Newbie - sort of bulking

mattw4jc · March 2016

I'm new to the idea of bulking / lifting / cutting world and find these forums to be fascinating. I have been a runner / cyclist for years and don't have much trouble controlling my weight. Just this year I thought it might be nice to have a bit more muscle mass. I messaged a little with Mr. Lemon about my situation and he says my cardio habits will make a bulk pretty tough. I understand that but am trying it anyway.

I started counting calories with MFP on March 1 and, at the recommendation of lemon, started the StrongLifts 5x5 program. I've used free weights and at home body weight exercises for years, but never on an actual program. I've done SL5x5 for two weeks so far. I started light and easy so have quickly gone up in weight lifted. And I think I have even gained 2 pounds already! Woohoo! I know that is not all muscle though as I can tell my midsection is growing too. However, my wife and kids insist that my muslces look bigger.

Basically I am having to consume 3600 - 4000 cal to be on the "gain 1 lb per week" setting of MFP. I know this isn't as good as a TDEE calculation and such, but I feel it is getting me in the ballpark. I guess because I continue to run and bike I don't feel like I can say I'm "bulking," but I am eating more than I used to and am doing a lifting program. I guess I'll see where that gets me after a few months.

I don't have any specific questions, but just wanted to chime in and say I appreciate the advice people give and the way everyone seems to be treated with respect and in an encouraging way here. I'm posting this from my desktop, but may try to add a couple of recent pics of me from my mobile so you all can see what I'm starting with.

mattw4jc · March 2016

This is from November of last year at the end of the marathon I was training for. Possibly under 140lbs here. I'm more like 145-7 now. I'm the shirtless guy.

mattw4jc · March 2016

And here is my official "before" pic from March 1. Weight 145lbs.

feisty_bucket · March 2016

Cool, glad to hear it. Sounds like a good plan. Maybe just monitor your gut size and if you start looking too pregnant, it might be time for the cut! (or, ya know, a bodyfat %. Whatever).

arditarose · March 2016

You're in a great position to bulk. Good luck!

raindawg · March 2016

Congrats on starting your bulk. Mine didn't quite work out for me. I'd just caution to manage your effort levels so you don't burn out or injure yourself. I did mine in my late 40's. For me the bulk was fun; going gung ho, eating the calories, lifting the weights, getting stronger and stronger and busting through PR after PR. My problem is I burned out during the cut both mentally and physically. Developed bad tendinitis in my bicep and shoulder and had to stop lifting.

jdscrubs32 · March 2016

Like @arditarose said you are in a great position to bulk. I used to run a lot myself and had unintentionally gotten down to a low body fat. Like you wanted to put weight/muscle on and continue running. I had to reduce running a good bit for me to gain anything and I gained on 4,000 calories. Do it slow so the increase in fat wont be discouraging. Good luck.

StealthHealth · March 2016

I don't want to discourage you - far from it. But, lots of running may be a problem as the lifts progress, in that they can significantly reduce your recovery. Recovery is more than food - rest is also important.

So, you must listen to your body (as an old hand at exercise and controlling your eating you will find this relatively easy) and there may come a point where you have to back off one or the other. The good thing is that the cardio performance can be maintained with a surprisingly small amount of work - it may be prudent to read up on this now as an option to have at your disposal in the future.

mattw4jc · March 2016

StealthHealth wrote: »

I don't want to discourage you - far from it. But, lots of running may be a problem as the lifts progress, in that they can significantly reduce your recovery. Recovery is more than food - rest is also important.

So, you must listen to your body (as an old hand at exercise and controlling your eating you will find this relatively easy) and there may come a point where you have to back off one or the other. The good thing is that the cardio performance can be maintained with a surprisingly small amount of work - it may be prudent to read up on this now as an option to have at your disposal in the future.

What's really odd for me is accepting that eating and going to the gym only 3 times a week is the recommended way to go. I did a serious marathon training program last year which meant running 6 days a week. On top of that I rode my bike to work 5 days a week, plus I fit in some swimming, push-ups, pull-ups, planks, etc. There was never a complete rest day. "Active recovery" is what I call it.

I don't have a scale at home but use one at the gym when I go. Saturday morning's gym visit showed I've gained another 1 - 1.5lbs. So 3 or 4 total since March 1. After that workout, I ran five miles. Back home, I ate 7 scrambled eggs with cheese and 3 medium sized pancakes. I was feeling pretty stuffed and ended up skipping lunch. I like @jdscrubs32's advice of going slow so the fat gain isn't discouraging. I just changed the MFP goal to .5lb per week instead of the 1 I had it on and see what happens there.

My weekly running mileage actually is down a bit from normal, but I'm still going about 5 times a week and for a total of just over 30 miles. Most miles are easy miles.

StealthHealth · March 2016

I understand your frustration and can see the logic in your points. You may have no problems at all, you may stall, who knows? What I do know though is that, as written, Starting Strength (the basis of SL 5x5) dictates minimal cross training and lots of rest. My personal experience* was that, past an initial gain in strength (neuro-muscular adaptation?) I failed to gain strength, muscle, or improve my runs when running and lifting on a similar program.

* I was not clever - I was attempting to improve my 1/2 mara time (which was at 1hr 30mins - OK not world class but not beginner either), lift and lose fat (I think I was on about 1800 -2000 calories at the time - so well into "loss" territory. I was working out 6 days a week - 3 strength and 3 runs. So, I'm sure your experience will be better than mine.

jdscrubs32 · March 2016

mattw4jc wrote: »

StealthHealth wrote: »

I don't want to discourage you - far from it. But, lots of running may be a problem as the lifts progress, in that they can significantly reduce your recovery. Recovery is more than food - rest is also important.

So, you must listen to your body (as an old hand at exercise and controlling your eating you will find this relatively easy) and there may come a point where you have to back off one or the other. The good thing is that the cardio performance can be maintained with a surprisingly small amount of work - it may be prudent to read up on this now as an option to have at your disposal in the future.

What's really odd for me is accepting that eating and going to the gym only 3 times a week is the recommended way to go. I did a serious marathon training program last year which meant running 6 days a week. On top of that I rode my bike to work 5 days a week, plus I fit in some swimming, push-ups, pull-ups, planks, etc. There was never a complete rest day. "Active recovery" is what I call it.

I don't have a scale at home but use one at the gym when I go. Saturday morning's gym visit showed I've gained another 1 - 1.5lbs. So 3 or 4 total since March 1. After that workout, I ran five miles. Back home, I ate 7 scrambled eggs with cheese and 3 medium sized pancakes. I was feeling pretty stuffed and ended up skipping lunch. I like @jdscrubs32's advice of going slow so the fat gain isn't discouraging. I just changed the MFP goal to .5lb per week instead of the 1 I had it on and see what happens there.

My weekly running mileage actually is down a bit from normal, but I'm still going about 5 times a week and for a total of just over 30 miles. Most miles are easy miles.

You may find in time that the gains will slow down due to the amount of running you are doing. Even though I didn't want to, I had to reduce the running I did to one 30 minute session a week just to continue gaining. Once I reached my goal weight, I increased the amount of running back to the amount I used to run at, one 10k a week, which is nothing compared to you. What @StealthHealth said about recovery is important. If you continue running the amount you do, it might be hard to progress on squats for example as your legs will always be fatigued from running. However continue going the way you are and see how you get on.

mattw4jc · March 2016

Thanks guys. Good info. Stealth, a 1:30 half is a great time and fast pace for non-elites and people with real lives. Last year I trained for a sub-3 marathon and was hitting 60 - 70 mile weeks. So 30is miles seems easy and not taxing at all. This year I only have some shorter races on the schedule and nothing until July, so keeping the miles lower and slower is fine.

And I didn't mean to come across as frustrated. Far from it. I just started and am so far pleased with how it's going. I've gained a little and feel stronger on all of the SL 5x5 exercises. It's just different only doing a "tough" workout only 3 times a week.

Right now I'm in a "Let's see how it goes" mind-set with no serious goal of "gain X pounds by Y date." So - yes to this: "However continue going the way you are and see how you get on."

mattw4jc · March 2016

Last week ended my third full week of StrongLifts 5x5. I started fairly light and was able to move up in weights pretty quickly. But now I'm noticing some difficulty in doing so - especially on the squat and overhead press.

I squatted 135 for the first time last Monday. It was tough and I felt I should repeat it before moving up, so I repeated the 135 on Wednesday. It felt better and I even added 5lbs to the last two sets. Then Friday I did 140, but it again felt tough. I feel like I'm comprimising form at this point. I feel a bit of strain on my lower back when doing the lift, but it doesn't seem to have any after effects. Should I drop back down to 135 (or less) or stick with the 140 for tonight's workout?

Similar situation on the overhead press. I have been adding weight each time, but the 90lb I did on Friday felt hard. And these also seem to strain my lower back. Should I go back down a little to feel more confident in the weight? Could I do this as a seated exercise (maybe moving an upright chair into the rack)?

I guess in general, how heavy should heavy feel before going increasing the weight in a given exercise?

In a couple of threads I've seen the term "deload" used. I'm not sure what that means. Is it only when doing a cut? In marathon training, most programs have you build up miles for 2 or 3 weeks, then do a cut-back before again upping the weekly total. Is there a similar recommendation in weight lifting?

I'm still eating plenty, so I don't think calorie intake is an issue. I'm also still biking to work and running, so perhaps that is causing some stagnation here. Any feedback is welcome. Thanks!

Newbie - sort of bulking

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