TDEE or fitness pal

if you use MFP, it anticipates you eating back work out calories; whereas TDEE you don't...with running and crossfit (especially a more cardio one) - you could easily burn those 260cal in a workout, so it evens out

Taken at face value, both should have you eating about the same amount... it's just a question of how you want to log/track. TDEE is more of a "things will balance out in the long run" approach, where MFP is more about logging/tracking everything.

There are shades of gray, but that's the cliff notes version.

As far as your numbers go... with MFP, you eat 1200 cals per day, log your exercise, which then allows you to eat more cals because you burned additional cals through exercise. TDEE factors your exercise in from the start, so it's more of a set it and forget it number.

If it's an occasional miss here or there, it's probably not necessary, unless you specifically want to... it should all get caught in the wash. If it's more regular, then yea, probably should.

Keep in mind, those numbers are just estimates based on impersonal equations. You may have to fuss with them a bit to find your actual numbers.

jennydelgado09 wrote: »

Ok good info.

So if I miss a workout here and there(aiming for the 5am class is hard) should I lower my calorie goal for that day?

I wouldn't worry about an occasional missed workout, but if your schedule is unpredictable, that may be a reason to use the MFP method. My exercise is weather dependent most of the year (rower), so the MFP approach works much better for me than TDEE.

Keep in mind that you could do a hybrid of both methods if you wish, as long as you can keep it straight: Calculate your TDEE with all of your exercise except the 5AM class, then eat the 5AM exercise calories (that day or over a couple of days) in the cases where you actually do make it to class.

I like TDEE better.

It amounts to almost the same either way, but when I have to wear a HRM, I end up caring more about the calories burnt than exercise its self.

jennydelgado09 wrote: »

Ok good info.

So if I miss a workout here and there(aiming for the 5am class is hard) should I lower my calorie goal for that day?

Later answer here, I hope it's still useful for you.

IMO, *NO*, if you look at rolling averages - which suggest over TDEE.

TDEE seems IMPOSSIBLE to calculate, imo.
(For example, who can say how many calories I burned up lifting weights?
Even if there were a calculator....does it account for rep speed? Probably not!
And, do I want to enter yet another set of numbers in an app for each set I do at the gym? No.)

OTOH, in regards to your question: YES, missing a workout changes calories out.

However, you can account for it another way
***Try using what I would probably call a Long Term Averages approach (let's call it LTA)***
(we could perhaps call it a Running Average or Long Term Running Average).

My method:

Cliff Notes:
Find a length of time for which you have consistent diet and activity.
After an iteration (or more) of that length of time, calculate weight loss and adjust food/exercise as desired.

Example (real world):

1. Find period of time with consistent Diet and Exercise (for me: weights and running).
Use the longest period of consistency.

A. Diet

My diet is surprisingly consistent week to week.
The average really is about the same, week to week.
(Certainly a two-week rolling average would be consistent at any point in time.)

Probably because: I use MFP exactingly. I weigh every morsel, use measuring spoons for oil when I sautee, etc.
I also listen to my body and eat what I seem to need.
But ultimately the whole thing is regulated by my MFP caloric goals.

A few notes on calories:
I used MFP's calculations as a starting point.
I really didn't enjoy the experience of that daily calorie suggestion.
So, i ate more, tweaked it, and ended up at 2,570 calories per day / 100g protein.

B. Exercise

i. Weights
Currently, my weight workout schedule evened out - it had to adjust for other activities in my life, workout a little less than i initially thought I would because 6x/week was too much, I do slightly fewer/less intense sets than 3 weeks ago - that was too taxing, etc.

But eventually, wound up with a consistent schedule:

Which happens to be this:
I intent to work out 6x/week, (PPLPPLR), but the recovery is too much so I generally workout 5x/week.
HOWEVER, every other week or so, I only work out 4x/week because I get bored, life gets in the way, etc.

Bottom line, I can count on 9 weight workouts in 2 weeks.

ii. Running.
Very consistent. Run 8 miles a week, walk 5.
However, if it were inconsistent, of course I would find a length of time that was, and use that to examine weight loss.

C. CALCULATING PERIOD OF TIME (longest period of consistency).
Clearly, I would want to examine a two-week period.
Because nothing is inconsistent for longer than 2 weeks.
And everything IS consistent over a two-week period.

2. Calculate weight loss and adjust as needed.

A. Calculate weight loss:
In the past X weeks (for me, it's two weeks), I've lost 2.5 lbs.
Weight loss: 1.25 lbs. / week.

(but soon I will look at longer periods).

B. Adjust as needed:
In my example, I'm very happy losing 1.25 lbs. / week
So I'm not going to adjust anything on that basis.

You might find you want to change fat loss per week -- if so, of course:
- Change calories and/or activity level.

I'm somewhat new to this process (I've been Dieting, Lifting, and Running for 6 weeks),
so I'll review this periodically to see if I want to make any adjustments.

---

Current adjustment notes, fwiw:

Weight loss: Happy

Lifting: more or less happy. I may decrease the intensity a bit, because the recovery days are a little wearing. FWIW, if I were not gaining strength, or, especially, if I were losing muscle, I would increase protein in, and consider adding calories.

Diet: More or less happy. I eat when I want (5x/day), and am never starving. I would love to pig out and/or eat as much as I want at meals, and also eat lots more brownies, but I always feel sated using MFP. So, for now, no changes planned.

Running: I'm just starting to ramp this up, with a goal of running most days, probably eventually to 12-17 miles a week? I'll probably want to eat more (and will allow this), but will keep an eye on total calories consumed per day to make sure they don't get out of hand. As long as I'm happy with weight loss, energy levels, and strength (and strength gains), I will allow some increased calories (particularly protein, as well as some fat and carbs).

Mostly I'll keep an eye on the weight loss number on the front page of MFP.
If it's not consistently going down, then I'll take a closer look at each component of my program (especially: calories).

jennydelgado09 wrote: »

Which one do you go off?

When I enter my goals into mfp- current 153lbs, goal 135lbs, lose 1lb a week, and not active. I do crossfit and run 3-5 days a week but work a very sedentary job. It gives me 1200 calories a day.

When I use an online TDEE calculator and enter the same info and want to lose 1lb a week I get 1460 calories a day.

260 calories seems like a big difference. I don't really trust the 1200 a day. I've tried that and couldn't lose any weight until I added calories.

But anyways, opinions?

They are two different methods, but when done properly they are 6 of 1, half dozen of the other.

MFP uses the NEAT method whereby your calorie target is derived by your day to day activity without exercise...you exercise and get calories to "eat back" to account for that activity since it isn't accounted for in your activity level.

TDEE includes your exercise in the total energy equation...so there is an estimate built in for fitness calories and thus you get a higher baseline target but wouldn't "eat back" calories because they're already in the energy equation.

I started out using the MFP method because I wasn't really working out and when I started working out, I wasn't really all that consistent with things. I switched to the TDEE method once my exercise became more consistent and a regular thing most days of the week.

The methods are pretty much 6 of 1...MFP will give me a base of about 1900 calories to lose 1 Lb per week...on average I was eating a total of around 2300 calories to lose about 1 Lb per week. TDEE gives me around 2800 calories for maintenance...a 500 calorie cut would be 2300 calories. The only difference between the methods is where you account for exercise.

Also, a lot of people don't do apples to apples with the two methods...they'll put 2 Lbs rate of loss goal with MFP and then 15-20% cut on a TDEE calculator which is going to usually be closer to about 1 Lb per week rate of loss...so you have to make sure you're comparing apples to apples.

brianneangell08 wrote: »

Personally I find it best to use a TDEE calculator but set it for “sedentary” and don’t put anything in when it asks about exercise. Then do -500cal for a 1 lb/week loss.

Set that number as your calorie goal in MFP. On days where you don’t exercise, eat that number.

Then, on the other days, log your purposeful exercise (CrossFit, going to the gym, etc) separately in MFP. Eat back 50-75% of those calories.

Personally, I find this to be the most accurate method. I’d calculate for you, but I don’t think you listed your height.

What you're describing is exactly what MFP already does...I don't understand using a TDEE calculator to use the MFP method...

not_a_runner wrote: »

PhilipABullen wrote: »

jennydelgado09 wrote: »

Ok good info.

So if I miss a workout here and there(aiming for the 5am class is hard) should I lower my calorie goal for that day?

TDEE seems IMPOSSIBLE to calculate, imo.

If TDEE seems impossible, you're probably overthinking it...
I've always gone according to TDEE and in my mind it's as simple as it gets. You don't need to know how many cals you burn doing every little thing. Just monitor your intake and your body weight and adjust accordingly. Scale trending up and you don't want it to? Adjust calories. Trying to maintain and weight is trending down? Increase calories.


OP, I often miss a planned workout here or there and it doesn't seem to have a significant impact at all. (That's maybe 300 calories for me, missing 300 calories of exercise one day a week isn't going to make much impact on body weight.)

You are correct!
The TDEE page works without knowing how many calories use.

HOWEVER - the TDEE numbers seem to be terrible!
Probably because I'm a terrible estimator of whether I'm Moderate or Heavy exerciser, and there are no boxes for running, nor weightlifting. It's just not terribly descriptive.

But, however you determine calories for the day,
my main point was in answer to her question:

'[what if I miss a work out]'

The answer being: P
ick a best-guess number and see if weight goes up or down (same as yours)
*but use a period of time for which exercise is consistent.
thereby, missed workouts are factored into the time period you examine.

To your last point - true, workouts missed of 300 calories may not affect much - since a pound is 3,500 calories.

Best -

I cycle a lot so my exercise is very variable day to day, week by week, even season by season.
MFP method is far better for me on that basis alone but often my burns are so high I have to eat them back on the day.

I have been affected by the 1200 cap, I noticed when I played around with the goals changing my activity level. I did this because I had noticed a change in weight loss etc.
I found this website:
https://www.caloriesecrets.net/how-many-calories-should-i-burn-a-day-to-lose-weight/#bmr-calculator

But, as others have said, it requires consistency, being realistic about activity level, maybe playing around with the numbers.
I have been trying this method for a couple weeks and it has helped my weight come off again. On my big exercise days (3hrs+) I aim for a certain calories, on my medium days (1-2hrs) another, and on my lazy days 1200.
It's a lot of tweaking of calories but with mfp to track the food it's not so bad. Basically I ignore mfp exercise calories by using the numbers spat out by the calculator on that website.
So far, I need to tweak it further as I'm losing a little too fast and had a carp weight session yesterday because of it, but in general it seems the way to go for the last 10kg for me.