Are you a hard gainer, please read!
Replies
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ForecasterJason wrote: »
This is really just more of a semantics question. I know that the discussion here is on metabolisms and variances to the norm, which for the most part I agree with. But if you have a high tdee, wouldn't it be fair to say that your overall metabolism is high as well (since metabolism is the sum of all reactions going on in the body)? Not that it's above what would be expected for height/weight/age/activity level, but high compared to someone who is less active (which would be the norm given how much of the population is sedentary).And due to that I had a high tdee, not a high metabolism.
Can't say I've ever seen anyone who gets their high TDEE from tons of exercise claiming they have a fast metabolism.0 -
Very nice! Thank you so much for making everything simple.0
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from the Oxford dictionary
Metabolism
'The chemical processes that occur within a living organism in order to maintain life.' (yes, so someone with a high TDEE could in this parameter be described as simply having a high metabolism)
BUT...then there was a second part to the description.
'Two types of metabolism are often distinguished: constructive metabolism, the synthesis of protein, carbohydrates and fats which store tissue and store energy, and destructive metabolism, the breakdown of complex substances and the consequent production of energy and waste matter.'
So, I have a constructive metabolism that starts at above 1750 net calories, which is LOW compared to most people on this thread.
I have a destructive metabolism that's starts below 1750 net which is again low compared to most people here.
The truth is though, I'd have to go from my BMR (coma calories) and compare it to other women my age, body fat percentage,state of wellness, bone density and weight to truly be able to label my metabolism low , high or average.
I'm betting we would all have the exact same BMR. Conclusion, you can't compare apples to pears. No such thing as a high or low metabolism.1 -
Bump0
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Great post0
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Thanks for a really useful post. I'm on the lookout for easy, high protein/calorie snacks to eat at work so this is great.
One stupid question though. The original post suggests limiting 'clean foods'... What constitutes a clean food? Sounds like something that would be good to eat more of from a novice perspective?
Thanks!1 -
baldylocks14 wrote: »Thanks for a really useful post. I'm on the lookout for easy, high protein/calorie snacks to eat at work so this is great.
One stupid question though. The original post suggests limiting 'clean foods'... What constitutes a clean food? Sounds like something that would be good to eat more of from a novice perspective?
Thanks!
Clean is subjective. Many times, many newbs struggle to get a certain number of calories because they eliminate foods based on their own definition of clean because they think eating clean means less fat accumulation. For some it can be dairy, or grains, or fast food, because they arent putting things into perspective.2 -
Thanks psulemon - that makes alot of sense.0
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We should just tell everyone that needs to gain to look at my diary and eat what I eat since I'm real good at gaining weight. Too bad I suck at losing it. I think I even unintentionally did a bulk once while eating too much and lifting pretty regularly. lol. Kidding...I haven't filled my diary out in weeks.2
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I was eating 2500 plus calories a day and couldn't gain past 95 pounds for five months. I had gastrointestinal problems and other related health issues. My doctor had me track my food reactions. Figured out I had food intolerance. I stopped those foods. And I gained five pounds in the past two months. So sometimes it's individual. If you do have food intolerance that could be part of the weight gain issues. Recovering limits my food options. But, I can always eat more vegetables.2
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@BinaryPulsar I didn't know food intolerance could prevent gain. I guess that makes sense if I think about it....If your body isn't processing the nutrients from the foods they are probably on a quick trip out...Glad you discovered part of the issue.1
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Good thread, psulemon.
I think the point that there are other non-metabolic issues that can occur that prevent gains can be important - from issues similar to "failure to thrive", testosterone, adrenal, thyroid, digestive diseases (even fibromas) can all contribute to what might appear to be a hard-gainer but isn't.
So called "Hard-gainers" tend to have high NEAT - neuromuscular, neurological, psychological, etc. twitchiness. The causes can be a crossover from those stated above - small hormonal changes easily shift NEAT.2 -
enterdanger wrote: »@BinaryPulsar I didn't know food intolerance could prevent gain. I guess that makes sense if I think about it....If your body isn't processing the nutrients from the foods they are probably on a quick trip out...Glad you discovered part of the issue.
Yeah, it appeared I was not able to digest food because my body was freaking out and rejecting foods from reacting to the foods I am intolerant to. But, cutting those out allowed my body to calm down and heal. Now I am digesting my food and everything is getting better.
The more trouble I had with weight gain, the more food I would eat (the foods I was intolerant to), and it got worse and worse. I was scared to cut out food, but that's what made me better.1 -
EvgeniZyntx wrote: »Good thread, psulemon.
I think the point that there are other non-metabolic issues that can occur that prevent gains can be important - from issues similar to "failure to thrive", testosterone, adrenal, thyroid, digestive diseases (even fibromas) can all contribute to what might appear to be a hard-gainer but isn't.
So called "Hard-gainers" tend to have high NEAT - neuromuscular, neurological, psychological, etc. twitchiness. The causes can be a crossover from those stated above - small hormonal changes easily shift NEAT.
Looking back at my OP, I could have sworn I addressed high levels of daily activities, but I guess not. Its a very valid point.
With that in mind, OP has been updated. Another fine example of using my mod powers for the greater good.2 -
EvgeniZyntx wrote: »Good thread, psulemon.
I think the point that there are other non-metabolic issues that can occur that prevent gains can be important - from issues similar to "failure to thrive", testosterone, adrenal, thyroid, digestive diseases (even fibromas) can all contribute to what might appear to be a hard-gainer but isn't.
So called "Hard-gainers" tend to have high NEAT - neuromuscular, neurological, psychological, etc. twitchiness. The causes can be a crossover from those stated above - small hormonal changes easily shift NEAT.
Looking back at my OP, I could have sworn I addressed high levels of daily activities, but I guess not. Its a very valid point.
With that in mind, OP has been updated. Another fine example of using my mod powers for the greater good.
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Great thread.
I see a lot of these questions...
What is the best hardgainer workout routine?”
“I’m a hardgainer and need a good meal plan!”
“What supplements are recommended for hardgainers?”
I would like to add and talk about GENETICS...
There’s no question that genetics do play a large role in determining how slowly or quickly someone can build lean muscle. And it's true that some lifters will require more time and patience to build the physique they’re after.
But whether you’re a naturally gifted bodybuilder with elite genetics or you’re starting off on the complete opposite side of the spectrum, the same basic muscle building principles still apply.
-You need to train hard in the gym using correct form and focus on progressive overload by adding more weight to the bar over time…
-You need to create a proper calorie surplus each day that revolves around high quality sources of protein, carbohydrates and fats…
-You need to understand which supplements could help you accelerate your progress and which ones to avoid…
-You need to track your progress, remain focused and motivated, and stay consistent to your program over time…
When someone call themselves a “hardgainer” and seeking out a specific hardgainer workout, meal plan and supplement approach is not only unnecessary, but it backs you into a corner and leaves you with the false background feeling that gaining muscle is going to be next to impossible.
Sure, you may not have been particularly blessed in the department of muscle building genetics, but so what? How does paying attention to this fact do anything to help you move forward and achieve your goals?
As with anything in life, you need to put your focus on the things you can control and forget about the things you can’t. Pre-occupying yourself with your genetic makeup is a complete waste of time, as absolutely anyone can achieve a strong, impressive, muscular body if they truly want to.
The only difference is that for some people the process may be longer or shorter. And whether you have “good genetics” or “bad genetics”, the overall structure of your bodybuilding approach is essentially going to be the same.
My advice....
Take the entire idea that you require a specific “hardgainer workout” or “hardgainer meal plan” and toss it out the window.
Find your individual calorie/protein/carb/fat needs, structure a workout plan that allows you to properly recover and make consistent strength gains over time, and simply move forward from there.
Very well written and great advice. Thank you for the input.
This and the original post are both great information. Definitely an eye opener for me. I've always been skinny and had a hard time gaining weight. Mostly genetics. I ate alot but the only time I actually gained weight was when I made myself drink ensure and a peanut butter samdwich after every meal. Looking back I realize the foods I did eat were mostly junk foods and I just wasn't eating enough. As I got older I started getting sick and now have food restrictions. It forced me to eat healthier. I found alot of the healthy stuff I already eat are healthy fats, I just need to eat more of it. I thought I was but this app is really helping me to get those calories I need.0 -
If you're a hard gainer:
1) Are you losing weight? If yes, eat more.
2) If you're not losing weight...eat more.
It helps to eat high caloric density foods, like PB&J sammiches...or shots of olive oil.1 -
Nuts are an excellent way to increase calories. Some nuts are especially high in calories such as Brazil nuts and Macadamia nuts. I also like walnuts and pecans and sunflower seeds too. Almonds are good too. And dark chocolate is yummy and high calories.2
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BinaryPulsar wrote: »enterdanger wrote: »@BinaryPulsar I didn't know food intolerance could prevent gain. I guess that makes sense if I think about it....If your body isn't processing the nutrients from the foods they are probably on a quick trip out...Glad you discovered part of the issue.
Yeah, it appeared I was not able to digest food because my body was freaking out and rejecting foods from reacting to the foods I am intolerant to. But, cutting those out allowed my body to calm down and heal. Now I am digesting my food and everything is getting better.
The more trouble I had with weight gain, the more food I would eat (the foods I was intolerant to), and it got worse and worse. I was scared to cut out food, but that's what made me better.
If you don't mind me asking, what condition do you have that cause malabsorption? I have only heard of this one other time and find these kinds of things interesting.0 -
BinaryPulsar wrote: »enterdanger wrote: »@BinaryPulsar I didn't know food intolerance could prevent gain. I guess that makes sense if I think about it....If your body isn't processing the nutrients from the foods they are probably on a quick trip out...Glad you discovered part of the issue.
Yeah, it appeared I was not able to digest food because my body was freaking out and rejecting foods from reacting to the foods I am intolerant to. But, cutting those out allowed my body to calm down and heal. Now I am digesting my food and everything is getting better.
The more trouble I had with weight gain, the more food I would eat (the foods I was intolerant to), and it got worse and worse. I was scared to cut out food, but that's what made me better.
If you don't mind me asking, what condition do you have that cause malabsorption? I have only heard of this one other time and find these kinds of things interesting.
I don't know what condition I have. I have been to 13 doctors and had tests done. I see a Rheumatologist (because I have elevated rheumatoid antibody factor), and she has been most helpful. She says I have all the same symptoms as celiac disease. I stopped gluten. But, ate tons of quinoa. And I had the worst reaction to quinoa. I can't digest most grains and legumes. It might be temporary. Maybe I will improve. It all started because I had a minor issue that a doctor said was an infection (although my test ended up showing no bacteria). I was prescribed antibiotics. It got worse, not better. So, they prescribed a stronger antibiotic. I had side effects and also scar tissue in the cartilage in my nose from the infection (I would have slight nerve sensations and dizziness). But, the infection was definitely gone. They misdiagnosed the side effects and gave me two, very strong, double strength antibiotics. I had a very bad reaction. I had pain, dizziness, couldn't even stand up, then on the last day every inch of my body was covered in a rash and I had very bad facial flushing. I live in Canada. I went to the United States to see a friend that is an ent. He said I was having a severe allergic and adverse reaction and they had given me too many antibiotics that I didn't need. He said I needed some testing for auto-immune disease and to see a neurologist. But, they referred me to a dermatologist. I was recovering so well. But, the dermatologist very very wrongly prescribed a topical vasoconstrictor. I used it just a few times. It triggered a severe nerve disorder in my face. I had debilitating nerve pain. Eating food increased the pain. Lying down increased the pain. So, I could barely sleep four hours a night. I was in a constant traumatic stressful state because of the pain in my trigeminal nerves in my face. I was eating a very weird diet because of it. Lots of quinoa and chickpeas. Then my belly would swell and food would pass through me undigested in just five hours after eating it. I weighed 95, couldn't gain. I started getting swollen welts all over my face. When I changed my diet, the welts all went away (still healing from it), and I began digesting my food again. I also managed my stress better. And I started some probiotics and fermented foods. I still have nerve pain in my face. But, it's improved a lot. And I can mostly sleep normally again. This happened seven months ago.2 -
BinaryPulsar wrote: »BinaryPulsar wrote: »enterdanger wrote: »@BinaryPulsar I didn't know food intolerance could prevent gain. I guess that makes sense if I think about it....If your body isn't processing the nutrients from the foods they are probably on a quick trip out...Glad you discovered part of the issue.
Yeah, it appeared I was not able to digest food because my body was freaking out and rejecting foods from reacting to the foods I am intolerant to. But, cutting those out allowed my body to calm down and heal. Now I am digesting my food and everything is getting better.
The more trouble I had with weight gain, the more food I would eat (the foods I was intolerant to), and it got worse and worse. I was scared to cut out food, but that's what made me better.
If you don't mind me asking, what condition do you have that cause malabsorption? I have only heard of this one other time and find these kinds of things interesting.
I don't know what condition I have. I have been to 13 doctors and had tests done. I see a Rheumatologist (because I have elevated rheumatoid antibody factor), and she has been most helpful. She says I have all the same symptoms as celiac disease. I stopped gluten. But, ate tons of quinoa. And I had the worst reaction to quinoa. I can't digest most grains and legumes. It might be temporary. Maybe I will improve. It all started because I had a minor issue that a doctor said was an infection (although my test ended up showing no bacteria). I was prescribed antibiotics. It got worse, not better. So, they prescribed a stronger antibiotic. I had side effects and also scar tissue in the cartilage in my nose from the infection (I would have slight nerve sensations and dizziness). But, the infection was definitely gone. They misdiagnosed the side effects and gave me two, very strong, double strength antibiotics. I had a very bad reaction. I had pain, dizziness, couldn't even stand up, then on the last day every inch of my body was covered in a rash and I had very bad facial flushing. I live in Canada. I went to the United States to see a friend that is an ent. He said I was having a severe allergic and adverse reaction and they had given me too many antibiotics that I didn't need. He said I needed some testing for auto-immune disease and to see a neurologist. But, they referred me to a dermatologist. I was recovering so well. But, the dermatologist very very wrongly prescribed a topical vasoconstrictor. I used it just a few times. It triggered a severe nerve disorder in my face. I had debilitating nerve pain. Eating food increased the pain. Lying down increased the pain. So, I could barely sleep four hours a night. I was in a constant traumatic stressful state because of the pain in my trigeminal nerves in my face. I was eating a very weird diet because of it. Lots of quinoa and chickpeas. Then my belly would swell and food would pass through me undigested in just five hours after eating it. I weighed 95, couldn't gain. I started getting swollen welts all over my face. When I changed my diet, the welts all went away (still healing from it), and I began digesting my food again. I also managed my stress better. And I started some probiotics and fermented foods. I still have nerve pain in my face. But, it's improved a lot. And I can mostly sleep normally again. This happened seven months ago.
Sorry you went through all of this.
Sounds like the malabsorption was due to the treatment (killing off gut bacteria) and highly restrictive dietary choices. I hope you are able to eat a much larger variety today.1 -
EvgeniZyntx wrote: »BinaryPulsar wrote: »BinaryPulsar wrote: »enterdanger wrote: »@BinaryPulsar I didn't know food intolerance could prevent gain. I guess that makes sense if I think about it....If your body isn't processing the nutrients from the foods they are probably on a quick trip out...Glad you discovered part of the issue.
Yeah, it appeared I was not able to digest food because my body was freaking out and rejecting foods from reacting to the foods I am intolerant to. But, cutting those out allowed my body to calm down and heal. Now I am digesting my food and everything is getting better.
The more trouble I had with weight gain, the more food I would eat (the foods I was intolerant to), and it got worse and worse. I was scared to cut out food, but that's what made me better.
If you don't mind me asking, what condition do you have that cause malabsorption? I have only heard of this one other time and find these kinds of things interesting.
I don't know what condition I have. I have been to 13 doctors and had tests done. I see a Rheumatologist (because I have elevated rheumatoid antibody factor), and she has been most helpful. She says I have all the same symptoms as celiac disease. I stopped gluten. But, ate tons of quinoa. And I had the worst reaction to quinoa. I can't digest most grains and legumes. It might be temporary. Maybe I will improve. It all started because I had a minor issue that a doctor said was an infection (although my test ended up showing no bacteria). I was prescribed antibiotics. It got worse, not better. So, they prescribed a stronger antibiotic. I had side effects and also scar tissue in the cartilage in my nose from the infection (I would have slight nerve sensations and dizziness). But, the infection was definitely gone. They misdiagnosed the side effects and gave me two, very strong, double strength antibiotics. I had a very bad reaction. I had pain, dizziness, couldn't even stand up, then on the last day every inch of my body was covered in a rash and I had very bad facial flushing. I live in Canada. I went to the United States to see a friend that is an ent. He said I was having a severe allergic and adverse reaction and they had given me too many antibiotics that I didn't need. He said I needed some testing for auto-immune disease and to see a neurologist. But, they referred me to a dermatologist. I was recovering so well. But, the dermatologist very very wrongly prescribed a topical vasoconstrictor. I used it just a few times. It triggered a severe nerve disorder in my face. I had debilitating nerve pain. Eating food increased the pain. Lying down increased the pain. So, I could barely sleep four hours a night. I was in a constant traumatic stressful state because of the pain in my trigeminal nerves in my face. I was eating a very weird diet because of it. Lots of quinoa and chickpeas. Then my belly would swell and food would pass through me undigested in just five hours after eating it. I weighed 95, couldn't gain. I started getting swollen welts all over my face. When I changed my diet, the welts all went away (still healing from it), and I began digesting my food again. I also managed my stress better. And I started some probiotics and fermented foods. I still have nerve pain in my face. But, it's improved a lot. And I can mostly sleep normally again. This happened seven months ago.
Sorry you went through all of this.
Sounds like the malabsorption was due to the treatment (killing off gut bacteria) and highly restrictive dietary choices. I hope you are able to eat a much larger variety today.
Thank you! I still have a challenging time. But, I am definitely doing a lot better and eating more variety. The original restrictive diet choices were because foods would cause flushing and nerve pain, that was because of the vasoconstrictor (topical brimonidine). I would have recovered much better from the antibiotics. But, six months after the antibiotics I was wrongly prescribed brimonidine, and that's what really destroyed me.0 -
Hard gainer=noneater3
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Bumping for new people.1
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Could use a bump.1
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Great information here. Thanks a lot. I wanted to know if anyone could suggest some drinks that are high in calories (other than protein shakes and easy to make/come by-no time for using the blender
. Some times I just cannot eat anymore, but I am always drinking something (usually water) so that would be an easy way to get in some extra calories. I only drink one whey protein shake per day after pilates. I do not want to drink another one as they fill me up pretty well and then I end up not eating what I should. Thanks again. 0 -
nicdthomson wrote: »Great information here. Thanks a lot. I wanted to know if anyone could suggest some drinks that are high in calories (other than protein shakes and easy to make/come by-no time for using the blender. Some times I just cannot eat anymore, but I am always drinking something (usually water) so that would be an easy way to get in some extra calories. I only drink one whey protein shake per day after pilates. I do not want to drink another one as they fill me up pretty well and then I end up not eating what I should. Thanks again.
Maybe kefir? I drink that. You can get different flavors. It's like drinkable yogurt.0 -
Bumping for mid-summer folks0
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Great info! Thank you for sharing!0
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