Advice for Increasing 5K pace
caramel827
Posts: 163 Member
I finally achieved my goal of completing my first 5K while running. It was at "turtle speed" but I finished which was the goal! (It took 41 minutes.)
Now I want to increase my pace but I really lack the endurance. Just finishing the 5K took me having to do Couch to 5K twice! The 5K pacer app has me doing intervals but my husband said that's like starting over.
Any advice on increasing the pace? All ideas welcome! Thanks in advance!
Now I want to increase my pace but I really lack the endurance. Just finishing the 5K took me having to do Couch to 5K twice! The 5K pacer app has me doing intervals but my husband said that's like starting over.
Any advice on increasing the pace? All ideas welcome! Thanks in advance!
9
Replies
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do the bridge to 10k next . the best way to increase your speed is to run farther.6
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Hi,
if you want to run faster:
1. Do intervals/hill training
2. Run further
3. Do threshold training
There's plenty on google
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Just keep running. Don't worry about your pace yet, as you gradually add more mileage your endurance and speed will start to increase naturally.
Agree with the above poster about bridge to 10k...3 -
Well done on your first 5k! I agree - increasing your distance will help you run 5k faster. I've also used intervals to get used to running at a faster pace, which seems to have helped my 5k timr. You may also be interested in doing some cross training - working on your core especially can help with your running performance too.2
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caramel827 wrote: »I finally achieved my goal of completing my first 5K while running. It was at "turtle speed" but I finished which was the goal! (It took 41 minutes.)
Now I want to increase my pace but I really lack the endurance. Just finishing the 5K took me having to do Couch to 5K twice! The 5K pacer app has me doing intervals but my husband said that's like starting over.
Any advice on increasing the pace? All ideas welcome! Thanks in advance!
As a new runner the most effective way to improve your pace is to increase your running volume. Once you're comfortably running for 10K you'll find that you'll have knocked several minutes off your 5K time.
Fwiw I'd generally avoid anything more sophisticated like fast intervals until you're comfortable running 10K, as the main thing you're going to do is increase your injury risk. Most plans will have you doing about 80% of your miles at an easy pace, rather than speedwork.2 -
More volume, More miles, more often. But not ramping up so quickly that you do too much too soon. Patience and time building your aerobic system. Intervals, speed work and all that comes later.2
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Hi when i started to get fitter i found that crosstraining/ bootcamp really helped. Weighted squats and lunges/ burpees/ squat jumps really strengthem your legs and help you to increase speed and stamina...1
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mattyoung1990 wrote: »Hi,
if you want to run faster:
1. Do intervals/hill training
2. Run further
3. Do threshold training
There's plenty on google
Normally, this would be my advice, but It sounds like you're still having trouble finishing.
So work on your work capacity. Mix it up. 20, 30 40, 60 minutes of running. Don't worry so much about distance for now. Learn to listen to your body, pick a time, and run just that far. when you finish, you should feel like you could go about 5 more minutes...
Also, your husband is wrong. going to intervals is not going backwards, it is the next step, but you're just not ready yet.2 -
+1 on more volume. Intervals and hill training are good advice for folks with a good running base because their bodies are used to the stress of running. If you don't run decent volume, you're much more likely to get injured doing speedwork.
On the other hand, if you don't find an elliptical or arc trainer to be absolute torture, then you could do interval programs on those.1 -
You're still working on your aerobic base. It sounds counter-intuitive but running more (don't increase your distance too quickly) at a slow pace will improve your 5K pace over time. A wise coach once told me not to worry about running a fast 5K until I could run a slow 10km...
Anecdotal but.....I ran my first 5K in just under 40 minutes, one year later - with no speed work - I got it down to 26 minutes.
Once you've built your base then you can incorporate some speed work11 -
Thanks everyone this is good advice. The thought of a 10K gives me chills because it seems soooo far but I am going to try it! I appreciate the advice!6
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There is already such a wealth of great advice here, including some great takeaways for myself, but as someone who was not that long ago in your shoes I can say that working on greater distances at a slower pace increased my 5K times immensely. This happened almost without me even realizing it. It just sort of evolved organically that way.
Getting your aerobic house in order just takes time and more running more frequently. It's fundamentals really, just like in any other sport. People do not go directly from Pop Warner to the NFL, and runners rarely go from ground zero to blazing fast 5K times. You are going to be discovering a great deal about your body in the next few months if you stick with this, but it takes patience. Congrats on completing your first 5K!2 -
How often are you running? To put up a decent time under 30 minutes, you probably need 4-6 months of 4 runs/week of 4 to 7 k. Intervals are a good idea. You could start with 2 min hard running, 1-2 min walk for 30 minutes once a week. The goal on the fast run part is race pace for a 30 min 5k. You could also add in a tempo run once a week. Try 8 min hard run, 2 min walk x 3 or 4. The idea is to push beyond your current comfort zone and run a bit faster than you normally do.
I don't see how running a longer-slow 10 k is going to get you to your goal of a fast 5 k in short order. Just sucks up your limited training time on slow endurance running. To run fast in a race, run fast in practise.
About me- running 5k to half marathon for 20 years. Just ran a 26 min 5 k last weekend. I have given up the longer races due to lack of time. Longest training session this year = 40 min.
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Completed C25K a few months ago at 32:00, ran this mornings park run at 28:27. I run a 5km twice a week plus park run. I think I'd struggle with a 10km even at a slower pace.1
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You'd be surprised at what you can do with a little perseverance. When I started running, 2 minutes was hard. Doing my first 5 mile run seemed impossible. Then came 8, then 10, then 12, then 15. When I did my first 20 I was sure that was impossible. But 3 marathons later it's just another number. The runs are not always easy - especially since I tend to do my long runs too fast - but knowing that I can do more than I ever thought possible is an incredible feeling.5
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Janice6543 wrote: »I don't see how running a longer-slow 10 k is going to get you to your goal of a fast 5 k in short order. Just sucks up your limited training time on slow endurance running. To run fast in a race, run fast in practise.
Essentially it comes down to aerobic capacity and the hierarchy of performance improvement. The originator has the aerobic capacity to run for 5Km. By increasing volume she'll make fairly rapid improvements in aerobic capacity. In contrast the rate of improvement from sprint intervals or tempo runs is considerably lower in the absence of an aerobic base.
If you look at the majority of training plans you'll see about 80% of the volume is easy paced, with the other 20% being speedwork, although even that has good long warm ups.
I'd also highlight that most plans have three stages; build up, speedwork then taper. That's assuming a Lydiard based schema which is most appropriate for many of the people asking questions like this in here. Essentially a build up to an event with say an 8-10 week lead time.
If someone is running races more regularly then personally I'd start building a more cyclic plan that almost allows them to race at very short notice. For me, I decided to race a half about 6 weeks ago with less than a weeks notice, but my training is designed around fairly regular marathons and ultras.About me- running 5k to half marathon for 20 years. Just ran a 26 min 5 k last weekend. I have given up the longer races due to lack of time. Longest training session this year = 40 min.
For someone with your experience you've got a very solid aerobic base, so you're not really comparing like with like. I can't put myself in the originators shoes given where I am now. Any advice has to reflect back to when I was recently finished C25K myself.6 -
spiriteagle99 wrote: »You'd be surprised at what you can do with a little perseverance. When I started running, 2 minutes was hard. Doing my first 5 mile run seemed impossible. Then came 8, then 10, then 12, then 15. When I did my first 20 I was sure that was impossible. But 3 marathons later it's just another number. The runs are not always easy - especially since I tend to do my long runs too fast - but knowing that I can do more than I ever thought possible is an incredible feeling.
So much THIS!!!1 -
I ran my first 5K in 39 minutes, 9 months or so later I have done it in just over 32 minutes.....and I'm 16 stone!!
Don't worry about how fast your doing it, just do it and maybe run a little further.2 -
I'm a new 50-something runner (within the past 2 years) who started with C25K. I can now do a 5K just a bit faster than a 9 minute mile pace and I'm slowly getting faster.
My approach has been to do about 4 mile workouts, concentrating on the central 3.1 miles. I don't agree that longer distances helps speed. Doing intervals and weight training to build muscle is what really increases speed. (I may be too old for that!)3 -
Jthanmyfitnesspal wrote: »Doing intervals and weight training to build muscle is what really increases speed. (I may be too old for that!)
I'd be interested to read what that's based on?
It's always useful to read around coaching and alternative outlooks.1 -
This all such great advice! What it is helping me learn the most that I need to approach this as I did weight loss by finding what works for me. Eventually I do hope to pick up some speed but I think I'll focus on completing a few more 5Ks and then try each suggestion for at least 8 weeks (intervals and then trying to increase distance) and run a 5K after each 8 week session. 100 pounds definitely didn't fall off overnight so I have to realize I guess that I'm not going to be Flash over night either lol!
Thanks so much everyone! I love this board! Keep it coming!
Monica3 -
Just keep running! First try increasing you distance 1km at a time. That what I did, now I'm running 20km in 2 hours 10 mins! Don't give up!5
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caramel827 wrote: »Eventually I do hope to pick up some speed but I think I'll focus on completing a few more 5Ks and then try each suggestion for at least 8 weeks (intervals and then trying to increase distance) and run a 5K after each 8 week session.
Can I make the suggestion that you try it the other way round, build your aerobic capacity, and then use intervals. To illustrate these are a few interval sessions that are appropriate to someone improving their 5K time.- 2 mile warm-up, 5 x 400 meters at 5k goal race pace with 100m slower rest, 1-2 mile cool down
- 2 mile warm-up, 4 x 600 meters at 5k goal race pace with 100m slower rest, 1-2 mile cool down
- 2-3 mile warm-up, 3 x 800 meters at 5k goal race pace with 200m slower rest, 1-2 mile cool down
- 2-3 mile warm-up, 6 x 400 meters at 5k goal race pace with 100m slower rest, hammer interval 6 as fast as you can, 1-2 mile cool down
- 2-3 mile warm-up, 4 x 800 meters at 5k goal race pace with 200m slower rest, hammer interval 4 as fast as you can, 1-2 mile cool down
You'll note that the most basic of those covers nearly 5 miles with the longest covering 8 miles.
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MeanderingMammal wrote: »caramel827 wrote: »Eventually I do hope to pick up some speed but I think I'll focus on completing a few more 5Ks and then try each suggestion for at least 8 weeks (intervals and then trying to increase distance) and run a 5K after each 8 week session.
Can I make the suggestion that you try it the other way round, build your aerobic capacity, and then use intervals. To illustrate these are a few interval sessions that are appropriate to someone improving their 5K time.- 2 mile warm-up, 5 x 400 meters at 5k goal race pace with 100m slower rest, 1-2 mile cool down
- 2 mile warm-up, 4 x 600 meters at 5k goal race pace with 100m slower rest, 1-2 mile cool down
- 2-3 mile warm-up, 3 x 800 meters at 5k goal race pace with 200m slower rest, 1-2 mile cool down
- 2-3 mile warm-up, 6 x 400 meters at 5k goal race pace with 100m slower rest, hammer interval 6 as fast as you can, 1-2 mile cool down
- 2-3 mile warm-up, 4 x 800 meters at 5k goal race pace with 200m slower rest, hammer interval 4 as fast as you can, 1-2 mile cool down
You'll note that the most basic of those covers nearly 5 miles with the longest covering 8 miles.
And those would all be equally effective with half(or less) warmup/cooldown1 -
MeanderingMammal wrote: »Jthanmyfitnesspal wrote: »Doing intervals and weight training to build muscle is what really increases speed. (I may be too old for that!)
I'd be interested to read what that's based on?
It's always useful to read around coaching and alternative outlooks.
I looked up Lydiard on your recommendation. Very interesting. Mostly aimed at marathon distance, but perhaps applicable to improving 5k's as well. The point about building an aerobic base prior to interval training seems reasonable and is well taken.
Just like the OP, I mostly want to improve my 5k. I've been running 3-5 miles, but Iwill try adding in some even longer distances (however more slowly) and see if it helps my 5k performance.2 -
I pretty much just run for fun now but at the finish line I am always looking at the clock.1
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stanmann571 wrote: »MeanderingMammal wrote: »caramel827 wrote: »Eventually I do hope to pick up some speed but I think I'll focus on completing a few more 5Ks and then try each suggestion for at least 8 weeks (intervals and then trying to increase distance) and run a 5K after each 8 week session.
Can I make the suggestion that you try it the other way round, build your aerobic capacity, and then use intervals. To illustrate these are a few interval sessions that are appropriate to someone improving their 5K time.- 2 mile warm-up, 5 x 400 meters at 5k goal race pace with 100m slower rest, 1-2 mile cool down
- 2 mile warm-up, 4 x 600 meters at 5k goal race pace with 100m slower rest, 1-2 mile cool down
- 2-3 mile warm-up, 3 x 800 meters at 5k goal race pace with 200m slower rest, 1-2 mile cool down
- 2-3 mile warm-up, 6 x 400 meters at 5k goal race pace with 100m slower rest, hammer interval 6 as fast as you can, 1-2 mile cool down
- 2-3 mile warm-up, 4 x 800 meters at 5k goal race pace with 200m slower rest, hammer interval 4 as fast as you can, 1-2 mile cool down
You'll note that the most basic of those covers nearly 5 miles with the longest covering 8 miles.
And those would all be equally effective with half(or less) warmup/cooldown
I couldn't, in good conscience, agree with you. The purpose of a warm up is to prepare for the workout and reduce the risk of injury. From a coaching perspective the originator is currently on an 8 minute kilometre. At the Parkrun I go to that would place her in the lower third of finishers, possibly even in the lower 20%. To get into a mid-pack finish I'd be designing a plan to get her to a 6 minute mile, so a 25% improvement. In truth, just going longer will do that in the space of about 6-8 weeks, but as we're discussing intervals let's pretend that's a more effective mode of training.
The sessions I've listed are the speed phase of a 5K plan, so building on an aerobic base of someone who's already able to cover 6 miles, having built up to that over the first four weeks.
So assuming that warm up/ easy pace is an 8 minute mile you'd suggest an eight minute warm up before adding 400 metres at 25% faster. That's quite a jump. I'd support a shorter warm up for a lower pace differential, but at that point you're in the realms of just adding distance anyway.
There is a point about balancing fatigue and development, as fatigue sets in running form diminishes and injury risk increases. Again a good argument to build the aerobic base before indulging in speedwork.1 -
I am so thankful that I came across this thread. I am on my final week of my C25K. I had every intention of posting this exact same question sometime next week. My first 5K race (post C25K) is in about 2 weeks. My only goal for that race is to actually run the entire time. But after that I would also like to work my way to a better pace. I will definitely be looking into 10K training programs to help with that.1
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Jthanmyfitnesspal wrote: »MeanderingMammal wrote: »Jthanmyfitnesspal wrote: »Doing intervals and weight training to build muscle is what really increases speed. (I may be too old for that!)
I'd be interested to read what that's based on?
It's always useful to read around coaching and alternative outlooks.
I looked up Lydiard on your recommendation. Very interesting. Mostly aimed at marathon distance, but perhaps applicable to improving 5k's as well. The point about building an aerobic base prior to interval training seems reasonable and is well taken.
Just like the OP, I mostly want to improve my 5k. I've been running 3-5 miles, but Iwill try adding in some even longer distances (however more slowly) and see if it helps my 5k performance.
He himself had most success at that distance but the principles are present in the vast majority ofstandard plans. Matt Fitzgerald wrote a fairly turgid book, along with a significantly over-complicated planning schema.
In practice a competitive 5K plan will have similar mileage to a mid-pack marathon plan, but the distribution of sessions will be different. Entering at about 30 miles per week and peaking at 50-60 miles per week. A marathoner or ultra runner might do one speedwork session per week, about a 10 mile run, whereas a 5K focus might do two, equally up to 8-10 miles each.
Fwiw my own experience was that at the end of C25K I was doing a 32 minute 5K, by the end of B210K I'd knocked that down to 27 minutes. At the end of a Half plan I was down to 24 minutes. I've not really focused on 5K myself as I'm an ultra runner, so beyond HM I've not made much improvement. Down to about 22 minutes now and I don't see any potential at the moment.1 -
MeanderingMammal wrote: »caramel827 wrote: »Eventually I do hope to pick up some speed but I think I'll focus on completing a few more 5Ks and then try each suggestion for at least 8 weeks (intervals and then trying to increase distance) and run a 5K after each 8 week session.
Can I make the suggestion that you try it the other way round, build your aerobic capacity, and then use intervals. To illustrate these are a few interval sessions that are appropriate to someone improving their 5K time.- 2 mile warm-up, 5 x 400 meters at 5k goal race pace with 100m slower rest, 1-2 mile cool down
- 2 mile warm-up, 4 x 600 meters at 5k goal race pace with 100m slower rest, 1-2 mile cool down
- 2-3 mile warm-up, 3 x 800 meters at 5k goal race pace with 200m slower rest, 1-2 mile cool down
- 2-3 mile warm-up, 6 x 400 meters at 5k goal race pace with 100m slower rest, hammer interval 6 as fast as you can, 1-2 mile cool down
- 2-3 mile warm-up, 4 x 800 meters at 5k goal race pace with 200m slower rest, hammer interval 4 as fast as you can, 1-2 mile cool down
You'll note that the most basic of those covers nearly 5 miles with the longest covering 8 miles.
Ditto's when you get to that point.
My only thought was if you meant still doing a form of jog reasonable / walk intervals.
If that was your intent, then keep that up while increasing distance as first improvement.
If sprinting / walking - no.
Being able to hit an efficient form at faster pace is usually noticeable, even if just for some minutes at a time until you walk again, or even within a jog segment you speed up to feel for when that is, then walk.
Also - an interesting aspect to testing 5K frequently like that - if you are doing any logging or watching of HR - use your race avgHR if you got it - and try to match that on each test.
You should see at same HR your speed goes up because you have become more fit.
Just interesting aside.2
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