Is 1200 calories not enough?
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So when giving credit for the awesome quote, to whom should I give it? Sue or Rabbit?
I say this as the person who told @winogelato that 'at the end of the day the one who eats the most and still loses wins"
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Those who are consistently eating sub 1200 are going against all scientific and current medical thinking and give me the sads
Read "good calories, bad calories" and/or "why we get fat" by Gary Taubes for starters. It is chock full of data that the NIH consistently gets wrong, but manages to publish as their "guidelines" despite all evidence being to the contrary.
Edit: and please don't misconstrue this post as an attack on your position. I'm simply saying that modern science is way ahead of what most people believe is the currently accepted "truth". For instance, if you try to get the NIH to take a position on intermittent fasting or ketosis as a nutritional management style, you would be SOL. Yet the science with supporting evidence has been there for years.
Yeah no thanks ....Gary Taubes is a master of strawman and logical fallacy. His Theories are not supported by current data.
http://weightology.net/gary-taubes/what-gary-taubes-can-learn-from-evolutionary-theory-an-open-challenge-to-his-hypothesis.html/
https://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/gary-taubes-and-the-cause-of-obesity/
http://www.weightymatters.ca/2011/01/book-review-gary-taubes-why-we-get-fat.html
http://2lbsofstarch.com/2015/05/20/gary-taubes-vs-alan-aragon-epic-debate/
Taubes is actually pretty famous for referencing very old studies and not following through on retractions or subsequent research. More research on low carb diets is to be welcomed but Taubes is nobody to admire
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selfepidemic1 wrote: »I eat 900-1200 doing IF and Keto, and have no issues. If I have a particularly strenuous day I'll eat more, but on low energy/not so taxing days I just eat less.
On IF I thought you were supposed to alternate a fasting day with a day eating at maintenance?
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WinoGelato wrote: »selfepidemic1 wrote: »I eat 900-1200 doing IF and Keto, and have no issues. If I have a particularly strenuous day I'll eat more, but on low energy/not so taxing days I just eat less.
On IF I thought you were supposed to alternate a fasting day with a day eating at maintenance?
You can break it up in a number of ways.
Some do the 5/2 thing. (5 feed days, 2 fast days) others do 18/6 (18h fast, 6h feed) or 23/1. There's several ways to break it up. I do 18/6 personally and verify ketosis with a simple ketostrip one morning a week to verify my schedule isn't off. I haven't gotten to maintenance yet, I will cross that bridge when I get to it.
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Taubes is actually pretty famous for referencing very old studies and not following through on retractions or subsequent research. More research on low carb diets is to be welcomed but Taubes is nobody to admire
As with everything, you have to read the subject matter and come to your own conclusions. There will ALWAYS be someone trying to discredit someone who challenges the norm or what another believes to be true. The most you can do is take it all in and decide for yourself.1 -
Cute kitty. Lol. But yeah you're right. I need to eat more. 1200 just isn't enough to live off of. Maybe some people can do it but I can't.
Except she isn't "right". She is correct in that it goes against the NIH's guidelines, but it is already well documented that the NIH's guidelines have little basis in modern science.
Allow me to directly answer your question. "is 1200 calories not enough?"
The simple answer is "1200 is enough for ME right now, given my goals".
The longer (but still simple answer) goes on to say:
But I avoid carbs because they make me more hungry. And I leverage intermittent fasting to eat more in each sitting, which keeps me satiated longer, which in turn allows me to burn more fat because doing it this way brings on ketosis.
I have lost a staggering amount of weight in a very short amount of time (102lb in 5 months) without losing a disproportionate amount of "lean mass" that the forum members here seem to claim is inevitable. I have tried to leverage any kind of measurable metric available to me. This includes blood work (which I'm required to get every three months thanks to my psoriasis meds), caliper BF measurements, my own scale that also measures pulse wave velocity and body fat, my fitbit measuring my resting heart rate over time, my simple measuring tape, and more. I am a numbers guy, so I will always gravitate towards Good Old Hard Data.
And by every measurable metric thus far, all of my numbers are going on the right direction - and I'm not passing out due to undernutrition or anything.
Despite my success thus far, you will be VERY hard pressed to believe what I am doing is "healthy" if you believe the people in these forums. Even with actual data, the MFP community clings to the idea that there is such a thing as a "dangerously low daily caloric intake" that will "make things worse for you" because the NIH says so. Well, we will simply have to agree to disagree. But my numbers don't lie.
There is a reason that the MFP community promotes slow and steady weight loss beyond trying to preserve lean mass. It is because many people cannot sustain an aggressive deficit, and will give up altogether.
So for the OP and others reading along, can you cut calories dramatically and lose weight rapidly and not lose lean mass and keep it off? I don't know. This poster certainly seems to think so, he's been at it all of 6 months it seems. There are literally hundreds or thousands of others here at MFP who tried aggressive deficits and could not sustain them, or did suffer ill effects like fatigue, hair loss, sallow skin, etc. Many of those people gave up, but many of them decided to try again with a more modest deficit, trying to lose the weight slowly in a way they could live with forever. Those people, like myself, are now successfully maintaining and have been doing so for a year or more.
My comments have nothing to do with NIH recommendations. They come from my own personal experience and what I've seen from 3 years of being an active member on this site and in these forums.2 -
Taubes is actually pretty famous for referencing very old studies and not following through on retractions or subsequent research. More research on low carb diets is to be welcomed but Taubes is nobody to admire
As with everything, you have to read the subject matter and come to your own conclusions. There will ALWAYS be someone trying to discredit someone who challenges the norm or what another believes to be true. The most you can do is take it all in and decide for yourself.
Absolutely, I have read a lot and find that Taubes continues to expound on what but his theory, putting insulin at the root of issues. I find that people like Lyle McDonald, Allan Aragon, Eric Helms and James Kreiger are far more worthwhile reading due to their use of critical thinking and application of the scientific method with an open mind.0 -
I was able to do 1200 to 1300 gross calories to get from 139 to 121 pounds, but after that I had to bump up my calorie intake. I'm 108 pounds now and I still lose weight on 1800 gross when I'm trying to maintain. 1200 gross calorie diets are easier to maintain for people who have a lot of weight to lose/a lot of body fat; this is why it is easier for some and not for others. I would ask everyone claiming they easily gross 1200 calories if they actually use a food scale though, because most of them don't and are eating more than they think.0
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I was able to do 1200 to 1300 gross calories to get from 139 to 121 pounds, but after that I had to bump up my calorie intake. I'm 108 pounds now and I still lose weight on 1800 gross when I'm trying to maintain. 1200 gross calorie diets are easier to maintain for people who have a lot of weight to lose/a lot of body fat; this is why it is easier for some and not for others. I would ask everyone claiming they easily gross 1200 calories if they actually use a food scale though, because most of them don't and are eating more than they think.
I do use a food scale. So I was definitely eating 1200.
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CoachJen71 wrote: »Nightmare_Queen88 wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »Nightmare_Queen88 wrote: »Ok I'll definitely do that. So as far as exercise calories go, if I burn 200 calories, do I eat 1600 calories? I'm only planning on eating half back or maybe 150 if it's 200.
That's a good starting point. Monitor what happens on the scale for a few weeks, if you are losing faster than expected then maybe eat a little more. I always ate back all the adjustments when I got estimates from MFP and when I got a FitBit and I lost at the rate I wanted and am now maintaining.
Ok I will do that. I think 1500 is a good range for me. Because I got really hungry last night and ended up eating a late snack when I shouldn't have. So I'm hoping eating more will prevent that.
I eat Greek yogurt when I take my bedtime pills. If I need extra protein, I add in nut butter and/or PB2. It only adds 80-200 cals to my day, and I always pre-log it like most of the rest of my day so that I make sure I have room for it.
I had 2 string cheeses. They're the ones made with skim milk. I did make sure it fit into my calories and macros. I did, however, go over my protein.0 -
Nightmare_Queen88 wrote: »CoachJen71 wrote: »Nightmare_Queen88 wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »Nightmare_Queen88 wrote: »Ok I'll definitely do that. So as far as exercise calories go, if I burn 200 calories, do I eat 1600 calories? I'm only planning on eating half back or maybe 150 if it's 200.
That's a good starting point. Monitor what happens on the scale for a few weeks, if you are losing faster than expected then maybe eat a little more. I always ate back all the adjustments when I got estimates from MFP and when I got a FitBit and I lost at the rate I wanted and am now maintaining.
Ok I will do that. I think 1500 is a good range for me. Because I got really hungry last night and ended up eating a late snack when I shouldn't have. So I'm hoping eating more will prevent that.
I eat Greek yogurt when I take my bedtime pills. If I need extra protein, I add in nut butter and/or PB2. It only adds 80-200 cals to my day, and I always pre-log it like most of the rest of my day so that I make sure I have room for it.
I had 2 string cheeses. They're the ones made with skim milk. I did make sure it fit into my calories and macros. I did, however, go over my protein.
Think of protein as a minimum to hit, not a limit.
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3dogsrunning wrote: »Nightmare_Queen88 wrote: »CoachJen71 wrote: »Nightmare_Queen88 wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »Nightmare_Queen88 wrote: »Ok I'll definitely do that. So as far as exercise calories go, if I burn 200 calories, do I eat 1600 calories? I'm only planning on eating half back or maybe 150 if it's 200.
That's a good starting point. Monitor what happens on the scale for a few weeks, if you are losing faster than expected then maybe eat a little more. I always ate back all the adjustments when I got estimates from MFP and when I got a FitBit and I lost at the rate I wanted and am now maintaining.
Ok I will do that. I think 1500 is a good range for me. Because I got really hungry last night and ended up eating a late snack when I shouldn't have. So I'm hoping eating more will prevent that.
I eat Greek yogurt when I take my bedtime pills. If I need extra protein, I add in nut butter and/or PB2. It only adds 80-200 cals to my day, and I always pre-log it like most of the rest of my day so that I make sure I have room for it.
I had 2 string cheeses. They're the ones made with skim milk. I did make sure it fit into my calories and macros. I did, however, go over my protein.
Think of protein as a minimum to hit, not a limit.
So it's not going to kill me if I go a little then?0 -
I aim for 1200 calories a day, eat plenty of protein and veggies - and I've lost a stone in a month but yet my muscles are harder and more visible than ever.
As plenty of people have said, eat whatever suits your body. After all, no one knows more about your body than you do.1 -
Nightmare_Queen88 wrote: »3dogsrunning wrote: »Nightmare_Queen88 wrote: »CoachJen71 wrote: »Nightmare_Queen88 wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »Nightmare_Queen88 wrote: »Ok I'll definitely do that. So as far as exercise calories go, if I burn 200 calories, do I eat 1600 calories? I'm only planning on eating half back or maybe 150 if it's 200.
That's a good starting point. Monitor what happens on the scale for a few weeks, if you are losing faster than expected then maybe eat a little more. I always ate back all the adjustments when I got estimates from MFP and when I got a FitBit and I lost at the rate I wanted and am now maintaining.
Ok I will do that. I think 1500 is a good range for me. Because I got really hungry last night and ended up eating a late snack when I shouldn't have. So I'm hoping eating more will prevent that.
I eat Greek yogurt when I take my bedtime pills. If I need extra protein, I add in nut butter and/or PB2. It only adds 80-200 cals to my day, and I always pre-log it like most of the rest of my day so that I make sure I have room for it.
I had 2 string cheeses. They're the ones made with skim milk. I did make sure it fit into my calories and macros. I did, however, go over my protein.
Think of protein as a minimum to hit, not a limit.
So it's not going to kill me if I go a little then?
Protein and fats are both minimums
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Nightmare_Queen88 wrote: »I was able to do 1200 to 1300 gross calories to get from 139 to 121 pounds, but after that I had to bump up my calorie intake. I'm 108 pounds now and I still lose weight on 1800 gross when I'm trying to maintain. 1200 gross calorie diets are easier to maintain for people who have a lot of weight to lose/a lot of body fat; this is why it is easier for some and not for others. I would ask everyone claiming they easily gross 1200 calories if they actually use a food scale though, because most of them don't and are eating more than they think.
I do use a food scale. So I was definitely eating 1200.
I also use a food scale and easily eat 1200 a day. Cut out sugar, cheese and processed foods and it's easy.1 -
Nightmare_Queen88 wrote: »3dogsrunning wrote: »Nightmare_Queen88 wrote: »CoachJen71 wrote: »Nightmare_Queen88 wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »Nightmare_Queen88 wrote: »Ok I'll definitely do that. So as far as exercise calories go, if I burn 200 calories, do I eat 1600 calories? I'm only planning on eating half back or maybe 150 if it's 200.
That's a good starting point. Monitor what happens on the scale for a few weeks, if you are losing faster than expected then maybe eat a little more. I always ate back all the adjustments when I got estimates from MFP and when I got a FitBit and I lost at the rate I wanted and am now maintaining.
Ok I will do that. I think 1500 is a good range for me. Because I got really hungry last night and ended up eating a late snack when I shouldn't have. So I'm hoping eating more will prevent that.
I eat Greek yogurt when I take my bedtime pills. If I need extra protein, I add in nut butter and/or PB2. It only adds 80-200 cals to my day, and I always pre-log it like most of the rest of my day so that I make sure I have room for it.
I had 2 string cheeses. They're the ones made with skim milk. I did make sure it fit into my calories and macros. I did, however, go over my protein.
Think of protein as a minimum to hit, not a limit.
So it's not going to kill me if I go a little then?
Protein and fats are both minimums
Yep, this.0 -
Nightmare_Queen88 wrote: »3dogsrunning wrote: »Nightmare_Queen88 wrote: »CoachJen71 wrote: »Nightmare_Queen88 wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »Nightmare_Queen88 wrote: »Ok I'll definitely do that. So as far as exercise calories go, if I burn 200 calories, do I eat 1600 calories? I'm only planning on eating half back or maybe 150 if it's 200.
That's a good starting point. Monitor what happens on the scale for a few weeks, if you are losing faster than expected then maybe eat a little more. I always ate back all the adjustments when I got estimates from MFP and when I got a FitBit and I lost at the rate I wanted and am now maintaining.
Ok I will do that. I think 1500 is a good range for me. Because I got really hungry last night and ended up eating a late snack when I shouldn't have. So I'm hoping eating more will prevent that.
I eat Greek yogurt when I take my bedtime pills. If I need extra protein, I add in nut butter and/or PB2. It only adds 80-200 cals to my day, and I always pre-log it like most of the rest of my day so that I make sure I have room for it.
I had 2 string cheeses. They're the ones made with skim milk. I did make sure it fit into my calories and macros. I did, however, go over my protein.
Think of protein as a minimum to hit, not a limit.
So it's not going to kill me if I go a little then?
Protein and fats are both minimums
Ok. So what about carbs. Because I can't seem to reach 1500 without going way over my macros. Especially that one. Fat is fine. But when I add everything in I'm over by quite a bit. Almost to 150 on carbs and almost 130 on protein.
I don't know how to reach my goal without going over. 0 -
Nightmare_Queen88 wrote: »Nightmare_Queen88 wrote: »3dogsrunning wrote: »Nightmare_Queen88 wrote: »CoachJen71 wrote: »Nightmare_Queen88 wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »Nightmare_Queen88 wrote: »Ok I'll definitely do that. So as far as exercise calories go, if I burn 200 calories, do I eat 1600 calories? I'm only planning on eating half back or maybe 150 if it's 200.
That's a good starting point. Monitor what happens on the scale for a few weeks, if you are losing faster than expected then maybe eat a little more. I always ate back all the adjustments when I got estimates from MFP and when I got a FitBit and I lost at the rate I wanted and am now maintaining.
Ok I will do that. I think 1500 is a good range for me. Because I got really hungry last night and ended up eating a late snack when I shouldn't have. So I'm hoping eating more will prevent that.
I eat Greek yogurt when I take my bedtime pills. If I need extra protein, I add in nut butter and/or PB2. It only adds 80-200 cals to my day, and I always pre-log it like most of the rest of my day so that I make sure I have room for it.
I had 2 string cheeses. They're the ones made with skim milk. I did make sure it fit into my calories and macros. I did, however, go over my protein.
Think of protein as a minimum to hit, not a limit.
So it's not going to kill me if I go a little then?
Protein and fats are both minimums
Ok. So what about carbs. Because I can't seem to reach 1500 without going way over my macros. Especially that one. Fat is fine. But when I add everything in I'm over by quite a bit. Almost to 150 on carbs and almost 130 on protein. I don't know how to reach my goal without going over.
I'm not worried about carbs. Well, coming up to a race I am but I don't usually have a hard time hitting them. So I worry about hitting my protein minimum which is my biggest challenge, then make sure I'm hitting my fats and let the carbs fall where they may.
But keep in mind - worry about your calorie goal first, and where you macros fall second. You don't have to be exact with your macros but if you are falling way short on one you may want to adjust.
Like I mentioned, I struggle with protein and I want to hit that to help maintain muscle, so I focus on that. Fat isn't hard for me to get.
If you are high on carbs and protein, you must be low on fat or some entries are incorrect.0 -
3dogsrunning wrote: »Nightmare_Queen88 wrote: »Nightmare_Queen88 wrote: »3dogsrunning wrote: »Nightmare_Queen88 wrote: »CoachJen71 wrote: »Nightmare_Queen88 wrote: »WinoGelato wrote: »Nightmare_Queen88 wrote: »Ok I'll definitely do that. So as far as exercise calories go, if I burn 200 calories, do I eat 1600 calories? I'm only planning on eating half back or maybe 150 if it's 200.
That's a good starting point. Monitor what happens on the scale for a few weeks, if you are losing faster than expected then maybe eat a little more. I always ate back all the adjustments when I got estimates from MFP and when I got a FitBit and I lost at the rate I wanted and am now maintaining.
Ok I will do that. I think 1500 is a good range for me. Because I got really hungry last night and ended up eating a late snack when I shouldn't have. So I'm hoping eating more will prevent that.
I eat Greek yogurt when I take my bedtime pills. If I need extra protein, I add in nut butter and/or PB2. It only adds 80-200 cals to my day, and I always pre-log it like most of the rest of my day so that I make sure I have room for it.
I had 2 string cheeses. They're the ones made with skim milk. I did make sure it fit into my calories and macros. I did, however, go over my protein.
Think of protein as a minimum to hit, not a limit.
So it's not going to kill me if I go a little then?
Protein and fats are both minimums
Ok. So what about carbs. Because I can't seem to reach 1500 without going way over my macros. Especially that one. Fat is fine. But when I add everything in I'm over by quite a bit. Almost to 150 on carbs and almost 130 on protein. I don't know how to reach my goal without going over.
I'm not worried about carbs. Well, coming up to a race I am but I don't usually have a hard time hitting them. So I worry about hitting my protein minimum which is my biggest challenge, then make sure I'm hitting my fats and let the carbs fall where they may.
But keep in mind - worry about your calorie goal first, and where you macros fall second. You don't have to be exact with your macros but if you are falling way short on one you may want to adjust.
Like I mentioned, I struggle with protein and I want to hit that to help maintain muscle, so I focus on that. Fat isn't hard for me to get.
If you are high on carbs and protein, you must be low on fat or some entries are incorrect.
All of this. For weight loss OP, the calories are the important part. For satiety and preserving muscle, the macros can be beneficial to focus on. For overall health, micronutrients are important. For mental health, ice cream is important.
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Try putting your numbers in here and see what it says for a 1-2 lb weight loss:
http://www.calculator.net/calorie-calculator.html
If I were you, I'd be very concerned about your impatience. You want to get through your "dieting period"; does that mean returning to "normal" -- and ending up putting it all back on in a year or two? If not, start planning now how you're going to do maintenance. Permanent lifestyle changes are better than dieting to lose as much as possible as quickly as possible. I think there's a reason why so many people here (including me) have a history of yo-yo dieting.2
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