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Kettle bells
Scarlettriestorun
Posts: 40 Member
Hi just a question regarding kettle bells. I'm a 52 year old female very active, do a lot of running. I'm now using my kettle bells to add a bit of strength to my body. How many reps do I need to do and how often before I start to notice any difference. Also, do the reps need doing at the same time, can I do them say three different times during the day? I can feel in my muscles it aches after using them so think I must be doing some good. Thanks for any advice
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Replies
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There's no set number. I'd rest between days of doing them. Also, please make sure that you're doing swings correctly. I've seen some horrid form on the internet. Even alledged online authorities doing them horribly wrong.
It's a hip hinge movement where you're pushing the KB up with hip/glute thrust, rapidly, then letting the weight fall down and, as soon as it hits bottom (between your legs) thrusting the hips and glutes again, all while keeping the back straight, not rounded.
This is a decent video on it. Many aren't. I've even seen Fitness Blender videos (and I like them) with horrific form on KB swings.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPrU323pamQ 3 -
Are you doing swings only?1
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Scarlettriestorun wrote: »Hi just a question regarding kettle bells. I'm a 52 year old female very active, do a lot of running. I'm now using my kettle bells to add a bit of strength to my body. How many reps do I need to do and how often before I start to notice any difference. Also, do the reps need doing at the same time, can I do them say three different times during the day? I can feel in my muscles it aches after using them so think I must be doing some good. Thanks for any advice
What made you decide on kettlebells? If you want to “add strength” they are likely not the best thing to do.0 -
I like to do kettlebell now and again. I was doing every morning in the summer. I should start back again!
https://greatist.com/fitness/22-kick-*kitten*-kettlebell-exercises
I don't do all of them, but pick ones I like and can stick to. Check it out!0 -
Reps of what particular exercise? What weight of bell? What difference are you hoping to notice?
There's a huge variety of stuff you can do with kettlebells. There's good advice here:
https://kettlebellsworkouts.com5 -
SnifterPug wrote: »Reps of what particular exercise? What weight of bell? What difference are you hoping to notice?
There's a huge variety of stuff you can do with kettlebells. There's good advice here:
https://kettlebellsworkouts.com
There are two "authorities" on KBs I'd trust on YouTube. RKC or Pavel Tsatsouline, the guy who introduced the KB to the US years ago. Bret Contrares (the guy who wrote Strong Curves) has some good stuff too. The concern I have (as someone who's trained with heavy KBs for years) is that some of these exercises are downright dangerous unless you have a very solid background in basics. For instance, a Get Up is very complex. You can dislocate your shoulder very easily not knowing what you're doing. You can throw out your back easily doing a swing the wrong way (I've done it!). It took me two years to understand the swing!
Just based off the three disagrees on the video I posted, it's clear that some of you don't have any idea either how to do the proper swing, because that video is very clear and accurate. Not to be snide, but there's a right and wrong way to do KBs and if you're not doing them right, don't use them, because that low of a weight of KB won't do much for you. Just do a squat and forget about KBs. Or use Dumbbells.
Just be cautious.5 -
MikePfirrman wrote: »SnifterPug wrote: »Reps of what particular exercise? What weight of bell? What difference are you hoping to notice?
There's a huge variety of stuff you can do with kettlebells. There's good advice here:
https://kettlebellsworkouts.com
There are two "authorities" on KBs I'd trust on YouTube. RKC or Pavel Tsatsouline, the guy who introduced the KB to the US years ago. Bret Contrares (the guy who wrote Strong Curves) has some good stuff too. The concern I have (as someone who's trained with heavy KBs for years) is that some of these exercises are downright dangerous unless you have a very solid background in basics. For instance, a Get Up is very complex. You can dislocate your shoulder very easily not knowing what you're doing. You can throw out your back easily doing a swing the wrong way (I've done it!). It took me two years to understand the swing!
Just based off the three disagrees on the video I posted, it's clear that some of you don't have any idea either how to do the proper swing, because that video is very clear and accurate. Not to be snide, but there's a right and wrong way to do KBs and if you're not doing them right, don't use them, because that low of a weight of KB won't do much for you. Just do a squat and forget about KBs. Or use Dumbbells.
Just be cautious.
I looked at that and thought "OK, there are at least 3 people who don't understand kettlebell swings". Even that video I thought had them raising the arms a little high, but at least it was being generated by the swing and not a separate "lift" at the end--maybe it was just a lighter weight for the demonstration.
KB swings are on my top 10 list of exercises consistently done incorrectly. To make matters worse, there is something called an American KB Swing that does include a full overhead lift at the top of the swing. At my last job, the trainers for the most part were excellent, but a couple taught the AKB swing style. I was always wary of correcting someone's swing, because I was afraid they were going to tell me they had learned it from another of our trainers.
But too many people do a "KB squat and lift" instead of a KB swing. As one trainer said (for guys): if you aren't attacking your balls, you aren't doing it correctly.
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MikePfirrman wrote: »There's no set number. I'd rest between days of doing them. Also, please make sure that you're doing swings correctly. I've seen some horrid form on the internet. Even alledged online authorities doing them horribly wrong.
It's a hip hinge movement where you're pushing the KB up with hip/glute thrust, rapidly, then letting the weight fall down and, as soon as it hits bottom (between your legs) thrusting the hips and glutes again, all while keeping the back straight, not rounded.
This is a decent video on it. Many aren't. I've even seen Fitness Blender videos (and I like them) with horrific form on KB swings.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPrU323pamQ
The video explains things fairly well from a theoretical level but I wouldn't say the video is great for learning the swing by any means.
The swing starts from the ground not from a standing position for one and it also ends back at the ground so it begins parked and ends part and that was not shown.
That alone is a big contributor to people messing up their backs. They are not loading and unloading from the right positions. I don't disagree with the information provided in the video but the swing itself could still use some improvement.
However my disagreement isn't with the video so much as it is with what you said about kettlebells.
"There's no set numbers." That's just not true. There are sets, reps, rest times, weight used or percentages, and so on to match your goals that have been written about extensively since forever...
Regardless of the tool being used you still have to respect the actual physiological response from the body and that it responds very similar from one tool to the next with respect to its given differences when it comes to reps and sets and so on.
Doing 100 reps with a kettlebell on the swing world produce 99% of the same result using a dumbbell at the same weight.
There definitely wasn't enough information given to prescribe the proper load management and tools to be used but you can definitely gain muscle and strength and endurance and so on with a kettlebell as long as you have the right weight and proper program.
Kettlebells are no more dangerous than any other tool out there. It all comes down to using it properly.2 -
@ MT1134 - thanks for clarifying. All valid points!
@ Asdak - had to laugh at the "attacking your balls", that's fantastic.0 -
MikePfirrman wrote: »@ MT1134 - thanks for clarifying. All valid points!
@ Asdak - had to laugh at the "attacking your balls", that's fantastic.
@MikePfirrman I think this is the most productive conversation I have ever had on MyFitnessPal. Quite possibly ever... When I say productive I guess I mean egoless. I'm guessing that's your wife in your profile picture they are with you but should things not work out... Haha.1 -
[quote="MikePfirrman;c-44523298"
I looked at that and thought "OK, there are at least 3 people who don't understand kettlebell swings". Even that video I thought had them raising the arms a little high, but at least it was being generated by the swing and not a separate "lift" at the end--maybe it was just a lighter weight for the demonstration.
KB swings are on my top 10 list of exercises consistently done incorrectly. To make matters worse, there is something called an American KB Swing that does include a full overhead lift at the top of the swing. At my last job, the trainers for the most part were excellent, but a couple taught the AKB swing style. I was always wary of correcting someone's swing, because I was afraid they were going to tell me they had learned it from another of our trainers.
But too many people do a "KB squat and lift" instead of a KB swing. As one trainer said (for guys): if you aren't attacking your balls, you aren't doing it correctly.
I like the final paragraph!
What annoys me most is that no trainer ever seems to point out the importance of planting one's feet properly.
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MikePfirrman wrote: »@ MT1134 - thanks for clarifying. All valid points!
@ Asdak - had to laugh at the "attacking your balls", that's fantastic.
@MikePfirrman I think this is the most productive conversation I have ever had on MyFitnessPal. Quite possibly ever... When I say productive I guess I mean egoless. I'm guessing that's your wife in your profile picture they are with you but should things not work out... Haha.
Thanks, but that wife (29 years this January) makes sure I have no ego. She's quick witted and keeps me grounded! And she's a gorgeous today as the day I met her. She's 59 this year and is 58 in that pic, so she'd appreciate the compliment.1 -
MikePfirrman wrote: »@ MT1134 - thanks for clarifying. All valid points!
@ Asdak - had to laugh at the "attacking your balls", that's fantastic.
I was going to quote Dan John who coaches to "attack the zipper." Maybe it was the angle but i thought it looked like the ball was going too low on the good example.
Dan John had a real good tip for learning the get up. Put the kettlebell away and do the movement with a paper cub about 2/3 full of water. When you can reps of the movement without spilling the water get a light kettlebell.1 -
Theoldguy1 wrote: »MikePfirrman wrote: »@ MT1134 - thanks for clarifying. All valid points!
@ Asdak - had to laugh at the "attacking your balls", that's fantastic.
I was going to quote Dan John who coaches to "attack the zipper." Maybe it was the angle but i thought it looked like the ball was going too low on the good example.
Dan John had a real good tip for learning the get up. Put the kettlebell away and do the movement with a paper cub about 2/3 full of water. When you can reps of the movement without spilling the water get a light kettlebell.
Funny you mentioned that, I learned to do the get up in exactly that fashion.
The caveat is that the water bottle is placed on your knuckles as you make a closed fist, simulating you're holding onto something while being forced to do the exercise with laser like precision.
My progression is that an athlete must be able to do 5 reps on each side back to back, all the way up and all the way down without dropping the bottle before being allowed to progress to an actual bell. It keeps you humble for sure.
Athletes like to muscle their way through it and the bottle will fall every time. This method builds stability and strength and teaches you to use the proper alignment.
Then as for the shoulders, an athlete is not allowed to press anything overhead that's heavier than the bell they do the get up with.3 -
MikePfirrman wrote: »There's no set number. I'd rest between days of doing them. Also, please make sure that you're doing swings correctly. I've seen some horrid form on the internet. Even alledged online authorities doing them horribly wrong.
It's a hip hinge movement where you're pushing the KB up with hip/glute thrust, rapidly, then letting the weight fall down and, as soon as it hits bottom (between your legs) thrusting the hips and glutes again, all while keeping the back straight, not rounded.
This is a decent video on it. Many aren't. I've even seen Fitness Blender videos (and I like them) with horrific form on KB swings.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPrU323pamQ
The video explains things fairly well from a theoretical level but I wouldn't say the video is great for learning the swing by any means.
The swing starts from the ground not from a standing position for one and it also ends back at the ground so it begins parked and ends part and that was not shown.
That alone is a big contributor to people messing up their backs. They are not loading and unloading from the right positions. I don't disagree with the information provided in the video but the swing itself could still use some improvement.
However my disagreement isn't with the video so much as it is with what you said about kettlebells.
"There's no set numbers." That's just not true. There are sets, reps, rest times, weight used or percentages, and so on to match your goals that have been written about extensively since forever...
Regardless of the tool being used you still have to respect the actual physiological response from the body and that it responds very similar from one tool to the next with respect to its given differences when it comes to reps and sets and so on.
Doing 100 reps with a kettlebell on the swing world produce 99% of the same result using a dumbbell at the same weight.
There definitely wasn't enough information given to prescribe the proper load management and tools to be used but you can definitely gain muscle and strength and endurance and so on with a kettlebell as long as you have the right weight and proper program.
Kettlebells are no more dangerous than any other tool out there. It all comes down to using it properly.
BTW, I liked the observation about the lack of start/stop positions. That was a clear oversight.
0 -
MikePfirrman wrote: »There's no set number. I'd rest between days of doing them. Also, please make sure that you're doing swings correctly. I've seen some horrid form on the internet. Even alledged online authorities doing them horribly wrong.
It's a hip hinge movement where you're pushing the KB up with hip/glute thrust, rapidly, then letting the weight fall down and, as soon as it hits bottom (between your legs) thrusting the hips and glutes again, all while keeping the back straight, not rounded.
This is a decent video on it. Many aren't. I've even seen Fitness Blender videos (and I like them) with horrific form on KB swings.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPrU323pamQ
The video explains things fairly well from a theoretical level but I wouldn't say the video is great for learning the swing by any means.
The swing starts from the ground not from a standing position for one and it also ends back at the ground so it begins parked and ends part and that was not shown.
That alone is a big contributor to people messing up their backs. They are not loading and unloading from the right positions. I don't disagree with the information provided in the video but the swing itself could still use some improvement.
However my disagreement isn't with the video so much as it is with what you said about kettlebells.
"There's no set numbers." That's just not true. There are sets, reps, rest times, weight used or percentages, and so on to match your goals that have been written about extensively since forever...
Regardless of the tool being used you still have to respect the actual physiological response from the body and that it responds very similar from one tool to the next with respect to its given differences when it comes to reps and sets and so on.
Doing 100 reps with a kettlebell on the swing world produce 99% of the same result using a dumbbell at the same weight.
There definitely wasn't enough information given to prescribe the proper load management and tools to be used but you can definitely gain muscle and strength and endurance and so on with a kettlebell as long as you have the right weight and proper program.
Kettlebells are no more dangerous than any other tool out there. It all comes down to using it properly.
BTW, I liked the observation about the lack of start/stop positions. That was a clear oversight.
This videos have pretty good explanations of start/stop. Lots of step by step coaching.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PhTKThP1Luo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GYHbu2LRqD0 2 -
Theoldguy1 wrote: »MikePfirrman wrote: »@ MT1134 - thanks for clarifying. All valid points!
@ Asdak - had to laugh at the "attacking your balls", that's fantastic.
I was going to quote Dan John who coaches to "attack the zipper." Maybe it was the angle but i thought it looked like the ball was going too low on the good example.
Dan John had a real good tip for learning the get up. Put the kettlebell away and do the movement with a paper cub about 2/3 full of water. When you can reps of the movement without spilling the water get a light kettlebell.
Funny you mentioned that, I learned to do the get up in exactly that fashion.
The caveat is that the water bottle is placed on your knuckles as you make a closed fist, simulating you're holding onto something while being forced to do the exercise with laser like precision.
My progression is that an athlete must be able to do 5 reps on each side back to back, all the way up and all the way down without dropping the bottle before being allowed to progress to an actual bell. It keeps you humble for sure.
Athletes like to muscle their way through it and the bottle will fall every time. This method builds stability and strength and teaches you to use the proper alignment.
Then as for the shoulders, an athlete is not allowed to press anything overhead that's heavier than the bell they do the get up with.
In the interest of not soaking the people next to me in the gym I use a yoga block on a closed fist. The block is useful because you can make it harder by balancing the block on its end. Also it's so light that it's very unstable in whatever position you place it.
1 -
Theoldguy1 wrote: »MikePfirrman wrote: »There's no set number. I'd rest between days of doing them. Also, please make sure that you're doing swings correctly. I've seen some horrid form on the internet. Even alledged online authorities doing them horribly wrong.
It's a hip hinge movement where you're pushing the KB up with hip/glute thrust, rapidly, then letting the weight fall down and, as soon as it hits bottom (between your legs) thrusting the hips and glutes again, all while keeping the back straight, not rounded.
This is a decent video on it. Many aren't. I've even seen Fitness Blender videos (and I like them) with horrific form on KB swings.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPrU323pamQ
The video explains things fairly well from a theoretical level but I wouldn't say the video is great for learning the swing by any means.
The swing starts from the ground not from a standing position for one and it also ends back at the ground so it begins parked and ends part and that was not shown.
That alone is a big contributor to people messing up their backs. They are not loading and unloading from the right positions. I don't disagree with the information provided in the video but the swing itself could still use some improvement.
However my disagreement isn't with the video so much as it is with what you said about kettlebells.
"There's no set numbers." That's just not true. There are sets, reps, rest times, weight used or percentages, and so on to match your goals that have been written about extensively since forever...
Regardless of the tool being used you still have to respect the actual physiological response from the body and that it responds very similar from one tool to the next with respect to its given differences when it comes to reps and sets and so on.
Doing 100 reps with a kettlebell on the swing world produce 99% of the same result using a dumbbell at the same weight.
There definitely wasn't enough information given to prescribe the proper load management and tools to be used but you can definitely gain muscle and strength and endurance and so on with a kettlebell as long as you have the right weight and proper program.
Kettlebells are no more dangerous than any other tool out there. It all comes down to using it properly.
BTW, I liked the observation about the lack of start/stop positions. That was a clear oversight.
This videos have pretty good explanations of start/stop. Lots of step by step coaching.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PhTKThP1Luohttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GYHbu2LRqD0
Tony G is one of the best there is. So is Boyle.
1 -
I appreciate you guys taking the time out to put up such useful info. I know when I tried to do KBs, I struggled to find info on it. I like Mike Boyle's stuff a lot too.
Didn't appreciate how important it is on the start and lift so thanks for letting me know that. I have a horrid back to start with, so don't need to aggravate it.1 -
MikePfirrman wrote: »based off the three disagrees on the video I posted, it's clear that some of you don't have any idea either how to do the proper swing
^This...
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One of the better videos on the swing I found when I was doing S&S was actually from crossfit.
https://www.youtube.com/embed/videoseries?list=PLsivjQrX9Kt-58VPsDMVLodtRX9qF9h3g
It's a 5 part series (Jeff Martone). He also has a series on the TGU:
0
This discussion has been closed.
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