"muscle vs. Fat"

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24

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  • Dragn77
    Dragn77 Posts: 810 Member
    edited March 2015
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    yeah, for true Dianne, your explanation is getting a bit confused.

    I agree that 10lbs of muscle weighs the same as 10lbs of fat. Truth.

    Also agree that 1 cubic sq inch of muscle takes up the same amount of space as 1 cubic sq inch of fat. Truth.

    But...because muscle is denser than fat, muscle will take up less space than fat, given that they are the same weight. If instead of being the same weight, they are the same volume, then then muscle will be heavier than the fat. But, you cant have fat and muscle be both the same weight *and* occupy the same amount of space. They simply are not equal.

    Same goes for bricks and feathers...they cannot be both the same weight and volume at the same time..its one or the other due to the composition of whats being measured.


    All that being said...from what I understand...also agree that the gains are likely water retention and something about muscle repair and stuff. (very scientific, I know...LoL! While I did retain some of what I learned in high school chemistry and sure about how to measure things, Im still learning the ins and outs of fitness)
  • jimrichardson00
    jimrichardson00 Posts: 8 Member
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    diannethegeek wrote: »
    gia07 wrote: »
    Muscle does NOT weigh more than FAT.

    Muscle is denser and takes up less space. One pound of feathers weighs the same as 1 pound of flour....

    Muscle does NOT take up less space than FAT.

    Muscle is denser and weighs more. One cubic inch of feathers takes up the same amount of space as 1 cubic inch of flour....

    I nominate Diannethegeek as the winner of this thread

  • joflo723
    joflo723 Posts: 119 Member
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    Bottom line...a pound of muscle on my *kitten* looks a lot better than a pound of fat on my *kitten*.
  • Morgaath
    Morgaath Posts: 679 Member
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    So, we have identical twins standing next to each other. Each is 5'6" tall, and one weighs 123lbs and has 38% body fat. The other weighs 137lbs and has 18% body fat....which one is going to look "lighter"... Oh wait, here is a picture of that, just with the same woman at different weights/bodyfat levels.
    weight-before-after.jpg
  • GlindaGoodwitch
    GlindaGoodwitch Posts: 157 Member
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    I'm drinking about 84 ounces of water a day - maybe a bit more - I could increase that, but probably realistically not by much more. How much water do you recommend drinking?
  • ninerbuff
    ninerbuff Posts: 48,672 Member
    edited March 2015
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    When comparing density, you weigh equal VOLUMES and compare. When volume is EQUAL, muscle weighs more than fat. There is NO DISPUTE in the scientific community on this. The dispute lies with people who always compare a pound with a pound, a liter with a liter, etc.

    Next argument will be that "natural" sugar is different than "processed" sugar when digested.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
    9285851.png

  • GlindaGoodwitch
    GlindaGoodwitch Posts: 157 Member
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    For the record... I did not intentionally open this can of worms LOL
  • GlindaGoodwitch
    GlindaGoodwitch Posts: 157 Member
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    BFDeal wrote: »
    Hmmm, all the info here sounds good but my only question is which one tastes better?

    Depends who's cooking ;)
  • sgthaggard
    sgthaggard Posts: 581 Member
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    GlindaGoodwitch wrote: »
    For the record... I did not intentionally open this can of worms LOL
    Not your fault. People just tend to be overly pedantic. Even those saying a pound of muscle weighs the same as a pound of fat knew what you were talking about.

  • astrampe
    astrampe Posts: 2,169 Member
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    sgthaggard wrote: »
    GlindaGoodwitch wrote: »
    For the record... I did not intentionally open this can of worms LOL
    Not your fault. People just tend to be overly pedantic. Even those saying a pound of muscle weighs the same as a pound of fat knew what you were talking about.

    this... People with a little knowledge just love to display it....... Boring....
  • ninerbuff
    ninerbuff Posts: 48,672 Member
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    GlindaGoodwitch wrote: »
    Yes. Muscle weighs more than fat. I lost 10 pounds (yay!) then started exercising - no change in diet - and am now starting to see weight GAIN. I know muscle weighs more, but at what point will I start to see weight LOSS again, while remaining active. I'm running 3-5 times per week, doing interval training.

    * Edit: Thank you for the clarification (a pound is a pound etc). :)
    You're retaining water and/or also storing glycogen in your muscle cells. Every gram of glycogen will hold 3 grams of water with it (for storage) which explains the initial gain that people get when they start or change a workout regimen.
    Be consistent and the weight loss will continue. It's not muscle gain on a calorie deficit.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
    9285851.png

  • rileysowner
    rileysowner Posts: 8,228 Member
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    As for how much to drink, you are drinking plenty. Water retention when lifting weights is a necessary part of the muscle recovering and getting stronger. The water is used to help the process on. That is why weight is a horrible measure of progress.

    I would suggest instead take measurements of your body, and take pictures. Looking at the one post above of the progress of Morgaath, you can see that based on weight she could have become very disappointed with her progress, but based on the pictures, and I am sure measurements, she moved from a good looking body to a great looking body.
  • tincanonastring
    tincanonastring Posts: 3,944 Member
    edited March 2015
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    ninerbuff wrote: »
    When comparing density, you weigh equal VOLUMES and compare. When volume is EQUAL, muscle weighs more than fat. There is NO DISPUTE in the scientific community on this. The dispute lies with people who always compare a pound with a pound, a liter with a liter, etc.

    Next argument will be that "natural" sugar is different than "processed" sugar when digested.

    A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
    IDEA Fitness member
    Kickboxing Certified Instructor
    Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
    9285851.png

    It is different, you know. :trollface:
  • GlindaGoodwitch
    GlindaGoodwitch Posts: 157 Member
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    rileysowner wrote: »
    As for how much to drink, you are drinking plenty. Water retention when lifting weights is a necessary part of the muscle recovering and getting stronger. The water is used to help the process on. That is why weight is a horrible measure of progress.

    I would suggest instead take measurements of your body, and take pictures. Looking at the one post above of the progress of Morgaath, you can see that based on weight she could have become very disappointed with her progress, but based on the pictures, and I am sure measurements, she moved from a good looking body to a great looking body.

    Yes! I am taking weekly pictures, as to document my journey. More for myself than anything - sometimes it's hard to see how far you've come until it's laid out right in front of you.
  • burnsjulia
    burnsjulia Posts: 50 Member
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    AllanMisner wrote: »
    I’ll avoid the measurement argument (although density is the answer).

    I will say this: Weight loss is a terrible goal. What I believe you want is fat loss. When people fixate on the scale, they’re pushed to make some very unhealthy choices. Instead of the scale, you should focus on the following:
    - How do I feel?
    - How and I sleeping?
    - How is my energy level?
    - Am I losing body fat (this can be by direct measurement or through a proxy of body measurements - neck, chest, stomach, waist, hips, upper arms, upper legs).
    - Am I meeting my other health goals (strength, muscle mass gain/retention, endurance, cardiovascular, mobility, balance, agility, speed, etc.)?
    - How does my blood work look (for some, this last one is optional, but I like to know and tweak my program to suit)?

    Totally agree with all of this. And yet, I just attained (!) a goal of a 10 pound weight loss. Admittedly I set the goal for a stupid reason (family wedding), but I have noted that I'm really feeling better too - energy is great, feeling great, clothes feeling really good just a tiny bit looser, and it's good for my aging ego. (This could coincide too with working back from an injury.) But it all goes hand-in-hand and it was a good question to ask!
  • rileyes
    rileyes Posts: 1,406 Member
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    GlindaGoodwitch wrote: »
    For the record... I did not intentionally open this can of worms LOL

    Some people are just more dense. ;)
  • gamesandgains
    gamesandgains Posts: 640 Member
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    GlindaGoodwitch wrote: »
    For the record... I did not intentionally open this can of worms LOL
    Lies! Lies, I say!
  • RoxieDawn
    RoxieDawn Posts: 15,488 Member
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    diannethegeek wrote: »
    gia07 wrote: »
    Muscle does NOT weigh more than FAT.

    Muscle is denser and takes up less space. One pound of feathers weighs the same as 1 pound of flour....

    Muscle does NOT take up less space than FAT.

    Muscle is denser and weighs more. One cubic inch of feathers takes up the same amount of space as 1 cubic inch of flour....

    Again and I will say... a pound is a pound is pound. It was NOT referring to space or volume I was simply saying a pound of feathers WEIGHS the same as a pound of flour..

    I knew I should have been careful about my wording...
  • stevencloser
    stevencloser Posts: 8,911 Member
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    Not even density is the be-all end-all of that. You can change a thing's density by adding/removing heat and/or pressure. You can have muscle that is less dense than fat by putting both in extreme conditions that make that happen. Or in other words "No it's not more dense, 1 g/cm³ is the same as 1 g/cm³!!!"

    Anyway. Yeah it's most likely water weight. Let's move along.

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