Metabolism Question- Starvation mode
RGJeff
Posts: 32
HI-
Does anyone have any solid number on what calorie level over what period of time puts a person into starvation mode and/or a lower metabolic state? Perhaps as a pecentage of BMR or something else that can be calulated?
Also- how much does the metabolism (BMR?) decline? 10%, 50%, 70%?
I know a 1,000 calorie deficit keeps you away from it but am curious how far away...
Does anyone have any solid number on what calorie level over what period of time puts a person into starvation mode and/or a lower metabolic state? Perhaps as a pecentage of BMR or something else that can be calulated?
Also- how much does the metabolism (BMR?) decline? 10%, 50%, 70%?
I know a 1,000 calorie deficit keeps you away from it but am curious how far away...
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Replies
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Bump...curious to see the responses0
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http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/230930-starvation-mode-how-it-works
Hopes this helps.......John0 -
I consumer between 200-600 calories a day and i've been loosing weight regularly. But i did get to the point before where i was stuck at 7st 12 for about 4 months no matter what happened and at the time i was eating a bowl of cereal a day, some squash and a piece of fruit. Hope this helps.0
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Bump...QQ0
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bump0
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I consumer between 200-600 calories a day and i've been loosing weight regularly. But i did get to the point before where i was stuck at 7st 12 for about 4 months no matter what happened and at the time i was eating a bowl of cereal a day, some squash and a piece of fruit. Hope this helps.
Oh Honey....I hope you forgot the 1 in front of those numbers
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I consumer between 200-600 calories a day and i've been loosing weight regularly. But i did get to the point before where i was stuck at 7st 12 for about 4 months no matter what happened and at the time i was eating a bowl of cereal a day, some squash and a piece of fruit. Hope this helps.
this kind of info does NOT help. 200-600 cals a day?! If you have your mind made up you are going to eat this way fine, but I would not suggest advising this for anyone else. There are impressionable people on here who may actually take your advice and eat this way. This is not healthy, hon. I hope you can get some help.0 -
I consumer between 200-600 calories a day and i've been loosing weight regularly. But i did get to the point before where i was stuck at 7st 12 for about 4 months no matter what happened and at the time i was eating a bowl of cereal a day, some squash and a piece of fruit. Hope this helps.
You do know that you're effectively starving yourself by eating so little? No wonder you're losing weight, and the reason you plateaued was because your body was clinging onto your weight for dear life (literally). The recommended minimum for women is 1200 calories. If you're having difficulties, then see a nutritionist, please, because what you are doing is very dangerous for your long-term health.
OP: there was a post about this somewhere - it's probably stickied - where they did give a rough estimate of numbers to hit starvation mode. Sorry I can't be more help, try having a good ole rummage through the stickies
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I consumer between 200-600 calories a day and i've been loosing weight regularly. But i did get to the point before where i was stuck at 7st 12 for about 4 months no matter what happened and at the time i was eating a bowl of cereal a day, some squash and a piece of fruit. Hope this helps.
this kind of info does NOT help. 200-600 cals a day?! If you have your mind made up you are going to eat this way fine, but I would not suggest advising this for anyone else. There are impressionable people on here who may actually take your advice and eat this way. This is not healthy, hon. I hope you can get some help.
I did not say anywhere in my post that people should eat like this! He asked about starvation and i told him the food i was eating when starvation kicked in.
And I do know that i am starving myself i've been anorexic with bulimic tendencies for the last 3 years.0 -
I consumer between 200-600 calories a day and i've been loosing weight regularly. But i did get to the point before where i was stuck at 7st 12 for about 4 months no matter what happened and at the time i was eating a bowl of cereal a day, some squash and a piece of fruit. Hope this helps.
seriously? that's not even enough for breakfast and 1 snack. 200-600 cal and if you workout too I am surprised your still standing and not out cold on the floor0 -
I consumer between 200-600 calories a day and i've been loosing weight regularly. But i did get to the point before where i was stuck at 7st 12 for about 4 months no matter what happened and at the time i was eating a bowl of cereal a day, some squash and a piece of fruit. Hope this helps.
this kind of info does NOT help. 200-600 cals a day?! If you have your mind made up you are going to eat this way fine, but I would not suggest advising this for anyone else. There are impressionable people on here who may actually take your advice and eat this way. This is not healthy, hon. I hope you can get some help.
I did not say anywhere in my post that people should eat like this! He asked about starvation and i told him the food i was eating when starvation kicked in.
And I do know that i am starving myself i've been anorexic with bulimic tendencies for the last 3 years.
Please get help. I know this is an illness, but sweetie, you need to talk to someone, a nutritionist or your doctor maybe. And, the way you said it, "I consumer between 200-600 calories a day and i've been loosing weight regularly" does suggest it is advice from you and it suggests you are saying it is a successful way to lose weight. Since you suffer, I'm sure you don't want anyone else to suffer from this illness.0 -
my neighbor died on 4th of July 2 years ago from a massive heart attack in her sleep and it turns out she was battling anorexia and bulemia too for years. Hope you find the help that gets you healthy asap.0
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I consumer between 200-600 calories a day and i've been loosing weight regularly. But i did get to the point before where i was stuck at 7st 12 for about 4 months no matter what happened and at the time i was eating a bowl of cereal a day, some squash and a piece of fruit. Hope this helps.
seriously? that's not even enough for breakfast and 1 snack. 200-600 cal and if you workout too I am surprised your still standing and not out cold on the floor
I also suffer from Chronic Fatigue Syndrome and Fibromyalgia so i can't exercise or really walk. But i think the convo should get back to the OPs question!0 -
Blimey when i'm writing a reply more pop up!
I'm sorry if my response looked like advice but trust me it really really isn't. I meant it in at that amount of calories i am consuming starving mode hasn't affected me yet. Please to anybody that read that do no go anywhere near that low i hate my EDs and it is something to stay away from, forever.
I see my doctor every couple of months i was with a therapist for 2 years, everyone is aware of my problems and help is there when i need it but i am seeing my doctors regularly to check on my heart etc. I think i did a blog last year on my page about it all. If anyone would like to ask questions or wants to comment on this please message me or something i don't want to be ruining the OPs thread! Again apologizes if my comment seemed as advice it honestly wasn't meant to be.0 -
Interesting... I read the article and it said you can enter this state at 1,200 to 2,000 calories per day. This puts me at risk since I am at 1,630 net calories per day. I am only running a deficit of 750 per day though. I thought I was pretty safe.
The scale is getting a little stubborn and I was thinking of bumping up to a 1,000 calorie deficit but maybe I should do the opposide, reduce to a 500 calorie deficit...0 -
Blimey when i'm writing a reply more pop up!
I'm sorry if my response looked like advice but trust me it really really isn't. I meant it in at that amount of calories i am consuming starving mode hasn't affected me yet. Please to anybody that read that do no go anywhere near that low i hate my EDs and it is something to stay away from, forever.
I see my doctor every couple of months i was with a therapist for 2 years, everyone is aware of my problems and help is there when i need it but i am seeing my doctors regularly to check on my heart etc. I think i did a blog last year on my page about it all. If anyone would like to ask questions or wants to comment on this please message me or something i don't want to be ruining the OPs thread! Again apologizes if my comment seemed as advice it honestly wasn't meant to be.
Good for you!! Stay healthy!! And God bless!!0 -
Interesting... I read the article and it said you can enter this state at 1,200 to 2,000 calories per day. This puts me at risk since I am at 1,630 net calories per day. I am only running a deficit of 750 per day though. I thought I was pretty safe.
The scale is getting a little stubborn and I was thinking of bumping up to a 1,000 calorie deficit but maybe I should do the opposide, reduce to a 500 calorie deficit...
Thanks for bringing us back to your topic...
I'm no expert, but I had to increase my calories for about 3 weeks to get the scale moving again. It worked for me but it was a little scary, and seemingly counter-intuitive, to eat MORE to lose but it did work.0 -
Interesting... I read the article and it said you can enter this state at 1,200 to 2,000 calories per day. This puts me at risk since I am at 1,630 net calories per day. I am only running a deficit of 750 per day though. I thought I was pretty safe.
The scale is getting a little stubborn and I was thinking of bumping up to a 1,000 calorie deficit but maybe I should do the opposide, reduce to a 500 calorie deficit...
I think that 1200-2000 number is consumed cals, not NET?0 -
'Starvation mode' as most people know it, is a complete myth.
To achieve a reduction in metabolism, a healthy individual would have to severely cut their daily required calories for a prolonged period of time. In 1950 a study was performed where 36 men were deprived of their daily caloric needs (as low as 50% below their daily need) for 6 months. The result was major weight loss, and 40% reduction in their RMR (resting metabolic rate). However the men CONTINUED to lose fat until the end of the study, or until they reached 5% body fat.
A reduction in RMR due to severe calorie restriction will not counter-act the resulting calorie deficit.
http://caloriecount.about.com/truth-starvation-mode-ft28742-1
Humans have evolved to handle starvation very well. Our bodies make great use of our stored fat.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starvation_response (cited sources at the bottom of the page, for those Wiki haters)0 -
Interesting... I read the article and it said you can enter this state at 1,200 to 2,000 calories per day. This puts me at risk since I am at 1,630 net calories per day. I am only running a deficit of 750 per day though. I thought I was pretty safe.
The scale is getting a little stubborn and I was thinking of bumping up to a 1,000 calorie deficit but maybe I should do the opposide, reduce to a 500 calorie deficit...
I think that the number to stay above is 1200 calories per day. But it's probably not a set in stone number and more of an individual thing. Here's some good reads:
http://www.weightwatchers.com/util/art/index_art.aspx?tabnum=1&art_id=35501
http://blogs.webmd.com/pamela-peeke-md/2009/07/stop-starving-yourselves.html (commentary that includes mention of going below 1200 calories per day)
http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/calorie-calculator/NU00598 (Mayo Clinic Calorie Counter)
I hope that you find this helpful!0 -
Starvation mode is a state in which the body is responding to prolonged periods of low caloric intake levels. During short periods of caloric abstinence, the human body will burn primarily free fatty acids from body fat stores. After prolonged periods of starvation the body has depleted its body fat and begins to burn lean tissue and muscle as a fuel source.[1]
Ordinarily, the body responds to reduced caloric intake by burning fat reserves first, and only consumes muscle and other tissues when those reserves are exhausted.[citation needed] Specifically, the body burns fat after first exhausting the contents of the digestive tract along with glycogen reserves stored in muscle and liver cells.[2] After prolonged periods of starvation, the body will utilize the proteins within muscle tissue as a fuel source. People who practice fasting on a regular basis, such as those adhering to caloric restricted diets, can prime their bodies to abstain from food without burning lean tissue.[3]. Resistance training (such as weight lifting) can also prevent the loss of muscle mass while a person is caloric restricted.0 -
Maybe everyone should be a little more understanding before automatically judging Julia when you don't know her history. Just sayin...0
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BUMP!!!0
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The body uses glucose as its main metabolic fuel if it is available. About 20% of the total energy consumption occurs in the brain. The rest of the glucose consumption fuels muscle tissue and red blood cells.
Glucose can be obtained directly from dietary sugars and carbohydrates. In the absence of dietary sugars and carbohydrates, it is obtained from the breakdown of glycogen. Glycogen is a readily-accessible storage form of glucose, stored in small quantities in the liver and muscles. The body's glycogen reserve can provide glucose for about 6 hours.
After the glycogen reserve is used up, glucose can be obtained from the breakdown of fats. Fats from adipose tissue are broken down into glycerol and free fatty acids. Glycerol can then be used by the liver as a substrate for gluconeogenesis, to produce glucose.
Fatty acids can be used directly as an energy source by most tissues in the body, except the brain, since fatty acids are unable to cross the blood-brain barrier. After the exhaustion of the glycogen reserve, and for the next 2-3 days, fatty acids are the principal metabolic fuel. At first, the brain continues to use glucose, because, if a non-brain tissue is using fatty acids as its metabolic fuel, the use of glucose in the same tissue is switched off. Thus, when fatty acids are being broken down for energy, all of the remaining glucose is made available for use by the brain.
However, the brain requires about 120 g of glucose per day (equivalent to the sugar in 3 cans of soda), and at this rate the brain will quickly use up the body's remaining carbohydrate stores. However, the body has a "backup plan," which involves molecules known as ketone bodies. Ketone bodies are short-chain derivatives of fatty acids. These shorter molecules can cross the blood-brain barrier and can be used by the brain as an alternative metabolic fuel.
After 2 or 3 days of fasting, the liver begins to synthesize ketone bodies from precursors obtained from fatty acid breakdown. The brain uses these ketone bodies as fuel, thus cutting its requirement for glucose. After fasting for 3 days, the brain gets 30% of its energy from ketone bodies. After 4 days, this goes up to 70%.
Thus, the production of ketone bodies cuts the brain's glucose requirement from 120 g per day to about 30 g per day. Of the remaining 30 g requirement, 20 g per day can be produced by the liver from glycerol (itself a product of fat breakdown). But this still leaves a deficit of about 10 g of glucose per day that must be supplied from some other source. This other source will be the body's own proteins.
After several days of fasting, all cells in the body begin to break down protein. This releases amino acids into the bloodstream, which can be converted into glucose by the liver. Since much of our muscle mass is protein, this phenomenon is responsible for the wasting away of muscle mass seen in starvation.
However, the body is able to selectively decide which cells will break down protein and which will not. About 2–3 g of protein has to be broken down to synthesise 1 g of glucose; about 20–30 g of protein is broken down each day to make 10 g of glucose to keep the brain alive. However, this number may decrease the longer the fasting period is continued in order to conserve protein.
Starvation ensues when the fat reserves are completely exhausted and protein is the only fuel source available to the body. Thus, after periods of starvation, the loss of body protein affects the function of important organs, and death results, even if there are still fat reserves left unused. (In a leaner person, the fat reserves are depleted earlier, the protein depletion occurs sooner, and therefore death occurs sooner.)
The ultimate cause of death is, in general, cardiac arrhythmia or cardiac arrest brought on by tissue degradation and electrolyte imbalances.0 -
HI-
Does anyone have any solid number on what calorie level over what period of time puts a person into starvation mode and/or a lower metabolic state? Perhaps as a pecentage of BMR or something else that can be calulated?
Also- how much does the metabolism (BMR?) decline? 10%, 50%, 70%?
I know a 1,000 calorie deficit keeps you away from it but am curious how far away...
Actually as a man I would venture to guess that 1000 cals will probably have you in starvation mode. That being said the intake is different for everyone, but it is suggested that women not go below 1200 net, and men not go below 1500 net.0 -
Interesting... I read the article and it said you can enter this state at 1,200 to 2,000 calories per day. This puts me at risk since I am at 1,630 net calories per day. I am only running a deficit of 750 per day though. I thought I was pretty safe.
The scale is getting a little stubborn and I was thinking of bumping up to a 1,000 calorie deficit but maybe I should do the opposide, reduce to a 500 calorie deficit...
Just a little tidbit about MFP that I've found... once you've entered your personal stats (weight, age, goals, etc), then daily input your food diary & exercise journal... when you submit that day's diary, if you are at risk, a warning will appear on the screen that says something to the effect of "you are not eating enough calories, and are at risk of your body going into starvation mode"... or something like that. I saw it a few times, and it really made me pay attention to how many calories I actually take in!
I was marathon training for months, on about 1200 calories a day... I didn't lose an ounce, and actually gained a couple of pounds. I'm not too beat up about it... I'm little by little, learning more about my body & how it works. 0 -
to the OP: i have seen various numbers for minimum NET calories consumed, ususally in the 1500-1600 calorie range for MEN. You said that you are set to a 750 calorie deficit currently, that you're eating just over 1600 NET calories daily and that you are at a standstill on your scale.
Question 1: what is your current BMI? If you are already in the healthy range, i would advise you to lower your weekly weightloss goal to 0.5 lbs a week optimally, and 1.0 lb/week max. This will allow you to lose more fat, preserve a higher degree of muscle tissue, and will preserve your metabolic rate. I would be sure to get in resistance training to assist in keeping your metabolic rate high and to preserve muscle.
Question 2: are you accurately (as possible) weighing/counting/measuring/recording both your food intake and your exercise expenditures? Sometimes "plateaus" are due to a loosening of our recording habits, and if thats the case, its an easy fix!
Question 3: have you taken body measurements with a tape measure to compare your non-scale-weight progress? I would highly recommend doing that! In addition, i would recommend doing one of those blood pressure self-checks the next time you are in a store/pharmacy (snap a pic w your cell phone camera!). Sometimes progress towards "healthy" is shown in ways other than the bathroom scale
be well! :drinker:0 -
:flowerforyou:Interesting... I read the article and it said you can enter this state at 1,200 to 2,000 calories per day. This puts me at risk since I am at 1,630 net calories per day. I am only running a deficit of 750 per day though. I thought I was pretty safe.
The scale is getting a little stubborn and I was thinking of bumping up to a 1,000 calorie deficit but maybe I should do the opposide, reduce to a 500 calorie deficit...
Just a little tidbit about MFP that I've found... once you've entered your personal stats (weight, age, goals, etc), then daily input your food diary & exercise journal... when you submit that day's diary, if you are at risk, a warning will appear on the screen that says something to the effect of "you are not eating enough calories, and are at risk of your body going into starvation mode"... or something like that. I saw it a few times, and it really made me pay attention to how many calories I actually take in!
I was marathon training for months, on about 1200 calories a day... I didn't lose an ounce, and actually gained a couple of pounds. I'm not too beat up about it... I'm little by little, learning more about my body & how it works.
Just a note on the MFP "starvation warning": it ONLY shows when your daily intake is under 1200, thats not 1200 NET calories, its just straight up 1200.... WE need to be sure the NET is making it to 1200~!!! I wish Mike would change the warning to 1200 NET calories, but until that happens, we need to be aware of this loophole and not accidentally overlook it and fall into thinking "i didnt get the starvation message so i must be ok" mindset! :noway:0 -
I read this one. It looks like the myth you are talking about is that people gain weight in starvation- that the metabolic reduction could outpace the calorie intake reduction. Sounds legit.
It did say they put the subjects at a 50% calorie intake and called that semi starvation, and that they lost weight, but did suffer some issues that anorexics have..
Thanks...'Starvation mode' as most people know it, is a complete myth.
To achieve a reduction in metabolism, a healthy individual would have to severely cut their daily required calories for a prolonged period of time. In 1950 a study was performed where 36 men were deprived of their daily caloric needs (as low as 50% below their daily need) for 6 months. The result was major weight loss, and 40% reduction in their RMR (resting metabolic rate). However the men CONTINUED to lose fat until the end of the study, or until they reached 5% body fat.
A reduction in RMR due to severe calorie restriction will not counter-act the resulting calorie deficit.
http://caloriecount.about.com/truth-starvation-mode-ft28742-1
Humans have evolved to handle starvation very well. Our bodies make great use of our stored fat.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starvation_response (cited sources at the bottom of the page, for those Wiki haters)0 -
Wikipedia- right? I went there first, they didn't have they number. Informative though....
Thanks!Starvation mode is a state in which the body is responding to prolonged periods of low caloric intake levels. During short periods of caloric abstinence, the human body will burn primarily free fatty acids from body fat stores. After prolonged periods of starvation the body has depleted its body fat and begins to burn lean tissue and muscle as a fuel source.[1]
Ordinarily, the body responds to reduced caloric intake by burning fat reserves first, and only consumes muscle and other tissues when those reserves are exhausted.[citation needed] Specifically, the body burns fat after first exhausting the contents of the digestive tract along with glycogen reserves stored in muscle and liver cells.[2] After prolonged periods of starvation, the body will utilize the proteins within muscle tissue as a fuel source. People who practice fasting on a regular basis, such as those adhering to caloric restricted diets, can prime their bodies to abstain from food without burning lean tissue.[3]. Resistance training (such as weight lifting) can also prevent the loss of muscle mass while a person is caloric restricted.0
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