Protein

lchillies
lchillies Posts: 13 Member
edited April 2015 in Food and Nutrition
Hi,

Im seeking some advice on how much protein i should be having. I am female, 5ft 6 and 10st 1lb which is just about my goal weight. I am now looking to build muscle and geta bit leaner. I have set mfp to 40% protein 30% carb and 30% fat. With my exercise today it is telling me my protein should be 185g, this seems like a lot and i am finding it difficult to eat that much!

I am doing a variety of cardio such as tabata and weight training. Does anyone have any advice on how to get more protein in my diet? My diary is public if anyone wants to look

Thanks!

Replies

  • jemhh
    jemhh Posts: 14,261 Member
    I base my macros on my bodyweight rather than percentages. I go for .8 grams of protein and .4 grams of fat per pound. So for you at 141 that would be 112 and 56. I think of those as minimums. My remaining calories come from a mix of carbs and more protein and fat.
  • sijomial
    sijomial Posts: 19,809 Member
    edited April 2015
    Percentages or ratios don't actually make a great deal of sense - especially when you follow the MFP eat back exercise calories method. On a big exercise day I would have to eat a whole cow and not just a nice steak....

    I much prefer to think in grams per day with protein (and fat) as minimum targets.

    And yes 185g for a 141lb person is much higher than necessary.
    1g / lb of lean mass is a common recommendation and unlikely going over 1g / 1lb of bodyweight is unlikely to confer any benefit.

  • dieselbyte
    dieselbyte Posts: 733 Member
    jemhh wrote: »
    I base my macros on my bodyweight rather than percentages. I go for .8 grams of protein and .4 grams of fat per pound. So for you at 141 that would be 112 and 56. I think of those as minimums. My remaining calories come from a mix of carbs and more protein and fat.

    ^This. 185g of protein is overkill.
  • lchillies
    lchillies Posts: 13 Member
    Okay thanks :) I did think it was a bit exteme but i have never really watched my macros before!
  • Michael190lbs
    Michael190lbs Posts: 1,510 Member
    I must be taking in way to much protein after reading this. I weigh 196lbs take in 250 protein grams a day 100 fat grams and 60 carbs currently.
  • RoxieDawn
    RoxieDawn Posts: 15,488 Member
    I actually do 1 gram of protein per body weight and 1/2 for carbs and 1/2 for fat per body weight, but I do not weigh very much. This seems to work well for the lifting program I am doing now.
  • dieselbyte
    dieselbyte Posts: 733 Member
    edited April 2015
    Michael190lbs wrote: »
    I must be taking in way to much protein after reading this. I weigh 196lbs take in 250 protein grams a day 100 fat grams and 60 carbs currently.

    Way too much is subjective. If you like eating that much protein, you aren't eating too much. If your diet or lifestyle protocol is centered around low carb, then you'll have to fill in the calories somewhere else obviously. However, if you have a high protein diet simply because you think this will build more muscle, burn more fat, etc, then you are mistaken. Studies show around .86g/lbs of protein while lifting to be sufficient intake for muscle growth.
  • Michael190lbs
    Michael190lbs Posts: 1,510 Member
    edited April 2015
    Ya i would much rather eat lean meats/fatty meats and fish than lots of veggies with little calories. There is a study for everything just not everyone some people require more or less of certain nutrient which is why we have cravings.. Let your body and mind decide what you need not some study.
  • dieselbyte
    dieselbyte Posts: 733 Member
    Michael190lbs wrote: »
    Ya i would much rather eat lean meats/fatty meats and fish than lots of veggies with little calories. There is a study for everything just not everyone some people require more or less of certain nutrient which is why we have cravings.. Let your body and mind decide what you need not some study.

    No, most bodies (barring specific medical concerns) don't require more or less of any nutrient. We are all unique, but bodies aren't that much different. While certain nutrients may make you feel a certain way, going on feel isn't reliable to what your body actually needs. Honestly, IMO, 250g of protein is just an expensive carb...
  • Michael190lbs
    Michael190lbs Posts: 1,510 Member
    edited April 2015
    I can understand just the needs of the body but everything I read says 1-1.5 to build muscle- This is just a quick google on a bodybuilding forum. The way I eat I could get rid of my protein powder and save some money if its only .8 grams

    Please educate me here is the link to that article. No disrespect

    http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/bbprotein.htm


    Lifestyle/Training Goal Daily Protein Needs Lifestyle/Training Goal Daily Protein Needs
    Bodybuilding 1.0 - 1.6g/lb bodyweight Endurance 0.7 - 0.9g/lb bodyweight
    Power & Speed 0.9 - 1.1g/lb bodyweight Trauma Recovery 0.9 - 1.4g/lb bodyweight
    Dieting 0.35 - 1.0g/lb bodyweight Stressed 0.45 - 0.7g/lb bodyweight
    REFERENCES
    Lemon PWR.:Protein and Amino Acid Requirements of the Strength Athlete.;Int J Sport Nutr , 1991;1;127-145
    Tarnoplosky et al: Evaluation of Protein Metabolism Requirements for Trained Strength Atheletes.; J Appl Physiol , 1992:73(5):1986-1995
    Teasley-Strausberg KM.: (Ed.) Nutritional Support Handbook; Cincinnati: Harvey Whitney Books, 1992
  • jemhh
    jemhh Posts: 14,261 Member
    From this article:
    • Tarnopolsky et al. (1992) observed no differences in whole body protein synthesis or indexes of lean body mass in strength athletes consuming either 0.64g/lb or 1.10g/lb over a 2 week period. Protein oxidation did increase in the high protein group, indicating a nutrient overload.
    • Walberg et al. (1988) found that 0.73g/lb was sufficient to maintain positive nitrogen balance in cutting weightlifters over a 7 day time period.
    • Tarnopolsky et al. (1988) found that only 0.37g/lb was required to maintain positive nitrogen balance in elite bodybuilders (over 5 years of experience, possible previous use of androgens) over a 10 day period. 0.45g/lb was sufficient to maintain lean body mass in bodybuilders over a 2 week period. The authors suggested that 0.55g/lb was sufficient for bodybuilders.
    • Lemon et al. (1992) found no differences in muscle mass or strength gains in novice bodybuilders consuming either 0.61g/lb or 1.19g/lb over a 4 week period. Based on nitrogen balance data, the authors recommended 0.75g/lb.
    • Hoffman et al. (2006) found no differences in body composition, strength or resting hormonal concentrations in strength athletes consuming either 0.77g/lb or >0.91g/lb over a 3 month period.

    and
    If you still think you need more than 0.82g/lb because you think you train harder than these test subjects, think again. Lemon et al. (1992) studied bodybuilders training 1.5h per day, 6 days per week and still concluded 0.75g/lb is the highest intake at which body composition benefits could occur.

    and then
    A final objection that is often heard is that these values may be true during bulking or maintenance periods, but cutting requires more protein to maintain muscle mass. Walberg et al. (1988) studied cutting weightlifters and they still found 0.73g/lb was sufficient to maintain lean body mass.

    In the end, eating more protein is likely not going to cause you problems (assuming no other underlying medical issues.) So if you like your protein, go for it. I eat over my protein goal fairly often because I like to.
  • Michael190lbs
    Michael190lbs Posts: 1,510 Member
    edited April 2015
    Well if this is true you two just saved me about $60.00 a month in protein suppliments thanks
  • dieselbyte
    dieselbyte Posts: 733 Member
    jemhh wrote: »
    From this article:
    • Tarnopolsky et al. (1992) observed no differences in whole body protein synthesis or indexes of lean body mass in strength athletes consuming either 0.64g/lb or 1.10g/lb over a 2 week period. Protein oxidation did increase in the high protein group, indicating a nutrient overload.
    • Walberg et al. (1988) found that 0.73g/lb was sufficient to maintain positive nitrogen balance in cutting weightlifters over a 7 day time period.
    • Tarnopolsky et al. (1988) found that only 0.37g/lb was required to maintain positive nitrogen balance in elite bodybuilders (over 5 years of experience, possible previous use of androgens) over a 10 day period. 0.45g/lb was sufficient to maintain lean body mass in bodybuilders over a 2 week period. The authors suggested that 0.55g/lb was sufficient for bodybuilders.
    • Lemon et al. (1992) found no differences in muscle mass or strength gains in novice bodybuilders consuming either 0.61g/lb or 1.19g/lb over a 4 week period. Based on nitrogen balance data, the authors recommended 0.75g/lb.
    • Hoffman et al. (2006) found no differences in body composition, strength or resting hormonal concentrations in strength athletes consuming either 0.77g/lb or >0.91g/lb over a 3 month period.

    and
    If you still think you need more than 0.82g/lb because you think you train harder than these test subjects, think again. Lemon et al. (1992) studied bodybuilders training 1.5h per day, 6 days per week and still concluded 0.75g/lb is the highest intake at which body composition benefits could occur.

    and then
    A final objection that is often heard is that these values may be true during bulking or maintenance periods, but cutting requires more protein to maintain muscle mass. Walberg et al. (1988) studied cutting weightlifters and they still found 0.73g/lb was sufficient to maintain lean body mass.

    In the end, eating more protein is likely not going to cause you problems (assuming no other underlying medical issues.) So if you like your protein, go for it. I eat over my protein goal fairly often because I like to.

    ^So this. Thank you @jemhh
  • jemhh
    jemhh Posts: 14,261 Member
    Feel free to send me my cut via Paypal :smile:
  • dieselbyte
    dieselbyte Posts: 733 Member
    Also -

    Dietary protein for athletes: from requirements to optimum adaptation
    Phillips SM, Van Loon LJ

    Protein intakes in the range of 1.3-1.8 g · kg(-1) · day(-1) consumed as 3-4 isonitrogenous meals will maximize muscle protein synthesis. These recommendations may also be dependent on training status: experienced athletes would require less, while more protein should be consumed during periods of high frequency/intensity training. Elevated protein consumption, as high as 1.8-2.0 g · kg(-1) · day(-1) depending on the caloric deficit, may be advantageous in preventing lean mass losses during periods of energy restriction to promote fat loss.

    1kg=2.2lbs. On the low end, .6g/lbs was studied to be sufficient.
  • dieselbyte
    dieselbyte Posts: 733 Member
    jemhh wrote: »
    Feel free to send me my cut via Paypal :smile:

    Check is in the mail... ;)
  • Michael190lbs
    Michael190lbs Posts: 1,510 Member
    edited April 2015
    LOL Thanks Guys I'm going to drop down to under 200 grams and see what happens- What about Fat I keep that at 100 grams and carbs around 50 do they matter? I love fish and meats get most of my fats from red meat, eggs and pistachios. I do Cardio everyday, twice two days a week and lift four days a week. I'm down 75 lbs over the course of two years 38 this past year..
  • jemhh
    jemhh Posts: 14,261 Member
    Michael190lbs wrote: »
    LOL Thanks Guys I'm going to drop down to under 200 grams and see what happens- What about Fat I keep that at 100 grams and carbs around 50 do they matter? I love fish and meats get most of my fats from red meat, eggs and pistachios. I do Cardio everyday, twice two days a week and lift four days a week. I'm down 75 lbs over the course of two years 38 this past year..

    .4 x 196 = 78.4 grams of fat. I'd round to 80 for simplicity's sake. That would be your minimum so if you like your 100 grams of fat by all means stick with it. The rest of your calories can be whatever you want. I could be wrong but if you up your carbs you might have a bit of water weight gain.

    You've done a great job losing. 75 lbs is fantastic. Are you still working on losing more?
  • richln
    richln Posts: 809 Member
    Anybody read the entire Tarnopolsky article? I would assume they are talking protein per pound (of lean body mass), although the abstract doesn't actually state LBM specifically.
  • Michael190lbs
    Michael190lbs Posts: 1,510 Member
    jemhh wrote: »
    Michael190lbs wrote: »
    LOL Thanks Guys I'm going to drop down to under 200 grams and see what happens- What about Fat I keep that at 100 grams and carbs around 50 do they matter? I love fish and meats get most of my fats from red meat, eggs and pistachios. I do Cardio everyday, twice two days a week and lift four days a week. I'm down 75 lbs over the course of two years 38 this past year..

    .4 x 196 = 78.4 grams of fat. I'd round to 80 for simplicity's sake. That would be your minimum so if you like your 100 grams of fat by all means stick with it. The rest of your calories can be whatever you want. I could be wrong but if you up your carbs you might have a bit of water weight gain.

    You've done a great job losing. 75 lbs is fantastic. Are you still working on losing more?

    I don't know what my magic number is or if one even exsists I just want to be healthy. My goal for this site is 190 lbs but I am pretty happy the way look now so if I had to answer 185-195 depending on the Time of year. I'm a lot more active in spring summer and fall..

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