clean eating but not meeting guidelines
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I always ate fairly healthy...mostly home cooked, rarely ate fast food, etc. But boy, it took me some time to adjust to what my proper portions should be!
At first I was just flat-out......hungry. I've adjusted, though. And now that 3 or 4 ozs of protein actually is enough.
The only real problem with processed foods in a diet is that they tend to have a lot of sodium, which can cause water retention, of course. And they also add in calories with stuff that really doesn't keep you fueled very well.
But it's good to focus on better food choices, of course. Look at it this way. You have that part down pat. Now you have to tackle.......portions.
Logging the food in and being honest is working for me.0 -
tennisdude2004 wrote: »
Whether kolache is healthier than broccoli or vice versa the point is on any one day it is likely one is a healthier choice than the other.DeguelloTex wrote: »
No, broccoli isn't inherently better than the kolache. It might be. If you need quick energy, or you already have enough for that day of what broccoli offers, the kolache might be the better choice. Neither one can be said to be better without knowing the purpose. It's like saying a hammer is better than a crescent wrench without knowing what the task is.tennisdude2004 wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
My viewpoint is that carbs, food with carbs, and, indeed, all foods are best evaluated within the context of the overall diet, rather than as items existing in their own little universes. It doesn't make sense to say, "X is healthier than Y" when you don't know what part X or Y is playing in the overall diet at any given time.tennisdude2004 wrote: »
That's why I am asking for clarification!DeguelloTex wrote: »
Your purported clarification is a pretty egregious misstatement of what I actually wrote.tennisdude2004 wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
I dispute it. It depends on the foods' places and uses in the overall diet.tennisdude2004 wrote: »
Plus, where have I said cake is an unhealthy option???????
A few quotes up you said:
"Absolutely not. Cake doesn't make it on my healthier food choice list." ?
I did say that. But how does that translate to unhealthy??
No carbs (excessive portions aside) are unhealthy. Therefore it stands to reason that the baseline is 'healthy' and the more micro nutrition a carb can deliver is a healthier choice.
I hope that has cleared up my meaning of healthier carbs for you and others.
I'm sure you are in agreement that some carbs (foods made up from carbs) are in fact healthier than others, or do you dispute this - I would be interested to know?
You dispute that some carbs are healthier than others????
So just to clarify - you believe all carbs 'gram for gram' offer the exact same level of health benefits?
Well there's your problem understanding my comments earlier right there.
If you are disputing that some carbs are healthier than others - surely it's the only other view point???
Either some carbs are healthier than other or they are not (and therefore all equal)!
Maybe you can explain your view point to clear up any misunderstanding!
If you already have enough -- macro, micro, whatever -- of whatever X offers, more X isn't necessarily better than some Y, whether X and Y are broccoli, chocolate cake, ribeye, or anything else.
So, no, your dichotomy is false. Today, broccoli may be the better choice than a kolache. Tomorrow, it may not be.
No my dichotomy is correct - some carbs are better than others - in your example broccoli is better than kolache.
So your statement that you dispute it is actually incorrect.
As I said in an earlier post its all about making healthier choices.
And yes I agree with you that those choices maybe be different for each individual - but the fact remains some carbs are better than other.
The dichotomy is correct - some carbs will always be a healthier choice than others.
As desperate as you are to disagree, everything you are saying is confirming it!
0 -
queenliz99 wrote: »tennisdude2004 wrote: »
Whether kolache is healthier than broccoli or vice versa the point is on any one day it is likely one is a healthier choice than the other.DeguelloTex wrote: »
No, broccoli isn't inherently better than the kolache. It might be. If you need quick energy, or you already have enough for that day of what broccoli offers, the kolache might be the better choice. Neither one can be said to be better without knowing the purpose. It's like saying a hammer is better than a crescent wrench without knowing what the task is.tennisdude2004 wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
My viewpoint is that carbs, food with carbs, and, indeed, all foods are best evaluated within the context of the overall diet, rather than as items existing in their own little universes. It doesn't make sense to say, "X is healthier than Y" when you don't know what part X or Y is playing in the overall diet at any given time.tennisdude2004 wrote: »
That's why I am asking for clarification!DeguelloTex wrote: »
Your purported clarification is a pretty egregious misstatement of what I actually wrote.tennisdude2004 wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
I dispute it. It depends on the foods' places and uses in the overall diet.tennisdude2004 wrote: »
Plus, where have I said cake is an unhealthy option???????
A few quotes up you said:
"Absolutely not. Cake doesn't make it on my healthier food choice list." ?
I did say that. But how does that translate to unhealthy??
No carbs (excessive portions aside) are unhealthy. Therefore it stands to reason that the baseline is 'healthy' and the more micro nutrition a carb can deliver is a healthier choice.
I hope that has cleared up my meaning of healthier carbs for you and others.
I'm sure you are in agreement that some carbs (foods made up from carbs) are in fact healthier than others, or do you dispute this - I would be interested to know?
You dispute that some carbs are healthier than others????
So just to clarify - you believe all carbs 'gram for gram' offer the exact same level of health benefits?
Well there's your problem understanding my comments earlier right there.
If you are disputing that some carbs are healthier than others - surely it's the only other view point???
Either some carbs are healthier than other or they are not (and therefore all equal)!
Maybe you can explain your view point to clear up any misunderstanding!
If you already have enough -- macro, micro, whatever -- of whatever X offers, more X isn't necessarily better than some Y, whether X and Y are broccoli, chocolate cake, ribeye, or anything else.
So, no, your dichotomy is false. Today, broccoli may be the better choice than a kolache. Tomorrow, it may not be.
No my dichotomy is correct - some carbs are better than others - in your example broccoli is better than kolache.
So your statement that you dispute it is actually incorrect.
As I said in an earlier post its all about making healthier choices.
And yes I agree with you that those choices maybe be different for each individual - but the fact remains some carbs are better than other.
The dichotomy is correct - some carbs will always be a healthier choice than others.
As desperate as you are to disagree, everything you are saying is confirming it!
@queenliz99 I am stealing this for the kitteh gif thread!0 -
DeguelloTex wrote: »
How do you get from "on any one day" your first paragraph to "always" in your second paragraph?tennisdude2004 wrote: »
Whether kolache is healthier than broccoli or vice versa the point is on any one day it is likely one is a healthier choice than the other.DeguelloTex wrote: »
No, broccoli isn't inherently better than the kolache. It might be. If you need quick energy, or you already have enough for that day of what broccoli offers, the kolache might be the better choice. Neither one can be said to be better without knowing the purpose. It's like saying a hammer is better than a crescent wrench without knowing what the task is.tennisdude2004 wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
My viewpoint is that carbs, food with carbs, and, indeed, all foods are best evaluated within the context of the overall diet, rather than as items existing in their own little universes. It doesn't make sense to say, "X is healthier than Y" when you don't know what part X or Y is playing in the overall diet at any given time.tennisdude2004 wrote: »
That's why I am asking for clarification!DeguelloTex wrote: »
Your purported clarification is a pretty egregious misstatement of what I actually wrote.tennisdude2004 wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
I dispute it. It depends on the foods' places and uses in the overall diet.tennisdude2004 wrote: »
Plus, where have I said cake is an unhealthy option???????
A few quotes up you said:
"Absolutely not. Cake doesn't make it on my healthier food choice list." ?
I did say that. But how does that translate to unhealthy??
No carbs (excessive portions aside) are unhealthy. Therefore it stands to reason that the baseline is 'healthy' and the more micro nutrition a carb can deliver is a healthier choice.
I hope that has cleared up my meaning of healthier carbs for you and others.
I'm sure you are in agreement that some carbs (foods made up from carbs) are in fact healthier than others, or do you dispute this - I would be interested to know?
You dispute that some carbs are healthier than others????
So just to clarify - you believe all carbs 'gram for gram' offer the exact same level of health benefits?
Well there's your problem understanding my comments earlier right there.
If you are disputing that some carbs are healthier than others - surely it's the only other view point???
Either some carbs are healthier than other or they are not (and therefore all equal)!
Maybe you can explain your view point to clear up any misunderstanding!
If you already have enough -- macro, micro, whatever -- of whatever X offers, more X isn't necessarily better than some Y, whether X and Y are broccoli, chocolate cake, ribeye, or anything else.
So, no, your dichotomy is false. Today, broccoli may be the better choice than a kolache. Tomorrow, it may not be.
No my dichotomy is correct - some carbs are better than others - in your example broccoli is better than kolache.
So your statement that you dispute it is actually incorrect.
As I said in an earlier post its all about making healthier choices.
And yes I agree with you that those choices maybe be different for each individual - but the fact remains some carbs are better than other.
The dichotomy is correct - some carbs will always be a healthier choice than others.
If it can vary by day, it isn't "always." If it's "always," it can't vary by day.
Surely, your point isn't so specious as to be "the best choice is the best choice."
Of course it can.
My dichotomy is some carbs are healthier than others.
Apart from two identical foods, give me an example where that dichotomy isn't correct.0 -
tennisdude2004 wrote: »
Whether kolache is healthier than broccoli or vice versa the point is on any one day it is likely one is a healthier choice than the other.DeguelloTex wrote: »
No, broccoli isn't inherently better than the kolache. It might be. If you need quick energy, or you already have enough for that day of what broccoli offers, the kolache might be the better choice. Neither one can be said to be better without knowing the purpose. It's like saying a hammer is better than a crescent wrench without knowing what the task is.tennisdude2004 wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
My viewpoint is that carbs, food with carbs, and, indeed, all foods are best evaluated within the context of the overall diet, rather than as items existing in their own little universes. It doesn't make sense to say, "X is healthier than Y" when you don't know what part X or Y is playing in the overall diet at any given time.tennisdude2004 wrote: »
That's why I am asking for clarification!DeguelloTex wrote: »
Your purported clarification is a pretty egregious misstatement of what I actually wrote.tennisdude2004 wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
I dispute it. It depends on the foods' places and uses in the overall diet.tennisdude2004 wrote: »
Plus, where have I said cake is an unhealthy option???????
A few quotes up you said:
"Absolutely not. Cake doesn't make it on my healthier food choice list." ?
I did say that. But how does that translate to unhealthy??
No carbs (excessive portions aside) are unhealthy. Therefore it stands to reason that the baseline is 'healthy' and the more micro nutrition a carb can deliver is a healthier choice.
I hope that has cleared up my meaning of healthier carbs for you and others.
I'm sure you are in agreement that some carbs (foods made up from carbs) are in fact healthier than others, or do you dispute this - I would be interested to know?
You dispute that some carbs are healthier than others????
So just to clarify - you believe all carbs 'gram for gram' offer the exact same level of health benefits?
Well there's your problem understanding my comments earlier right there.
If you are disputing that some carbs are healthier than others - surely it's the only other view point???
Either some carbs are healthier than other or they are not (and therefore all equal)!
Maybe you can explain your view point to clear up any misunderstanding!
If you already have enough -- macro, micro, whatever -- of whatever X offers, more X isn't necessarily better than some Y, whether X and Y are broccoli, chocolate cake, ribeye, or anything else.
So, no, your dichotomy is false. Today, broccoli may be the better choice than a kolache. Tomorrow, it may not be.
No my dichotomy is correct - some carbs are better than others - in your example broccoli is better than kolache.
So your statement that you dispute it is actually incorrect.
As I said in an earlier post its all about making healthier choices.
And yes I agree with you that those choices maybe be different for each individual - but the fact remains some carbs are better than other.
The dichotomy is correct - some carbs will always be a healthier choice than others.
As desperate as you are to disagree, everything you are saying is confirming it!
Your edit makes this post confusing.
The first para/sentence agrees with Tex, regarding one choice being preferable to another on a given day due to context.
Then you come in with a second sentence that throws in the word always and perhaps now you're down to parsing things a bit too finely.
Are you asserting that as long as ANY carb is preferable to any other carb it doesn't matter whether it's broccoli or kolache or whether that healthy sticker gets placed on either of those items, as long as one of them gets declared the winner of the healthier choice for the day?
Surely, you wouldn't be doing that now would you?0 -
PeachyCarol wrote: »tennisdude2004 wrote: »
Whether kolache is healthier than broccoli or vice versa the point is on any one day it is likely one is a healthier choice than the other.DeguelloTex wrote: »
No, broccoli isn't inherently better than the kolache. It might be. If you need quick energy, or you already have enough for that day of what broccoli offers, the kolache might be the better choice. Neither one can be said to be better without knowing the purpose. It's like saying a hammer is better than a crescent wrench without knowing what the task is.tennisdude2004 wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
My viewpoint is that carbs, food with carbs, and, indeed, all foods are best evaluated within the context of the overall diet, rather than as items existing in their own little universes. It doesn't make sense to say, "X is healthier than Y" when you don't know what part X or Y is playing in the overall diet at any given time.tennisdude2004 wrote: »
That's why I am asking for clarification!DeguelloTex wrote: »
Your purported clarification is a pretty egregious misstatement of what I actually wrote.tennisdude2004 wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
I dispute it. It depends on the foods' places and uses in the overall diet.tennisdude2004 wrote: »
Plus, where have I said cake is an unhealthy option???????
A few quotes up you said:
"Absolutely not. Cake doesn't make it on my healthier food choice list." ?
I did say that. But how does that translate to unhealthy??
No carbs (excessive portions aside) are unhealthy. Therefore it stands to reason that the baseline is 'healthy' and the more micro nutrition a carb can deliver is a healthier choice.
I hope that has cleared up my meaning of healthier carbs for you and others.
I'm sure you are in agreement that some carbs (foods made up from carbs) are in fact healthier than others, or do you dispute this - I would be interested to know?
You dispute that some carbs are healthier than others????
So just to clarify - you believe all carbs 'gram for gram' offer the exact same level of health benefits?
Well there's your problem understanding my comments earlier right there.
If you are disputing that some carbs are healthier than others - surely it's the only other view point???
Either some carbs are healthier than other or they are not (and therefore all equal)!
Maybe you can explain your view point to clear up any misunderstanding!
If you already have enough -- macro, micro, whatever -- of whatever X offers, more X isn't necessarily better than some Y, whether X and Y are broccoli, chocolate cake, ribeye, or anything else.
So, no, your dichotomy is false. Today, broccoli may be the better choice than a kolache. Tomorrow, it may not be.
No my dichotomy is correct - some carbs are better than others - in your example broccoli is better than kolache.
So your statement that you dispute it is actually incorrect.
As I said in an earlier post its all about making healthier choices.
And yes I agree with you that those choices maybe be different for each individual - but the fact remains some carbs are better than other.
The dichotomy is correct - some carbs will always be a healthier choice than others.
As desperate as you are to disagree, everything you are saying is confirming it!
Your edit makes this post confusing.
The first para/sentence agrees with Tex, regarding one choice being preferable to another on a given day due to context.
Then you come in with a second sentence that throws in the word always and perhaps now you're down to parsing things a bit too finely.
Are you asserting that as long as ANY carb is preferable to any other carb it doesn't matter whether it's broccoli or kolache or whether that healthy sticker gets placed on either of those items, as long as one of them gets declared the winner of the healthier choice for the day?
Surely, you wouldn't be doing that now would you?
My stand point is very clear.
All carbs are healthy.
Some carbs are healthier than others. What's healthier for me may not be what's healthier for others.
But unless there is a belief that all carbs have equal health benefits then that is surely the the view of all.
0 -
I eat 80 - 90% carbs every day and I do just fine. It's a personal preference. If seeing the red upsets you, manually adjust your macro goals
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tennisdude2004 wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
How do you get from "on any one day" your first paragraph to "always" in your second paragraph?tennisdude2004 wrote: »
Whether kolache is healthier than broccoli or vice versa the point is on any one day it is likely one is a healthier choice than the other.DeguelloTex wrote: »
No, broccoli isn't inherently better than the kolache. It might be. If you need quick energy, or you already have enough for that day of what broccoli offers, the kolache might be the better choice. Neither one can be said to be better without knowing the purpose. It's like saying a hammer is better than a crescent wrench without knowing what the task is.tennisdude2004 wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
My viewpoint is that carbs, food with carbs, and, indeed, all foods are best evaluated within the context of the overall diet, rather than as items existing in their own little universes. It doesn't make sense to say, "X is healthier than Y" when you don't know what part X or Y is playing in the overall diet at any given time.tennisdude2004 wrote: »
That's why I am asking for clarification!DeguelloTex wrote: »
Your purported clarification is a pretty egregious misstatement of what I actually wrote.tennisdude2004 wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
I dispute it. It depends on the foods' places and uses in the overall diet.tennisdude2004 wrote: »
Plus, where have I said cake is an unhealthy option???????
A few quotes up you said:
"Absolutely not. Cake doesn't make it on my healthier food choice list." ?
I did say that. But how does that translate to unhealthy??
No carbs (excessive portions aside) are unhealthy. Therefore it stands to reason that the baseline is 'healthy' and the more micro nutrition a carb can deliver is a healthier choice.
I hope that has cleared up my meaning of healthier carbs for you and others.
I'm sure you are in agreement that some carbs (foods made up from carbs) are in fact healthier than others, or do you dispute this - I would be interested to know?
You dispute that some carbs are healthier than others????
So just to clarify - you believe all carbs 'gram for gram' offer the exact same level of health benefits?
Well there's your problem understanding my comments earlier right there.
If you are disputing that some carbs are healthier than others - surely it's the only other view point???
Either some carbs are healthier than other or they are not (and therefore all equal)!
Maybe you can explain your view point to clear up any misunderstanding!
If you already have enough -- macro, micro, whatever -- of whatever X offers, more X isn't necessarily better than some Y, whether X and Y are broccoli, chocolate cake, ribeye, or anything else.
So, no, your dichotomy is false. Today, broccoli may be the better choice than a kolache. Tomorrow, it may not be.
No my dichotomy is correct - some carbs are better than others - in your example broccoli is better than kolache.
So your statement that you dispute it is actually incorrect.
As I said in an earlier post its all about making healthier choices.
And yes I agree with you that those choices maybe be different for each individual - but the fact remains some carbs are better than other.
The dichotomy is correct - some carbs will always be a healthier choice than others.
If it can vary by day, it isn't "always." If it's "always," it can't vary by day.
Surely, your point isn't so specious as to be "the best choice is the best choice."
Of course it can.
My dichotomy is some carbs are healthier than others.
Apart from two identical foods, give me an example where that dichotomy isn't correct.
Kale vs. spinach. Likely irrelevant, and in any case depends on what else you've eaten.
Or for a bigger difference, lentils vs. spinach. Lentils and spinach both have strengths that the other does not have.
Or post workout, rice or sweet potato vs. spinach. Different answer than at some other times.
Someone trying to bulk: sweet potato vs. kale -- different answer than for someone trying to lose weight.
When I was on the bike portion of the half ironman I did this year, I consumed three Cliff shots. I suspect that was a better carb than eating some spinach or even an apple would have been, and I certainly couldn't have easily carried around rice.
So like Tex said, it depends.0 -
kshama2001 wrote: »The wholeness of a food has nothing to do with its caloric and macros values. Look at the differences in almonds, chicken breast, bananas and strawberries.
For the OP, this is one of the more helpful posts.
Wondering if you are reading along, OP, or have any thoughts.0 -
tennisdude2004 wrote: »PeachyCarol wrote: »tennisdude2004 wrote: »
Whether kolache is healthier than broccoli or vice versa the point is on any one day it is likely one is a healthier choice than the other.DeguelloTex wrote: »
No, broccoli isn't inherently better than the kolache. It might be. If you need quick energy, or you already have enough for that day of what broccoli offers, the kolache might be the better choice. Neither one can be said to be better without knowing the purpose. It's like saying a hammer is better than a crescent wrench without knowing what the task is.tennisdude2004 wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
My viewpoint is that carbs, food with carbs, and, indeed, all foods are best evaluated within the context of the overall diet, rather than as items existing in their own little universes. It doesn't make sense to say, "X is healthier than Y" when you don't know what part X or Y is playing in the overall diet at any given time.tennisdude2004 wrote: »
That's why I am asking for clarification!DeguelloTex wrote: »
Your purported clarification is a pretty egregious misstatement of what I actually wrote.tennisdude2004 wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
I dispute it. It depends on the foods' places and uses in the overall diet.tennisdude2004 wrote: »
Plus, where have I said cake is an unhealthy option???????
A few quotes up you said:
"Absolutely not. Cake doesn't make it on my healthier food choice list." ?
I did say that. But how does that translate to unhealthy??
No carbs (excessive portions aside) are unhealthy. Therefore it stands to reason that the baseline is 'healthy' and the more micro nutrition a carb can deliver is a healthier choice.
I hope that has cleared up my meaning of healthier carbs for you and others.
I'm sure you are in agreement that some carbs (foods made up from carbs) are in fact healthier than others, or do you dispute this - I would be interested to know?
You dispute that some carbs are healthier than others????
So just to clarify - you believe all carbs 'gram for gram' offer the exact same level of health benefits?
Well there's your problem understanding my comments earlier right there.
If you are disputing that some carbs are healthier than others - surely it's the only other view point???
Either some carbs are healthier than other or they are not (and therefore all equal)!
Maybe you can explain your view point to clear up any misunderstanding!
If you already have enough -- macro, micro, whatever -- of whatever X offers, more X isn't necessarily better than some Y, whether X and Y are broccoli, chocolate cake, ribeye, or anything else.
So, no, your dichotomy is false. Today, broccoli may be the better choice than a kolache. Tomorrow, it may not be.
No my dichotomy is correct - some carbs are better than others - in your example broccoli is better than kolache.
So your statement that you dispute it is actually incorrect.
As I said in an earlier post its all about making healthier choices.
And yes I agree with you that those choices maybe be different for each individual - but the fact remains some carbs are better than other.
The dichotomy is correct - some carbs will always be a healthier choice than others.
As desperate as you are to disagree, everything you are saying is confirming it!
Your edit makes this post confusing.
The first para/sentence agrees with Tex, regarding one choice being preferable to another on a given day due to context.
Then you come in with a second sentence that throws in the word always and perhaps now you're down to parsing things a bit too finely.
Are you asserting that as long as ANY carb is preferable to any other carb it doesn't matter whether it's broccoli or kolache or whether that healthy sticker gets placed on either of those items, as long as one of them gets declared the winner of the healthier choice for the day?
Surely, you wouldn't be doing that now would you?
My stand point is very clear.
All carbs are healthy.
Some carbs are healthier than others. What's healthier for me may not be what's healthier for others.
But unless there is a belief that all carbs have equal health benefits then that is surely the the view of all.
Some foods are more nutritious than others, but that isn't synonymous with healthy without context of diet.
It would be similar to if you were to ask me which has more energy kerosene or gasoline - does it matter which if I'm not looking to start a random fire, but am looking to fuel my car? Of course it does.
So it is with food. Broccoli will always have more micronutrients than raw cane sugar, but if I was looking to use one for energy while doing exercise (something probably healthy, right?), trying to pack enough broccoli in the time it would take to digest would just be silly. So now, would you still insist the broccoli is healthier if relying on it as my carb source prevents me from ever engaging in exercise at full output?0 -
I have been logging at cronometer, mostly for interest and to educate myself. I eat lots of vegetables. In particular, most days I eat broccoli and kale or spinach in the morning, plus some other veg and fruit. By the end of the day, when looking at what I'm short on, according to cronometer, neither broccoli nor spinach/kale nor any fruit will likely help much if at all. Other carbs could. So like Tex said above, it really depends.0
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Your macros aren't going to be the same for every meal so you can't judge if you're over or under until the end of the day or better yet for the week as a whole.0
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DeguelloTex wrote: »
My viewpoint is that carbs, food with carbs, and, indeed, all foods are best evaluated within the context of the overall diet, rather than as items existing in their own little universes. It doesn't make sense to say, "X is healthier than Y" when you don't know what part X or Y is playing in the overall diet at any given time.tennisdude2004 wrote: »
That's why I am asking for clarification!DeguelloTex wrote: »
Your purported clarification is a pretty egregious misstatement of what I actually wrote.tennisdude2004 wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
I dispute it. It depends on the foods' places and uses in the overall diet.tennisdude2004 wrote: »
Plus, where have I said cake is an unhealthy option???????
A few quotes up you said:
"Absolutely not. Cake doesn't make it on my healthier food choice list." ?
I did say that. But how does that translate to unhealthy??
No carbs (excessive portions aside) are unhealthy. Therefore it stands to reason that the baseline is 'healthy' and the more micro nutrition a carb can deliver is a healthier choice.
I hope that has cleared up my meaning of healthier carbs for you and others.
I'm sure you are in agreement that some carbs (foods made up from carbs) are in fact healthier than others, or do you dispute this - I would be interested to know?
You dispute that some carbs are healthier than others????
So just to clarify - you believe all carbs 'gram for gram' offer the exact same level of health benefits?
Well there's your problem understanding my comments earlier right there.
If you are disputing that some carbs are healthier than others - surely it's the only other view point???
Either some carbs are healthier than other or they are not (and therefore all equal)!
Maybe you can explain your view point to clear up any misunderstanding!
If you already have enough -- macro, micro, whatever -- of whatever X offers, more X isn't necessarily better than some Y, whether X and Y are broccoli, chocolate cake, ribeye, or anything else.
So, no, your dichotomy is false. Today, broccoli may be the better choice than a kolache. Tomorrow, it may not be.
Also if you don't follow overly restrictive diets, but just stick with the widely accepted dietary recommendations, you need a hierarchy of choices to draw a healthy "context".
-eat at least 5 portions of fruit and vegetables per day
-limit refined grains to no more than 50% of total grain intake
-limit added/free sugar to no more than 10% of total calorie intake.
You can certainly make room for kolache in your diet, but there are healthier choices, you have to give the priority first.0 -
Gianfranco_R wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
My viewpoint is that carbs, food with carbs, and, indeed, all foods are best evaluated within the context of the overall diet, rather than as items existing in their own little universes. It doesn't make sense to say, "X is healthier than Y" when you don't know what part X or Y is playing in the overall diet at any given time.tennisdude2004 wrote: »
That's why I am asking for clarification!DeguelloTex wrote: »
Your purported clarification is a pretty egregious misstatement of what I actually wrote.tennisdude2004 wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
I dispute it. It depends on the foods' places and uses in the overall diet.tennisdude2004 wrote: »
Plus, where have I said cake is an unhealthy option???????
A few quotes up you said:
"Absolutely not. Cake doesn't make it on my healthier food choice list." ?
I did say that. But how does that translate to unhealthy??
No carbs (excessive portions aside) are unhealthy. Therefore it stands to reason that the baseline is 'healthy' and the more micro nutrition a carb can deliver is a healthier choice.
I hope that has cleared up my meaning of healthier carbs for you and others.
I'm sure you are in agreement that some carbs (foods made up from carbs) are in fact healthier than others, or do you dispute this - I would be interested to know?
You dispute that some carbs are healthier than others????
So just to clarify - you believe all carbs 'gram for gram' offer the exact same level of health benefits?
Well there's your problem understanding my comments earlier right there.
If you are disputing that some carbs are healthier than others - surely it's the only other view point???
Either some carbs are healthier than other or they are not (and therefore all equal)!
Maybe you can explain your view point to clear up any misunderstanding!
If you already have enough -- macro, micro, whatever -- of whatever X offers, more X isn't necessarily better than some Y, whether X and Y are broccoli, chocolate cake, ribeye, or anything else.
So, no, your dichotomy is false. Today, broccoli may be the better choice than a kolache. Tomorrow, it may not be.
Also if you don't follow overly restrictive diets, but just stick with the widely accepted dietary recommendations, you need a hierarchy of choices to draw a healthy "context".
-eat at least 5 portions of fruit and vegetables per day
-limit refined grains to no more than 50% of total grain intake
-limit added/free sugar to no more than 10% of total calorie intake.
You can certainly make room for kolache in your diet, but there are healthier choices, you have to give the priority first.
I would say the hierarcy is more like this:
Appropriate number of calories.
Safe food.
Enough fat and protein.
Enough micronutrients.
Fiber.
Varied food.
Tasty food.
Exciting food.0 -
kommodevaran wrote: »Gianfranco_R wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
My viewpoint is that carbs, food with carbs, and, indeed, all foods are best evaluated within the context of the overall diet, rather than as items existing in their own little universes. It doesn't make sense to say, "X is healthier than Y" when you don't know what part X or Y is playing in the overall diet at any given time.tennisdude2004 wrote: »
That's why I am asking for clarification!DeguelloTex wrote: »
Your purported clarification is a pretty egregious misstatement of what I actually wrote.tennisdude2004 wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
I dispute it. It depends on the foods' places and uses in the overall diet.tennisdude2004 wrote: »
Plus, where have I said cake is an unhealthy option???????
A few quotes up you said:
"Absolutely not. Cake doesn't make it on my healthier food choice list." ?
I did say that. But how does that translate to unhealthy??
No carbs (excessive portions aside) are unhealthy. Therefore it stands to reason that the baseline is 'healthy' and the more micro nutrition a carb can deliver is a healthier choice.
I hope that has cleared up my meaning of healthier carbs for you and others.
I'm sure you are in agreement that some carbs (foods made up from carbs) are in fact healthier than others, or do you dispute this - I would be interested to know?
You dispute that some carbs are healthier than others????
So just to clarify - you believe all carbs 'gram for gram' offer the exact same level of health benefits?
Well there's your problem understanding my comments earlier right there.
If you are disputing that some carbs are healthier than others - surely it's the only other view point???
Either some carbs are healthier than other or they are not (and therefore all equal)!
Maybe you can explain your view point to clear up any misunderstanding!
If you already have enough -- macro, micro, whatever -- of whatever X offers, more X isn't necessarily better than some Y, whether X and Y are broccoli, chocolate cake, ribeye, or anything else.
So, no, your dichotomy is false. Today, broccoli may be the better choice than a kolache. Tomorrow, it may not be.
Also if you don't follow overly restrictive diets, but just stick with the widely accepted dietary recommendations, you need a hierarchy of choices to draw a healthy "context".
-eat at least 5 portions of fruit and vegetables per day
-limit refined grains to no more than 50% of total grain intake
-limit added/free sugar to no more than 10% of total calorie intake.
You can certainly make room for kolache in your diet, but there are healthier choices, you have to give the priority first.
I would say the hierarcy is more like this:
Appropriate number of calories.
Safe food.
Enough fat and protein.
Enough micronutrients.
Fiber.
Varied food.
Tasty food.
Exciting food.
I'm pretty sure Gainfranco-r's hierarchy is from a government website developed by professionals. This should trump the opinion of a random person on a forum.0 -
No such thing as a bad carb. But if I were you I'd try and up my protein, just for satitey. Fruit won't keep you full. Almonds or greek yogurt tends to do more to keep you satisified.0
-
The same pros who gave us the low fat stuff? The egg and sodium merry-go-rounds? Newark?Packerjohn wrote: »kommodevaran wrote: »Gianfranco_R wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
My viewpoint is that carbs, food with carbs, and, indeed, all foods are best evaluated within the context of the overall diet, rather than as items existing in their own little universes. It doesn't make sense to say, "X is healthier than Y" when you don't know what part X or Y is playing in the overall diet at any given time.tennisdude2004 wrote: »
That's why I am asking for clarification!DeguelloTex wrote: »
Your purported clarification is a pretty egregious misstatement of what I actually wrote.tennisdude2004 wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
I dispute it. It depends on the foods' places and uses in the overall diet.tennisdude2004 wrote: »
Plus, where have I said cake is an unhealthy option???????
A few quotes up you said:
"Absolutely not. Cake doesn't make it on my healthier food choice list." ?
I did say that. But how does that translate to unhealthy??
No carbs (excessive portions aside) are unhealthy. Therefore it stands to reason that the baseline is 'healthy' and the more micro nutrition a carb can deliver is a healthier choice.
I hope that has cleared up my meaning of healthier carbs for you and others.
I'm sure you are in agreement that some carbs (foods made up from carbs) are in fact healthier than others, or do you dispute this - I would be interested to know?
You dispute that some carbs are healthier than others????
So just to clarify - you believe all carbs 'gram for gram' offer the exact same level of health benefits?
Well there's your problem understanding my comments earlier right there.
If you are disputing that some carbs are healthier than others - surely it's the only other view point???
Either some carbs are healthier than other or they are not (and therefore all equal)!
Maybe you can explain your view point to clear up any misunderstanding!
If you already have enough -- macro, micro, whatever -- of whatever X offers, more X isn't necessarily better than some Y, whether X and Y are broccoli, chocolate cake, ribeye, or anything else.
So, no, your dichotomy is false. Today, broccoli may be the better choice than a kolache. Tomorrow, it may not be.
Also if you don't follow overly restrictive diets, but just stick with the widely accepted dietary recommendations, you need a hierarchy of choices to draw a healthy "context".
-eat at least 5 portions of fruit and vegetables per day
-limit refined grains to no more than 50% of total grain intake
-limit added/free sugar to no more than 10% of total calorie intake.
You can certainly make room for kolache in your diet, but there are healthier choices, you have to give the priority first.
I would say the hierarcy is more like this:
Appropriate number of calories.
Safe food.
Enough fat and protein.
Enough micronutrients.
Fiber.
Varied food.
Tasty food.
Exciting food.
I'm pretty sure Gainfranco-r's hierarchy is from a government website developed by professionals. This should trump the opinion of a random person on a forum.
Your faith in government professionals is touching.
0 -
Maybe you skipped over this paragraph, even though it was in the bit you quoted (emphasis added):Gianfranco_R wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
My viewpoint is that carbs, food with carbs, and, indeed, all foods are best evaluated within the context of the overall diet, rather than as items existing in their own little universes. It doesn't make sense to say, "X is healthier than Y" when you don't know what part X or Y is playing in the overall diet at any given time.tennisdude2004 wrote: »
That's why I am asking for clarification!DeguelloTex wrote: »
Your purported clarification is a pretty egregious misstatement of what I actually wrote.tennisdude2004 wrote: »DeguelloTex wrote: »
I dispute it. It depends on the foods' places and uses in the overall diet.tennisdude2004 wrote: »
Plus, where have I said cake is an unhealthy option???????
A few quotes up you said:
"Absolutely not. Cake doesn't make it on my healthier food choice list." ?
I did say that. But how does that translate to unhealthy??
No carbs (excessive portions aside) are unhealthy. Therefore it stands to reason that the baseline is 'healthy' and the more micro nutrition a carb can deliver is a healthier choice.
I hope that has cleared up my meaning of healthier carbs for you and others.
I'm sure you are in agreement that some carbs (foods made up from carbs) are in fact healthier than others, or do you dispute this - I would be interested to know?
You dispute that some carbs are healthier than others????
So just to clarify - you believe all carbs 'gram for gram' offer the exact same level of health benefits?
Well there's your problem understanding my comments earlier right there.
If you are disputing that some carbs are healthier than others - surely it's the only other view point???
Either some carbs are healthier than other or they are not (and therefore all equal)!
Maybe you can explain your view point to clear up any misunderstanding!
If you already have enough -- macro, micro, whatever -- of whatever X offers, more X isn't necessarily better than some Y, whether X and Y are broccoli, chocolate cake, ribeye, or anything else.
So, no, your dichotomy is false. Today, broccoli may be the better choice than a kolache. Tomorrow, it may not be.
Also if you don't follow overly restrictive diets, but just stick with the widely accepted dietary recommendations, you need a hierarchy of choices to draw a healthy "context".
-eat at least 5 portions of fruit and vegetables per day
-limit refined grains to no more than 50% of total grain intake
-limit added/free sugar to no more than 10% of total calorie intake.
You can certainly make room for kolache in your diet, but there are healthier choices, you have to give the priority first.
If you already have enough -- macro, micro, whatever -- of whatever X offers, more X isn't necessarily better than some Y, whether X and Y are broccoli, chocolate cake, ribeye, or anything else.0 -
*ahem*
OP a couple pages back you asked if you were keeping to a fairly "whole food" diet and close to your calorie goal, how can your macros be unbalanced? As a person with diabetic training I can answer that.
Besides their relative refinement or otherwise, and their relative calories, different foods have different macro ratios. Take the potato, bald. It is mostly carb. Add cheese and you have fat and a little protein. Add chilli on top and you have even more protein. The potato, beans and tomato all contribute fiber as well.
I was trained to get as many macros, balanced, in every meal. When I balance my macros in every meal they will even out, fairly well, at the end of the day.
You will lose weight, regardless of the macro balance and regardless of the "wholeness" of the foods, if you stick fairly close to the calorie goal.
If you eat potatoes, bald, all day, your macros will be unbalanced. Depending how many you ate will determine if you went over on your calories. It will be a "whole food" day.0
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