MFP database is a minefield :'(

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  • boomerising
    boomerising Posts: 43 Member
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    Thanks for further comments everyone! I am SO behind on all forms of writing and recording. I haven’t even done my food diary for 2 days now. However I am still being careful and I did see a new low weight on the scale this morning so I’m doing alright I guess. I didn’t record that weight here because I know it’s a little fake—I didn’t make my water quota yesterday for one thing, I worked out at the gym which dumps more water, and I went to bed exhausted basically without any dinner except a couple servings of bean and pea chips. :) So my true weight is probably 1.5-2 lb higher than what I saw today, but it still is somewhat reassuring of the correct trend. Will catch up here this evening!
  • boomerising
    boomerising Posts: 43 Member
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    theabsentmindednurse wrote: »
    I ask the wait staff a lot of questions regard ingredients.
    I find the generic version in the app, than add the “Extras”.
    Cheese, dressing, salads, bread and so on.
    It is best to over estimate.
    Try not to stress. It does get easier the more you use the app and the more confident you feel.
    You will get there.
    For my particular temperament this is really good and succinct advice that I appreciate better after taking two days off from logging. Thanks.
  • boomerising
    boomerising Posts: 43 Member
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    @CyberTone your lesson in manipulating the MFP database was awesome. I do also use web based MFP much more than the app but I clearly have more to discover about what it can do. Did not know, for example, that you could enter negative values. A question: when you mention “the USDA database” are you referring to the consumer-friendly Food-a-Pedia that’s going away in June, or the root materials at the links you posted previously here? I’m wondering, among other things, which of the agency’s resources MFP’s database is pulling from when you enter a name that matches USDA’s.

    @wizzybeth if I understand correctly what is going on, the USDA database resources that are located outside Supertracker are going to remain basically intact, because USDA needs all that for specific purposes related to food industry regulations. But without the Food-a-Pedia UI we may need to be power users like CyberTone in order to get what we need out of it.
  • boomerising
    boomerising Posts: 43 Member
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    DX2JX2 wrote: »
    For an entree or main dish-sized portion at a restaurant, I will generally use 800 calories as a generic estimate unless it contains massive calorie bomb items (fried foods, etc.).
    OMG fried foods. Got to be one of the hardest things to get right. Of course when restricting calories we can’t eat them much anyway. I should thank my stomach for becoming intolerant of fried foods around the time of menopause. My indulgences in deep fried treats (including donuts for example) went to the “almost never” end of the graph long ago. I will occasionally sample some breakfast potatoes but usually regret that because on top of all the grease they typically contain onions, which I don’t handle well either. (Garlic? No prob ;) ) Most of the time I take whatever nutritionally preferable substitution they offer, such as the raw sliced tomatoes at one of my favorite diners, instead of the potatoes.
    For a generic diner-sized omelette: 210 calories for three eggs. 200 calories for 2 ounces of cheese cheese, 200 calories for 1 cup of chili and 200 calories for 2 tablespoons of cooking oil. Toast or home fries are extra.
    I still say that’s too high for my omelette. A whole cup of chili? No way. It wouldn’t fit, half of it would be oozing out. The way these folks do the chili-cheese omelette is really not “the traditional diner omelette” as @AllSpiceNice put it, but you both have convinced me that I was substantially too optimistic with the number I used. Next time maybe I’ll split the difference at 600. :D

  • Machka9
    Machka9 Posts: 24,944 Member
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    boomerising wrote: »
    I salute everyone here who has figured out how to overcome these hassles while maintaining a healthful diet and a balanced life. :)

    Thanks! :)

    I haven't had any particular difficulty with MFP's food database. In fact, of all the sites/programs I've used which are similar to MFP, MFP is the best by far. :)

  • boomerising
    boomerising Posts: 43 Member
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    Crafty_camper123 wrote: »
    I figure with some things being overestimated, and some being under things will even out. […] My goal is currently around 1450 cal a day, so I can see the frustration at figuring out you're at 1500cal by 5 pm when over-estimating those entries, and there is still dinner to be eaten! My current strategy for this is to figure out what my maintenance cals are (1650, roundabouts) and I try to stay within +/- 100 cals of goal and maintenance.
    Thanks! Your strategy makes huge sense and reminds me of something to look forward to as part of getting better at this. Still too early for me to have a handle on what my maintenance level is.

  • CyberTone
    CyberTone Posts: 7,337 Member
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    boomerising wrote: »
    @CyberTone your lesson in manipulating the MFP database was awesome. I do also use web based MFP much more than the app but I clearly have more to discover about what it can do. Did not know, for example, that you could enter negative values. A question: when you mention “the USDA database” are you referring to the consumer-friendly Food-a-Pedia that’s going away in June, or the root materials at the links you posted previously here? I’m wondering, among other things, which of the agency’s resources MFP’s database is pulling from when you enter a name that matches USDA’s.

    The USDA database I use is at these links. This link searches only the Standard Reference tables. I have this link bookmarked and use it all the time. Once you find an item, copy the name and paste it into the MFP search, which normally brings up the item that MFP imported.

    https://ndb.nal.usda.gov/ndb/search/list?ds=Standard+Reference

    This is the main link that searches both the Standard Reference and Branded Food Products tables. When you are on the page, click on the Select Source drop down field and you can choose which tables to search.

    https://ndb.nal.usda.gov/ndb/search/list

  • boomerising
    boomerising Posts: 43 Member
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    Many thanks @CyberTone for the links update. Those are “must” bookmarks for me!
  • boomerising
    boomerising Posts: 43 Member
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    Here I sit at one of the other local diners, a hugely popular one where I haven’t been in a while. Resisted the omelettes and ordered 2 eggs “over well,” but decided I needed the sausage, too. LOL. Subbed corn for the potatoes. No toast. Black coffee. And I’m here to tell ya, I might as well have had my fave thing at the neighborhood joint. OMG the grease. I was tempted to photograph the plate so you could see it glisten. The corn was a delightful accompaniment, but seemed to be coated with the same stuff that was on the eggs and the sausage. THIS place is the proverbial “greasy spoon.” A good one though. Given lots of protein and fat and not all that much high-glycemic carb (yeah, I know, corn), hopefully this meal will keep my motor running for most of the day. :)

    (Someone mentioned poached eggs upthread. Me and poached eggs at a diner = #nevergonnahappen. Won’t bore you with my reasons. I do prepare them at home occasionally.)
  • livingleanlivingclean
    livingleanlivingclean Posts: 11,751 Member
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    boomerising wrote: »
    Here I sit at one of the other local diners, a hugely popular one where I haven’t been in a while. Resisted the omelettes and ordered 2 eggs “over well,” but decided I needed the sausage, too. LOL. Subbed corn for the potatoes. No toast. Black coffee. And I’m here to tell ya, I might as well have had my fave thing at the neighborhood joint. OMG the grease. I was tempted to photograph the plate so you could see it glisten. The corn was a delightful accompaniment, but seemed to be coated with the same stuff that was on the eggs and the sausage. THIS place is the proverbial “greasy spoon.” A good one though. Given lots of protein and fat and not all that much high-glycemic carb (yeah, I know, corn), hopefully this meal will keep my motor running for most of the day. :)

    (Someone mentioned poached eggs upthread. Me and poached eggs at a diner = #nevergonnahappen. Won’t bore you with my reasons. I do prepare them at home occasionally.)

    That was me - that's my "easy to track" egg option, due to fat not being used in preparation.
  • mortuseon_
    mortuseon_ Posts: 257 Member
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    I agree that it can be a pain. Recently I've had a lot of trouble with inaccurate entries - for example, today I tried to log 70g of uncooked Tilda wholegrain basmati rice, which the top entry assured me would be just 161 kcals. Luckily, I checked the label so I knew that listing was bunk and probably ACTUALLY referred to the cooked rice (actual raw value was more like 250 kcal), but it makes logging more stressful and time-consuming than it needs to be. Likewise, a tub of vanilla Halo Top came in 40 kcal lower than the label, so I had to spend a while looking for the correct listing. If you're short and female and don't have too many calories to play with, these inaccuracies can really add up, and having to be SO careful can take the joy out of eating.

    Agreed on restaurants as well...unless I 'bank' calories throughout the week, I don't feel that it's 'safe' to eat at non-chains. Which sucks, when so much of my social life was previously food-related. I do feel that it's a delicate balance and MFP's bloated database can tip it to the side of frustration.
  • boomerising
    boomerising Posts: 43 Member
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    Thank you @mortuseon_ You understand my feelings quite exactly and the "taking the joy out of eating" hazard is a serious one. Wishing you good luck and plenty of joy.
  • wizzybeth
    wizzybeth Posts: 3,573 Member
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    Do not let it rob your joy. Even food labels can be inaccurate. Ya just do the very best you can with what you have. Some times you will eat a little more than you think, sometimes a little less - eventually in the grand scheme of things it will all even out - I just try to pick the very best entry I can find. I often rely on the USDA database to verify...eating out is a hazard to accuracy to be sure. Even chain food entries are not always accurate esp. if the chain restaurant changes their recipe / ingredients along the way and the info isn't updated right away.

    Just relax and do the best you can.
  • Kst76
    Kst76 Posts: 935 Member
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    I ate a vegetable omelette in a diner this morning. There were no cheese, and if it was it certainly wasn’t 2 oz. I dissected the omelet and all I saw was broccoli, peppers, onions and of course egg.
  • boomerising
    boomerising Posts: 43 Member
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    Sounds like a smart choice. Unfortunately when my brain says “omelette” it always says “cheese” no matter what other ingredients may be available. :D When I have an omelette anywhere other than this one neighborhood place where I am so stuck on the chili-cheese version, I normally do include veggies. Broccoli-and-cheddar and spinach-and-swiss are favorites.
  • boomerising
    boomerising Posts: 43 Member
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    BREAKING: For brunch at one of the great (and non-greasy) local joints, I just ordered an omelette WITH NO CHEESE. Thanks to everyone who took the time to reply here for kicking my butt. Difficult as this is for me, I’m impressed with the value of MFP and hopeful for success. Another new low on the scale this morning, to about 6 lb down since January 18 start. I do also have a perfect record of 3 workouts per week—after completely blowing off the gym for the entire last quarter of 2017. I know that has been crucial and will have to continue indefinitely. I have to regularly remind myself the gym is not primarily about weight loss or even maintenance, it is about fitness which at 65 means heart health, bone density, strength, flexibility, balance. Key things. But MFP helps with perspective on this too, because when I had a bad day earlier this week and went over by “only” 260 calories, it told me that if every day were like that day I would be half a pound HEAVIER in 5 weeks than now. That was sobering, because if correct it tells me just how tiny my margin for error will be in maintenance mode and that exercise will always be needed to prevent those errors from repopulating my fat cells :)
  • ckdprevent
    ckdprevent Posts: 105 Member
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    I'm 50 and just try not to eat out. My husband loves to eat out; so I allow myself sometimes and eat 1/2 serving. I have to watch my salt, sugar, protein; so whenever I eat out my salt is through the roof. If you travel a lot make pack food. That is what I do. Have fruit, veges, etc. If you can eat nuts, pack them for a great protein source.

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