"Lifting heavy" question...
bpatt012
Posts: 10 Member
So I'm on board (albeit somewhat overwhelmed) with the whole strength training thing, I understand the benefits, etc.
My question is, for women, what does lifting heavy actually mean? For you, or in general.
The reason for the question is because I am decently strong for a girl who has not spent a lot of time, at least recently, in a weight room, and also quite competitive, I like to push myself. However, I have glaucoma, and the one thing my doctor has highlighted that should be careful with is heavy weightlifting, which he characterized as "Oh you know, like 200 pounds or whatever, really straining".
Would like to incorporate strength training, and see gains in my strength and fitness, but obviously want to preserve my eyesight. So I'm just wondering, for people who are in this mindset of lifting heavy, pushing yourself.. in practical terms/numbers, what does that mean?
My question is, for women, what does lifting heavy actually mean? For you, or in general.
The reason for the question is because I am decently strong for a girl who has not spent a lot of time, at least recently, in a weight room, and also quite competitive, I like to push myself. However, I have glaucoma, and the one thing my doctor has highlighted that should be careful with is heavy weightlifting, which he characterized as "Oh you know, like 200 pounds or whatever, really straining".
Would like to incorporate strength training, and see gains in my strength and fitness, but obviously want to preserve my eyesight. So I'm just wondering, for people who are in this mindset of lifting heavy, pushing yourself.. in practical terms/numbers, what does that mean?
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Replies
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Heavy for you. It's basically reaching the point to where you can't finish your last set.3
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I started with a dumbbell routine before doing anything with the bar. On things like curls, OHP, etc., I couldn't get much farther than 8-10 pounds. After a few sessions of trying, I dropped back down to 5 pounds and worked back up until my next stall. I haven't lifted in a while due to personal reasons, but when I started Stronglifts I was easily able to do the 45-pound bar for each exercise.2 -
I started with a dumbbell routine before doing anything with the bar. On things like curls, OHP, etc., I couldn't get much farther than 8-10 pounds. After a few sessions of trying, I dropped back down to 5 pounds and worked back up until my next stall. I haven't lifted in a while due to personal reasons, but when I started Stronglifts I was easily able to do the 45-pound bar for each exercise.
thanks for the response! 0 -
I started with the bar and about 9 months later, I'm deadlifting 200lbs and squatting 160lbs. Someone will come and give you bigger numbers. It's all relative.
Start light, work on form, and build up using a progressive lifting program.4 -
There's a big difference between heavy and straining and im guessing the second is probably more important. 200 lbs may be a lot for a beginner but for an experienced lifter it's not straining. So you might start with the bar and just increase very slowly. I wonder if the recommendation is related to avoiding activities that might increase your blood pressure?1
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My question is, for women, what does lifting heavy actually mean? For you, or in general.
context: i'm 51, started lifting just before 49, mild to moderate rheumatoid arthritis that seems to be dormant (touch wood). joints and fatigue are my limiting factors, not eyes. so bear in mind i know nothing at all about what your specific needs or warnings might be.
'heavy' to me after three years of trial and error means what my trainer's been telling me for 18 months. 'always leave two in the tank'. i think it takes a while to find the range of that for your own self, and to get acquainted with the size of your tank.
'heavy' lifting is all about the valsalva manoeuvre, where you stabilize your trunk by pulling in air and creating pressure against/with the muscles throughout your core. so in your case, that does kind of come to my mind as a possible thing. the trouble is, i don't know anything about glaucoma or about how to accommodate something like that if it is an issue.
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Heavy is extremely relevant to the person. When I first started training 225 was my absolute max. Veins popping in my forehead and back rounded. Now it's quite literally a warmup. Overtime heavy now, will be considered light in the future, just slowly progress forward. Id suggest looking for a beginners program like starting strength2
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richardgavel wrote: »I wonder if the recommendation is related to avoiding activities that might increase your blood pressure?
Thanks for all the responses!
And yes, the pressure aspect is exactly it, same with not being able to do things like bungee jumping. It's just tough because not doing bungee jumping is a hard and fast no, so that's easy, but weight training is something that would be good for my health overall to a point, it's just difficult to know at what point it becomes detrimental to my eyes.1 -
If your doctor says don't 'really strain' in the context of protecting your intraocular pressure, then that's your limit.
Don't lift things so heavy that you will be straining.
Maybe work with a PT to find what that (pre straining) max will be for you now? The actual weight and ease at which you lift it can still increase within your safe level of exertion as you make progress.
You will have to be honest with yourself though. If something is 'too heavy' for you to lift without straining, stop and drop back.
If you need more clarification from your doctor/opthamologyst ask for it.
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Was the advice given by your regular doctor? If so, try to get a 2nd opinion by an ophthalmologist.
I took a look at a couple of studies on Pubmed on glaucoma and lifting, and it seems the valsalva maneuver is a definite spiker of intraocular pressure, but so are isometric contractions (holding a muscle's contraction), which means a non-heavy exercise like a plank should be done with caution too. Keep in mind a pushup is essentially a plank.
My understanding is the larger the muscle mass involved, the higher the likelihood of it raising pressure. So a back squat, which mainly works your legs and core, would raise it more than a split squat, which mainly works your legs, with a lot less core. A leg extension machine uses even fewer leg muscles.. but.. machines aren't as good for functional strength as unsupported exercises, so i'd save them as a last resort.
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Heavy is not only a matter of individual strength, but also individual perception. For me personally, if I can do more than three reps with a given weight, it's not heavy. Others will say five repa, snd I've even seen some say 8-10. I can do all compound lifts to 10+ reps with 65% of my 1RM though, and imo, just over half of my max is so far from "heavy" that I barely have words for it.0
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Cherimoose wrote: »Was the advice given by your regular doctor? If so, try to get a 2nd opinion by an ophthalmologist.
I took a look at a couple of studies on Pubmed on glaucoma and lifting, and it seems the valsalva maneuver is a definite spiker of intraocular pressure, but so are isometric contractions (holding a muscle's contraction), which means a non-heavy exercise like a plank should be done with caution too. Keep in mind a pushup is essentially a plank.
My understanding is the larger the muscle mass involved, the higher the likelihood of it raising pressure. So a back squat, which mainly works your legs and core, would raise it more than a split squat, which mainly works your legs, with a lot less core. A leg extension machine uses even fewer leg muscles.. but.. machines aren't as good for functional strength as unsupported exercises, so i'd save them as a last resort.
Thank you all, this has been very helpful. Cherimoose, thank you so much for doing that extra research for me, and for the explanation. The advice comes from my ophthalmologist, and he's been my doctor for years so he knows my conditions well, but I think the idea that I would be doing any kind of heavy lifting wasn't really taken seriously, lol. When I asked him to remind me about what kinds of things I should avoid he said "well, weight lifting, but I mean you don't need to worry about that." The clarification about not straining was after pushing him a bit more and explaining that I'd like to be doing some weight training.0 -
From an absolute or linguistic perspective.
Lifting heavy usually means
Greater than 1x BW on Bench
and 1.5-2.0 on DL or Squat.
AKA Intermediate lifting.0 -
Gallowmere1984 wrote: »Heavy is not only a matter of individual strength, but also individual perception. For me personally, if I can do more than three reps with a given weight, it's not heavy. Others will say five repa, snd I've even seen some say 8-10. I can do all compound lifts to 10+ reps with 65% of my 1RM though, and imo, just over half of my max is so far from "heavy" that I barely have words for it.
I think that this is a good point. Depending on my programming for the day I might do a few sets in the 3-5 rep range and/or the 6-8 range and/or 8-12. I don't call any of it light lifting. I think of light lifting as what people tend to term "pink dumbbell" weights. But Gallowmere would use different terminology for some of that stuff.stanmann571 wrote: »From an absolute or linguistic perspective.
Lifting heavy usually means
Greater than 1x BW on Bench
and 1.5-2.0 on DL or Squat.
AKA Intermediate lifting.
I would disagree with this description of heavy lifting. I am curious as to where you found it or heard it though.0 -
stanmann571 wrote: »From an absolute or linguistic perspective.
Lifting heavy usually means
Greater than 1x BW on Bench
and 1.5-2.0 on DL or Squat.
AKA Intermediate lifting.
Absolutely not. Most women will take many many years of hard training to hit 1x on bench, though the other two are a bit more realistic.
Still not a great definition anyway. What's heavy to you might be Suzy Hartwig-Gary's warmup weight. What's heavy to Dan Green might as well be stapled to the floor for you.2 -
I'd be very tentative due to your eye issue. I know that I often have visual auras around lights after I lift heavy. I would take it very slowly and see how your body and eyes like what's happening.0
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So I'm on board (albeit somewhat overwhelmed) with the whole strength training thing, I understand the benefits, etc.
My question is, for women, what does lifting heavy actually mean? For you, or in general.
The reason for the question is because I am decently strong for a girl who has not spent a lot of time, at least recently, in a weight room, and also quite competitive, I like to push myself. However, I have glaucoma, and the one thing my doctor has highlighted that should be careful with is heavy weightlifting, which he characterized as "Oh you know, like 200 pounds or whatever, really straining".
Would like to incorporate strength training, and see gains in my strength and fitness, but obviously want to preserve my eyesight. So I'm just wondering, for people who are in this mindset of lifting heavy, pushing yourself.. in practical terms/numbers, what does that mean?
"Heavy" really describes the rep range...the lower the rep range, the heavier the weight should be as a % of your 1RM. The actual weight would be relative to your current abilities.2 -
I like to lift "heavy" but at 57 it is a matter of perspective. One person's idea of heavy - given medical conditions - is not the same as another. Here is a link to weight lifting standards that I often refer to when I am trying to see where I am in relation to someone else's idea of where I should be. Keep in mind that you need to refer to the Women's chart, for the lift that you are doing, and your age. Also, this is a ONE REP standard. There is a calculator to determine your one rep weight from your multi rep set. Although I feel like I am strong for an older woman, and there are very few women in my gym who lift what I do, I still tend to fall in the novice category for most of the lifts. So.... matter of opinion. http://www.exrx.net/Testing/WeightLifting/BenchStandards.html1
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juliewatkin wrote: »I'd be very tentative due to your eye issue. I know that I often have visual auras around lights after I lift heavy. I would take it very slowly and see how your body and eyes like what's happening.
Yes, as others have mentioned, be very careful with the Valsalva Maneuver. I would say definitely avoid using a weight belt. I have on occasion built up enough pressure in my eyes trying to get a PR on deadlift to get eye flares. It's pretty scary so you definitely do not want to push yourself that far with glaucoma.0 -
Gallowmere1984 wrote: »stanmann571 wrote: »From an absolute or linguistic perspective.
Lifting heavy usually means
Greater than 1x BW on Bench
and 1.5-2.0 on DL or Squat.
AKA Intermediate lifting.
Absolutely not. Most women will take many many years of hard training to hit 1x on bench, though the other two are a bit more realistic.
Still not a great definition anyway. What's heavy to you might be Suzy Hartwig-Gary's warmup weight. What's heavy to Dan Green might as well be stapled to the floor for you.
Ugh love Suzy her squat is perfection!! And yeah "heavy" is for sure subjective. As you get stronger, what you consider heavy should change. When I was starting out, I though 135lb squats were heavy and I couldn't picture deadlifting anything more than 200lbs. However, no I can bench a few lbs more than bodyweight for a single,I have hit 215lbs for a single squat, and I have deadlifted well over 200lbs for more than 1 rep (going for the 300+ 1RM!!) so yeah you'll progress and your perceptions and goals will likely change.1 -
maranarasauce93 wrote: »Gallowmere1984 wrote: »stanmann571 wrote: »From an absolute or linguistic perspective.
Lifting heavy usually means
Greater than 1x BW on Bench
and 1.5-2.0 on DL or Squat.
AKA Intermediate lifting.
Absolutely not. Most women will take many many years of hard training to hit 1x on bench, though the other two are a bit more realistic.
Still not a great definition anyway. What's heavy to you might be Suzy Hartwig-Gary's warmup weight. What's heavy to Dan Green might as well be stapled to the floor for you.
Ugh love Suzy her squat is perfection!! And yeah "heavy" is for sure subjective. As you get stronger, what you consider heavy should change. When I was starting out, I though 135lb squats were heavy and I couldn't picture deadlifting anything more than 200lbs. However, no I can bench a few lbs more than bodyweight for a single,I have hit 215lbs for a single squat, and I have deadlifted well over 200lbs for more than 1 rep (going for the 300+ 1RM!!) so yeah you'll progress and your perceptions and goals will likely change.
Just the fact that you know who she is makes you awesome in my book. The lift progression just confirms it.
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Gallowmere1984 wrote: »maranarasauce93 wrote: »Gallowmere1984 wrote: »stanmann571 wrote: »From an absolute or linguistic perspective.
Lifting heavy usually means
Greater than 1x BW on Bench
and 1.5-2.0 on DL or Squat.
AKA Intermediate lifting.
Absolutely not. Most women will take many many years of hard training to hit 1x on bench, though the other two are a bit more realistic.
Still not a great definition anyway. What's heavy to you might be Suzy Hartwig-Gary's warmup weight. What's heavy to Dan Green might as well be stapled to the floor for you.
Just the fact that you know who she is makes you awesome in my book. The lift progression just confirms it.
Thank you!! And I mainly know of Suzy because I was trying to look for a good example for how to set up and walk out efficiently for squats and Matt used Suzy to demo an example...I streamed the prime time of raw nats this year and saw that she has an amazing squat to go along with her the excellent set up. I also love her little robot dance when she sets up for deadlift and the little smile and nod when she knows she has a lift. Such a cool and inspiring lady!!1 -
Gallowmere1984 wrote: »Heavy is not only a matter of individual strength, but also individual perception. For me personally, if I can do more than three reps with a given weight, it's not heavy. Others will say five reps, and I've even seen some say 8-10. I can do all compound lifts to 10+ reps with 65% of my 1RM though, and imo, just over half of my max is so far from "heavy" that I barely have words for it.
Ya, I say I lift medium heavy and for me that means I do 3-5 reps on the set with the heaviest weight.1 -
Lifting HEAVY for any one - - young/old, male/female, lightweight/heavy weight - - is generally considered lifting weight at or above 80% of your one rep max (1RM).
If you've never attempted a 1RM lift, there are calculators that will give you an approximation, based on the lift performed, the weight lifted and the number of reps. Here 's a link to one that takes into account age, sex and bodyweight (which are all relevant factors) when making the calculation:
http://strengthlevel.com/
Just bear in mind that all caculators do not take all of these factors into consideration and that different lift calculators can yield different results.
Here's a calculator that only takes gender and body weight into account:
http://www.liftcalculator.com/
Furthermore, I have found that most lift calculators tend to OVER estimate the 1RM and that you may not be able to actually do the 1RM as calculated. The only way to find this out is to actually try the calculated 1RM lift. So, don't claim that you can actually do a 1RM lift at a specific weight based on a calculator. Only claim it if you've actually done it.
You should also take a look at the Killustrated Charts, which will give you the variations in strength based on these factors at a glance:
http://lonkilgore.com/freebies/freebies.html
Generally, men can lift more than women of the same age/wt class and the older and lighter you are the less you are expected to lift regardless of gender.
FYI, as a 66 yr old male at 160#, I am rated in the Elite class for the DL, SQT, BP and OHP in tbe Killustrated Charts but for men under 40 my lifts would only rank me as a Novice or Intermediate. So, age, weight and gender definitely matter in terms of ranking one's strength and weight lifting abilities.
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I have a health condition also, albiet different from yours... As I result of my condition, I sometimes get lightheaded and faint (black vision) under normal, non-lifting conditions. But I love to lift, so I continue to lift, but stick to dumbells so that I can drop or get rid of them quickly if needed. Just thought I would share.0
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Thanks for all the responses, much appreciated 0
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stanmann571 wrote: »From an absolute or linguistic perspective.
Lifting heavy usually means
Greater than 1x BW on Bench
and 1.5-2.0 on DL or Squat.
AKA Intermediate lifting.
disagree.
heavy lifting is a rep range.
it is NEVER and has never been an actual number or statistical limit to your lift.
I have yet to someone break this down in a more meaningful manner so I will continue to argue this being the most simple way to explain the context of heavy lifting:
0-1- is heavy- arguably too heavy for a beginner lifter
1-5- heavy
5-10 moderate
10-15 moderate/light
15-20- light (muscle endurance being the end goal- or super sets to fatigue.)
OP- I would start with something in the 8-12 range- if you think you can do more than 12 reps- it's probably to light. Give yourself permission to go ahead and stop- like if you get to 10 and you feel like you're massively losing form and starting to momentum swing the weight- just stop- there is no harm in actually doing a rep range.
I did a fantastic shoulder workout yesterday and the last group of super sets was "do as many as you can of these- followed by do as many as you can for this"
my goal was 8- and 12.
The last set I got 4 and 8 for the two exercises. absolutely nothing wrong with either dropping down a weight or cutting a rep or two off- especially if you have a medical condition.2 -
So I'm on board (albeit somewhat overwhelmed) with the whole strength training thing, I understand the benefits, etc.
My question is, for women, what does lifting heavy actually mean? For you, or in general.
?
The best explanation I got was from doing a program. Heavy lifting is what ever wait you can do for 'about' 6 reps (4-8), maybe 2-3 sets. So if I can do 15 pounds somewhat easy on my first set of 6 reps, but am struggling to finish my second set, then the weight is about right.
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It's simple. Lift weights in the 15 or lower rep range that make you struggle for the last 1 or 2 reps. If you can do a lot more when you set the weight down, you're not lifting heavy.
That's it.
It has 0 to do with how much you are lifting.1
This discussion has been closed.
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