Saucony "minimalist" running shoes vs. Vibrams?

mzenzer
mzenzer Posts: 503 Member
edited September 29 in Fitness and Exercise
Anybody have any experience with Saucony ProGrid Kinvara's? I'm looking to start training for a 5K qualifier race in Septermber and was thinking about getting into the minimalist shoe trend and see how I do with it. I thought about going with some Vibrams but these seem like a better compromise from that extreme, but I don't know maybe their isn't much of a difference between the two. Are these Kinvara's considered "barefoot" in a similar way as the Vibrams are?

http://www.zappos.com/saucony-progrid-kinvara-white-black-slime-green

Replies

  • ckmama
    ckmama Posts: 1,668 Member
    My cousin bought some of those weird shoes with the toes, I think that 's what you are talking about and for the first time ever he runs without shin splints. I also see another guy at the gym running in them.
  • mzenzer
    mzenzer Posts: 503 Member
    My cousin bought some of those weird shoes with the toes, I think that 's what you are talking about and for the first time ever he runs without shin splints. I also see another guy at the gym running in them.

    The Vibrams are the "weird" shoes with the toes. But in looking around at them I came across mentions of the ProGrid shoes that are normal looking but apparently conform to the whole minimalist or natural thing.
  • ckmama
    ckmama Posts: 1,668 Member
    here's a review I found helpful on the site

    If you are over weight or have arch issues these aren't for you. Be prepared that if you're going to wear a pair of Vibram Fivefingers, you are going to be asked how you like them by complete strangers. Also, don't think you're going to be able to step out of a pair of Nike or New Balance running shoes and hit the road with these right away. I wore my KSOs around for about three months to strengthen my feet and lower legs before I went for a run. I still had to take it easy for a while. And forget your normal heel-toe running, you'll need to change your gait. Check out Chi or Pose running and other barefoot running techniques.

    But this person and many other also said how much they loved them.
    I've never had much success with shoes no matter what they are for it doesn't seem to help. I am a tennis shoe fanatic, so I would probably buy the tennis shoes. If it didn't feel right or help I would get the vibrams.
  • XFitMojoMom
    XFitMojoMom Posts: 3,255 Member
    I thought Saucony's minimalist shoe was the Hattoris... http://www.saucony.com/store/SiteController/saucony/productdetails?stockNumber=20126-5&showDefaultOption=true&skuId=***4********20126-5*M090&productId=4-106900&catId=cat700254

    There are two people at my CF gym that use the vibrams and swear by them, personally I haven't tried them, but I'm swapping out my Nike Free for the Hattoris.

    anyway - here is a review on the Hattori
    http://birthdayshoes.com/saucony-hattori-review
  • ckmama
    ckmama Posts: 1,668 Member
    gl
  • sarahkbarnes
    sarahkbarnes Posts: 70
    The less shoe, the better. I would run barefoot every day if it weren't for so many sharp and dangerous things on the ground. I can't comment on either shoe, though, as I've never tried them. I did run a cross country marathon in racing flats, however. Everyopne thought I was insane ;)
  • KPFOLSOM
    KPFOLSOM Posts: 7
    I have a pair of KSO five fingers and I love them. It take a couple of weeks for my feet and legs to get use to them. You use every tiny little muscle and I was sore for about two weeks. However, now that my feet and legs are used it, I can run longer and I think faster than I have before. I love them and would recommend them to everyone, except maybe if you do have arch problems.
  • Madgiebee
    Madgiebee Posts: 6
    I have not tried Saucony's minimalist running shoes but I do use New Balance's version and LOVE THEM. I never throught running felt natural until I started running in them. They look more like regular shoes too, so no questions from complete strangers, or weird things between my toes.

    When shopping for shoes, try different minimalist shoes on side by side, I found the merrells had a very stiff sole.

    If you are going to get into minimalist running: start off slow. Even if you normally do more mileage as you will be using muscles that your former shoes didn't let you use before. A good rule of thumb is to cut your current mileage in half and work up from there. Believe me, I over-did it yesterday and my calves are screaming!

    Good luck! Minimalist running is the way to go!
  • 512cheangela
    512cheangela Posts: 133
    I have Saucony Peregrine's and 2 different models of the Vibrams, the KSO and Sprint. I first joined the minimalist movement with the Vibram KSO's. After 3-4 runs in them, I noticed that although my form was improving, I was slowing down considerably and it was taking me twice as long to recover. They are not kidding that they use muscles you never thought you had ;-).

    This is what prompted me to look at the Saucony shoes. I looked at the Kinvara and decided I wanted just a little more, but not much, shoe than that. I run on a mixture of pavement, asphalt, clay trail, dirt track, and occasionally some pretty rocky trails. The only difference between the Peregrine and Kinvara is 2.3 ounces and a little light cushion and enhanced grip (it's a trail shoe that still feels great on road). The Peregrine feels like a happy middle ground between the conventional shoe and going full minamalist which is quite a shock. The Kinvaras really felt like racing flats to me with a lot of unnecessary cushion/bulk on the heel. I didn't really feel like they felt like a minimalist shoe aside from being lightweight. It just felt like they would promote heel strike which is against the whole mantra of "natural running."

    The Vibrams have done wonders for my form, the Peregrine's are great for building distance, but it wasn't until I got my Newtons that I noticed a significant increase in speed. They promote quicker turnaround and forefoot strike. It's more of a barefoot feel than the Saucony's but they also come at a vastly steeper price. But, truth be told, I've been known to get 600 miles out of my Newtons where the Saucony feels tired after 300.

    Best wishes!
  • rybo
    rybo Posts: 5,424 Member
    I have both the kinvara's & 2 pairs of VFF's. There is no comparison.

    The kinvara's (although called a minimalist shoe) are NOTHING like running in Vibrams. You still have a lot of shoe and a lot of cushioning. But they are extremly light & comfy. I ran a spring marathon in mine with no foot issues at all. One time I ran 3 miles in vibram's then immediate threw on the Kinvara's & ran 3 more miles. It was like I put a pair of bouncy balls on my feet.

    So while yes the saucony's are a really nice shoe, and called minimalist, it's really no where in the ball park of going to a true minimalist shoe like the vibram's.
  • bunchesonothing
    bunchesonothing Posts: 1,015 Member
    I've tried a few minimalist shoes, although not the ones you're talking about. So far, nothing has compared in feel to my Vibrams. And now, they really do feel like a glove. After a run or two in my more regular shoe looking minimalist shoes, when I put on the Vibrams, I am always drawn back to how much of a glove-like, awesome feel they have. <3
  • sharper43
    sharper43 Posts: 109
    I have the Vibram FiveFinger Bikilas. KSOs were originally made for running and then they made the Bikilas, which are a step above that. They have 1mm more rubber sole in the bottom and a little more running tech added. They are great for running and cross training. I haven't had them for very long, but I love wearing them in my boot camp classes - interval / cross training. I've only jogged in them once for 30 mins so far, and had no problems.

    If you only plan to do some serious cross training / plyo only, then i would recommend the Vibram FF Komodo Sport. Those are a step above the Bikilas. They aren't really made for running, but I'm sure you can do that. They are a little more thicker for jumping, but less flexible and kind of stepping away from the barefoot as you cannot feel the ground as well.

    Make sure you stretch your calves really well before working out in these and roll them out on a foam roller after. Also, my trainer gave me some good tips of stretching your achilles tendon. They have these rocking-type stretchers that can help you, but I just do it against a wall. google "achilles stretch" or something like that. I'm sure once your legs and feet are used to them, you can go on some good runs. I'm still trying to ease into mine.

    Other than that, these suckers are soooo comfortable! I wear them everywhere, even grocery shopping. And yes, people often stop me to talk about my shoes, but I don't mind spreading the word about these awesome shoes!
  • sharper43
    sharper43 Posts: 109
    . And now, they really do feel like a glove.

    That's the perfect description! I kept trying to tell people it feels like a compressed sock, but a glove sounds much better.


    Oh and i want to buy some of the other models of fivefingers. I want more pairs!
  • mzenzer
    mzenzer Posts: 503 Member
    Wow thanks everyone tons of great information, as usual MFP'ers come through! The most interesting thing for me is the idea that barefoot/minimalist shoes seem to get you using muscles you didn't know you had or at least in a different way. I've dislocated both knees in the past, and the best thing for me is to have as strong legs as possible. But, also, to have good footing because each time I've dislocated my right and left knees, at least the last time, was because my shoes slipped on unstable surfaces so my foot went one way and my knee when the other. I just think if my feet are more in tune with the ground under them I'd be more aware of surface issues and get a better, more stable grip. That sound right?
  • sla0814
    sla0814 Posts: 240
    I have a pair of the KSO's and I also just purchased the VIVO ultra barefoot shoes. I ran in them for the first time today and REALLY liked them!
  • mzenzer
    mzenzer Posts: 503 Member
    I have a pair of the KSO's and I also just purchased the VIVO ultra barefoot shoes. I ran in them for the first time today and REALLY liked them!

    I like your signature!
  • UltraRunnerGale
    UltraRunnerGale Posts: 346 Member
    I have the Vibram Trek Sports. They are more for trail running and have a bit more traction. I have run 3 road half marathons and many other shorter distances in them. But, to tell you the truth, I don't have the guts to wear them on the trail. While many of my friends do, I just haven't been able to bring myself to do it. During an ultra marathon I stubbed my toe so hard on something hiding under a thick covering of leaves, that I tore my big toenail off the cuticle. Had I been wearing these shoes, I would have broken my toe(s) and maybe my foot.

    Sooooo for me, they are great on the roads and I highly recommend them. AND...... people stop me ALL of the time on the street, in stores, etc and ask me about them! Hell, I've had volunteers at aid stations ask me about them!! Once a woman glanced down and thought I was barefoot and hollered "hillbilly"!!! NO LIE!!
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