That being said- I have both PCOS and CFS and wouldn't go low carb if you paid me! I know this may be a controversial opinion here but I think it is important that people are aware the CICO is not the full picture.0 -
herrspoons wrote: »HotPotato22 wrote: »snoringcat wrote: »Try messing with your macros more. Increase your protein and fat and reduce your carbs (not cut them out- but make sure they're super clean and not processed). Sometimes it's all about balance. All calories are not created equal.
Actually all calories are equal - 1kcal = 1kcal. It's a scientific unit of measurement!
Nutrition is not that simple. I have a degree in it and my husband has a phd in it. There is sooo much evidence that sugar is bad, too many carbs can be bad, all calories are not created equal, what you put into your body influences your gut microbiome which effects your weight. Yes if you reduce calories you will lose weight but focusing on the types of food is the healthiest way to do this, hence why looking at macros can matter.
Since you have a degree, please explain why sugar is bad. In particular which sugars - monosaccharides, disaccharides, polysaccharides, etc - what the difference between the sugar molecules sourced from, say, fruit and a cookie is, and if, as you suggest, sugar is bad why the body runs on glucose even to a limited degree when ketones are the primary energy source.
Shouldn't be too hard.
Sugar is in excess, especially if you are consuming high fructose corn syrup, is bad. The problem with this is the fructose skips the rate limiting enzyme step in the glycolytic pathway, there is no regulation when using fructose so any excess energy gets stored as fat.
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SergeantSausage wrote: »snoringcat wrote: »Try messing with your macros more. Increase your protein and fat and reduce your carbs (not cut them out- but make sure they're super clean and not processed). Sometimes it's all about balance. All calories are not created equal.
Actually all calories are equal - 1kcal = 1kcal. It's a scientific unit of measurement!snoringcat wrote: »Try messing with your macros more. Increase your protein and fat and reduce your carbs (not cut them out- but make sure they're super clean and not processed). Sometimes it's all about balance. All calories are not created equal.
Actually all calories are equal - 1kcal = 1kcal. It's a scientific unit of measurement!
I have learned that although all calories are equal, not ALL used the same way. Non resistant carbs, coupled with a body shoots out a-amaylase will pack crap into your fat cells faster than an angry woman packing her cheating husband's bags!.
I gotta call Shenanigans here. This is doo doo.
Doesn't any body here understand what a kcals is? A sample is burned and the resulting energy (heat) released is measured. It is the amount of energy used to raise 1 kilogram of water 1 degree Celsius. All above board and scientific.
However.....our bodies are not calorie meters. This is an approximation of the energy each "unit" of food can give our bodies if we could burn it completely. Our bodies don't burn calories cleanly and efficiently. Some bodies are more efficient than others, and somethings that are easy to burn aren't easy to digest.
Our bodies aren't machines. I was plateaued for months struggling to lose weight eating about 1800 a day. I did an elimination diet eating 2000-2200 a day and lost 20 lbs in 20 days.
Does this mean I think this is an issue for the OP. Maybe, maybe not. Probably not. First you have to honestly look at what you are eating, your exercise and if there are any medical issues.
So yes all calories are equal in a calorie meter, but not in someone's body. Especially if you are close to the weight your body wants to be. 140 to 150 lbs at 5'11"? I would suggest at that height and weight if she is unhappy with her body to try body building for a more sculpted look.
Ayup.
Still doo doo.0 -
SergeantSausage wrote: »SergeantSausage wrote: »snoringcat wrote: »Try messing with your macros more. Increase your protein and fat and reduce your carbs (not cut them out- but make sure they're super clean and not processed). Sometimes it's all about balance. All calories are not created equal.
Actually all calories are equal - 1kcal = 1kcal. It's a scientific unit of measurement!snoringcat wrote: »Try messing with your macros more. Increase your protein and fat and reduce your carbs (not cut them out- but make sure they're super clean and not processed). Sometimes it's all about balance. All calories are not created equal.
Actually all calories are equal - 1kcal = 1kcal. It's a scientific unit of measurement!
I have learned that although all calories are equal, not ALL used the same way. Non resistant carbs, coupled with a body shoots out a-amaylase will pack crap into your fat cells faster than an angry woman packing her cheating husband's bags!.
I gotta call Shenanigans here. This is doo doo.
Doesn't any body here understand what a kcals is? A sample is burned and the resulting energy (heat) released is measured. It is the amount of energy used to raise 1 kilogram of water 1 degree Celsius. All above board and scientific.
However.....our bodies are not calorie meters. This is an approximation of the energy each "unit" of food can give our bodies if we could burn it completely. Our bodies don't burn calories cleanly and efficiently. Some bodies are more efficient than others, and somethings that are easy to burn aren't easy to digest.
Our bodies aren't machines. I was plateaued for months struggling to lose weight eating about 1800 a day. I did an elimination diet eating 2000-2200 a day and lost 20 lbs in 20 days.
Does this mean I think this is an issue for the OP. Maybe, maybe not. Probably not. First you have to honestly look at what you are eating, your exercise and if there are any medical issues.
So yes all calories are equal in a calorie meter, but not in someone's body. Especially if you are close to the weight your body wants to be. 140 to 150 lbs at 5'11"? I would suggest at that height and weight if she is unhappy with her body to try body building for a more sculpted look.
Ayup.
Still doo doo.
I thought it was well said
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This content has been removed.
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mamapeach910 wrote: »
Yes, you can, because science, especially for a physically active person. The issue here is not total intake. It's the size of the deficit. And eating too little can cause one to be more lethargic and burn fewer calories during a workout. If a 200 calorie boost in your diet allows you to burn 300 calories extra during your workout (or gives you the energy for longer or more frequent workouts), then you are creating a greater deficit because of the extra intake. Does this happen? Well, I have often found that if I exercise when I'm hungry, I burn 200-300 calories less during my workout, mostly because I don't have the energy to workout for longer.No that's not right. You can't increase calories to lose weight .. what you can do is tighten up on your logging, weigh everything, log it carefully, never use cups, check calories against packages and other calorie databases, never use other people's homemade recipes and don't overestimate your exercise burns using the MFP database (cut them in half)
That's general advice .. if you want specific you will need to set your diary to public
PS it's Lose weight... and when you do your clothes will become loose
Sometimes you can increase calories to lose weight. I have seen it work several times when people are eating very little and exercising too much. OP...if you are exercising a lot and never eating more than 1400 it could be your problem. How much do you exercise and how much do you weigh?
Nope .. You can't .. cos Science!
The problem is we go around and assume that no matter how much you eat, you will expend the exact same amount of energy working out or that you will do the same intensity, same time workouts no matter your intake. That is often not the case.
Even if you have a point (I don't know enough to care), posting this is on this thread is just pointless. Did you even look at her diary? She's claiming 300+ calorie burns for a half hour activity. That's just not happening.
You can see her specific exercises in her diary? Because I can't. How do I do that? If you are looking at her calorie goals and subtracting 1400 form it and looking at what she says she does in terms of working out, I read it as about 60 mins of activity daily (30 mins walk + 30 mix crosstraining).
You may indeed be correct that she is overestimating her burns but as for whether it's at all possible to burn 300 calories in an hour - I don't know her specific size and how's she's measuring the calories, but it is certainly possible to burn 300+ calories in a half hour of cardio, especially with interval training. Will it happen from a half-hour walk? No. But is it at all possible? It depends on the intensity and the activity (as well as the size of the person) but oh yes.
@deaniac83 Yes, you can see her exercise diary. Go to her diary, then click on the exercise diary link at the bottom.
Most days it's 216 calories for 50 minutes of walking.0 -
No, an elimination diet is where you eliminate the most reactive foods, then add them back in one by one. Each one is a test. The fourth day I ate dairy (goat cheese), and twenty minutes later I turned bright red. I also found out that I am sensitive to most legumes and nuts, nightshades, and a few other things. Yes, I would say that most of the weight loss was fluid, but fluid from chronic inflammation. My carb counts didn't really change much.
[/quote]
Wild stab in the dark: Elimination was carbs and weight loss is primarily fluid and therefore temporary?
[/quote]
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Admittedly, I am very much a newbie here, but I think the simplest advice also happens to the correct advice. I've read lots of articles and papers concerning this or that diet methodology and it seems the one thing most agree on is that fact that you must be at a calorie deficit to lose weight. Everything else seems to be about the best way to get there with the greatest benefit (or at least lack of discomfort) over time.
I have been logging faithfully and actually over-estimating portions when I can't measure, lowering my carb intake (I go some days with very few and for the most part I've changed the nature of the carbs i.e. eating oranges instead of British-made Cadbury Dairy Milk bars. I still get some from processed foods like Cheerios or Raisin Bran - don't judge - but the volume of that intake is DRAMATICALLY lower than it was just a few weeks ago i.e. a measuring cup versus a box) and we've been hitting the gym almost daily now for the last 23 days. (We've missed one or two and went for long, faster paced walks instead or rested completely.)
I also don't trust the MFP calorie counts for exercise. I rely on the equipment at the gym and cross reference to other apps or web sites to see if that is on target. MFP seems to give me more credit than I deserve in some cases, and less in others.
Even with some likely inaccuracies in my diary, I've lost 17 pounds since starting on this adventure. Nothing to write home about yet, but it is a good start and at a decent pace. And, I attribute all of whatever success I've seen so far to doing my best to stay at a deficit each day. (Some days were tough to stay under, others lately have been tougher to get to the minimum!)
At any rate, I eat less, move more and the evidence is clear: You must be at a deficit to lose weight.
If you're gaining its most likely because; 1) You've replaced fat with muscle. 2) You aren't really burning as many calories per day as you think you are or 3) You are eating more calories than you think you are. 4) Some combination of these. (I'll not even attempt to think about unusual conditions, etc as I am completely clueless)
That's my two cents worth and it's worth everything you paid for it. (Forgive the over-use of the parenthetical statement.)
To you and to everyone reading, GOOD LUCK AND GET FIT!
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electricmoogaloo wrote: »I weigh 10st 10 and I'm 5"11.
You're already well within a healthy weight (BMI 20.9) so I wouldn't try to lose any more.
http://www.nhs.uk/Tools/Pages/Healthyweightcalculator.aspx
You might like to aim for different goals, like a sporting challenge or reducing fat percentage through weight training.
I also wouldn't add exercise calories for walking, set yourself to lightly active instead.
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Strsnoringcat wrote: »Try messing with your macros more. Increase your protein and fat and reduce your carbs (not cut them out- but make sure they're super clean and not processed). Sometimes it's all about balance. All calories are not created equal.
Actually all calories are equal - 1kcal = 1kcal. It's a scientific unit of measurement!
Right- but your body doesn't process all calories the same way.
Strictly speaking this is true but studies (sorry on train so can't link ) have shown that you can still lose weight if you get all your calories from sugar, providing you are in calorie deficit. With the exception of a few rare ish metabolic disorders such as pcos, the difference between carb calories and protein calories etc. is small.
The main issues are people not weighing accurately, exercise calories incorrectly calculated, and the fact that the TDEE calculators are an estimation. A well established and we'll researched estimation to be sure but as it's very difficult to measure true activity level and you need special equipment to measure BMR. Small inaccuracies in these can quickly add up, and leave you with a significantly smaller calorie deficit than you thought you had.0 -
mudmonkeyonwheels wrote: »Actually, Roza42 does have a point. See http://www.nutritionj.com/content/3/1/9
This is a peer-reviewed scientific journal and research is increasingly pointing to this. A calorie is a calorie only takes into account the 1st law of thermodynamics and fails to take into account the second law.
Although research is still being done, it appears that low carbohydrate diets do have an advantage in terms of weight loss but more work needs to be done to fully explain the mechanism behind this (no it is not just water weight).
However, my personal belief is that although theoretically relevant, the practical advantages to changing macronutrient profiles are negligible to the average individual. The majority of people got overweight because they ate too much- pure and simple! Therefore, if someone accurately logs their calories they will lose weight. For some people, e.g., those with reduced metabolic rates (e.g., PCOS, CFS) a low carbohydrate diet may help because any inaccuracies in logging can cause more problems due to a reduced ability to eat at a deficit.
That being said- I have both PCOS and CFS and wouldn't go low carb if you paid me! I know this may be a controversial opinion here but I think it is important that people are aware the CICO is not the full picture.
Good point, but I think most people realize that it takes more energy to digest some foods than it does others. Supposedly, it takes more energy to digest bok choy than the energy it has in it. However, when we talk about a calorie is a calorie, I think we can ignore the 2nd law of thermodynamics because we separate the calories burned from the calories consumed. If it requires more calories to convert a food into usable form than other foods, the additional calories go on the calories burned side of the equation, while the calories in the food go on the calories consumed side. By that method, carbs don't give us more calories or a different kind of calorie, but we may burn fewer calories if we consume carbs rather than protein.0 -
Some foods do have less calories than listed (in the sense that you don't digest them all). Like almonds. Some foods do take more energy to digest than others. The difference is really small, though. And that makes sense. We are very well adapted to consuming high fiber foods and extracting the calories with minimal expenditure of energy. A pity. I wish I could eat almonds and sweet potatoes all day long and not gain weight!0
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This is why she's not losing -- she is probably eating around maintenance, and she shouldn't even be trying to lose weight. I have a daughter who is 5'10" and 150 is her goal weight. While the debate about CICO and her eating more is interesting on this thread, the point is, this is not a person who should be cutting her calories more. She's not losing because she's at her goal weight; she probably won't lose more than .25 lb. a week, and she shouldn't be losing anyway. She would be better off increasing her protein and doing some strength training if she's not happy with her body shape.electricmoogaloo wrote: »I weigh 10st 10 and I'm 5"11.
You're already well within a healthy weight (BMI 20.9) so I wouldn't try to lose any more.
http://www.nhs.uk/Tools/Pages/Healthyweightcalculator.aspx
You might like to aim for different goals, like a sporting challenge or reducing fat percentage through weight training.
I also wouldn't add exercise calories for walking, set yourself to lightly active instead.
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This is why she's not losing -- she is probably eating around maintenance, and she shouldn't even be trying to lose weight. I have a daughter who is 5'10" and 150 is her goal weight. While the debate about CICO and her eating more is interesting on this thread, the point is, this is not a person who should be cutting her calories more. She's not losing because she's at her goal weight; she probably won't lose more than .25 lb. a week, and she shouldn't be losing anyway. She would be better off increasing her protein and doing some strength training if she's not happy with her body shape.electricmoogaloo wrote: »I weigh 10st 10 and I'm 5"11.
You're already well within a healthy weight (BMI 20.9) so I wouldn't try to lose any more.
http://www.nhs.uk/Tools/Pages/Healthyweightcalculator.aspx
You might like to aim for different goals, like a sporting challenge or reducing fat percentage through weight training.
I also wouldn't add exercise calories for walking, set yourself to lightly active instead.
I have bolded your personal opinions that the OP does not share. I am 5'11 and currently 149. My goal weight is 139, which is a BMI of 19.4. The healthy BMI range is 18.5-24.9. The whole "She's not losing because she's at her goal weight" is just not true. She wants to lose a few lbs, so she's not at her goal. She can lose more weight if she wants to; that's her choice.
Someone who is 5'11 is within the "Normal" weight range at 133 lbs - 178.5 lbs.
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