Body Fat Scales

Hi all,

I am a newbie here and this is my first post.

I have been going to the gym and using MFP since 1/2/19 and have lost 52 pounds. This actually happened on March 28. Since then I have upped my calorie intake some and my protein intake a LOT in an effort to become more fit by adding muscle. My weight has stayed the same as I have added weight training and obvious muscle back on my frame.

My issue is that my "digital BMI scale" shows little improvement in BMI since I stopped losing weight and started moving it around. This makes it clear that it is using my weight and other info I input ( such as age, height etc) to calculate BMI and body fat % rather than actually determining it through electrical means. Bummer. Wasted money.

I need someone here to point me at a better scale that actually does the work of measuring body fat %, muscle mass, etc.

What is a good model? Where can I get one?

TIA,

Jim

Replies

  • aloyouis
    aloyouis Posts: 6 Member
    OK, will do.
  • caleb_93
    caleb_93 Posts: 17 Member
    The best way to do it is with a skinfold caliper test. You can buy a skinfold caliper on amazon and then use the “Jackson pollock 7 site calculator” online. Just google it and you’ll find one. You’ll need a friend to help you measure your skinfolds. If none of this makes sense just YouTube it..
  • cwolfman13
    cwolfman13 Posts: 41,879 Member
    aloyouis wrote: »
    Hi all,

    I am a newbie here and this is my first post.

    I have been going to the gym and using MFP since 1/2/19 and have lost 52 pounds. This actually happened on March 28. Since then I have upped my calorie intake some and my protein intake a LOT in an effort to become more fit by adding muscle. My weight has stayed the same as I have added weight training and obvious muscle back on my frame.

    My issue is that my "digital BMI scale" shows little improvement in BMI since I stopped losing weight and started moving it around. This makes it clear that it is using my weight and other info I input ( such as age, height etc) to calculate BMI and body fat % rather than actually determining it through electrical means. Bummer. Wasted money.

    I need someone here to point me at a better scale that actually does the work of measuring body fat %, muscle mass, etc.

    What is a good model? Where can I get one?

    TIA,

    Jim

    BMI is based on your weight, so it wouldn't change if your weight isn't changing...BMI has nothing to do with your BF% or a measure of BF% or muscle mass. It is just a height to weight calculation.

    No scale is going to give you an accurate measure of BF% either. At best they can give you some kind of observable long term trend. They're so bad that Consumer Reports won't even review them anymore.
  • AnnPT77
    AnnPT77 Posts: 31,717 Member
    And do you really mean BMI? (Body mass index: It's a formula that just uses your height and weight, and it is intended to give a not-very-precise, not-very-individualized statistical guess about whether people are underweight, normal, or some category of obesity). BMI inherently is the same for the same height and weight, irrespective of body composition.

    Do you mean BMR? (Basal metabolic rate, the number of calories we burn pretty much in a coma, just by being alive.) Even that is more interesting than useful, since what we really need to know to guide eating is our TDEE (Total Daily Energy Expenditure), which depends on BMR/RMR (resting metabolic rate, similar but not identical), NEAT (non-exercise activity thermogenesis, a fancy way of saying calories burned doing our regular everyday life stuff other than exercise), EAT (exercise activity thermogenesis, calories burned through intentional exercise), and maybe a few minor factors not worth talking about.

    In terms of what you can expect from home or gym scales, or even more complicated gym-based BIA devices, for body composition: NovusDies gave you a perfect link.

    The good news is that knowing the exact answers is more interesting than essential, whether to guide either eating or exercise. There are (kind of expensive) lab-based tests you can do periodically to get better answers, like DEXA. Even those aren't exact.
  • aloyouis
    aloyouis Posts: 6 Member
    NovusDies wrote: »

    OK. I read his post and quite a bit of the thread itself. Thank you.

    I understand that the scales in question are not that reliable. That said, I don't really need them to be accurate as to the exact measurements. I need one to be consistent as to measurement even if inaccurate. I hope that makes sense. I can help in this regard:

    I get up at the same time every day.
    I eat about the same amount and at the same time every night.
    LOL, I have a "movement" every morning before I step on the scale.
    I know the weekends will be different and I will mostly ignore the data. Again, LOL.

    So with all of that said, I am trying to find a scale that actually DOES the electrical measurements most IMPLY they do. What I am finding is what I said in the OP: They use weight and data we enter only. I know this because as I was losing weight it showed progress in fat % and BMI. Since I have maintained a consistent weight but continued to work out I have significantly added muscle (both by the eye test and the amount weight I am able to lift) the body fat % and BMI have stayed the same. Clearly, the scale is not actually measuring those data points.

    So I need a scale that DOES measure them consistently. I really don't care if they are off as long as they are consistent and I can see record the results of my WORK. As you can image, losing 50+lbs makes using the calipers point right now as the skin is tightening up. It is, fortunately.

    So, scales that actually do measure?

    Thanks again.

    JIM
  • cwolfman13
    cwolfman13 Posts: 41,879 Member
    aloyouis wrote: »
    NovusDies wrote: »

    OK. I read his post and quite a bit of the thread itself. Thank you.

    I understand that the scales in question are not that reliable. That said, I don't really need them to be accurate as to the exact measurements. I need one to be consistent as to measurement even if inaccurate. I hope that makes sense. I can help in this regard:

    I get up at the same time every day.
    I eat about the same amount and at the same time every night.
    LOL, I have a "movement" every morning before I step on the scale.
    I know the weekends will be different and I will mostly ignore the data. Again, LOL.

    So with all of that said, I am trying to find a scale that actually DOES the electrical measurements most IMPLY they do. What I am finding is what I said in the OP: They use weight and data we enter only. I know this because as I was losing weight it showed progress in fat % and BMI. Since I have maintained a consistent weight but continued to work out I have significantly added muscle (both by the eye test and the amount weight I am able to lift) the body fat % and BMI have stayed the same. Clearly, the scale is not actually measuring those data points.

    So I need a scale that DOES measure them consistently. I really don't care if they are off as long as they are consistent and I can see record the results of my WORK. As you can image, losing 50+lbs makes using the calipers point right now as the skin is tightening up. It is, fortunately.

    So, scales that actually do measure?

    Thanks again.

    JIM

    As I stated above, BMI is a calculation based on height and weight...BMI won't change if your weight doesn't change. BMI isn't a measure of BF%. A body builder with 8% BF can be obese as per BMI...because BMI has nothing to do with fat or BF%

    I'm sure the scale you are using is using bioimpedence...it's just that bioimpedence is crap.
  • pierinifitness
    pierinifitness Posts: 2,231 Member
    @aloyouis - I purchased a Withings / Nokia | Body+ - Smart Body Composition Wi-Fi Digital Scale with smartphone app and it's a good tool in my fitness, health and wellness toolbox. It will wildly fluctuate despite me keeping constant several of the variables you mentioned. Nonetheless, I jump on it faithfully and regularly because I'm a data-driven fitness guy and like the stats despite their imperfection. Had the same experience years ago when I owned a different brand.

    Hydration level will have a big impact on your readings as will whether you have it set on athlete mode. Nonetheless, as time goes on and with your diligent efforts working both the nutrition and exercise components, your readings will move in the direction you want. Mine have.

    I now get DEXA-SCAN readings about every 3 months to get another report card of my efforts.

    I would recommend what I purchased given your desire. I think you'll be satisfied enough. Consider it like a Zillow report of your home value - entertainment. You like it when it tells you what you want to want to be told and dislike it when it gives you an outlier stat in the wrong direction.

    The proof-is-in-the-pudding measures will be when you have to go out and buy a bunch of new clothes and are constantly pulling up your pants.

    Keep marching forward.
  • kimny72
    kimny72 Posts: 16,023 Member
    aloyouis wrote: »
    NovusDies wrote: »

    OK. I read his post and quite a bit of the thread itself. Thank you.

    I understand that the scales in question are not that reliable. That said, I don't really need them to be accurate as to the exact measurements. I need one to be consistent as to measurement even if inaccurate. I hope that makes sense. I can help in this regard:

    I get up at the same time every day.
    I eat about the same amount and at the same time every night.
    LOL, I have a "movement" every morning before I step on the scale.
    I know the weekends will be different and I will mostly ignore the data. Again, LOL.

    So with all of that said, I am trying to find a scale that actually DOES the electrical measurements most IMPLY they do. What I am finding is what I said in the OP: They use weight and data we enter only. I know this because as I was losing weight it showed progress in fat % and BMI. Since I have maintained a consistent weight but continued to work out I have significantly added muscle (both by the eye test and the amount weight I am able to lift) the body fat % and BMI have stayed the same. Clearly, the scale is not actually measuring those data points.

    So I need a scale that DOES measure them consistently. I really don't care if they are off as long as they are consistent and I can see record the results of my WORK. As you can image, losing 50+lbs makes using the calipers point right now as the skin is tightening up. It is, fortunately.

    So, scales that actually do measure?

    Thanks again.

    JIM

    Scales you just stand on are sending an electric pulse up through your feet. My understanding is it usually ends up going up one leg and down the other, not actually measuring your top half. So if you are lean up top but carry your excess weight on your bottom half, the scale will give you a higher than accurate BF%, and vice versa. They also can be greatly affected by water weight fluctuations. So your BF% will most likely look very different on days you are carrying extra water weight (like the day after a hard workout or a salty meal) than on days you are perhaps a bit dehydrated when you wake up.

    In all honesty, bioimpedence scales are simply not reliable. For some people whose water weight fluctuations are naturally minor, and whose body fat distribution is generally even, they might be able to at least see a good trend over the long term. That has more to do with your body than with the brand of the scale though.

    Even fancy-pants ways of measuring BF like a DEXA scans have a hit-or-miss component. I believe water displacement is about as accurate as it gets. This is why using BF% as a general health metric hasn't caught on (even though it certainly has health implications) - there is no reliable and accessible way to test it. Most people here that I've read judge their results in reducing body fat and increasing muscle mass by eye and performance, and perhaps getting a DEXA or dunk tank when they can afford it.

    Sorry! Maybe someone else will have better info than this.
  • aloyouis
    aloyouis Posts: 6 Member
    cwolfman13 wrote: »
    aloyouis wrote: »
    NovusDies wrote: »

    OK. I read his post and quite a bit of the thread itself. Thank you.

    I understand that the scales in question are not that reliable. That said, I don't really need them to be accurate as to the exact measurements. I need one to be consistent as to measurement even if inaccurate. I hope that makes sense. I can help in this regard:

    I get up at the same time every day.
    I eat about the same amount and at the same time every night.
    LOL, I have a "movement" every morning before I step on the scale.
    I know the weekends will be different and I will mostly ignore the data. Again, LOL.

    So with all of that said, I am trying to find a scale that actually DOES the electrical measurements most IMPLY they do. What I am finding is what I said in the OP: They use weight and data we enter only. I know this because as I was losing weight it showed progress in fat % and BMI. Since I have maintained a consistent weight but continued to work out I have significantly added muscle (both by the eye test and the amount weight I am able to lift) the body fat % and BMI have stayed the same. Clearly, the scale is not actually measuring those data points.

    So I need a scale that DOES measure them consistently. I really don't care if they are off as long as they are consistent and I can see record the results of my WORK. As you can image, losing 50+lbs makes using the calipers point right now as the skin is tightening up. It is, fortunately.

    So, scales that actually do measure?

    Thanks again.

    JIM

    As I stated above, BMI is a calculation based on height and weight...BMI won't change if your weight doesn't change. BMI isn't a measure of BF%. A body builder with 8% BF can be obese as per BMI...because BMI has nothing to do with fat or BF%

    I'm sure the scale you are using is using bioimpedence...it's just that bioimpedence is crap.

    Ok. Shouldn't body fat % change?
  • aloyouis
    aloyouis Posts: 6 Member
    @aloyouis - I purchased a Withings / Nokia | Body+ - Smart Body Composition Wi-Fi Digital Scale with smartphone app and it's a good tool in my fitness, health and wellness toolbox. It will wildly fluctuate despite me keeping constant several of the variables you mentioned. Nonetheless, I jump on it faithfully and regularly because I'm a data-driven fitness guy and like the stats despite their imperfection. Had the same experience years ago when I owned a different brand.

    Hydration level will have a big impact on your readings as will whether you have it set on athlete mode. Nonetheless, as time goes on and with your diligent efforts working both the nutrition and exercise components, your readings will move in the direction you want. Mine have.

    I now get DEXA-SCAN readings about every 3 months to get another report card of my efforts.

    I would recommend what I purchased given your desire. I think you'll be satisfied enough. Consider it like a Zillow report of your home value - entertainment. You like it when it tells you what you want to want to be told and dislike it when it gives you an outlier stat in the wrong direction.

    The proof-is-in-the-pudding measures will be when you have to go out and buy a bunch of new clothes and are constantly pulling up your pants.

    Keep marching forward.

    You KNOW IT! The only things that still fit me are my socks and shoes. My wedding ring doesn't. I have been through a couple of plateaus where I bought clothes and now they seem like a ridiculous purchase. May have only worn them once or twice. My waist has gone from 42 to 34. It is a great feeling, but a little expensive. :-)

    I will research your device above, thank you.
  • cwolfman13
    cwolfman13 Posts: 41,879 Member
    aloyouis wrote: »
    cwolfman13 wrote: »
    aloyouis wrote: »
    NovusDies wrote: »

    OK. I read his post and quite a bit of the thread itself. Thank you.

    I understand that the scales in question are not that reliable. That said, I don't really need them to be accurate as to the exact measurements. I need one to be consistent as to measurement even if inaccurate. I hope that makes sense. I can help in this regard:

    I get up at the same time every day.
    I eat about the same amount and at the same time every night.
    LOL, I have a "movement" every morning before I step on the scale.
    I know the weekends will be different and I will mostly ignore the data. Again, LOL.

    So with all of that said, I am trying to find a scale that actually DOES the electrical measurements most IMPLY they do. What I am finding is what I said in the OP: They use weight and data we enter only. I know this because as I was losing weight it showed progress in fat % and BMI. Since I have maintained a consistent weight but continued to work out I have significantly added muscle (both by the eye test and the amount weight I am able to lift) the body fat % and BMI have stayed the same. Clearly, the scale is not actually measuring those data points.

    So I need a scale that DOES measure them consistently. I really don't care if they are off as long as they are consistent and I can see record the results of my WORK. As you can image, losing 50+lbs makes using the calipers point right now as the skin is tightening up. It is, fortunately.

    So, scales that actually do measure?

    Thanks again.

    JIM

    As I stated above, BMI is a calculation based on height and weight...BMI won't change if your weight doesn't change. BMI isn't a measure of BF%. A body builder with 8% BF can be obese as per BMI...because BMI has nothing to do with fat or BF%

    I'm sure the scale you are using is using bioimpedence...it's just that bioimpedence is crap.

    Ok. Shouldn't body fat % change?

    Maybe, maybe not...bioimpedence is crap. I pretty much look at it as a gimmick. Like I said before, those scales are so worthless that Consumer Reports won't even review them anymore.
  • aloyouis
    aloyouis Posts: 6 Member
    kimny72 wrote: »
    aloyouis wrote: »
    NovusDies wrote: »

    OK. I read his post and quite a bit of the thread itself. Thank you.

    I understand that the scales in question are not that reliable. That said, I don't really need them to be accurate as to the exact measurements. I need one to be consistent as to measurement even if inaccurate. I hope that makes sense. I can help in this regard:

    I get up at the same time every day.
    I eat about the same amount and at the same time every night.
    LOL, I have a "movement" every morning before I step on the scale.
    I know the weekends will be different and I will mostly ignore the data. Again, LOL.

    So with all of that said, I am trying to find a scale that actually DOES the electrical measurements most IMPLY they do. What I am finding is what I said in the OP: They use weight and data we enter only. I know this because as I was losing weight it showed progress in fat % and BMI. Since I have maintained a consistent weight but continued to work out I have significantly added muscle (both by the eye test and the amount weight I am able to lift) the body fat % and BMI have stayed the same. Clearly, the scale is not actually measuring those data points.

    So I need a scale that DOES measure them consistently. I really don't care if they are off as long as they are consistent and I can see record the results of my WORK. As you can image, losing 50+lbs makes using the calipers point right now as the skin is tightening up. It is, fortunately.

    So, scales that actually do measure?

    Thanks again.

    JIM

    Scales you just stand on are sending an electric pulse up through your feet. My understanding is it usually ends up going up one leg and down the other, not actually measuring your top half. So if you are lean up top but carry your excess weight on your bottom half, the scale will give you a higher than accurate BF%, and vice versa. They also can be greatly affected by water weight fluctuations. So your BF% will most likely look very different on days you are carrying extra water weight (like the day after a hard workout or a salty meal) than on days you are perhaps a bit dehydrated when you wake up.

    In all honesty, bioimpedence scales are simply not reliable. For some people whose water weight fluctuations are naturally minor, and whose body fat distribution is generally even, they might be able to at least see a good trend over the long term. That has more to do with your body than with the brand of the scale though.

    Even fancy-pants ways of measuring BF like a DEXA scans have a hit-or-miss component. I believe water displacement is about as accurate as it gets. This is why using BF% as a general health metric hasn't caught on (even though it certainly has health implications) - there is no reliable and accessible way to test it. Most people here that I've read judge their results in reducing body fat and increasing muscle mass by eye and performance, and perhaps getting a DEXA or dunk tank when they can afford it.

    Sorry! Maybe someone else will have better info than this.

    Good info and thank you.

    I am looking for a way to track a trend, that is all. When weight loss is done and your waist size is where you want it then there needs to be another way of showing results. Like was said above: I am a data driven person and if I can graph it, I will. Even if the graph has only the trend line and no actual numbers.

    This is what I need.
  • tcunbeliever
    tcunbeliever Posts: 8,219 Member
    I have this scale (currently it's $13) and it's pretty consistent first thing in the morning, naked, no food/drink, I've had it for 2 years, so far so good:

    https://amazon.com/gp/product/B01LBM3AVG/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

    I used to have an Omron handheld and it was also consistent but totally quit working after about 6 years...it was $20, I figured it lasted long enough to be worth it.

    I have noticed that any kind of alcohol consumption throws it off for a few days, probably because of shifts in water retention.

    There are scale/handheld combo units now, but I haven't tried any of those...whenever the scale quits working then I'll try one of those next most likely.

    I also do measurements, so if the number on the scale shifts dramatically then I can use measurements to see if that shift really makes sense (are my fat storage areas actually smaller) or if it's likely to be just a junk measurement. It's just one more metric I like to keep an eye on, but it's not 100% accurate, that's for sure.
  • tcunbeliever
    tcunbeliever Posts: 8,219 Member