Interesting Issue
alexialmann
Posts: 36 Member
Back story: I work 3rd shift, during which I have very little time to stop and eat (which is ok with me, its a very fast paced job, not complaining) but I am usually able to get in a 10 minute meal break of about 600-ish calories. I will have a decent sized (abut 24 oz) cup of coffee with about 2 oz of half and half to last me the night. When I get home I try to sleep for a while, usually until about 5pm. I will have dinner and go back to work around 10pm. Some days I have to stay up during the day and I tend to get a bit sick to the stomach those days, so I eat very lightly. I nearly always hit 1200-1500 calories, but I do tend to have around 200-500 calories left 4 or 5 days a week. I've been losing right at 3 lbs a week since this started.
My question is this, since I am hitting above the minimum 1200 for calories, not losing excessively (yes I know 2lbs is usually the recommended limit), and don't feel awful, should I just leave it alone or should I force myself to makeup those calories? I stopped going to the gym for right now until I figure out the best way to approach this. At 5'8 and 195, I am about 15lbs short of my last goal weight (180) before I reassess and see if I feel I need to lose to 165lbs. Should I leave it be until I hit 180 and then try to eat at maintenance for a while if I start noticing bad effects? I do take a multivitamin but that obviously doesn't help with calories. I also will have a donut or a smoothie or some other random thing to help make up a few if I feel I really need to. BTW those Bon Appetit pastries are 500 calories a piece, LOL. Am I worrying too much or does this sound like its ok temporarily as it shouldn't be but another couple months of this schedule?
If you look at my diary, it's a bit screwy because of the AM versus PM, and about every 3-4 days I sleep for 16 hours when I'm off, so very little food gets put on those days and instead, I put it on the days I am awake. I will say I did better last week than the previous few, I think because I am aware there is possibly an issue. Really wasn't thinking it was, until I noticed the increased weight loss.
Thanks for your insight!
*Edit: I don't enter water in here, but I drink about 70-100oz a day. Also, I don't enter exercise, the exercise is all logged automatically from my FitBit and is from work.
My question is this, since I am hitting above the minimum 1200 for calories, not losing excessively (yes I know 2lbs is usually the recommended limit), and don't feel awful, should I just leave it alone or should I force myself to makeup those calories? I stopped going to the gym for right now until I figure out the best way to approach this. At 5'8 and 195, I am about 15lbs short of my last goal weight (180) before I reassess and see if I feel I need to lose to 165lbs. Should I leave it be until I hit 180 and then try to eat at maintenance for a while if I start noticing bad effects? I do take a multivitamin but that obviously doesn't help with calories. I also will have a donut or a smoothie or some other random thing to help make up a few if I feel I really need to. BTW those Bon Appetit pastries are 500 calories a piece, LOL. Am I worrying too much or does this sound like its ok temporarily as it shouldn't be but another couple months of this schedule?
If you look at my diary, it's a bit screwy because of the AM versus PM, and about every 3-4 days I sleep for 16 hours when I'm off, so very little food gets put on those days and instead, I put it on the days I am awake. I will say I did better last week than the previous few, I think because I am aware there is possibly an issue. Really wasn't thinking it was, until I noticed the increased weight loss.
Thanks for your insight!
*Edit: I don't enter water in here, but I drink about 70-100oz a day. Also, I don't enter exercise, the exercise is all logged automatically from my FitBit and is from work.
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Replies
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The reason it is not recommended to drop weight quickly is because in addition to fat you are losing muscle.
If you eat adequate protein, follow a weight lifting program, and lose weight a little slower you will minimize the amount of muscle lost.2 -
What I wonder is, you say "force yourself." I will be blunt but understand this is not judging as I have BTDT: are you saying you eat more now than what you ate that ultimately made you heavy? Or were you forcing yourself even more then? Those choices don't make a lot of sense, do they? (Maybe there's another option I'm not thinking of.)
I feel like you may be in the honeymoon phase of dieting. Very very very few of us got to the weight loss applications of MFP by being unable to force ourselves to eat.
I say, give yourself a bit more time. (I'll be frank, it is unlikely you are starving yourself and doing damage on 1500 calories a day.) Then see how you feel about food and amounts. In the meantime during this golden phase, just ride it and enjoy it. It doesn't last long. Barring some hidden medical condition, it is unlikely you are doing any sort of long-term damage by eating up to 1500 calories per day for what probably will be a limited time.
If another month goes by, you are weak, having dizzy spells, your hair is falling out and you're experiencing memory loss but you still can't seem to force food down, then you know it's probably time to see a doctor. But if you're totally well and energetic, you are likely getting what you need.2 -
LOL...honeymoon phase. If only. I've lost nearly 60lbs over the last year simply following CICO with a food scale and MFP. So no, very aware of my body and how it works. What made me heavy was eating too much and having a desk job where I didn't burn any of it off. I just started this job in the last 2 months so the calorie burn is much more than I have been having over the last year and thus I am attempting to adjust to it. The question is, while I am adjusting and allowing my appetite to catch up (since before I was eating around 1600 over the last year and my body was used to that) will I do any long term damage by not eating all the way to that calorie burn that I now have. Which again, will be temporary as I most likely will only be on this shift another 2 months at max.0
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alexialmann wrote: »LOL...honeymoon phase. If only. I've lost nearly 60lbs over the last year simply following CICO with a food scale and MFP. So no, very aware of my body and how it works. What made me heavy was eating too much and having a desk job where I didn't burn any of it off. I just started this job in the last 2 months so the calorie burn is much more than I have been having and thus I am attempting to adjust to it. The question is, while I am adjusting and allowing my appetite to catch up (since before I was eating around 1600 over the last year and my body was used to that) will I do any long term damage by not eating all the way to that calorie burn that I now have.
So then these changes ARE new; two months or less?
Plus switching from 1600 to 1200-1500.
If you are so non-hungry that you can't force more food in then it is possible you are either overestimating your calorie burn or underestimating your calories, but if not and you literally can not choke down adequate food even to slow your rate of loss and you start experiencing malnutrition symptoms, then it is time to see your doctor. Until that point if you feel entirely fine and energetic it is unlikely that you are doing damage. What sort of damage are you fearing?2 -
alexialmann wrote: »LOL...honeymoon phase. If only. I've lost nearly 60lbs over the last year simply following CICO with a food scale and MFP. So no, very aware of my body and how it works. What made me heavy was eating too much and having a desk job where I didn't burn any of it off. I just started this job in the last 2 months so the calorie burn is much more than I have been having and thus I am attempting to adjust to it. The question is, while I am adjusting and allowing my appetite to catch up (since before I was eating around 1600 over the last year and my body was used to that) will I do any long term damage by not eating all the way to that calorie burn that I now have.
So then these changes ARE new; two months or less?
Plus switching from 1600 to 1200-1500.
If you are so non-hungry that you can't force more food in then it is possible you are either overestimating your calorie burn or underestimating your calories, but if not and you literally can not choke down adequate food even to slow your rate of loss and you start experiencing malnutrition symptoms, then it is time to see your doctor. Until that point if you feel entirely fine and energetic it is unlikely that you are doing damage. What sort of damage are you fearing?
OP is losing three pounds a week, so overestimating burns and underestimating intake doesn't seem like it's an issue.
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Yes, the increased weight loss is new, just started the job recently. I've been losing pretty much 1 to 2lbs max for the last year, a week at a time. But I'm not new to the weight loss itself. The calorie burn is coming from FITBit, not putting it in, so it definitely could be overestimating. As far as damage, just general fatigue, muscle loss etc. I'm not sure what the tipping point really is here, before that starts happening. I don't want it to happen obviously but I have a little more time I have to get through this shift. So I will plan to just keep trying to hit at least 1800-2000 n the high burn days I suppose. Looks like more peanut butter is in my future. LOL0
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alexialmann, you need the protein to help with your muscles (so as not to lose muscle mass) your doing great on your water intake. Try getting a protein shake (Premiere are my recommended brand then Atkins. Both have low sugar and carbs but 15-30 grams of protein). You should set a calorie range to stay within per day and do your best to hit that goal. Try not to go below as your body will go into starvation mode and use up muscle mass to get its nutrients. To answer your question I believe YES you can do lasting negative impact to your body if you don't concentrate on a HEALTHY range of calories each day.
I would also suggest you seek the help of a nutritionist or dietitian for better insight.
Sounds like you've been doing great dear. Don't get hung up on your scale. Listen to your body.
Remember you lose too fast your more likely to regain that weight. It is about healthy life changes not dieting my dear!
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lynn_glenmont wrote: »alexialmann wrote: »LOL...honeymoon phase. If only. I've lost nearly 60lbs over the last year simply following CICO with a food scale and MFP. So no, very aware of my body and how it works. What made me heavy was eating too much and having a desk job where I didn't burn any of it off. I just started this job in the last 2 months so the calorie burn is much more than I have been having and thus I am attempting to adjust to it. The question is, while I am adjusting and allowing my appetite to catch up (since before I was eating around 1600 over the last year and my body was used to that) will I do any long term damage by not eating all the way to that calorie burn that I now have.
So then these changes ARE new; two months or less?
Plus switching from 1600 to 1200-1500.
If you are so non-hungry that you can't force more food in then it is possible you are either overestimating your calorie burn or underestimating your calories, but if not and you literally can not choke down adequate food even to slow your rate of loss and you start experiencing malnutrition symptoms, then it is time to see your doctor. Until that point if you feel entirely fine and energetic it is unlikely that you are doing damage. What sort of damage are you fearing?
OP is losing three pounds a week, so overestimating burns and underestimating intake doesn't seem like it's an issue.
This rate of loss is new according to her.
All of this put together is why "honeymoon phase" was the first thing that came to mind.
Again, if not, we can't predict that "damage" is or is not occurring - only a doctor can make that determination. OTOH, OP is worried about fatigue. That is something she herself can determine, and can keep an eye out for.0 -
Fatigue is likely to be the first symptom. As for damage, if you are not getting adequate nutrition you can lose your hair, your nails could become thin and brittle, you can stop menstruating. As things progress you could develop heart problems and die.0
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alexialmann, you need the protein to help with your muscles (so as not to lose muscle mass) your doing great on your water intake. Try getting a protein shake (Premiere are my recommended brand then Atkins. Both have low sugar and carbs but 15-30 grams of protein). You should set a calorie range to stay within per day and do your best to hit that goal. Try not to go below as your body will go into starvation mode and use up muscle mass to get its nutrients. To answer your question I believe YES you can do lasting negative impact to your body if you don't concentrate on a HEALTHY range of calories each day.
I would also suggest you seek the help of a nutritionist or dietitian for better insight.
Sounds like you've been doing great dear. Don't get hung up on your scale. Listen to your body.
Remember you lose too fast your more likely to regain that weight. It is about healthy life changes not dieting my dear!
Thank you, and yes for sure lifestyle changes, not dieting. I am definitely focusing on protein right now, and yes, I do intend to speak with a nutritionist about it. I don't want to get derailed by this after working so hard at it for the last year. Thank you for your support!1 -
lynn_glenmont wrote: »alexialmann wrote: »LOL...honeymoon phase. If only. I've lost nearly 60lbs over the last year simply following CICO with a food scale and MFP. So no, very aware of my body and how it works. What made me heavy was eating too much and having a desk job where I didn't burn any of it off. I just started this job in the last 2 months so the calorie burn is much more than I have been having and thus I am attempting to adjust to it. The question is, while I am adjusting and allowing my appetite to catch up (since before I was eating around 1600 over the last year and my body was used to that) will I do any long term damage by not eating all the way to that calorie burn that I now have.
So then these changes ARE new; two months or less?
Plus switching from 1600 to 1200-1500.
If you are so non-hungry that you can't force more food in then it is possible you are either overestimating your calorie burn or underestimating your calories, but if not and you literally can not choke down adequate food even to slow your rate of loss and you start experiencing malnutrition symptoms, then it is time to see your doctor. Until that point if you feel entirely fine and energetic it is unlikely that you are doing damage. What sort of damage are you fearing?
OP is losing three pounds a week, so overestimating burns and underestimating intake doesn't seem like it's an issue.
This rate of loss is new according to her. All of this put together is why "honeymoon phase" was the first thing that came to mind.
Again, if not, we can't predict that "damage" is or is not occurring - only a doctor can make that determination. OTOH, OP is worried about fatigue. That is something she herself can determine, and can keep an eye out for.
Three pounds a week for the past two months at her current weight, especially when she isn't doing any resistance training, certainly creates a risk for losing more muscle than is necessary.0 -
Fatigue is likely to be the first symptom. As for damage, if you are not getting adequate nutrition you can lose your hair, your nails could become thin and brittle, you can stop menstruating. As things progress you could develop heart problems and die.
Well yes, that is possible. But unlikely over a couple months. Generally speaking, isn't that kind of deprivation something that is long term or very severe malnutrition? We are talking about 1500-2000 calories short a week (at most) here, not 5000k+.0 -
lynn_glenmont wrote: »lynn_glenmont wrote: »alexialmann wrote: »LOL...honeymoon phase. If only. I've lost nearly 60lbs over the last year simply following CICO with a food scale and MFP. So no, very aware of my body and how it works. What made me heavy was eating too much and having a desk job where I didn't burn any of it off. I just started this job in the last 2 months so the calorie burn is much more than I have been having and thus I am attempting to adjust to it. The question is, while I am adjusting and allowing my appetite to catch up (since before I was eating around 1600 over the last year and my body was used to that) will I do any long term damage by not eating all the way to that calorie burn that I now have.
So then these changes ARE new; two months or less?
Plus switching from 1600 to 1200-1500.
If you are so non-hungry that you can't force more food in then it is possible you are either overestimating your calorie burn or underestimating your calories, but if not and you literally can not choke down adequate food even to slow your rate of loss and you start experiencing malnutrition symptoms, then it is time to see your doctor. Until that point if you feel entirely fine and energetic it is unlikely that you are doing damage. What sort of damage are you fearing?
OP is losing three pounds a week, so overestimating burns and underestimating intake doesn't seem like it's an issue.
This rate of loss is new according to her. All of this put together is why "honeymoon phase" was the first thing that came to mind.
Again, if not, we can't predict that "damage" is or is not occurring - only a doctor can make that determination. OTOH, OP is worried about fatigue. That is something she herself can determine, and can keep an eye out for.
Three pounds a week for the past two months at her current weight, especially when she isn't doing any resistance training, certainly creates a risk for losing more muscle than is necessary.
Which is why again I say: if OP just can't make herself eat enough literally to keep from being sick, see a doctor.
And OTOH if she is energetic and strong, it isn't likely she is self-cannibalizing at an alarming rate.
Only she can say whether she is experiencing malnutrition symptoms.
Only a doctor can tell her whether physical damage is being done to her body.
If OP wishes to be on the safe side she can increase her calories preventatively...but she said she'd have to force herself up to even deficit levels (I mean still at a rate of weight loss).
THAT to me is the more alarming issue here. If THAT were to continue I would be heading to a doctor. Because that is a concern and this type of anorexia, since it would appear not to be psychological, may then be medical. There could be something else going on. Healthy people don't generally experience sudden and extreme loss of appetite for months on end to the point of muscle loss and wasting. It doesn't take a doctor to know that much.
So as I said earlier...if this were short term and there were no malnutrition symptoms, I'd just ride it...that appetite WILL come back, for the typical healthy person. But if it were to go on and on, still with the inability to eat well...it is doctor visit time.
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As far as fatigue, to be honest, that is a constant anyway. I have 2 kids, 5 dogs, 2 (out of the house) jobs and a custom cake business. I'm pretty much always tired. LOL
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lynn_glenmont wrote: »lynn_glenmont wrote: »alexialmann wrote: »LOL...honeymoon phase. If only. I've lost nearly 60lbs over the last year simply following CICO with a food scale and MFP. So no, very aware of my body and how it works. What made me heavy was eating too much and having a desk job where I didn't burn any of it off. I just started this job in the last 2 months so the calorie burn is much more than I have been having and thus I am attempting to adjust to it. The question is, while I am adjusting and allowing my appetite to catch up (since before I was eating around 1600 over the last year and my body was used to that) will I do any long term damage by not eating all the way to that calorie burn that I now have.
So then these changes ARE new; two months or less?
Plus switching from 1600 to 1200-1500.
If you are so non-hungry that you can't force more food in then it is possible you are either overestimating your calorie burn or underestimating your calories, but if not and you literally can not choke down adequate food even to slow your rate of loss and you start experiencing malnutrition symptoms, then it is time to see your doctor. Until that point if you feel entirely fine and energetic it is unlikely that you are doing damage. What sort of damage are you fearing?
OP is losing three pounds a week, so overestimating burns and underestimating intake doesn't seem like it's an issue.
This rate of loss is new according to her. All of this put together is why "honeymoon phase" was the first thing that came to mind.
Again, if not, we can't predict that "damage" is or is not occurring - only a doctor can make that determination. OTOH, OP is worried about fatigue. That is something she herself can determine, and can keep an eye out for.
Three pounds a week for the past two months at her current weight, especially when she isn't doing any resistance training, certainly creates a risk for losing more muscle than is necessary.
Which is why again I say: if OP just can't make herself eat enough literally to keep from being sick, see a doctor.
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lynn_glenmont wrote: »lynn_glenmont wrote: »alexialmann wrote: »LOL...honeymoon phase. If only. I've lost nearly 60lbs over the last year simply following CICO with a food scale and MFP. So no, very aware of my body and how it works. What made me heavy was eating too much and having a desk job where I didn't burn any of it off. I just started this job in the last 2 months so the calorie burn is much more than I have been having and thus I am attempting to adjust to it. The question is, while I am adjusting and allowing my appetite to catch up (since before I was eating around 1600 over the last year and my body was used to that) will I do any long term damage by not eating all the way to that calorie burn that I now have.
So then these changes ARE new; two months or less?
Plus switching from 1600 to 1200-1500.
If you are so non-hungry that you can't force more food in then it is possible you are either overestimating your calorie burn or underestimating your calories, but if not and you literally can not choke down adequate food even to slow your rate of loss and you start experiencing malnutrition symptoms, then it is time to see your doctor. Until that point if you feel entirely fine and energetic it is unlikely that you are doing damage. What sort of damage are you fearing?
OP is losing three pounds a week, so overestimating burns and underestimating intake doesn't seem like it's an issue.
This rate of loss is new according to her. All of this put together is why "honeymoon phase" was the first thing that came to mind.
Again, if not, we can't predict that "damage" is or is not occurring - only a doctor can make that determination. OTOH, OP is worried about fatigue. That is something she herself can determine, and can keep an eye out for.
Three pounds a week for the past two months at her current weight, especially when she isn't doing any resistance training, certainly creates a risk for losing more muscle than is necessary.
Which is why again I say: if OP just can't make herself eat enough literally to keep from being sick, see a doctor.
And OTOH if she is energetic and strong, it isn't likely she is self a cannibalizing at an alarming rate.
Only she can say whether she is experiencing malnutrition symptoms.
Only a doctor can tell her whether physical damage is being done to her body.
If OP wishes to be on the safe side she can increase her calories preventatively...but she said she'd have to force herself up to even deficit levels (I mean still at a rate of weight loss).
THAT to me is the more alarming issue here.
I think you may have taken "force" the wrong way, I simply meant make myself eat more, like you know, just eat. I definitely don't have any problems eating on a normal day. As I sit here with my queso and grilled meat with rice...and margarita. LOL1 -
And yes, I do have a "sudden loss of appetite" when I'm exhausted. Because my body wants sleep more than food, which is why my stomach contracts and make me not want to eat. I do believe in the hierarchy of needs, sleep actually comes before food. We can't survive without sleep for less time than without food if I recall correctly.
I think as you said, I will just "ride it" for a bit and go from there if it starts affecting me.
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I agree with making sure you get enough protein. An idea is to add protein powder to your coffee, but it mixes best with a blender (glass is best due to heat, unless you have a plastic blender designed to handle high temperatures).
Otherwise, listen to your body.1 -
midwesterner85 wrote: »I agree with making sure you get enough protein. An idea is to add protein powder to your coffee, but it mixes best with a blender (glass is best due to heat, unless you have a plastic blender designed to handle high temperatures).
Otherwise, listen to your body.
Never thought about adding it to coffee, that might be tasty. Do you know a good brand that blends well? I can't stand Muscle Milk, the one they have at LifeTime is pretty good but so expensive.
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alexialmann wrote: »And yes, I do have a "sudden loss of appetite" when I'm exhausted. Because my body wants sleep more than food, which is why my stomach contracts and make me not want to eat. I do believe in the hierarchy of needs, sleep actually comes before food. We can't survive without sleep for less time than without food if I recall correctly.
I think as you said, I will just "ride it" for a bit and go from there if it starts affecting me.
I believe they both are on the same level in the Maslow model. IIRC.
I have never heard of this stomach constriction to sleep rather than eat thing. I wish! If I am extremely hungry I actually can't eat. My drive is to find the sustenance first, before relaxation, even when exhausted.
Good luck and good health to you.1 -
alexialmann wrote: »And yes, I do have a "sudden loss of appetite" when I'm exhausted. Because my body wants sleep more than food, which is why my stomach contracts and make me not want to eat. I do believe in the hierarchy of needs, sleep actually comes before food. We can't survive without sleep for less time than without food if I recall correctly.
I think as you said, I will just "ride it" for a bit and go from there if it starts affecting me.
I believe they both are on the same level in the Maslow model. IIRC.
I have never heard of this stomach constriction to sleep rather than eat thing. I wish! If I am extremely hungry I actually can't eat. My drive is to find the sustenance first, before relaxation, even when exhausted.
Good luck and good health to you.
Yeah, it's weird I know. Always been like that though for as long as I can remember. i'm a sleep first kinda girl I guess! LOL
Thank you for your input, I wish you the same!
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I'd be ploughing into a jar of peanut butter face first if i had your problem
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Christine_72 wrote: »I'd be ploughing into a jar of peanut butter face first if i had your problem
I can eat it sometimes (had some today actually) but most of the time I'm not into it LOL
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alexialmann wrote: »midwesterner85 wrote: »I agree with making sure you get enough protein. An idea is to add protein powder to your coffee, but it mixes best with a blender (glass is best due to heat, unless you have a plastic blender designed to handle high temperatures).
Otherwise, listen to your body.
Never thought about adding it to coffee, that might be tasty. Do you know a good brand that blends well? I can't stand Muscle Milk, the one they have at LifeTime is pretty good but so expensive.
Most often, I've just used the GNC brand. My preference is chocolate, but sometimes banana is a lighter option.1 -
In regards to logging, I have friends who I know have found it helpful to rename the meals in their diary! Instead of breakfast/lunch/dinner/snacks, they are things like "12am-6am" "6am-12pm," etc. YMMV0
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I was going to suggest an iced coffee protein drink to help top up your calories as I was reading through the thread- but it has just come up.
I use kaizen vanilla from Costco. I just make a cup of strong coffee, cool it in the fridge, then mix it with a scoop of powder, adding ice cubes to fill the container. A banana or orange go well.
You could also get yourself some protein bars to snack on.
Cheers, h.0
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