Am I wrong for not having the same lifestyle choice?
Jdismybug1
Posts: 443 Member
Hi! I'm new to posting on the forums.
I've been a bit of a lurker for a while. I've lost 20.5lbs since April 4th.
I started tracking on myfitnesspal in may.
So here is my problem.
I'm making my own changes in my diet, and exercise, just by observing how my body feels, my personal choice, and what works for me.
I was having a friendly conversation with a friend I've had for 20+ years. She is a vegan. Has been for 2 years now.
I was more or less talking to her about my sisters struggling with high blood pressure and mess from it. (Recent changes)
She suggested plant based diet, and I did tell my sister and she did respond how it's a great idea it probably isn't a good fit for her. I also feel the same way, and I let her know that.
Then I was told we were full of excuses. That I made excuses for why I don't want to live a plant based life. We got into it a little because she thinks if someone has done the research and they're not plant based they're a terrible person. She has no respect and thinks they're stupid.
I'm stuck. I really think I need to be making my own choices. I shouldn't have to earn someone's respect after 20 + years because they changed their lifestyle.
I never judged her for being vegan. Never said I wouldn't try vegan meals, even told her when I was visiting for a day that I would eat what's she's eating. That way she didn't have to go out of her way for anything.
I am trying to be healthier. I have my good days and bad, I don't think becoming vegan is necessary. I don't think it's right to judge me because I'm not vegan. Am I wrong?
I've been a bit of a lurker for a while. I've lost 20.5lbs since April 4th.
I started tracking on myfitnesspal in may.
So here is my problem.
I'm making my own changes in my diet, and exercise, just by observing how my body feels, my personal choice, and what works for me.
I was having a friendly conversation with a friend I've had for 20+ years. She is a vegan. Has been for 2 years now.
I was more or less talking to her about my sisters struggling with high blood pressure and mess from it. (Recent changes)
She suggested plant based diet, and I did tell my sister and she did respond how it's a great idea it probably isn't a good fit for her. I also feel the same way, and I let her know that.
Then I was told we were full of excuses. That I made excuses for why I don't want to live a plant based life. We got into it a little because she thinks if someone has done the research and they're not plant based they're a terrible person. She has no respect and thinks they're stupid.
I'm stuck. I really think I need to be making my own choices. I shouldn't have to earn someone's respect after 20 + years because they changed their lifestyle.
I never judged her for being vegan. Never said I wouldn't try vegan meals, even told her when I was visiting for a day that I would eat what's she's eating. That way she didn't have to go out of her way for anything.
I am trying to be healthier. I have my good days and bad, I don't think becoming vegan is necessary. I don't think it's right to judge me because I'm not vegan. Am I wrong?
8
Replies
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You are not wrong. The thing is, in today's society with the decline of historically powerful religions in much of the world, the human capacity for fervent religious belief has been occupied by other things, one of which is the various ways of eating which people adhere to. It affects western vegans as severely as eastern vegetarians. Did you catch the news item yesterday about the PM of India, representing a Hindu Party, having to publicly denounce the mob killing of suspected non-Hindu meat-eaters? We haven't gotten entirely to that in the West yet, but we have gotten all the way to the point of destruction of private property and personal relationships.21
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I did not catch the news yesterday, but I certainly see what you're saying. Thank you for responding. This has been bothering me for a few days. She's a good friend of mine, and it hurts that she feels she needs to be this way. We could just let each other be... which I am doing. What she said wasn't necessary.0
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@Jdismybug1 you are lucky to have a body that talks with your brain as to how to eat and move. Some of us break our health to a point where we can not trust our eating clues until we start eating correctly for our own body for a good period of time.
The next time someone tells you how you need to eat be polite but totally do not let your brain hear their words on the subject. It is your internal clues you need to listen to based on my experience and the science I have read on the subject.
In my case it was getting the right balance of carbs, protein and fats figured out to lose weight and keep it off that was Job #1. When at 63 I understood and acted on that understanding the number of calories that I ate were self controlled without much thought on my part. At 66 my health and health markers are the best they have been in decades.
Best of continued success.5 -
Thank you @GaleHawkins0
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For any "weight loss" & "healthy lifestyle" to not only work but last long term, you need to do what is right for you and fits into your life. This is how I've managed to lose weight and in turn help some of my medical conditions. As also being disabled, makes traditional exercise impossible. Every ones different and will want to eat different foods or follow different diet plans. But I feel it's important to respect everyone's right to follow their own path and to be supportive of their hard work. We all now how difficult it can be at times. It sounds as if you've listened to your friend, supported her decisions and then decided to continue with your own way of doing things. This is working and I don't think you should change anything. It's a shame that your friend can't be as supportive to you.3
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The problem is she's just damn judgemental. There's a difference in constructive criticism & judgement & she crossed that line from the moment you decided against her ideals. It's rampant in a lot of diet circles. I see it a lot from vegans & I see it alot among fellow keto'ers. And from others against keto'ers & against vegans. If your friend can't be respectful, tell her that she's judgemental & she needs to reevaluate her values. If she can't then move on or distance yourself from her long enough to decide if her ideals or your joint friendship are more valuable to her. Chances are, she has judged you secretly for a while & the discussion just gave way for her to do it openly.
It sucks, but it's the way many people are. We do this to each other with religion, lack of religion, politics, diet, morals, different cultures, different nations, different child rearing philosophies, different vehicle choices, and the list could go on forever.
We're judgemental based on nearly everything from huge issues all the way down to microscopically petty ones. You need to decide if having someone in your circle that will tear you down for your choices or build you up & support the ones you do make.7 -
@Wendyanneroberts this is exactly how I feel.
My sister I have watched struggle. I have had struggles but learned to work with them. Never once have I disrespected my friend. But if that's the way that she wants to live her life I say so be it.
I have had different experiences than her that led me to where I am today, and I feel our values are different.
I don't expect her to understand them. So I will just have to live my life and let her live hers.
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You're not wrong, but try not to be to angry at your friend. Sometimes people think they have all the answers and they will sabotage everything for their cause only to realize that they were insane to do so. That being said, don't let her constantly bring you down. Sometimes it's better to know when to let go of a friendship.
Is it something she has just started nagging you about or has it been going on for the whole 2 years she has been vegan?0 -
@Colt1835 she was kind of saying these things one time towards the beginning of her becoming vegan. She went on a whole rant about how she can't be as close to me as we used to be because she has different values. She wished she had someone that was a close friend with the same values.
She recently started seeing someone with the same values. Which makes me happy for her. i told her that and she still thought I wasn't excited or caring enough, even tho I asked what he was like etc.
She's said little things here and there but aside from that she's never really nagged me.0 -
You are not wrong, it is your body and because you have a keen sense of how your body responds you'll be able to tailor your eating to what works for you which is really the best way. I just went plant based this week after a 5-month transition to it for health reasons. It was hard for me because I love my steaks and I am sure I'll dream of them for some time.
Each person's body is different and each of us, when we can hear our bodies are the best judge of how to nourish it. I will share my experience which is in February I was running 192/145 and that was on 8 medications just for blood pressure. today I run in the 120's/80's and in the past 30 days, the kidney doctor has dropped three of my meds because I have started getting too low, which after 25 years of too high, was the evidence that helped me make the switch completely. I hope I have that ability some day to really listen to my body, but I will probably need to get that last 75 lbs off so the sound can get through. :-)3 -
That's not awful then I guess. There are plenty of worse ways for friends to behave. We all have flaws and such.Jdismybug1 wrote: »@Colt1835 she was kind of saying these things one time towards the beginning of her becoming vegan. She went on a whole rant about how she can't be as close to me as we used to be because she has different values. She wished she had someone that was a close friend with the same values.
She recently started seeing someone with the same values. Which makes me happy for her. i told her that and she still thought I wasn't excited or caring enough, even tho I asked what he was like etc.
She's said little things here and there but aside from that she's never really nagged me.
You should definitely do what you believe is best for your body though. You know it much better than she does.
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You are not wrong, she is for trying to force her lifestyle upon you. It's fine to recommend your eating style to people, I do the same by recommending calorie counting if someone says they want to lose weight, but if they decline you drop it.3
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Thank you @StevLL it's about listening to my body.
My life is very different from someone else's. I work a lot, it's a part of who I am. I put my family and work first because that is our livelihood, it keeps a roof over our heads and foods in our bellies.
I was criticized because I said I work a lot and have to take my family's dietary and financial needs into account on a lifestyle change too. I was literally told that's an excuse.
If done in an unhealthy way vegans, especially children can be malnourished, I don't want to take risk when I have a 4 year old. There's a lot of extra supplemental needs to afford, that we can't do on a weekly grocery budget.
If it works for someone else more power to them. I will stand by making my family and and work a priority while making health changes. When I told someone this they said that work isn't important. It's not as important as vegan values for animal products and such.
This is what is really getting me. I'm told I'm selfish for trying to take care of myself and my family.
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I have run into similar situations a lot and it really bother me too.
It's pretty much undisputed at this point that eating more plants is good for our bodies and the environment. However, I also think that there gets to be a point of diminishing returns. Sure, we're eating fewer animals, but we're also expanding farmland and using more slave labor for harvest while depleting soil of its nutrients.
While I definitely make an effort to include as much plant stuff in my diet as possible, it is not realistic for me to be 100% plants 100% of the time. Beans and lentils are cheap, but most other plant based substitutes are expensive. (Pea protein, soy yogurt, meat substitutes, etc)
It should not make me a terrible person or a murderer or selfish because I make different choices. What really drives me nuts is that for the number of "but what about bacon?" and "where do you get your protein?" questions they get, you'd think that they'd be stoked to be able to eat with an omnivore who's not going to *kitten* and whine about the lack of meat.
*sigh* sorry for the rant. This really butters my bagel.3 -
The two of you are moving apart in values. It's sad but not your doing. Maybe mentally shift her in to friendly acquaintance category.6
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I watched the documentaries "Cowspiracy" and "Forks Over Knives" with my son and his wife. Both of the films convinced me that the vegan lifestyle is commendable for those who can do it and remain healthy. I applaud my son and his wife for choosing to continue on that path for the health, moral and environmental reasons.
However, after almost six months on a vegan diet my health declined drastically. I had little energy, gained weight, and my A1C went up two whole points. Adding animal products back into my diet (as well as cutting back on carbs) allowed me to regain my energy, lose weight, and lower my A1C back down the two points without medication.
Do what is right for you and your health, regardless what others tell you. It's a shame your friend insists on being judgmental. My son and his wife are the same way, and it makes me sad that it has damaged our relationship, but I have to do what I know will keep me healthy.4 -
"Cowspiracy" is a factually-incorrect attempt at a 'documentary'. You ever want to know what really goes on at farms, talk to farmers.3
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This is your journey. Your body. Your choices. Personally if an old friend of mine was behaving in such a way I'd let them have their say, acknowledge their opinion and then politely tell them to keep it to themselves! I have only told very close family members that I'm using mfp to avoid unwanted advice. Sorry you're being made to feel like this when its tough enough dealing with diet/fitness and the emotions it involves. Stick to your guns!2
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MichelleSilverleaf wrote: »"Cowspiracy" is a factually-incorrect attempt at a 'documentary'. You ever want to know what really goes on at farms, talk to farmers.
I've seen a lot of "Forks Over Knives" de-bunked, too. Nobody can get it 100% right, it seems.
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Welcome to the world of the virtuous.
Let's get together for coffee. I'll explain why I'm a better person than you.12 -
I'm so thankful I posted this. I'm thankful for all the advice. More than anything when I've had hard times I've relied on her for comfort, being there, listening, and this time I really had no one to talk to about it.
For now I'm pretty much just eased back on talking about values. I am not going to cut her out of my life, but am not going to really update her in the way I used to.
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My sister is a vegan and eating an 80% carb, 10% protein, 10% fat diet. I'm an avowed meat eater with an emphasis on protein and fat. We both think that the other's diet is nuts. Yet we both recognize that our relationship doesn't have to be affected by that. I'm sorry about your friend. She sounds pretty extreme. Try not to take it too much to heart.5
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Everyone who has ever had an epiphany seems compelled to share their excitement with everyone they know. Understandable I suppose, but not always useful or wanted. She's clearly a newbie at vegan-ism, and thinks it's the Answer To Life. Maybe, maybe not - but her fervor may wane in a year or so and you don't have to be a follower of *her* lifestyle to have a worthwhile, fulfilling, healthy life. Smile and tell her you love her as a friend and that you're happy she's so content with her new eating habits. Do not speak of it again.4
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Sounds like a "friend" you need to say "forget you" to...0
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Can I interest you in Jesus? He died for your sins and mine0
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Let it be... maybe your friend will settle down3
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Just do you.
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I am vegan: for me it works as an athlete. But I don't preach it to anyone. Mainly because I do not care whatsoever what people eat as long as they eat right. Mcdonald french fries are vegan. So there you go: crap is crap.5
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I was plant-based for a while and I could have only dreamed that my social circle would be as supportive as you seem to be!
Vegans go through what feels like a very eye opening and life changing experience when they do it for the animals. I really do believe it's almost a baptism of sorts.. their old life is dead to them and it's very important that they surround themselves with people who not only share the same values but who understand the need for this 'baptism'. And I can understand first hand the kind of treatment they receive based on what they eat. I tried to be really hush-hush when i was plant-based but i still heard a lot of snide and derisive comments from people. So I'm guessing there's a certain amount of defensiveness that builds up in them too. Understandably so.
As a result, I try to treat vegans with a certain amount of care. I know that for some, it's traumatic to even look at meat. I have no problem enjoying a vegan meal with vegan friends or coworkers to avoid the issue. However, I also don't think that should be the expectation. If anything, there needs to be a mutual respect for each other's diets and choices. If her worldview has changed so dramatically that she cannot see beyond your diet.. there's so little you can work with. I think you've done a bang up job already of being respectful and caring. The rest is up to her.6 -
I think the problem might be that it's not a "diet" to her but something she is doing for the animals and for the environment and doesn't understand others not doing the same. But she's talking about it like it's a diet and then expecting you to read her mind about the rest which isn't exactly fair. Really being vegan isn't just what you eat, it's what you wear, how you live, it affects everything. I stop for animals in the road, etc. When I first went vegan I thought my friends would all see how awesome it was and decide to join me. Yeah, that didn't happen.
If the friendship is worth hanging onto I guess give her some space but also let her talk to you about the things she cares about. I agree with the comment above that for someone who cares about animals, once you see, and that means really see on film or in real life, what's going on, it is hard to not be emotional about it.3
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