Fat/sugar calories vs. "good" calories
robinjoyc
Posts: 6 Member
Hi Folks - wondering about the general opinion on good vs. bad calories. I have done Weight Watchers off and on throughout my life and have been mostly successful - generally I'm only trying to lose about 5-20 lbs at a time. Their latest points plan pretty much allows you all the fruit and veggies you want - they are free points! I liked that alot.
Now that I've swtiched to MFP and counting calories - no matter what - it's a little bit limiting to have to worry about eating an apple, etc. I have been successful on MFP as well - when I actually track stuff - some times I count the fruit, some times I do not. When I stray, I generally stray towards "bad" foods and weight gain comes quickly. Bad foods like cookies, high fat stuff....you know what I mean. And I feel like I can almost FEEL the fat accumulating in my already fatty areas.
So - trying to formulate this question - Does anyone feel like some calories are worse than others?
Now that I've swtiched to MFP and counting calories - no matter what - it's a little bit limiting to have to worry about eating an apple, etc. I have been successful on MFP as well - when I actually track stuff - some times I count the fruit, some times I do not. When I stray, I generally stray towards "bad" foods and weight gain comes quickly. Bad foods like cookies, high fat stuff....you know what I mean. And I feel like I can almost FEEL the fat accumulating in my already fatty areas.
So - trying to formulate this question - Does anyone feel like some calories are worse than others?
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No. That's not how this works. That's not how any of this works.0
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The general opinion here is that calories matter for weight loss, not what they're made of. Eating certain types of food may make you retain water or feel bloated, but they won't make you gain any more weight than the equivalent amount of calories of any other type of food. And the reason that's the general opinion here is because that's what science tells us, studies have shown that it's calories that matter.
Also I was under the impression that Weight Watchers allowed you 5 portions of 'free' fruit and veg - not all the fruit and veg you want.0 -
Hi Folks - wondering about the general opinion on good vs. bad calories. I have done Weight Watchers off and on throughout my life and have been mostly successful - generally I'm only trying to lose about 5-20 lbs at a time. Their latest points plan pretty much allows you all the fruit and veggies you want - they are free points! I liked that alot.
Now that I've swtiched to MFP and counting calories - no matter what - it's a little bit limiting to have to worry about eating an apple, etc. I have been successful on MFP as well - when I actually track stuff - some times I count the fruit, some times I do not. When I stray, I generally stray towards "bad" foods and weight gain comes quickly. Bad foods like cookies, high fat stuff....you know what I mean. And I feel like I can almost FEEL the fat accumulating in my already fatty areas.
So - trying to formulate this question - Does anyone feel like some calories are worse than others?
Nope.0 -
No such thing as bad calories. It is all about eating the right mix of macro and micro nutrients for you.
I find that pre-logging my main meals really helps. I can see where I am with my macros and then decide what snacks and treats I can have that will fit in. Tonight I am going to a bar to play bar trivia so I add in a couple of beers and popcorn. Other times I know I am going to a birthday party so I add in a slice of cake.
BTW: Weight Watchers does not allow you to eat all the fruit and veggies you want. They have recommendations as to the amounts you should be eating, especially fruit, but you just don't count the points. Last time I did WW, you could eat all the non-starchy veggies you wanted but had to count fruit and starchy veggies like corn, peas, sugar snap pea pods, etc. The point system was not good for me. I did not eat enough fat and protein so I ended up shedding half of my hair and my skin became very dried and crepe-y looking. MFP is much better because you can see exactly what you are eating.
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from what i understand ww allows you less calories in general and gives you 5 "Free" fruits and veggies so you will make it up with what they want you to eat. like say you can have 1500 on MFP. .on ww you would have the equivalent of 1000 but the 5 "free" over that.0
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I believe that natural occurring sugars that you find in fruits are fine to eat as long as that's not the only thing you eat. I'd much rather eat a banana and get the added vitamins than a cookie or some low fat junk with lots of sugar in it that contains more 'bad stuff'. And of course some FOODS are worse than others - and that alters the calories. A calorie is a calorie and cannot be good or bad. Happy logging
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Calories are calories. Everything has calories, except water.
Volume wise, you can eat more fruits and veggies (as long as you stay away from high calorie dressings and toppings) than what you consider "bad foods". Your body, your life, your choice on how you want to spend your daily calorie allotment.0 -
That whole "free" thing is ridiculous. If you want to put a little work in your weight loss a calorie limit does not HAVE to be limiting. I mean, damn...guess what I'm eating? Honey sriracha chicken and chicken fajitas. All in one day. I find healthy calorie-smart recipes and then fit them into my allotment for the day. In short, there are no BAD calories. There are no GOOD calories. A calorie is a calorie. You're gonna probably feel better after eating veggies and leaner meats than you will downing a large fry and bacon-covered burger but honestly? Calories in/calories out.0
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There are no "bad" foods (well except maybe trans fats). There are however, some foods that are more filling, and contain more nutrients than other foods. While eating less it's important to maximize the filling, high nutrient foods. Dietary fat does not make you fat, it's just calorie dense.
What I try to do is IMPROVE my eating habits. I'm not trying for perfection. I will eat a cookie here and there even when I am trying to lose weight. I won't have a perfect diet in the future, so I need to learn portion sizes and calorie counts. As long as I log these things, I'm ok.
WW starts at a lower calorie goal....thus fruits & veggies are "free." They're not free, it's assumed you will eat some of them.
MFP doesn't assume anything, so you need to log these foods.0 -
Food is not good or bad. Some food has more calories than others. Some foods have different macronutrient ratios. Some foods make you feel differently after you eat them. You are attaching your own value system to the food. If eating a cookie makes you feel like fat is instantly accumulating on your body, you do not have a healthy relationship with that food. Cookies are perfectly fine in moderation. Don't beat yourself up because you ate something "bad." You're only making this process worse for yourself by stressing.0
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Definitely log your fruit and vegetables.0
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I think a bad calorie is similar to a weed. A weed is just a plant that is growing somewhere that we don't want it. It is nt not, just not to that spot.
I eat low carb high fat, so I don't eat many carbs. I think some types of carbs are not great foods, but many manage to put them into their diets. They just aren't for me.
So your free fruits and veggies are the type of food I restrict.0 -
For weight loss? No.
Listen, you have to log your fruits and veggies if you're going to use this. You can eat your sweets, but log them, make them fit in your day.0 -
Food is not good or bad. Some food has more calories than others. Some foods have different macronutrient ratios. Some foods make you feel differently after you eat them. You are attaching your own value system to the food. If eating a cookie makes you feel like fat is instantly accumulating on your body, you do not have a healthy relationship with that food. Cookies are perfectly fine in moderation. Don't beat yourself up because you ate something "bad." You're only making this process worse for yourself by stressing.
I want to print this out on cards and hand it out to people. Well said. 0 -
I totally understand what you are saying OP. I try to stay good in my fats and sugars macros because I tend to want to eat more of that type of stuff too. And I also get that you can feel the fat accumulating in your already fat storing areas because I swear I can too. I think (and this is only my opinion) that it is totally better to try and stay within your macro goals. Lower on fat, lower on sugar. I have been doing ok in the sugar area a lot of my days but the fat area is still a little bit of a problem for me. When I am really good, watching sugar intake, watching fat intake, staying at a good carb balance (mostly with fresh vegies there) and getting lots of protein. The weight just falls off for me. It's sticking to that that is a bit harder but it can be done. Good luck to you!0
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Its not so much about good & bad, but there are foods that are easily over eaten because they are calorie dense. Others you can eat as much as you can stand, because they are going to fill you up without adding significant calories.0
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Does anyone feel like some calories are worse than others?
No, for weight loss/gain a calorie is a calorie. For nutritional purposes and other goals, obviously foods are different and not interchangeable, but that doesn't mean that the calories in them do or don't contribute to weight gain depending on what they are.
However, some ways of eating may lead to more calories more easily. Fat is not unhealthy (many high fat foods have lots of nutritional positives), but it adds up to lots of calories more quickly, because fat is 9 cal/gram. So olive oil isn't bad for you, but add a lot and you may be eating a lot more calories than you realized.
Similarly, if you gravitate toward high cal/low nutrient foods (which many of us find not that filling), it may be easy to consume far more calories than you would have thought, without hardly noticing.
I personally think it's important to eat a healthy diet for reasons unrelated to weight loss, and also because for me it makes weight loss/maintenance easier (I tend to be more satisfied and it helps me stay motivated and energetic and feel like I'm getting my all from workouts). But I also think it's important to pay attention to all calories and foods I eat. I dislike the WW approach personally, since it seems to say that fruits and vegetables are irrelevant, only high cal foods (and limiting them) matter, whereas I like to think of constructing a healthy diet as about actively seeking out foods that are good to include in my diet (and tasty). I like to track vegetables to make sure I'm eating enough and a good variety of them.
So I don't equate logging with limiting and that I log my apple doesn't mean I won't eat it (although I don't eat crazy amounts of fruit because it is higher cal -- I pretty much eat unlimited vegetables, though). But if I ate 100 calories from an apple or banana I'd want to know that in deciding how many potatoes to eat that night or when trying to calculate what my maintenance calories are or if I'd eaten enough to fuel my workouts. It's about information, not simply cutting out calories.0 -
Good calories = calories which cause me to meet my calorie goals
Bad calories = calories which cause me not to meet my calorie goals0 -
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I think it highly depends on the person. For some people HOW they create their caloric deficit doesn't matter. For them, it's all about the total numbers. For others, it can make quite a difference.
For example, there was a study done a couple years ago with obese women who were insulin resistant and those who were insulin sensitive. The insulin sensitive women lost nearly twice as much weight with more carbs. It was the exact opposite for the insulin resistant women. They lost nearly twice as much with less carbs. The protein and caloric deficits were the same across all groups -- so same amount of calories proportionally, but how they created their respective deficits yielded dramatically different results. If I could lose nearly twice as much weight by simply adjusting my carbs, I'd definitely want to know about that!
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1038/oby.2005.79/full
Almost half of the US adult population has insulin resistance (at prediabetic or diabetic levels) and the vast majority of them don't know it. That's why it can feel like a magic bullet or a small miracle for people who didn't realize they were insulin resistant and reduce carbs and see dramatically improved results.
I know for me personally, when I hit my protein macros, I'm much more satisfied and able to keep my deficit MUCH MUCH easier. Same with if I'm getting my carbs from primarily whole food source (vegetables and fruits). If I don't eat as much protein and eat more carbs -- especially the super tasty fast acting carbs like cookies, bread, etc. -- it's much more difficult. They aren't nearly as satisfying for me and it's much easier to overeat them. I suspect this is what happens for a LOT of people -- it's just harder for them to keep a caloric deficit with those types of foods in abundance. Some can't even do the moderation thing because it's slippery slope, so they prefer to avoid them altogether.
There is no doubt that the food industry does a LOT of research on figuring out what is the perfect combination of fat/sugar to hit those pleasure centers and have some ingredients that spark appetite (or decrease satiety) -- so you want to eat more and more of their foods. That makes perfect sense from a seller-viewpoint, but not so great for someone that is trying to manage their calories. But, once again, it really does come down the individual. Some will notice no difference and others of us will notice BIG differences.0 -
Strictly speaking, only calories matter for weight loss. However, you need protein and fat to live. You don't absolutely need carbs, although there are some carbs in foods that are good for you.0
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If the calories keep me under my deficit, they are all good - in my opinion!
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you don't get fat just because you had a cookie...your fat doesn't accumulate while you're eating a cookie...if you think that, you need to start doing a ton of research asap.
things like cookies and other typical "junk" foods are calorie dense with a low satiety value and very easy to overeat...thus when people tend to eat a lot of "junk", they tend to overeat...thus they store fat...but in and of itself, a cookie doesn't make you fat.0 -
DeguelloTex wrote: »No. That's not how this works. That's not how any of this works.
^^ that0 -
Food is not good or bad. Some food has more calories than others. Some foods have different macronutrient ratios. Some foods make you feel differently after you eat them. You are attaching your own value system to the food. If eating a cookie makes you feel like fat is instantly accumulating on your body, you do not have a healthy relationship with that food. Cookies are perfectly fine in moderation. Don't beat yourself up because you ate something "bad." You're only making this process worse for yourself by stressing.
For me, timing of foods high in sugar is important. I had two cookies in the middle of the afternoon yesterday and felt yucky afterwards but I am fine with sweets after dinner.
I placed a negative value on my decision making yesterday
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There are no bad foods, except maybe rotten or toxic food (and some rotten or toxic foods are regarded as delicacies (rakfisk, Escolar)). There are no bad calories, or even bad carbs, or bad fats, except trans fats. A calorie is a calorie.
But some foods are more nutritious than others, and some foods are easier to overeat than others. Which foods these are, will vary somewhat from person to person, but usually they are high in calories but low in nutrients (besides carbs and/or fat, obviously), and hyperpalatable.
If you think you can feel fat accumulate while eating a cookie... well, no offense, but talk to a therapist.
MFP and WW are just two of lots of different ways to create a calorie deficit, which is what this weight loss thing is all about. If you cheat, it will feel like it's easier, but it may not give you the result you want. There is no magic involved. Do whatever suits you best!0 -
wow! you guys are so cool for responding! So the general consensus is a calorie is a calorie - which is good news for me - nice and simple. (Some days I want to just drink my calories!) But there were a couple of posts that were very interesting - particularly the weight loss study. I've had this in the back of my mind for a long time - that it made a difference what the calories were made of.
I generally have not paid any attention to the break down of proteins/carbs/fats..etc. I'll start paying more attention to that. One point to make is when I stay within the calorie limits there really isn't enough room to indulge much of the problem foods so I don't think there would be much of a variance in my weight loss/maintenance if I ate horribly imbalanced - there just aren't that many calories to go around which is the point I guess.
i will also start tracking the fruit I eat. It may make a subtle difference. I just have always thought to myself that no one is fat because they've eaten an apple and a pear
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cwolfman13 wrote: »you don't get fat just because you had a cookie...your fat doesn't accumulate while you're eating a cookie...if you think that, you need to start doing a ton of research asap.
things like cookies and other typical "junk" foods are calorie dense with a low satiety value and very easy to overeat...thus when people tend to eat a lot of "junk", they tend to overeat...thus they store fat...but in and of itself, a cookie doesn't make you fat.
ummm...I was speaking figuratively...don't really think that....
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It's all about a deficit. Feel free to check my diary. I eat a real range of things, and I generally eat so-called 'good' food, but I do have treats, and I'm losing weight.
I train a lot, so I like my protein, but you could lose weight eating burgers, fries, chocolate etc, so long as you were at a deficit. You might feel a bit crappy though.0 -
I'm a good calorie / bad calorie person. Good fat / bad fat. Good carb / bad carb.
I don't care how much others rant against the good/bad. Thinking of food as good / bad has kept me healthy for over half a century so I'm not changing now.
More of the good and less of the bad works for me.0
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