When on a cut, is it better having high carb/low fat, the other way around or it doesn't matter?
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filbo132
Posts: 956 Member
I will be starting my cut on the first week of march, but before I do, I was looking at the tdee calculator on tdeecalculator.net and it gives me three ways of cutting, one with moderate carb, one with high carbs and the other being high in fat. Which one is better and what difference does it make...if any?
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Replies
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I will be starting my cut on the first week of march, but before I do, I was looking at the tdee calculator on tdeecalculator.net and it gives me three ways of cutting, one with moderate carb, one with high carbs and the other being high in fat. Which one is better and what difference does it make...if any?
It doesn't make any difference in terms of weight loss.
Your macro balance (after a few important factors) comes down to what mix of macronutrients is most satisfying for you and which fosters adherence for you.
Make sure you're getting adequate protein (.6 - .8 grams of protein per pound of bodyweight) and fat (.25 -.45 grams per pound of bodyweight) and the rest of your calories can be spent on carbs, or split between carbs and the other macros.
Focus on nutri-dense foods first, and fit in treat foods here and there if they help with compliance/dietary satisfaction.8 -
GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »I will be starting my cut on the first week of march, but before I do, I was looking at the tdee calculator on tdeecalculator.net and it gives me three ways of cutting, one with moderate carb, one with high carbs and the other being high in fat. Which one is better and what difference does it make...if any?
It doesn't make any difference in terms of weight loss.
Your macro balance (after a few important factors) comes down to what mix of macronutrients is most satisfying for you and which fosters adherence for you.
Make sure you're getting adequate protein (.6 - .8 grams of protein per pound of bodyweight) and fat (.25 -.45 grams per pound of bodyweight) and the rest of your calories can be spent on carbs, or split between carbs and the other macros.
Focus on nutri-dense foods first, and fit in treat foods here and there if they help with compliance/dietary satisfaction.
You're a lady after my own heart or have come to very similar conclusions to mine0 -
I will be starting my cut on the first week of march, but before I do, I was looking at the tdee calculator on tdeecalculator.net and it gives me three ways of cutting, one with moderate carb, one with high carbs and the other being high in fat. Which one is better and what difference does it make...if any?
Not sure how you've been training up until this point, where you are currently in body composition, and what your goals are, but this article discusses nutrition during cuts. The subjects were bodybuilders, so that changes the equation a bit, but it seems the protein recommendation in their case was higher than that given above. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4033492/
This article also discusses increasing protein intake for athletes to reduce lean body mass loss, and also has the protein higher, around 35%: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19927027
Based on what I've read, it seems like increasing protein and reducing carb intake to a lower percentage than that of protein is the way to go. I think most people here stick to the 0.6-0.8g/kg, but those are people who are mainly focusing on weight loss and aren't dealing as much with the body composition concerns as someone doing a bulk/cut cycle.0 -
I'm pretty sure I typed per pound of bodyweight, not kg, which would account for a similar intake to the recommendations based on kg/LBM.4
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GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »I will be starting my cut on the first week of march, but before I do, I was looking at the tdee calculator on tdeecalculator.net and it gives me three ways of cutting, one with moderate carb, one with high carbs and the other being high in fat. Which one is better and what difference does it make...if any?
It doesn't make any difference in terms of weight loss.
Your macro balance (after a few important factors) comes down to what mix of macronutrients is most satisfying for you and which fosters adherence for you.
Make sure you're getting adequate protein (.6 - .8 grams of protein per pound of bodyweight) and fat (.25 -.45 grams per pound of bodyweight) and the rest of your calories can be spent on carbs, or split between carbs and the other macros.
Focus on nutri-dense foods first, and fit in treat foods here and there if they help with compliance/dietary satisfaction.
You're a lady after my own heart or have come to very similar conclusions to mine
Mine too. Great advice!0 -
GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »I will be starting my cut on the first week of march, but before I do, I was looking at the tdee calculator on tdeecalculator.net and it gives me three ways of cutting, one with moderate carb, one with high carbs and the other being high in fat. Which one is better and what difference does it make...if any?
It doesn't make any difference in terms of weight loss.
Your macro balance (after a few important factors) comes down to what mix of macronutrients is most satisfying for you and which fosters adherence for you.
Make sure you're getting adequate protein (.6 - .8 grams of protein per pound of bodyweight) and fat (.25 -.45 grams per pound of bodyweight) and the rest of your calories can be spent on carbs, or split between carbs and the other macros.
Focus on nutri-dense foods first, and fit in treat foods here and there if they help with compliance/dietary satisfaction.
QFT.0 -
High carb is a bad bad idea in my opinion. If you're trying to gain muscles and lose fat mass, cutting out carbs is the way to go. Healthy food has good carbs, that where you get the carbs you need. Focus on healthy fat and high protein0
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GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »I'm pretty sure I typed per pound of bodyweight, not kg, which would account for a similar intake to the recommendations based on kg/LBM.
I misread the kg/lb, but Helms was still recommending 2.3-3.1 g/kg LBM, which is a significant jump. When you factor in that a cut cycle follows a bulk, and a person engaging in this is generally going to have a higher LBM to body fat ratio than the average person, a higher protein intake seems to be necessary to preserve the muscle. And as I said, I don't know if he needs to necessarily go that high, but I do think that he is most likely looking at something slightly higher than the average for his goals.1 -
nomorepuke wrote: »High carb is a bad bad idea in my opinion. If you're trying to gain muscles and lose fat mass, cutting out carbs is the way to go. Healthy food has good carbs, that where you get the carbs you need. Focus on healthy fat and high protein
I disagree.. cutting out carbs for most people that lift is not the way to go. I know there are some exceptions, keto lifters and all that, but for the majority of weightlifters, carbs provide exercise fuel and actually help with muscle building (pathways stimulated by insulin play a role here).
I usually keep protein and fats the same but reduce carbs to suit my calorie goal during a cut. Your level will be different based on your satiety and caloric intake. I tend to do a very small deficit though, so I keep a good balance of all three macros that keeps me fueled, full and happy6 -
nomorepuke wrote: »High carb is a bad bad idea in my opinion. If you're trying to gain muscles and lose fat mass, cutting out carbs is the way to go. Healthy food has good carbs, that where you get the carbs you need. Focus on healthy fat and high protein
I eat about 39% carbs from all kinds of sources. fruits.. Ice cream.. veggies.. chips.. lost 55 pounds and have maintained majority of muscle during this very long cut. carbs are fine if it suits the person and from any source as long as your in an overall slight deficit. a carb is a carb.. Don't let anyone tell you differently0 -
If you REALLY want to get into it:
0.6 to 0.8g per LB of bodyweight is a MINIMUM. This is about 2x RDA. Protective effects have been measured to 3x RDA. The downside of excess protein is relatively small given normal kidney function. Protein target can be considered a minimum with no maximum in this situation. Both Helms AND other researchers in the field have suggested/hinted of protective effects with higher protein consumption.
Fat should be 0.25g+ per lb of bodyweight. For female it should probably be at least 0.35g if not 0.4g per lb of bodyweight. Saturated fats should be minimal. Hopefully less than 15g. No coconut is NOT gooder and while it may be ok to replace butter it should NOT be used instead of olive oil, or added on top because its healthy!
Fiber should be ~26g+ for female ~38g+ for male. Again, I see that as a minimum.
Carbs? Well other than the above go to town
However there is a school of thought that says limit sugars to 25% of your carbs. I would like to move there from my current 40%+ but hey, nobody's perfect, and certainly NOT me!
While you're at it make sure you eat 4-6x 80g portions of vegetables a day and 2-3x 80g portions of fruit, why not
Perfection is the enemy of good enough: to do a nice healthy cut you first of all need to worry about your calories. Then the protein. Then the rest of it.2 -
GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »I'm pretty sure I typed per pound of bodyweight, not kg, which would account for a similar intake to the recommendations based on kg/LBM.
I misread the kg/lb, but Helms was still recommending 2.3-3.1 g/kg LBM, which is a significant jump. When you factor in that a cut cycle follows a bulk, and a person engaging in this is generally going to have a higher LBM to body fat ratio than the average person, a higher protein intake seems to be necessary to preserve the muscle. And as I said, I don't know if he needs to necessarily go that high, but I do think that he is most likely looking at something slightly higher than the average for his goals.
I did the math on LBM vs. bodyweight and... it's pretty much the same protein intake. Since most people can't factor the LBM reliably, we're pretty much quibbling at this point. If he goes for the high end of my rec, he should be fine, especially if he allocates extra calories to protein.
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I just did some math.
For a 185 pound male with 15% body fat, using Helm's figures, he'd need 163 grams of protein on the low end.
Using my rec, he'd get 148 grams on the high end.
That's not a significant difference, especially since I did state imply my recs were for minimal intake and that you could add additional protein.
Again, this is quibbling. I'm a fan of higher protein intake myself. I find it satiating.2 -
If you're eating the protein you'll want to help maintain muscle mass, you'll almost certainly end up doing the higher fat / lower carb option in order to keep a calorie deficit.
Correlation vs. causality - you don't need to intentionally avoid carbs, but you'll have to in some degree to fit the other macros.3
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