Reverse diet and calorie cycling
toshie333
Posts: 295 Member
Hi
I am really looking for some advice/views.
I'm female, 27years, 5ft 5".
I had a baby in August and have dieted down from 167 lb to 132lb.
I have used Calorie cycling in hope to preserve as much of my metabolic capacity as possible however my average daily intake is about 1100 per day.
I usually have 2 non consecutive "higher" days a week of about 1700 cal but it means some days I'm under 1000 cal.
I do Hiit resistance 5-6 times a week.
I would like to reverse diet as I have this week started the insanity workout programme and am finding I just don't have the energy to do it 5-6 days a week on such minimal calories.
My first question is,
can reverse diet whilst using insanity as my exercise as I know I'm meant to taper down the steady state cardio but I believe this is max interval/resistance training? (I don't do any steady state.)
Can I Calorie cycle whilst reverse dieting? If I was to add say 40 cal to each day regardless if low or high day as long as my avg daily intake was up by 40 cal per day??
Any advise or guidance would be amazing.
Thank you in advance!
I am really looking for some advice/views.
I'm female, 27years, 5ft 5".
I had a baby in August and have dieted down from 167 lb to 132lb.
I have used Calorie cycling in hope to preserve as much of my metabolic capacity as possible however my average daily intake is about 1100 per day.
I usually have 2 non consecutive "higher" days a week of about 1700 cal but it means some days I'm under 1000 cal.
I do Hiit resistance 5-6 times a week.
I would like to reverse diet as I have this week started the insanity workout programme and am finding I just don't have the energy to do it 5-6 days a week on such minimal calories.
My first question is,
can reverse diet whilst using insanity as my exercise as I know I'm meant to taper down the steady state cardio but I believe this is max interval/resistance training? (I don't do any steady state.)
Can I Calorie cycle whilst reverse dieting? If I was to add say 40 cal to each day regardless if low or high day as long as my avg daily intake was up by 40 cal per day??
Any advise or guidance would be amazing.
Thank you in advance!
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Replies
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You shouldn't eat less than 1200 calories let alone 1200.
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I've done alternate day fasting at some point in history, it's the 72 hour mark your metabolism starts to decrease and adapt.
People eat 0 cal one day and slightly above maintenance the next with no effect on metabolism.... but anyway I don't want to eat less than 1200 a day when I'm working out so hard.1 -
Preserving metabolic capacity? what do you mean?0
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your metabolism slows (adapts) to low calorie diet , by adding in higher cal days (calorie cycling) you reduce stress that's being put on your body as well as positively effecting leptin etc. Basically says to your body that food is plentiful so fat loss doesn't stall and metabolism doesn't adapt/slow0
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your metabolism slows (adapts) to low calorie diet , by adding in higher cal days (calorie cycling) you reduce stress that's being put on your body as well as positively effecting leptin etc. Basically says to your body that food is plentiful so fat loss doesn't stall and metabolism doesn't adapt/slow
I for one would like to see some proof of this.2 -
Why were/are you eating so little? It's no wonder you have no energy for your workouts.
Eat more either by bumping up your cals daily or weekly.. if you prefer to reverse diet that is fine. Just please eat more.2 -
Metabolic adaptation to low calorie diets is in the form of NEAT - Non-exercise activity thermogenesis, this can be countered by "getting up and walking around" a few times a day.
Leptin is reduced in long term dieting but (as Lyle McDonald states) you need a few days at least to bring it up to anywhere near "normal levels" a meal or even a high calorie day is not going to cut it.1 -
Back you your original post:can reverse diet whilst using insanity as my exercise as I know I'm meant to taper down the steady state cardio but I believe this is max interval/resistance training? (I don't do any steady state.)
Yes you can. It's a bit like hitting a moving target when reverse dieting in that, you eat a little more and feel great so hit the exercise harder and consequently burn a little more which means your increased cals are used up a little by the upswing in exercise. But, in the end you hit a "steady state" input/output.Can I Calorie cycle whilst reverse dieting? If I was to add say 40 cal to each day regardless if low or high day as long as my avg daily intake was up by 40 cal per day??
Yes - track your weekly intake and the daily fluctuations of your calorie cycling don't mess things up. You can also IF or run 5:2 fast protocols whilst reverse dieting.
Note: if when reverse dieting you're bringing in significantly more carbs you may find your weight spikes on each calorie increase. This is usually glycogen/fluid retention/in transit food - you should be wary of this - some people fall for the trap of thinking that they are putting on fat and immediately reduce the calories again.
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Why do you have such low days? Even if you follow the protocols on beachbody's website, they certainly don't have you down around 1100 or 1200 calories while doing insanity. It's a fairly intense cardio/HIIT program. And you can calorie/carb cycle if you prefer, but the high days are around 10% below TDEE, and low days should be roughly 20-25% below TDEE.
You could follow IF protocols, but while doing insanity, that might be rather difficult since it's a 6 day workout program.
And if you want to maintain metabolism (which you won't know unless you get metabolic testing), you want adequate protein and resistance. I am not sure if insanity is the most appropriate program for this.1 -
HiWhy were/are you eating so little? It's no wonder you have no energy for your workouts.
I was following weightwatchers for 4 months. When I calculated Cal's along side the program on mfp it was averaging 1100...Mycophilia wrote: »your metabolism slows (adapts) to low calorie diet , by adding in higher cal days (calorie cycling) you reduce stress that's being put on your body as well as positively effecting leptin etc. Basically says to your body that food is plentiful so fat loss doesn't stall and metabolism doesn't adapt/slow
I for one would like to see some proof of this.
There's loads of studies on this on IF, "zigzagging" calories, just google it if you're interested.Why do you have such low days? Even if you follow the protocols on beachbody's website, they certainly don't have you down around 1100 or 1200 calories while doing insanity. It's a fairly intense cardio/HIIT program. And you can calorie/carb cycle if you prefer, but the high days are around 10% below TDEE, and low days should be roughly 20-25% below TDEE.
yes I agree exactly hence why I want to get up to these calorie levels. I was previously on weightwatchers which was a lot lower cal than realised. Started insanity this week and obv would like to get to their cal recommendations hence the post. I will aim for the -10%/-25% split. Thank you.StealthHealth wrote: »Back you your original post:can reverse diet whilst using insanity as my exercise as I know I'm meant to taper down the steady state cardio but I believe this is max interval/resistance training? (I don't do any steady state.)
Yes you can. It's a bit like hitting a moving target when reverse dieting in that, you eat a little more and feel great so hit the exercise harder and consequently burn a little more which means your increased cals are used up a little by the upswing in exercise. But, in the end you hit a "steady state" input/output.Can I Calorie cycle whilst reverse dieting? If I was to add say 40 cal to each day regardless if low or high day as long as my avg daily intake was up by 40 cal per day??
Yes - track your weekly intake and the daily fluctuations of your calorie cycling don't mess things up. You can also IF or run 5:2 fast protocols whilst reverse dieting.
Note: if when reverse dieting you're bringing in significantly more carbs you may find your weight spikes on each calorie increase. This is usually glycogen/fluid retention/in transit food - you should be wary of this - some people fall for the trap of thinking that they are putting on fat and immediately reduce the calories again.
Thanks that's really helpful. Appreciate that.0 -
Since you posted this in the gaining/bodybuilding forum.. what are your goals exactly? Insanity is a fine program, don't get me wrong.. but it is more cardio focused so if you are looking to change your body composition that is probably not the best program for it.0
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Since you posted this in the gaining/bodybuilding forum.. what are your goals exactly? Insanity is a fine program, don't get me wrong.. but it is more cardio focused so if you are looking to change your body composition that is probably not the best program for it.
Hi
I would like to gain some muscle - at the moment I have some muscle definition particularly in arms and stomach is just visible but I have a long way to go and I know I can't get lean muscle without eating more.
I am happy to build in a heavy lifting program. We converted our garage into a gym so we have bar bells, loads of weights, smith machine, benches etc I do a day of heavy lifting with compound exercises but I could defo increase it.
If there is a program you suggest let me know as I like structure to follow.
Was looking at German volume training or 5x5?? Any views?0 -
Mycophilia wrote: »your metabolism slows (adapts) to low calorie diet , by adding in higher cal days (calorie cycling) you reduce stress that's being put on your body as well as positively effecting leptin etc. Basically says to your body that food is plentiful so fat loss doesn't stall and metabolism doesn't adapt/slow
I for one would like to see some proof of this.
There are a couple Sigma Nutrition Radio podcasts on this topic.0 -
With having eaten so little calories, I would reverse diet, yes. You will probably feel more comfortable as if you just jump to maintenance you may retain crap tons of water, and honestly, you may have some metabolic adaptations that would be best sussed out by adding calories slowly. Maybe not...but it doesn't hurt.
If you want to gain muscle, you are just going to have to take your time getting back to maintenance first. Once you are there, I'd stick to maintenance for awhile before you go into a surplus. I went from a heavy cut right into a bulk and...my body was just primed for dat fat.2 -
Since you posted this in the gaining/bodybuilding forum.. what are your goals exactly? Insanity is a fine program, don't get me wrong.. but it is more cardio focused so if you are looking to change your body composition that is probably not the best program for it.
Hi
I would like to gain some muscle - at the moment I have some muscle definition particularly in arms and stomach is just visible but I have a long way to go and I know I can't get lean muscle without eating more.
I am happy to build in a heavy lifting program. We converted our garage into a gym so we have bar bells, loads of weights, smith machine, benches etc I do a day of heavy lifting with compound exercises but I could defo increase it.
If there is a program you suggest let me know as I like structure to follow.
Was looking at German volume training or 5x5?? Any views?
I would check out this thread:
community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10332083/which-lifting-program-is-the-best-for-you/p1
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I would definitely not start with GVT. I would go with Starting Strength, StrongCurvers, StrongLift, NROL4W or Thinner Leaner Stronger; this depends on what your goals are and if you have any focus areas.1
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I would absolutely not reverse diet at 40cals unless you'd like to take forever to get to maintenance and feel awful the entire time.
When you're in a steep deficit and having problems (performance or mood or adherence or all) then your goal should be to get to maintenance as quickly as possible to alleviate those symptoms.1 -
Ok cool thank you.
If I continue to calorie cycle whilst reverse diet do I just raise my low days each week and keep high days static at maintenance cals?
Or do I increase the high days too so the average daily total is the one I'm looking at?
Hope that makes sense....1 -
From a cals in v cals out point of view doesn't matter - your average daily total or weekly total is the important bit.
From a dietary compliance point of view do whatever feels best. I know personally that when I'm at maintenance or above (when trying to gain muscle) fasting is more difficult because I then need to eat a lot of food in a reduced window, but if it works for you - go for it.1 -
I won't fast or have an eating window, for I will just eat lower cal days and higher cal days (at what I believe maintenance is through calculations) and try do more than one in a row as previously mentioned. Thank you
0 -
Since you posted this in the gaining/bodybuilding forum.. what are your goals exactly? Insanity is a fine program, don't get me wrong.. but it is more cardio focused so if you are looking to change your body composition that is probably not the best program for it.
Hi
I would like to gain some muscle - at the moment I have some muscle definition particularly in arms and stomach is just visible but I have a long way to go and I know I can't get lean muscle without eating more.
I am happy to build in a heavy lifting program. We converted our garage into a gym so we have bar bells, loads of weights, smith machine, benches etc I do a day of heavy lifting with compound exercises but I could defo increase it.
If there is a program you suggest let me know as I like structure to follow.
Was looking at German volume training or 5x5?? Any views?
do you know what your current body fat% is?0 -
I've had success after long stretches of very low calorie intake by doubling my calories and exercise. I realized i prefer to exercise more to lose/maintain rather than restrict calories. I wont go back to a low cal diet ever again. I hate that feeling of being irritable and weak and tired. I want to be strong & healthy not skinny, sounds like you feel similarly.0
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