Running Safety

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  • ffbrown25
    ffbrown25 Posts: 110 Member
    I think that it's probably a good idea to be wary of running alone in secluded trails, no matter if this taser rapist sicko has moved on. Not to be alarmist, but in a country where 1 out of 4 women are sexually assaulted in their lifetimes, a little bit of caution is called for. Everybody knows that women jogging in secluded areas, like trails, are at risk. I think you're doing the right thing in being cautious, listening to your instincts and talking to runners in your area, @demoiselle2014.
  • mwyvr
    mwyvr Posts: 1,883 Member
    edited July 2015
    ffbrown25 wrote: »
    Not to be alarmist, but in a country where 1 out of 4 women are sexually assaulted in their lifetimes, a little bit of caution is called for.

    You are being alarmist. A little bit of understanding is called for. According to the largest anti-sexual assault charity in the United States, persons known to the victim are responsible for 4 of 5 rapes.

    I quote RAINN here: The Perpetrator's not Hiding in the Bushes.

    @ffbrown25 Calling for "caution" using a gross statistic placed out of context isn't helpful. If you want to use the "1 of 4" stat then you should be advocating that women run in a park and never return home. They'd be safer.

    I can't pretend to know what's best for a woman in deciding whether to run or not in a forest except to know the choice is of course going to very individual according to perceived risk and their own physical abilities.

    Statistically I know there is a far greater chance of being hit by a car, or being doored while on a bike, or run over by a bus or garbage truck (all things which have happened lately) than being assaulted on a forest trail in our city, but it happens, even in our fair city.

    I regularly run in a large forested urban park (trails 5 - 10km in length) where a female runner was murdered several years ago. No suspect was located nor arrest ever made. Women banded together to "take back the park", organizing groups of runners. One of my friends hit the trails, alone, the very next day. She's carries a gun (not while running) for her job though. It was a while before lone female runners would regularly frequent the park, but they do again... although my sense is that fewer do. Other friends of mine run deep into the mountains, alone, and cherish the time. They worry about injury and bears, not human predators, and take precautions accordingly.

    I think of the incident every time I run in that park and go out of my way to not surprise people, women in particular, when over taking them and I run with a rather happy looking dog which, perhaps naively, I hope puts people's mind at ease. The more of us that run there, the safer it is.

  • twofastdogs
    twofastdogs Posts: 37 Member
    One suggestion - have you tried the RoadID app? You can send a message with a link to a friend or family member that contains a GPS link. They can track you as you run via your cell phone. You can also set the app to notify that person if you don't move for a certain period of time. While it won't prevent someone from harming you, it is an extra level of protection should something happen.
  • DavPul
    DavPul Posts: 61,406 Member
    demoiselle2014 wrote: »
    To be clear, there were, I believe, six or so reported rapes and attempted rapes this park against joggers by this particular rapist, who hides by the trails in the woods, waits for lone women joggers, and tasers his victims. The first victims were attacked, but the rapist got flustered when they fought back. The last two or so, he'd gotten better/less fearful, and he succeeded in tasering and raping the women despite their fighting back. He was attacking women of all ages, from teenager to 70s.

    There was a cluster of attacks in 2011, and then a period of two years when there was quiet, then another cluster of attacks in 2013, and now another two year period of quiet. The police believe that between 2011 and 2013, the rapist was living in another city, and then moved back to this area. He was never caught. It is unclear whether he's permanently gone from the area.

    It was the pattern of escalating violence and the gaps in the attack history that concerned me.

    So how long till we consider an attacker that hasn't attacked in two years to no longer be an "active" attacker? If we're using gaps in attack history to escalate the perceived danger, we're gonna be chasing our tails.

    The gaps were probably while the guy was serving time for something else. Now he's in his third strike so this gap might be a while
  • DavPul
    DavPul Posts: 61,406 Member
    ffbrown25 wrote: »
    I think that it's probably a good idea to be wary of running alone in secluded trails, no matter if this taser rapist sicko has moved on. Not to be alarmist, but in a country where 1 out of 4 women are sexually assaulted in their lifetimes, a little bit of caution is called for. Everybody knows that women jogging in secluded areas, like trails, are at risk. I think you're doing the right thing in being cautious, listening to your instincts and talking to runners in your area, @demoiselle2014.

    Well.....

    Mvdyennbr covered everything I would have said, so....carry on, then
  • demoiselle2014
    demoiselle2014 Posts: 474 Member
    DavPul wrote: »
    demoiselle2014 wrote: »
    To be clear, there were, I believe, six or so reported rapes and attempted rapes this park against joggers by this particular rapist, who hides by the trails in the woods, waits for lone women joggers, and tasers his victims. The first victims were attacked, but the rapist got flustered when they fought back. The last two or so, he'd gotten better/less fearful, and he succeeded in tasering and raping the women despite their fighting back. He was attacking women of all ages, from teenager to 70s.

    There was a cluster of attacks in 2011, and then a period of two years when there was quiet, then another cluster of attacks in 2013, and now another two year period of quiet. The police believe that between 2011 and 2013, the rapist was living in another city, and then moved back to this area. He was never caught. It is unclear whether he's permanently gone from the area.

    It was the pattern of escalating violence and the gaps in the attack history that concerned me.

    So how long till we consider an attacker that hasn't attacked in two years to no longer be an "active" attacker? If we're using gaps in attack history to escalate the perceived danger, we're gonna be chasing our tails.

    The gaps were probably while the guy was serving time for something else. Now he's in his third strike so this gap might be a while

    Agreed.

    I would have thought two years was enough time. The insistence of the running group that I shouldn't run made me reconsider everything.

    I thank everyone for their good advice. I am going to join the running group one day a week, and reevaluate running alone in that particular area later on. I wish I could get hubby to run with me, but maybe he'll agree to hikes sometimes, too.

    I'll consider borrowing a dog, too... But only if I am sure I can commit regularly.
  • Teamhynes
    Teamhynes Posts: 31 Member
    Several years ago a man exposed himself to me when I went to get my mail early in the morning (had just come home from a trip the night before). When I stepped outside my apartment, in the few seconds it took for me to take in the scene, I knew something wasn't right, but dismissed myself. College-type guy, nice complex, 30 second walk to the mailbox. Reality - I was by myself at 7 AM in the morning with a guy standing on the sidewalk leaning against his car doing nothing, but watching me. It could've taken him a minute to subdue me and get me into his car if that's what he wanted and no one would've known. I wasn't even wearing shoes. It was a good lesson.

    Ignore OP and his crazy comments about letting fear run your life. That isn't this. There's situational awareness and also putting yourself into a situation that's questionable to begin with. Mwyvr has some solid, practical advice. You can still be an introvert and run with a group who will all be busy running instead of conversing. No one says you have to be besties, but if you enjoy that particular route, it's the best way to get it and still stay safe. Or seek out safer routes. You'll enjoy it more either way.
  • MeanderingMammal
    MeanderingMammal Posts: 7,866 Member
    demoiselle2014 wrote: »
    The insistence of the running group that I shouldn't run...

    Groupthink and victim blaming?

  • litsy3
    litsy3 Posts: 783 Member
    I've been thinking about whether I would run there or not, based on this discussion, and I've decided most likely I would. But it's a very individual decision. I run in secluded areas by myself all the time (country roads, woodland, the beach) and sometimes in the dark (I live in Scotland where it is dark quite a lot in the winter!) and I don't worry. When I lived in a city I used to run through some slightly scarier urban areas, if I needed to get somewhere and wanted to get a run in too. When I did that I used to tell myself that I can run quite fast for a long time and that if the average non-distance-running man doesn't catch me in the first 800 metres he probably isn't going to. He wouldn't know when I was coming, so by the time he'd got himself ready to attack me I'd be gone. If I were a slower runner I might think twice about running in an area with a known risk. And if, knowing about the possible risk, I still thought it MIGHT be safe but felt uncomfortable enough not to enjoy it any more, I'd run somewhere else.
  • demoiselle2014
    demoiselle2014 Posts: 474 Member
    MeanderingMammal wrote: »
    demoiselle2014 wrote: »
    The insistence of the running group that I shouldn't run...

    Groupthink and victim blaming?

    Possibly groupthink, but I don't think it was quite victim blaming.
  • MeanderingMammal
    MeanderingMammal Posts: 7,866 Member
    edited July 2015
    demoiselle2014 wrote: »
    MeanderingMammal wrote: »
    demoiselle2014 wrote: »
    The insistence of the running group that I shouldn't run...

    Groupthink and victim blaming?

    Possibly groupthink, but I don't think it was quite victim blaming.

    I was going back to your point about people essentially saying what was she thinking in the event of an incident. Victim blaming is so deeply entrenched that it's the norm, as illustrated at the top of this page.

    I read an article recently by a journalist talking about the #whorepants tag. Having posted a photo in her running tights she got responses along those lines so co-opted the hashtag in Instagram and Twitter.

    What makes a woman wearing running tights warrant those responses, in a way that a man wouldn't?

  • demoiselle2014
    demoiselle2014 Posts: 474 Member
    MeanderingMammal wrote: »
    demoiselle2014 wrote: »
    MeanderingMammal wrote: »
    demoiselle2014 wrote: »
    The insistence of the running group that I shouldn't run...

    Groupthink and victim blaming?

    Possibly groupthink, but I don't think it was quite victim blaming.

    I was going back to your point about people essentially saying what was she thinking in the event of an incident. Victim blaming is so deeply entrenched that it's the norm, as illustrated at the top of this page.

    I got you, now. Yes, it can be an issue.
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