Sugar is Evil

Your trying to justify that you NEED refined sugar????

That is wrong and eventually it will catch up with you. Just like most athletes, you are causing your body to become more and more desensitized to the insulin you are forcing it to make and eventually you will have hormone issues, blood sugar issues, etc.

I prefer to have my body make glucose through the conversion of protein. No added sugar needed here, no matter how hard or light I work out.

Once again, you have no idea what you're talking about. It will not eventually catch up with me because my diet will be determined by how much/when I exercise. It's not that hard to figure out. I workout less, I eat less. I workout more, I eat more, including more sugar.

I will not have hormone issues or blood sugar issues because the insulin spike is what allows me to shuttle nutrients to my muscles in order to use them again for my next session of exercise. Do you have ANY idea how insulin works? Any?

Good luck getting protein to turn into glucose fast enough when you're doing a triathlon.

Exercise has nothing to do with it. Look at these world class athletes that eat all these so called "healthy carbs" that end up gaining an absurd amount of weight even though they are still exercising.

It is because over time the body becomes resistant to the insulin you are causing your body to secrete everytime you put grains, sugar and other carbs in your mouth to begin the digestiion process.

I know exactly HOW the insulin process works. You have no clue.

Exercise has nothing to do with it. Look at these world class athletes that eat all these so called "healthy carbs" that end up gaining an absurd amount of weight even though they are still exercising.

It is because over time the body becomes resistant to the insulin you are causing your body to secrete everytime you put grains, sugar and other carbs in your mouth to begin the digestiion process.

I know exactly HOW the insulin process works. You have no clue.

I'm beginning to think you don't actually believe what you're typing here. But hey, if you want to go against decades of peer reviewed research into exercise physiology based on what your brother's second cousin's uncle said then more power to you.

I'm so blown away that you think carbs cause world class athletes to "absurd" amounts of weight that I don't even know how to respond. In fact, I won't respond. I'll just be done with responding to you.

Yes, I do. Need I post proof on the process of glycogenesis? I have doctors and scientists to back me up as well as my own experiences.

I know people that live on nothing more than Water, Tea, FAT and protein and are far healthier than the rest of us. We do not NEED carbs to live healthy or function.

It is a WANT, plain and simple.

GLUCOSE IS THE PRIMARY NUTRIENT USED IN GLYCOLYSIS.

If you want glucose to quickly hit the blood stream in order to fuel glycolysis, you eat foods that are glucose based. PLAIN SIMPLE SCIENTIFIC FACT. You cannot argue this because this is absolutely, positively BASIC physiology. Converting fat and protein into glucose is not ideal when you're engaging in any exercise that depletes glycogen quickly.

I run, lift heavy weights and I have no problem with recovering from any exercise or from exerting heavily during the way while I am at work.

I was a body builder and amateur boxer in the Army and I ate the same way you say you eat now...................My body became insulin resistant and I ended up gaining over 140 pounds in a few months time because I believed the same thing you belive now.

I am an avid reader and researcher now and I know the truth and I am no longer brain washed by this government. It will catch up to you, even if it takes until you are 50.

And my apologies - I used the wrong word................I was referring to gluconeogenesis. Which is preferred for proper brain function. This is why you hear so many people say when they dropped the carbs that they have no more brain fog. The sugar and grains affects brain function, but most people are brainwashed to believe the opposite to be true.

Exercise has nothing to do with it. Look at these world class athletes that eat all these so called "healthy carbs" that end up gaining an absurd amount of weight even though they are still exercising.

It is because over time the body becomes resistant to the insulin you are causing your body to secrete everytime you put grains, sugar and other carbs in your mouth to begin the digestiion process.

I know exactly HOW the insulin process works. You have no clue.

I'm beginning to think you don't actually believe what you're typing here. But hey, if you want to go against decades of peer reviewed research into exercise physiology based on what your brother's second cousin's uncle said then more power to you.

I'm so blown away that you think carbs cause world class athletes to "absurd" amounts of weight that I don't even know how to respond. In fact, I won't respond. I'll just be done with responding to you.

You know exactly what I am talking about. World class athletes from years past that still keep up the exercise, but as they get older are gaining absurd amounts of weight.

This is due to the insulin resistance from all those years of eating large amounts of sugar taking a toll on their bodies.

And I never said anything about anyone saying anything to me. This is my own reading and research, plus my own experience.

I never meant to cause a ruckus... I just thought I was sharing some really great/ interesting videos...
And I know sugar to be the #1 detriment to MY personal health.
MY ability and copacity and endurance to excercise has only increased since giving up the junk.

But you say potato...

Arguments on the forums here always remind me of a quote from my mother's favorite coffee mug:
"Never try to teach a pig to sing. It wastes your time and annoys the pig"


Once again, hugs all around

Don't take fault. This is usually what happens. It's actually makes my day a little more interesting. Love your hat. I want one. Reminds me a little bit of Kermit and I'm a big muppet fan.

too much fat can have an effect on your arteries and heart disease

Oh no you didn't! :huh:

Arguments on the forums here always remind me of a quote from my mother's favorite coffee mug:
"Never try to teach a pig to sing. It wastes your time and annoys the pig"

I need to tattoo the following across my hands so I can see it while I am typing:

Those convinced against their will are of the same opinion still.

But hey, I used to be on the other side of the debate. :laugh: I am rethinking things. It ain't about the calories folks, it is about the insulin. But don't take my word for it: Gary Taubes does a fantastic job explaining it here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M6vpFV6Wkl4 and Dr. Lustig here http://www.kqed.org/a/forum/R201104211000

(And hey, no one has explained to me why some baby formulas contain as much sucrose as Coke. I'm still curious what the nutritional benefit is.)

Yes, bread is a rarity and a recent thing. Never mind the fact that people have been eating "refined" carbs and baking bread for 15,000 years and milling and eating rice for 12,000 years, it's a totally new thing and it's the downfall of civilization. Too much of anything is bad for you. Too much protein can ruin your kidneys, too much fat can have an effect on your arteries and heart disease, too much sodium can cause high blood pressure, too much water can over hydrate and dilute the electrolytes in your blood and cause you to lose all motor function, etc. etc.

Nothing is particularly good or bad on it's own. Even most essential vitamins and minerals can be poisonous if you eat too much of them.

fat doesn't clog arteries: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/cholesterol-fighting-foods/

And in evolutionary time (i.e. millions of years) we have been eating refined carbs (and grains) since yesterday. And we have been 'de-volving' ever since.

I'll also let Mark explain rice: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/is-rice-unhealthy/

As far as protein and kidneys: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/protein-kidneys/

Some people would say that I get too much fat. Some people do. 70% of my daily calories - I think - it's the one thing I eat in unlimited amounts - I never worry about it - worry causes stress and stress is bad for the body. Most of that is saturated fat. Yet I am the healthiest I have been in my entire life - 40 years old. And yet I'm 111.4 pounds - the lowest I have been since before puberty. 18-19% body fat. I exercise very little - just enough to maintain the amazing definition that has popped up since going Primal. I don't have to bother watching sodium because if I get too much my body gets rid of it. Same thing with too much water. If I drink a lot my body get rids of it.

This is called homeostasis. Since going Primal my body is doing what it is supposed to be doing. N=1 (and if you go to marksdailyapple and read the success stories - he posts a new one every Friday: N=lots).

Ahh yes, the tin foil hat wearing conspiracy theory argument. ALL the world governments are conspiring to brainwash the human race into eating more sugar, so they can all become diabetic, get serious health problems, and die. That makes such perfect sense! :huh:

Honest question. Have you read "Good Calories, Bad Calories" or "Why We Get Fat and What To Do About It"? If yes, I'd like to know your thoughts on them. If not, I'm interested in knowing what you think of the lecture that I link to in my signature. I'm really not trying to be snarky or attack you. All of what I thought I knew about why I gain weight has been altered by what Taubes (and others) have said in these works but I am interested in educated criticisms.

I am an avid reader and researcher now and I know the truth and I am no longer brain washed by this government.

Ahh yes, the tin foil hat wearing conspiracy theory argument. ALL the world governments are conspiring to brainwash the human race into eating more sugar, so they can all become diabetic, get serious health problems, and die. That makes such perfect sense! :huh:

You do know a good chunk of those researchers that promote a very strict "never eat this, it's a conspiracy to make you unhealthy" kind of diet that flies in the face of the majority of the research are generally making large amounts of money on their "book of the week" or diet plan system, or whatever they happen to be shilling on their websites, right? Most of them are no different from the old timey snake oil salesmen.

Yes, bread is a rarity and a recent thing. Never mind the fact that people have been eating "refined" carbs and baking bread for 15,000 years and milling and eating rice for 12,000 years, it's a totally new thing and it's the downfall of civilization. Too much of anything is bad for you. Too much protein can ruin your kidneys, too much fat can have an effect on your arteries and heart disease, too much sodium can cause high blood pressure, too much water can over hydrate and dilute the electrolytes in your blood and cause you to lose all motor function, etc. etc.

Nothing is particularly good or bad on it's own. Even most essential vitamins and minerals can be poisonous if you eat too much of them.

Grain consumption is less than 10,000 years old.

And carbs is what affects your artieries and causes heart disease, not fats.

The point is sugar (in any form) be it from starch, fructose, sucrose, etc...............is a toxin, aka a poison.

I just rechecked my numbers, and people in the Yangtze Valley in China have been cultivating rice since 12,000BC, which would be 14,000 years ago. And archaeological evidence has found that people in Europe were baking primitive flat breads on flat rocks 30,000 years ago. Leavened bread has been around since about 10,000BC, so for 12,000 years.

Also, carbs don't turn into cholesterol. Atherosclerosis is caused by LDL's oxidizing. Carbs and grains don't have LDL's, in fact, many whole grains contain fiber, which actually have been show to reduce LDL's in the bloodstream, while increasing the HDL's.

Also, glucose is sugar, so glucose is a toxin?

Reading material

http://www.ucsf.edu/news/2009/06/8187/obesity-and-metabolic-syndrome-driven-fructose-sugar-diet

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBnniua6-oM

I don't know, 10,000 years is still a really long time. Regardless, what is the point? I don't see a lot of fat Asians (unless they're Americans, that is). Most of the world is still consuming breads and rice, pastas and carbs every day without becoming fat. You'd be hard-pressed to find a large number of corpulent people in Europe. Americans are ridiculously huge. Is it because we eat carbs? hmm.

Anecdotally, I spent a lot of time in Yerevan, Armenia (Far Eastern Europe) during 2008 and 2009. During that period of time I weighed just what I do now; about 129 lbs., US size 4. It was interesting to note that i was regarded as a "fat American" there. On one occasion when my lost luggage had still not been delivered after 9 days, I went shopping for a skirt and couldn't fit in a size Large.

I found while living in Yerevan (large, busy, capital city like a mini-version of NYC in terms of commerce) that there were absolutely no processed foods readily available. No McDonald's, no Starbucks, no fast food. Restaurants and people cooking at home made everything from scratch. There was only one large supermarket that had a small section devoted to American food - the processed stuff. However, what was readily available and copiously consumed by all those very slim Armenians? Lavash: BREAD. Bread for breakfast, bread for lunch, bread for dinner. All manner of pastries and baked goods everywhere.

Just interesting to note.

I don't know, 10,000 years is still a really long time. Regardless, what is the point? I don't see a lot of fat Asians (unless they're Americans, that is). Most of the world is still consuming breads and rice, pastas and carbs every day without becoming fat. You'd be hard-pressed to find a large number of corpulent people in Europe. Americans are ridiculously huge. Is it because we eat carbs? hmm.

Anecdotally, I spent a lot of time in Yerevan, Armenia (Far Eastern Europe) during 2008 and 2009. During that period of time I weighed just what I do now; about 129 lbs., US size 4. It was interesting to note that i was regarded as a "fat American" there. On one occasion when my lost luggage had still not been delivered after 9 days, I went shopping for a skirt and couldn't fit in a size Large.

I found while living in Yerevan (large, busy, capital city like a mini-version of NYC in terms of commerce) that there were absolutely no processed foods readily available. No McDonald's, no Starbucks, no fast food. Restaurants and people cooking at home made everything from scratch. There was only one large supermarket that had a small section devoted to American food - the processed stuff. However, what was readily available and copiously consumed by all those very slim Armenians? Lavash: BREAD. Bread for breakfast, bread for lunch, bread for dinner. All manner of pastries and baked goods everywhere.

Just interesting to note.

Most Europeans don't eat 3 carbs and a starch for one meal like most Americans do either. In fact, I know in a lot of European countries that they don't eat as many starches and carbs as Americans do.

so many times I see when I go out to eat that someone ordered a pasta dish, with breadsticks or garlic bread.................or another one I see a lot is small portion of meat, macaroni and cheese, mashed potatoes and dressing and dinner rolls.

That is disgusting. Where are the veggies to go along with the meat???

And 10,000 years is a long time, but not long as all when speaking of evolution, especially for the body to have had adapted to being capable of handling grains and such.

I didn't make my point correctly, I guess. There was plenty of sugar -- I did mention pastries and bread, right? Oh, and full-sugar coke; they do like that. But why are they still so slim? They are slim despite consuming sugar and carbs.

I can guarantee that the amount of sugar they consume is significantly less than what the typical American consumes -- pastries and soft drinks and all. You said it yourself when noting that people cook at home and usually cook from scratch. I cook from home most of the time too and I have a bag of sugar that has been with me for years and yet, if I were to start eating at restaurants more and eating a lot more boxed and processed foods, I am sure that I would consume the equivalent of that bag (and more) in a couple months (or even sooner).

Unless you are eating a calorie surplus, no carbs ingested head straight to fat cells and make you gain weight, and that's actually kind of silly to suggest otherwise.

If I remember, I think that is pretty much exactly what Dr. Robert Lustig does claim about fructose in the absence of fiber, but it has been a bit since I listened to his lecture.

Yes, bread is a rarity and a recent thing. Never mind the fact that people have been eating "refined" carbs and baking bread for 15,000 years and milling and eating rice for 12,000 years, it's a totally new thing and it's the downfall of civilization. Too much of anything is bad for you. Too much protein can ruin your kidneys, too much fat can have an effect on your arteries and heart disease, too much sodium can cause high blood pressure, too much water can over hydrate and dilute the electrolytes in your blood and cause you to lose all motor function, etc. etc.

Nothing is particularly good or bad on it's own. Even most essential vitamins and minerals can be poisonous if you eat too much of them.

Grain consumption is less than 10,000 years old.

And carbs is what affects your artieries and causes heart disease, not fats.

The point is sugar (in any form) be it from starch, fructose, sucrose, etc...............is a toxin, aka a poison.

You REALLY need to read this article:
http://www.fi.edu/learn/brain/carbs.html This is from the Franklin Institue
Here is an excerpt:
"Glucose is the form of sugar that travels in your bloodstream to fuel the mitochondrial furnaces responsible for your brain power. Glucose is the only fuel normally used by brain cells. Because neurons cannot store glucose, they depend on the bloodstream to deliver a constant supply of this precious fuel."

Another article for you to research: Cambridge-
http://journals.cambridge.org/download.php?file=/PNS/PNS53_02/S0029665194000492a.pdf&code=b7464efc7c96906ead870197ef071dd8
"It has long been accepted that the human brain uses glucose as its only metabolic fuel
and, thus, is entirely dependent on glucose for its function. This is in spite of the fact that
the brain contains many enzyme systems theoretically capable of metabolizing non-
glucose substrates such as glycerol, fatty acids, lactate, ketones and amino acids.
Nevertheless, it is true that the brain is the major consumer of glucose in the resting state
and about 10% of the blood glucose is extracted by the brain. Of that glucose, over 90%
is fully oxidized to C02 and water with the generation of high-energy phosphates.
Perhaps about 5 % of brain glucose is metabolized through the hexose monophosphate
shunt and the remainder through glycolysis to lactate and pyruvate, and only a very small
quantity is synthesized into glycogen. The glycogen stores of the brain are very small and
do not provide a useful reservoir of glucose in times of glucose lack."

Another: National Center for Biotechnology Information
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK22436/
"Brain. Glucose is virtually the sole fuel for the human brain, except during prolonged starvation. The brain lacks fuel stores and hence requires a continuous supply of glucose. It consumes about 120 g daily, which corresponds to an energy input of about 420 kcal (1760 kJ), accounting for some 60% of the utilization of glucose by the whole body in the resting state. Much of the energy, estimates suggest from 60% to 70%, is used to power transport mechanisms that maintain the Na+-K+ membrane potential required for the transmission of the nerve impulses. The brain must also synthesize neurotransmitters and their receptors to propagate nerve impulses. Overall, glucose metabolism remains unchanged during mental activity, although local increases are detected when a subject performs certain tasks."

For you to claim that any level or form of glucose is "poison" is misleading and wrong. Your brain REQUIRES glucose. You muscles run on it. Your liver breaks it down, stores it, creates it again then ships it out to the tissue that needs it. Glucose is not a poison, it is a necessary nutrient for our body's function.

As always, moderation in everything. Be smart people.